You folks are so helpful--hoping for more ideas! We are flying into Bordeux, staying 2 nights close to the central area, without a car so we can get rest and oriented, and check out some sites downtown, then rent a car and drive to the Sarlat area for a week then back to Bordeux, return car and take the train to paris and stay a few days, flying out of there. my main interest is seeing the prehistoric caves in Dordogne(which I have asked questions about!), but figured if going all the way to France need to see Paris. I was thinking 8 nights in Sarlat and 3 nights in paris, but after looking at all the things I would like to do in Paris I am wondering if we should do 7 in Sarlat and 4 in Paris? Is 6.5 days enough to see the major caves and chateuxs and a canoe ride down the river? I want to see the highlights in Paris--maybe a 3 hr tour of the Louvre(like the Takewalks group), the Musee de Orangerie, a boat ride down the Seine, a half day trip to the Giverney gardens, and the Notre Dame(the only place my husband said is a must for him). not sure if 2.5 days is enough for all that! Any opinions would be greatly appreciated! thanks so much!
Posted by
275 posts
For the list of things you want to see in Paris, I don't think 2.5 days is enough. I think you should do 4 or 5 days.
Posted by
Seattle, WA
589 posts
You have parts of a similar trip we took two years ago. 3 nights in Bordeaux followed by an 8 night cycle trip through the Dordogne to start and at the end of our trip, 4 planned nights in Paris. (We also had another two weeks in the middle: Nantes, Loire cycling and chateaux, Chartres and Versailles on our way to Paris).
Whether your Sarlat/Paris split should remain 7 and 3 or whether you should do 6 and 4 is perhaps a question with no right answer.
Have you been to Paris before? I suspect not as you say you want to see the highlights and you mention big/popular sights. If my suspicion is correct, I would suggest you spend four nights in Paris, and don’t try to include what will be a 3/4 day trip to Giverny.
Our first trip to Paris had Versailles and Giverny on the list and we were too enthralled and busy in Paris to go to either of those out-of-Paris sights.
Let me add that your Paris (and Giverny) itinerary, while “do-able,” is chock full of very crowded sights and will make for a pretty unpleasant 2.5 days. They say Paris is for lovers. Lovers spend time in parks and cafes.
We are going to spend just three nights in Paris at the end of this month. We plan a reasonably full 2-1/2 days, but not an insanely packed visit. This will be our third visit to Paris; fourth to France. Our first trip to Paris was for 7 nights so we have seen many of the major sights already before our second visit two years ago and our upcoming visit later this month.
I will share some TRs and a recent query of mine that you might find useful. Allan had a fantastic Dordogne TR in the past year. See:
Our TR from two years ago:
(I’ll add to that TR that we really liked Chateau Milandes, the home for Josephine Baker after WW2. You might enjoy it too.)
And finally, my query (and planning process) some months ago about our upcoming, short three night trip to Paris:
https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/france/paris-suggestions-s-il-vous-plait
If you’ve been to Paris before and know the city, you can have a great long “weekend” there. If it’s your first trip to Paris, that’s a different story. Spend 3 full days (4 nights) IN Paris.
As for our upcoming 2-1/2 days, just as a comparison for your own planning and timing, I think we will manage
- Jardin des Plantes (as we walk from Gare de Lyon to our hotel)
- Notre Dame
- Jazz, one night in the 6th Arrondisement
- Musee Jacquemart-Andre (Have Tix)
- Perhaps a stroll in the Parc Monceau
- Seine Cruise (depending on weather)
- Musee d’Orsay (Have Tix)
- Musee Cluny
- Neighborhoods we’ve seen before - and not.
(We have decided against any classical music, despite my forum query comments.)
Have a great trip. Enjoy your time and each other.
Posted by
19 posts
My wife and I visited the Dordogne using public transport and a private driver from Bordeaux to Sarlat (the RS recommended Christoph Küsters who was wonderful.) I’ll focus my advice on that portion of your trip. We saw Font de Gaume on our own and booked a day tour to see Rouffignac and Lascaux and the museum in Les Eyzies (as I recall)and a boat (not canoe) ride on the river. We couldn’t get to Pech Merle on public transportation. The time you spend in the Dordogne will depend on what caves you want to see, your reservations (timed entry?) and driving time. Cave visits are fairly brief, but getting around will take a bit more time.
We had an elderly Frenchman who spoke little English for our Font de Gaume tour. It was us and a young family of four. Our guide knew the cave like the back of his hand, and was wonderful. The path up to the cave is lovely too. Rouffignac does not make a good first impression: it is privately owned and at first seems more like an amusement park. You ride 3/4 mile into the cave on a funky mine train. And at the end? Let’s just say there were two visits on that French trip that literally brought tears to my eyes: St. Chapelle in Paris, and Rouffignac. We thought Lascaux was skippable: crowded, and you only see a replica.
Don't dismiss the idea that you will want to spend some leisure time in the Dordogne: Sarlat and Beynac were enchanting, and the countryside is absolutely gorgeous.
We did Font de Gaume one day, stayed a couple well-spent extra nights in Sarlat for their big spring market fair, took an organized tour that hit Rouffignac, Beynac, boat ride, Lascaux, museum in Les Eyzies all in one long day. That will give you an idea of the least and most you can pack into a day. Even with a car, we couldn’t have done the tour itinerary in one day, would have been too tight on our own.
Posted by
SoCal
2040 posts
I can't speak for anyone else, but 7-8 days in Sarlat would drive me nuts. The Dordogne is pretty, but it's not a region packed with sites and activities. Then again, I'm a very urban creature.
Another note I'd add: the Musée d'Orsay is IMO a much more important art museum than the Louvre, and I recommend all art lovers visit the Orsay. The Louvre has a much less comprehensive historical record of artwork. The Louvre does, however, have a very important archeological section that shouldn't be missed.
Posted by
OP
26 posts
RickS--if you don't mind. how much did it cost to have a driver from Bordeux to sarlat? We were planning on renting a car to have more flexibility but it could be worth it to us to not be driving that distance. And which organized tour group did you use to do the all day site seeing? And thank you to all who have responded! we decided to book the Paris B&B for 4 nights.
Another question--what is a realistic time to allow for driving Bordeux to Sarlat and back again? I know Google is not always accurate of course! It says 2 hr 39 min -so I am thinking allow for 3.5? And does anyone have a preference on trains to Paris--TGV or is Ouigo ok?
Posted by
Seattle, WA & Bordeaux, France
473 posts
Hi debjsd,
The drive time from Bordeaux center to Sarlat is probably going to be more like 3.5 hours with traffic (both city and the rocade traffic.) The train is a little less than 3 hours and super relaxing and easy. The walk from the train station is a leisurely 15-20mins.
Regarding the TGV trains, there are two kinds: InOui and OUIGo. The InOui is your traditional TGV and takes roughly 2hrs from Bordeaux to Paris often non-stop (though there are a few routes where there is a stop or two.) The OUIGo is a low cost TGV (think similar to low cost airline.) All seats are 2nd class, the train takes longer to go from Bordeaux to Paris (usually 3hrs), often has 3-4 stops along the route. We take both but try not to take the OUIGo during school breaks as it gets very crowded with vacationing families or school groups of kids.
Enjoy your trip!
Posted by
Long Beach, Ca, usa
2454 posts
debjsd,
In June 2023 we drove from Bordeaux to La Roque Gageac (15 min. from Sarlat) in about 3 3/4 hours, but stopped for lunch in a small town along the way. We took only D (non-auturoute) roads. I would say 3-4 hours depending on how much you like to enjoy the countryside. By the fastest way (A89), just under 3 hours. IMHO, having a car is the way to enjoy the Dordogne region. Driving around the area is not difficult. We rented a gite (house) with 7 (2 cars) of us and were able to comfortably see and do a lot in 9 days, but you could see and do a lot in 5-6 days. (Beynac and Castelnaud-la-Chapelle, kayaking on the river, Font de Gaume, Lascaux IV, Les Eyzies museum, Sarlat-la-Caneda market, driving to/through some of the "plus Beaux Villages" of France. The things I mentioned all take about a half-day each. Most places we went to (granted, in the western section only), were not long drives from our rental. Sarlat-la-Caneda is the best-known place to stay, so driving in and out of the town, and parking there, can be problematical. There are many towns not far from Sarlat that may offer more convenience if you have a car. If you don't have a car, I guess Sarlat is the best choice, albeit more touristy.
See my trip report from June 2023 titled "Just Returned from Four Weeks in France.....Continued". We did what you are thinking of. We took a train from Marseille to Bordeaux, stayed one night (wandered around the center near the river, had dinner) and drove to the Dordogne next day. After the Dordogne visit we drove back to Bordeaux, dropped off the car, stayed 2 nights (went to Cite Du Vin, strolled around the centre ville, enjoyed the city). We took an early TGV to Paris (less than 3 hours. ). You can explore Bordeaux before or after the drive to Sarlat.
I love the Doerdogne, but Paris has so much I would take 1 or 2 days from there and add it to Paris. Paris, if I am honest, deserves a month, but of course that isn't possible for most of us. But at least give it 5-6 days.
Have a wonderful trip!
Posted by
19 posts
debjsd,
I’m afraid I did not keep a record of the cost for a driver from Bordeaux to Sarlat. Your cost might be different anyway: Christoph was dropping off clients in Bordeaux so he was right there to drive us back to Sarlat, which is near his home. He arranged a stop in St. Emilion, including a private wine tasting and time to tour the underground church. His company is www.taxialacarte.com and his email is [email protected] and he is very responsive. Husband and wife business using very nice vehicles. His wife gave us a ride from one small town to another during our time in the Dordogne. You could email him with your dates and desires and see what he can offer.
We opted for a private driver because, while there is train service to the region, we couldn’t figure out how to get exactly where we wanted to go by train at all times. Hence the need for an organized commercial tour.
We booked our day tour through Ophorus.
I am a very reluctant foreign driver, but the roads in the area seemed well-signed and not too busy. Most are two lane. Many people would not have difficulty in a rental car. But lack of car prevented us getting to Pech Merle. We are on an organized Smithsonian tour next spring to revisit some caves, go to others new to us in Spain and France.