Transportation plans for a family of 6

Are you only going to England? For only 6 days? On the ground?

I'll be one of the first to say that you need to pack light, especially for such a short trip, even in winter. Then you will cut down on the amount of luggage hauling you need to do, period. Oddly, I found that I needed less stuff for our month-long trip to the Netherlands and Belgium in April, 2013 when it was bitterly cold most of the time, than I normally need for better weather.

And as many say, the answer to every packing question is "layers."

Also remember that getting a vehicle for 6 people, especially if you have luggage that is big and heavy, will be a serious and expensive challenge. A van in England may not exactly be the same size as a van here, so if you do rent something, make sure that it will hold all of you and your luggage. If you haven't already been to it, go to Gemut.com. Be sure to thoroughly explore the website, read the brochure (especially p.8 about vans and p.6-7 about International Driving Permits) and contact Andy for more information. They specialize in Germany and Austria, but they know about car rentals anywhere in Europe. By the way, they book all their rental customers through Auto Europe.

And you might find that taking a taxi or 2 from the airport would be the cheapest option all round until you get out into the countryside.

" We would rent a van from Heathrow and drive to the apartment. I am thinking that the traffic would be tolerable on Dec 26th and Wimbledon isn't down town London. Am I thinking correctly??? "

I have to question the wisdom of getting off a transatlantic flight and driving on the other side of unfamiliar roads. BTW, a "van" in the UK is for transporting goods (they don't usually have side windows fitted), what you would be after is a minibus or a MPV (although an MPV may be too small for 6 with luggage).

Van: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/96/UK_Mail_van.JPG

Minibus: https://www.minibus-hire-warrington.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Minibus-hire-Warrington-home-page1.jpg

MPV: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/00/2006_Mazda_MPV_02.jpg

I would avoid driving in London at all costs. Even something as simple as parking the 'mini-bus' overnight may be more difficult than you would imagine, with many areas in London having 'residents only' parking.

Driving a car in London is tough enough, I personally would want to drive any kind of larger vehicle. A ford Tourneo is fairly common in the UK and might suit you (if you do rent something).

https://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1350&bih=859&q=ford+tourneo&oq=ford+tourneo&gs_l=img.12..0l10.1234.1234.0.4420.1.1.0.0.0.0.60.60.1.1.0.msedr...0...1ac.1.64.img..0.1.59.TTsKI6wWFJk

I would recommend getting the Tube from Heathrow to a Central London location (Wimbledon isn't down town London as you say). The Tube should be reasonably quite and is easy enough, especially if you get somewhere to stay very close to a Piccadilly Line tube station. I'm assuming your 'kids' are old enough / capable of helping with the luggage, if not, then you have to avoid the Tube with luggage.

Or with 6x tube fares, a pre-booked mini-cab (not a black cab where the limit is 5) may well be cheaper. Make sure you tell them how many people and an idea of luggage though, it will cost a little more for a bigger vehicle. Most mini-cab firms have 7 seat vehicles or 'people carriers' as they are sometimes called.

For your days outside London, you could make a deal for a 'day rate' with the same cab company whereby they assign you a driver for the day to go where you like, you would pay a fixed sum (last time I arranged this I think I paid £150 a day) plus fuel. The driver will meet you with a full fuel tank, you drive where you want, he will then fill up again before he drops you off and you pay the cost directly at the petrol station.

This might sound expensive, but all told, you'd have chauffeured transport without all the hassle for around £500 for the 3 days. Compared to driving yourself, parking, navigating and leaving the mini-bus idle for 3 days whilst in London, this may well be cheaper, better and much less hassle. You could alternate, day in London, day out, day in, etc.

There is generally much less traffic over the Xmas period and the 'Congestion Zone' charge of £11.50 per day is not in effect. Parking rules, apart from Xmas day, are always in effect. Some people 'assume' Sunday rules (i.e. you can park in residential bays and on single yellow lines) but each borough (there are 32 in what is considered Greater London i.e. inside the M25) has their own rules and even Londoners outside their home area, find the rules impossible to follow, often resulting in an expensive parking ticket.

You might find the 'outside London' areas very quiet over the Xmas holidays.

The same mini-cab firm can then drop you to Gatwick on Jan 1st, which is much further outside London than Heathrow is.

If you're planning to attend the 'Big Ben/London Eye NYE Fireworks' be aware it's now a ticketed event. Only £10 each, but might be tough to get hold of as they are very popular. You can see the fireworks outside the ticketed area, but it's not quite the same.

Good Luck.

Mike...do u know the name of the pre book taxi for 6, as well as a name for a day rate driver?

Thanks

Does the apartment you are staying in have off road parking? There are many street parking restrictions in Wimbledon which means you may not be able to park in certain areas or you will have to pay for parking. Do not drive into London - it costs £35 a day to park there. Take the train or tube from Wimbledon. There is hideous traffic everywhere in the London area and most will be on holiday on the 26th so will be taking to their cars for visiting and sale shopping. A private transfer or hire car would make sense for 6 of you to transfer. Staying closer to central London will be very expensive at that time of year.

Public transport is more restricted over the Christmas holiday period and this is the time that many rail companies undertake large engineering projects whilst there are fewer commuters. Some companies run a more limited Sunday service and others run a revised timetable - none of the details are available for 2015 yet. 1 January is a Bank Holiday so services will again be limited including the Gatwick Express.

December is not the best time to visit the Cotswolds so I would suggest that you give these a miss and visit them Spring though to Autumn. Their small local shops may well be closed for the whole duration of your visit. Warwick is a 2 hour drive from London so you may want to visit somewhere closer rather than spending much of the day in a car with 4 children (assuming they are not teenagers or older!). Stonehenge is closed 28 December. Norwich is an easy train ride from Liverpool Street and a nice city to look round.

We do not usually get much snow in London at this time of year, but it is a possibility, particularly the further north you travel, which could impact on your out of London days. Half an inch of snow and London grinds to a halt - it's pathetic really.

I would focus on spending one day out of London as there are so many sights in the capital itself.

Well, the people I used were http://middlesexcars.co.uk/. Which is a cab company local to my work which we use sometimes, and I was able to wander in and speak to the boss, and strike a deal for cash. It's not officially a service they offer.

If it were me, I'd talk to my hotel, and ask them the name of a local mini cab firm that they use, they will have at least one.

Then it's all about your ability to negotiate, and judge how reliable you believe the company to be, not always easy. However, if your deal allows for cash AFTER the event, then if they don't perform, you don't pay them... simple. If they know you are associated with the hotel, they will not want to upset you, as this may upset the hotel and cost them future business. You might initially get 'tourist rates' especially if it's a posh hotel... but negotiation, and speaking to two or more companies, will allow you to get a good deal.

Don't be too harsh in your negotiation... the deal needs to be a good deal for both sides for it to work well.

I didn't part with any cash 'up front' but the cab firm knew my company and felt they could trust me. But the client paid an agreed 'retainer' on the first day.

Addison Lee are the 'big boys' in this field in London, they are apparently very good, but may not be the cheapest. I've personally never used them, but you see their cabs everywhere.

http://www.addisonlee.com/?gclid=CPzS1sPzscUCFXDLtAodkjAAYA

I drafted a little 'contract' as I was arranging this for a friend, just so both sides knew the deal. Actually the cost was £200 per day, but I didn't negotiate too hard as I knew the guy coming was not short of money, £150 per day or less, seems reasonable for me.

Wording I used as below. I make no legal guarantees, I'm just a cautious sole who likes writing things down. The guy who used this service was very happy with how it went.

Period of hire: Saturday 29th October to Tuesday 8th November inclusive (11 days). Day rate: £200 incl. VAT if applicable. Flight details, Arrival: BA0262 12:25 29th Oct. Terminal 5 Flight details, Departure: BA0263 21:00 8th Nov. Terminal 5 Base address: ### Queens Gate, SW7 5LE. Client name and mobile: Mr #### #### – #### #### Driver name and mobile: Mr #### – #### #### Car details: Mercedes MPV

Day 1 Hours: 12:00 – 21:00 meet at Airport and transfer to base address. Then as required by client. Day 2-11 Hours: 09:00 – 18:00 at base address with final transfer to Airport on Day 11. Hours outside the above charged at £10 / 60min period, rounded up to nearest 60min. Travel to and from base address: included in day rate. Method of payment: Cash, direct from client. Deposit amount: £600 paid on the first day. Interim payment after 4 days service: £600 Balance payable before departure. Driver food and drinks: included in day rate. Fuel for mileage within the M25: included in day rate. For trips outside the M25: the driver should fill the tank before leaving the M25 area, then refill upon return within the M25, the petrol bill to be paid directly by the client at cost. Congestion charge: included in day rate. Car park tickets: parking charges should not be payable as driver will stay with the car, apart from Airport collect or drop off, where the expenses will be covered directly by the client at cost. Speed camera’s and any penalty notices: All at drivers own risk. No other charges will apply or be paid. With 24Hr notice, the client reserves the right to suspend or cancel drivers services without reason. The car should be kept clean and tidy throughout the hire period. The vehicle must be non-smoking and suitable for 6 adults with appropriate luggage.

Thank you for the replies! The gemut.com was very helpful and the brochure!

Our children our ages 10, 13, 15, 17. We will being going to , Paris for 2 days, Germany for 6 days, and then England for 6 days. So, I won't be driving for several days after our trans atlantic flight. The "van" I was referring to was a "passenger van" like a Citroen Grand C4. Site says that it will seat 5 + 2. Through Avis it would be about 400$ w/collision which I thought was reasonable. We do like the idea of packing light and know that it is strongly recommended. On the other hand, I was thinking that if we just get to our apartment with our luggage then we are set. Maybe we can do with 6 (largest) carry on size suitcases. It looks like luggage would end up being on a few of our laps :( if I decide to rent.

So is it common to see people on the tube or bus with luggage? Should I be concerned in any way?

The place that I am considering is 'The Ridgeway' (Ref: RDG) through Coach House Rentals. Parking there is 2.50 (pounds) a day (visitor parking ticket).

So if I rented the passenger van from Heathrow and spent Sunday, Monday, & Tuesday touring the countryside then I could return the vehicle and spend the next few days touring London using public transport. Then hire a taxi to Gatwick for departure.

This is so complicated. Any more ideas would be helpful.

Luggage on the Tube, very common, the bus, less so, no need for concern but avoid rush hour on the Tube in London.

Your Sun-Tues tour then London, cab to Gatwick idea is a good one.

I would usually say avoid peak commuter times on the tube with luggage, but most people will not be working on the 26th or any of the week! Wimbledon Station has disabled access from street to platform, so you will be able to manage your luggage OK.

I hate doing laundry whilst on holiday, as it is a holiday, so I always pack enough stuff and never get away with hand luggage only! You are only concerned with the luggage whilst in transit then you have plenty of clothing to hand rather than wishing you had brought x or y along.

I am always wary of rentals that do not show external photos as I like to know what I am leasing. This accommodation appears to be just over a mile from the rail/tube station. There are plenty of places to eat and supermarkets in Wimbledon.

Good point Jennifer, forgot it was over Xmas, no rush hour.

No one is addressing the public transport issue on the 12/26. Nor advising you that you are cramming in a lot of travel in a 6 day period. Reality is that you don't have enough time to see everything on your itinerary especially with the short hours of daylight that happens in Winter as well as the distance between the places you've mentioned. You need to be more selective and fine tune your wish list.

On 12/26, both tube and bus transport will be operational again, having shut down completely on Christmas Day, but will not be fully operational (fewer trains than usual) AND it will be crowded. The issue of public transport in London over the Xmas holidays has been addressed more than once on the Helpline so please use the search engine to review responses and suggestions on how best to deal with this seasonal occurrence.

Also as locals have noted it would be a huge headache and waste of money to rent a "van" to drive to Wimbledon and then let it sit there for 3 days whilst you used public transport to see the sights. You also need to consider the cost of using public transport into and out of London city centre from Wimbledon. At least 30 minutes each way.

Make it easy on yourself. Stay in the city centre. Bayswater neighborhood is good, practical and close to Paddington Station, Hyde Park. Checkout Vancouver Studio Apartments or look on Airbnb for an apartment or flat.
Start looking NOW. I've already booked my 2 bedroom flat for my trip this Fall. it's in the Bayswater/Nottinghill neighborhood.

Consider taking a tour of Stonehenge from London, leaving the Cotswolds and Warrick Castle for another visit. You could also substitute Hampton Court for Warrick Castle. It's a day trip from London. Just my humble opinion

Yeah, Cotswold, Warwick Castle will have to be another trip. I am downsizing :(

Sunday, I wanted to visit friends in Norwich and take my family out there. It's pretty important to me.

Revised Plan:
Sat 26th fly in from Frankfurt, rent vehicle at Heathrow, drive 2 hours to Thetford and stay at a B&B (possibly Bridge Hotel Brandon).

Sun 27th Meet up with friends in Norwich, attend church, tour countryside a little, drive back to Heathrow and RETURN RENTAL VAN. Hop on public transport to a B&B/APARTMENT Downtown London.

Mon 28th: Use public transport for a day trip to Stonehenge ETC.

Tues through Sat: tour London
Taxi to Gatwick
Does this sound better?

It does sound better. Stonehenge is a long way from London and whilst I get the historical aspect, it is in essence a few stones in a field.

Maybe, to spend less time travelling, you could do Windsor Castle... Which combines, to a lesser degree, the old aspect of Stongehenge and the history aspect of Warwick Castle.

It's almost definitely going to be cold, but it could be blue sunny skies or snowing, and anything in between. I'd have an alternate plan ready for if the weather is shocking.

Please see my advice about carrying luggage on your lap in a car in a concurrent thread
https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/transportation/rental-car-size-question

If the unthinkable happens your previously safe car becomes a deathtrap. Don't do it.

Your transportation issues have been addressed, so I'll move on to what I think is an important issue for you. I agree with Lo, her first paragraph. Remember to travel light.

You wrote, "I also have a hard time seeing 6 of us hauling our luggage on public transport to and from the airport." A word of advice. Don't ruin your trip by taking three times as much stuff with you as you need. Many regulars here on this forum travel with one carry-on bag and one day bag per person.

Some travel with one medium size backpack per person only. For the length of time you'll be in England, that would probably be plenty.

Do read some of the threads here on the "Packing" forum.
https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/packing/packing-advice-for-europe-newbies

https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/packing

Watch this Rick Steves video "Packing Light and Right" to see people trying to lift huge bags onto a train:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58HdRSTAFec
Notice the people who have taken a ton of stuff struggling with their bags. It's not very much fun to lug this much stuff around, and it's unnecessary.