Three weeks in Europe. Which countries?

One possibility is to forget a third country and travel more widely within France and Italy.

Good idea - I'd stick with that one.

This is your first trip to Europe. You will probably not be terribly efficient. You will get a lot more out of your trip if you slow down a little and take time to enjoy the experiences. With three weeks, you can have a wonderful trip and see a lot of the highlights of these two countries (you can't "see it all", don't try).

You're headed to Europe when it's most crowded and hottest. If you can, I'd move the trip as early in June as you can.

I'm a big proponent of itineraries that make geographical sense. There are so many wonderful places to see in France and Italy that I'd stick to those two countries for this trip. If you want variety, you can have it by including Alsace in France (heavy German influence) and/or the Dolomites in Italy (heavy Austrian influence). You also have the Italian lake district quite near Milan. The options are almost limitless. Get hold of comprehensive guide books to France and Italy and explore.

It's just so difficult to choose countries for the first trip to Europe. It's easy to take on too much turf and be completely overwhelmed by the pressures of traveling to unknown destinations and just the culture in general.
I always suggest flying into London for a 4 day minimum, and then taking the Eurostar to Paris for a 4 day minimum. Then regroup.
For many, Italy is a priority place and I suggest taking a budget airline down to Rome for 4-5 days. Fast trains can get you up to Florence for 3 days, and taking excursions into the Tuscan countryside works well. Then Venice is a priority place to see, as the place is sinking.
We have started going to new countries and cities on our trips--and stopping by one of our old favorite cities on the way back. The budget airlines can get you from point A to point B so easily. Prague, Budapest, Munich and Amsterdam are some of our favorite big cities, but all can get pretty wild unless the teenagers are pretty mature. We have been going to Budapest in recent years as it's inexpensive to stay in and has over 150 museums of all kinds.

Thanks for the advice everyone. I was leaning toward the idea of eliminating that third country but I am not 100% sure I will have another opportunity to visit Europe (ya never know). If this is the case, would I regret seeing only two countries?

Great start to your planning so far. If you do stay with your two country idea and June-July travel dates, I’d suggest starting in Rome and flying home from Paris. Two things come to mind for me. It just might be a bit “cooler” in Rome in June rather than mid July. Then in Paris there are several kid interesting things happening about mid July—Paris Plages, Bastille Day, etc.

Also I like the idea of ONE other place between your cities and the Lake District in Italy or Strasbourg FR seem well positioned and a nice change of scenery from city visits.

Anything can happen - an asteroid can smash the earth tomorrow - but why plan for such calamities? You can never "see it all" no matter how much time you spend, but trying to see too much can short-change you and wreck your experience of the places you actually do pass through. You don't need to spend a week in every little village, but there's plenty of 5-star things to see and do in just France and Italy for a 3 week trip. Fight the "but, I may never come again" impulses. Take the "I SHALL return!" approach. You will get more out of this trip, and you will start thinking about the next one...which is the best guarantee that you actually will go again!

One possibility is to forget a third country and travel more widely
within France and Italy.

I'd go with that one too. Fewer country moves will allow you to get a better handle on the couple you know you want to visit.

We enjoy historical sites, art galleries, walking and short hikes,
cathedrals and monasteries, nice scenery, waterways, local foods/wine,
and being among the local people.

I'm a bit curious why you chose Milan? I've nothing against the city but for the first-timer - especially one with an interest in art galleries, churches and historic sites - I'd place Florence well above Milan: outstanding art and architecture, and lots of history, not that Milan doesn't have history too. It's just more evident in much of Florence, if that makes sense?
Lots of tourists? Yep, but you're going to run into that in any of the magnet European cities during high season, including Paris.

Local food and wine will be anywhere/everywhere so not a condition for choosing a location: do it based on what you most want to DO and SEE.

Train travel in Italy is easy, and there are some really nice day trips you could take from Florence.

Rome to Paris would be an excellent 3-week trip. Fly into Rome and out of Paris so you start at the hottest place first and work your way north. Rome, Florence (and Tuscany), Cinque Terre, Nice, Provence, Paris.

Hi,

Do you have any top priorities as to which country? If not, then I would suggest France and Germany, these two, also better to leave out a third country, unless it is of top priority. My two top priorities on the first trip were England and Germany, mostly Germany where I spent seven weeks, the bulk of the trip.

Maybe you've already decided on France and Italy. Then it's only a matter of narrowing it down to the specifics and logistics...no problem.

If not, what about these combinations, Poland and Hungary, or Hungary and Austria.

I love the idea of starting in Rome and making our way north. I sometimes forget to think about the weather.

Kathy, we are visiting family in Milan, otherwise that would likely not be on our itinerary. Probably staying for three days.

Thank you all for your suggestions. It seems we will have a wonderful experience staying in France and Italy. I will keep my fingers crossed that we will return and with some experience under our belts.

Stopping in Milan to visit family being the case, skip the Nice & Provence, and put in Switzerland. There's your third country. The Berner Oberland is just off the main rail route from Milan to Paris going through Basel.

I absolutely agree with Sam. Add Switzerland.

Italy, Switzerland, and France, with a focus on Rome, Berner Oberland, and Paris - and a family stop in Milano - would make for a very doable and even exceptional 3-week trip to Europe.

Hey Sue,

If you feel you might not get another chance to visit Europe anytime soon, then do Italy , France and Netherlands. 1 week in France, 1 week in Italy and 1 week in Netherlands. You can get a 3 week rail pass to travel in between these countries. Switzerland is a magnificent country saturated with beautiful landscapes but very expensive and with a family of 4 that can disrupt your budget. Write a quick Itinerary draft of the places you wish to see in those countries and we will help you polish it.

Take care

My first couple trips to Europe were multi country 3 week trips. I prioritized seeing a variety of kinds of places over other things.

My first trip to Europe had my husband and I in Paris, overnight train to Rome (would fly today), train to Florence, Innsbruck, Salzburg, and then back to Luxembourg to fly home. I think the Germanic countries are quite different from France or Italy (have visited Germany and other parts of Austria on subsequent trips) and provide a nice contrast. You certainly can’t see everything in one trip but I personally think there are some advNtages to a sampler approach.

sue,

As this is your first trip to Europe, I would recommend reading Europe Through The Back Door prior to your trip. Once you've decided on a definite list of cities, use the country or city-specific guidebooks to plan sightseeing, hotels, etc. The Rick Steves books are excellent (IMO).

Three weeks is a reasonably good time frame so I don't see any reason not to fit in a third country, especially if it works with your other destinations. I agree with previous suggestions to start in Rome and work north. One point to mention though..... I'd skip Milan unless there's something definite you want to see there.

Does your three week time frame include your two flight days? Also, where are you flying from?

Would something like this work.....

• Fly inbound Rome - 4 nights (including a possible day trip or two, perhaps Orvieto)
• Train to Venice (if interested?) - 3 nights
• Train to Florence - 4 nights (day trips to Siena, Lucca or other locations)
• Train to Cinque Terre (Monterosso suggested) - 2 nights (you can do some hiking here)
• Train to Berner Oberland (CH) / Lauterbrunnen Valley - 3 nights (also lots of opportunities for hiking in spectacular scenery - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19LRzh7ycs4 )
• Train to Paris - remaining time - fly outbound from CDG

There are many ways your trip could be arranged and this is only one suggestion. Venice is somewhat of an "outlier" so skipping that would allow more room to expand the other locations.

Especially in Italy, there are some potentially expensive "caveats" to be aware of when using trains or other public transit, so be sure to do some research on that. Finally if you decide to include Switzerland, you'll need to budget accordingly as it's not cheap!

Good luck with your planning!

Thank you all for great suggestions and insight. We are making our decision soon and I will let everyone know what we decide.

Can't wait to hear what you decide from what's been suggested so far. All of the decisions rest with you and your style of travel/comfort levels, but I think two countries sounds ideal. Three are doable, with Switzerland being a very reasonable connection.

I also understand your feeling that this may be your 'only' trip to Europe. I know I felt like that on my first trip to Italy. And now I am planning my 5th trip to Italy for next year. It's like any hobby. Once the bug bites, you find a way to make things happen.

Whatever you decide, I hope you have an amazing adventure! :-)

Good, plan for Italy and France. I would add a country geographically close like Switzerland (although one of the most expensive in Europe) or Munich/Salzburg.

Fly in to Rome or Paris and out of the other. Take the train from Rome to Florence, then to Venice, then to Munich (day trip to Salzburg and/or Fussen/Garmisch). Then the night train to Paris.

Rome 5-6 nights
Florence 3-4 nights
Venice 2 nights
Munich with day trips 3-4 nights
Paris 5-6 nights

OR
Going through Switzerland you could take in Milan then on to Interlakken (use as a base) then on to Paris.

I have been to Europe 12 times and if I were on my deathbed and had never been, the two places I would most regret not seeing would be Italy and England. That being said, England is too far away to include on this trip. Extra time in Paris and Italy is never a bad idea. You will see more if you do less travel between destinations. The reason group tours can cover more ground in the same amount of time is because someone else has already figured out the most efficient way to travel between locations and see the sights. Since you said you enjoy cathedrals, you must go to Chartres. If you are going during the summer you should spend the night so you can see the light show. RS book recommends a former monastery conveniently located across the street from the cathedral and it's cheap enough to get the boys their own room. I would include a day trip to Pompeii from Rome. If you love art museums, you must go to Florence-my #1 favorite place in Europe and a comfortable place to walk around (Rome is big and spread out but Florence is compact and very walkable.) I have been to Italy 3 times but never to Milan and have no desire to do so but all you have to do is hand me a plane ticket for Florence and I'm on my way. For waterways, Chenenceux in the Loire is a chateau built over a river. Driving in France outside of Paris (get car at airport) is easy according to my husband who drove us to Chartres and Chenenceaux-be sure you have lots of change for the tolls on the highways.

As much as I love Eastern Europe, for s first trip, especially with uncertainty of future trips the best mix is London, Paris, Rome. It's the classic European tour and it provides a good cross section of several cultures.

While you're waiting for your copy of Europe Through the Back Door (hard copy recommended), exploring this RS website can provide tons of information and answer questions you never thought to ask. I'm providing some links below to get you started, but there's much more you will find online here. It would be good for all of you to read the information at these links so you are all on the same information level from the beginning.

For detailed information on what to see and do in the the countries and cities of interest, go to Explore Europe, click on Browse Countries, pick a country and then a city.

For packing advice go to Travel Tips: Packing Light. Watch Sarah Murdoch's travel talk, Packing Light & Right. And lurk and ask questions in the Packing Forum.

For money matters go to Travel Tips: Money. Remember that if you do go to Switzerland, you will be using Swiss Francs, not Euros.

For safety information go to Travel Tips: Theft & Scams.

Please note that there are many other resources online here that will be helpful for your first trip to Europe.

Finally, make sure all your passports are current. My son is accompanying his daughter on a trip to Israel. He had totally forgotten that her kid passport was going to expire on her birthday, and that she needed a new one ASAP. They had to jump through some hoops, but she did get it renewed in time for the trip. If you don't have passports yet, here's a link for info on that. Be sure to read the details, including the section on passport pictures.

Everyone else is wrong, the logical trip is

Prague/Czech, Budapest/Hungary, 

Maybe include Montenegro or Ukraine or Bulgaria. Budapest is a hub for Wizzair, so it opens the East for exploration.

Start in Amsterdam. Train to Paris. Fly to Florence. Train to Siena. Train to Rome.

Hi everyone! We've made a decision and have taken much of your advice. We've decided to restrict our travel to within France and Italy - with the hopes that we will return to Europe in the future. Here's our itinerary: Paris - Normadie (region) - Milan - Venice - Rome.

We are starting in the north so we can coordinate a family get-together in Milan, otherwise we would start in Rome as several of you recommended. We are now going to start booking travel and accommodations. If you would like to share any tips/advice, I will be all "ears!"