Where or When? What comes first?

A book could be written in these subjecfs. Not enough time to address when and where to go as travellers have too many travel objectives. What is right for one is not right for another.

You can go anywhere you want. You can go any time you want. Your trip can be as long or as short as you want it to be. You can fly into and out of airports of your choice, taking advantage of super-duper fare sales.

But it is not a good idea to make each of those decisions in isolation. They need to fit together reasonably well (based on your standards of comfort, economy, etc.), else you will not have as good/inexpensive a vacation as you otherwise might.

Looking at a map, and noting the scale, is usually a good idea, too.

Well, there are also the why, if and how questions, which may even come before where and when.

"Where" always takes preference over "When".
I would go to Scandinavia or Eastern Europe any time - you couldn't pay me enough to go to Las Vegas - ever.

It's a totally subjective question but okay, I'll answer it. For me it's all about the where and always has been. Even when I was working and had restrictions on when I could go, that was never the first consideration and it did not influence the where. And when I decided on where I wanted to go, it didn't really influence the when, I just went when it was convenient and/or possible for me to go.

Everyone has their own travel style and their own needs/must haves when then travel. For me, weather is not a deciding factor and neither is the possibility of tourist crowds - the two reasons most people use for deciding when to go. I don't love crowds but I don't abhor them like some do; I don't need A/C even in the summer heat and rainy or cold weather doesn't deter me either. But that's just me.

Hmmm, well as a retired person, it doesn't matter when I travel so I guess I pick the where first. For those that are still working, maybe when works better (thinking of those who have to take school schedules in to account).

After I pick the where, I KNOW I can't tolerate summer heat. Have done that before - last boo-boo, uh....opportunity for learning...was Paris and Germany starting the end of August in 2016 which was a heat wave year. I learned I will probably not travel to Europe in July or August!

From another standpoint, I see lots of people on the Trip Advisor Yellowstone forum who decide the "when" before they do any research then want to try and visit the end of March/beginning of April or in November. That's a huge no-go as most of the park is closed during those times.

I guess really basic research means looking at the where and when in tandem.

Hi Laurel,

Well, I suspect job constraints have something to do with 'when' for many people, although not retirees. In our case, we go when the kids - 10, 13, 15 - are not in school, which means summer (bc there is cost/time-spent ratio that we want to optimize, so we plan to travel for several weeks). Then, we try to go in the first part of the summer to avoid the worst of the heat, and bc we are chomping at the bit by the time school's out. So, for the foreseeable future, the 'when' is taken care of. If my kids were not a factor, and our jobs gave us freedom to choose, I might choose differently for different trips, depending on my mood. Last summer we did a lot of outdoor excursions, so I wouldn't have wanted to do those in cold or rainy weather (the calanques in s. France, for example)

The where is like a candy store; its sort of what we're most interested in at the time. I wonder if everyone harbors a curiosity about a particular place or places for reasons they can't quite identify. Thats how its been for us. And as we have traveled to some of the initial places, new places are cropping up as curiosities, so if we're lucky, we will get to those some day, but by then, maybe we'll want to return to places we've been. For us, family and western civilization's history has guided the past two trips. This year is a little different.

Last but certainly not least is the ability to find a dirt cheap price to somewhere. This year we had the dates first (that we could get off work), and then some ideas of where we might like to go, and then we kept our eyes peeled for the tickets. Without finding cheap tickets, we wouldn't be going at all. Prices are far cheaper out of summer months, so that would factor in our future trip planning.

Jessica

Pre retirement the when took precedence. The where was secondary, but weather was a major determining factor. If the weather was going to be a problem during that when, then the where was changed to somewhere more convivial.

Now that we're retired, the where takes precedence, generally. We're working on our bucket list and try for 2-3 different trips each year. We'll look at a few places we want to go to next and slot them into fall, spring, or winter getaways. We generally don't do long trips in summer. Too much to do in my garden.

For true newcomers to European travel (those who have never been before), I would start with "why" and "what". As in "why are you motivated to travel to Europe?" and "what are your travel interests generally and in Europe, specifically?" The most aggravating newbie posts are from folks who can't answer these simple questions. They go straight to "what should I do in country x?" and "where/ when should I go?" How can anyone give good advice without knowing what the person's travel interests and motivations are, or why they're going to country "z" to begin with? If you can answer the "why" and "what", everything else flows from there. I would assume that from interests, one can get some sense of destinations they want to visit, and then they can focus on narrowing down a larger set of options to a manageable trip within all the other constraints they have like timing, budget, etc.

For seasoned travelers, I don't think it's a where versus when dichotomy, or whether one precedes the other. There many other variables that have to be weighed together: for how long?, with whom?, how?, at what cost (as in what will the trip cost and what's the opportunity cost of going on the trip, since it will mean foregoing something else?) Some of these variables may pose more rigid constraints than others and they can vary throughout one's life. At one stage, maybe budget is the biggest constraint. At another, it may be mostly someone else's decision as to where to go (and you're not the main decision-maker, or even not at all). Maybe on another trip, you only have certain dates to work with that year. Or perhaps one year, you really need to use some airline points and they can be best used for "x" but not "y", even though you'd rather go to "y" if you were not constrained. The point is that you're always playing with a bunch of factors (including where and when, but much more than that) and trying to trade them off against each other.

For people who are not retired (or those who are), it's not a simple where or when - that choice presumes that you are able to go somewhere to begin with. Travel unfortunately is a discretionary expense and many folks can't always fit it into their financial goals. One has to also juggle saving for retirement, kids' college, and other financial priorities, as well as professional and career goals. At a certain (advanced) age, health will also constrain your travel choices - the when's, the why's, the where's, and the how's.

For me, the first question is "how much?" -- when I see a giant sale from SFO/OAK to anyplace in Europe (but particularly France or Italy) at a time of year that has good weather, I consider booking a flight. Since we're retired, "when" is mostly a function of what other trips are already scheduled. Christmas markets trips have obvious when and where limitations. Preferred times for other trips are April-June and September-October to avoid the traveling hordes (as much as possible.) And "where" is places we have been and loved, or new places that other people have mentioned, or a combination.

For new travelers, I would suggest figuring out "where" is calling you, then cutting the locations by one-third to half. But if "when" is locked in by kids' schedules and/or employer restrictions, you do what you gotta do. And pay attention to Agnes' excellent "what" and "why" questions rather than picking places because everyone says you "must" see them.

Planning a trip is an iterative process involving all the considerations mentioned. They affect each other and can change each other as you plan.

For many of us, the "where" kicks off the planning partly because we've been doing this for a long time. I think it's harder for your first trip unless there's someplace that draws you even if you have no specifics about what you want to see and do there.

You might start by asking yourself and anyone else who might be going with you this question: If you can only see or do one thing, what would it be? If you can't answer that question with what pops into your head immediately, you have some research to do.

If you can answer that question easily, go for #2. Set a limit of some kind, write the options down without revealing what they are (to each other) and then compare them when you've reached that limit. You will likely see some patterns whether you're traveling solo or with others. Those patterns can tell you a lot about both where and when and form the skeleton of your trip.

When I took my husband on his first trip to Europe, our primary goal was to visit our daughter and her husband who was stationed at the NATO base in Sicily. I thought we'd spend about a week with them, about 3 weeks in other parts of Italy and head home.

But as is so often the case with first timers who think they'll never get back, my husband started adding his priorities which were all "whats" located in Iceland, England, Belfast and Germany. The 3-4 week trip expanded to 2 months. It had a very large skeleton

Fortunately, we had both the money and the time to do that, but it was a prime example of how a trip can expand. There was only one "must do" with a specific time for him, so we built the when of the whole trip around that one event.

As you plan perhaps you'll discover an event that can help you get started with the when and where.

For us Where and why dictate when. I prefer not to go in summer as to avoid big crowds, but this year it is impossible because the main reason for the whole trip is to finish a hike we were previously unable to finish due to ice fields having not melted. This dictated the when:)

I would think for those traveling with children when would be the first determinant followed by where as they don't have much of a choice about school holidays. This was true for us before we became empty nesters:)

Why dictated when and where for our Christmas Market trip 3 years ago.

Laurel,

I usually know the when as I always prefer to travel in September, although I have travelled in April / May a few times in the past. The exact start and end dates are worked out once I decide on flights and an Itinerary. The where usually consists of return visits to some favourite places as well as some new places.

Given the split choices of "when" vs "where" on European travel, an either or choice, the "when" always takes precedence. I choose "when" and everything else falls into place, once the general planning starts....moving onto specific planning.

If they are total newbies to European travel and ask me about traveling in France or Germany,...first timers. I never tell them about Rothenburg or Neuschwanstein ...well, unless I am asked. Then they are free to take my advice..ie, forget it, or reject it.

If I didn't have school age children I would decided where first and then I would travel in shoulder season whenever that is for that region. Of course we have to travel in when schools out. Where is still my first choice but things such as rainy season, bad mosquitos season elimate countries.

For us it's where - we always travelled in Sept before, but the last trip - I wanted to see the NL at tulip time - well, obviously it'd have be April. Next year want to go to Venice for Carnival, so obviously we have to travel late Feb/early March.

My list of 'where' is so long...I don't care 'when' we get there, as long as we do.

I guess for us, we don't have kids and hubby doesn't have restrictions on when he can use his vacation, so 'when' has never been an issue.

When my husband and I were working, we started with when. We had no choice; sometimes it was hard to find two weeks that we could both get away. Now that we are retired, we start with where. But we still have to consider when because we are so busy.

Probably where first for me. I know the places I want to see and keep an eye out for good opportunities to visit. That said, I'm always considering good options for a Spring (May/early June) trip and good option for a Fall (mid Sept/early Oct) trip.

I think for us it's been always WHERE. We have tried to keep a list of places but really after we visited our top two (Italy & New Zealand) it's been less about the list since it seems to change with every travel show or blog we read :).

Before my school teacher husband retired the when was always the same so we didn't have to decide when. We went to Italy in July because it's when we could go. Now we go to Italy in September because we can.

I will say sometimes it about the HOW ... the how seems to be a factor that takes a WHERE off the list. We would love to see South Africa - we would hate the 2 days of travel on both ends so South Africa slips down the list of choices. We are not in a major airport market so that always adds to the HOW for us. Crazy connections with really long layovers in Seattle or Salt Lake City for now keep the HOW a priority.

I can't travel in summer due to job concerns, which is perfectly fine as I'd rather avoid the heat and massive amounts of people. May, Sept and Oct are pretty much what I'll consider, and I'm interested in just about every European country as long as I can end my trip in Budapest.

For us there is no rhyme or reason. I work in a school so limited for when. My husband works for Hilton so sometimes it depends on the discount we can find. Two of the chefs who worked with him moved back home to Germany, one to Berlin, the other near Heidleberg. A quick search of Hilton in Berlin, great rate, two emails later and we are off to Germany. My cousin and her husband wanted to take a European cruise. A quick Hilton check and great rates in Amsterdam, checked for cruises out of Amsterdam - British isles, vacation booked. One summer we were visiting family in Croatia, called a few Hiltons to see if we could get an employee rate (this was before Internet) got hits in Budapest and Prague. Called an old friend who lived in Vienna, and our mini vacation within a vacation was all set. One day I was trolling airline websites and found a great fare to Rome r/t. for February break. No Hilton this time but since it was off season found great rates anyway. Called some family, we booked the next day, and 3 couples off on a fabulous Roman odyssey. We grab the opportunity whenever we can. I want to go everywhere, so where is just a matter of price, convenience, timing, whatever. This summer is Poland, why people ask us, why not I ask them. Great cities, so much history, nice people, delicious food, museums, we will have a fabulous time, I know it. No trip has not been fabulous with the right attitude and armed with pre-booked tickets to most sites.

Sometimes these two choices collide.
Sometimes they don’t need to, when it’s a ‘year round’ destination.
If you are restricted as to when you can go, then make sure where you go is worthwhile at that time.
It you are totally flexible, then lucky you, the world is your oyster.
... and if you like oysters, then consider Australia.
Happy and safe travels.

For me its Where. I usually travel around an American holiday weekend, get that extra day in without being charged vacation time. If I can add 5 or 6 nights of Paris onto the other location I am visiting, that is even better. I am currently working on my Switzerland (Mürren & Lucerne) and Paris trip for May/June 2019. On the docket is Budapest/Croatia, All of Ireland, England/Scotland & Jordan. The trick will be if I can add Paris to any of those.

Barbara: No trip has not been fabulous with the right attitude. We so agree! Have had some not so fabulous experiences but over all each trip has been fabulous.

We usually start with where, the problem being that we have so many where's that it becomes difficult to decide what year to fit them into. Then we decide when - we usually travel spring and fall but have been to SE Asia in the winter. The biggest issue is the when. That is, when and how to fit in all the countries we're interested in experiencing into the time available. This becomes more difficult as we age since we're beginning to slow down. But we do realize that we're very lucky to have these issues.

Sadly, as a teacher the when is always first. After I am able to retire the where will take the front seat.

When a special event, a route to Budapest and a perfect guide all come together we leave. And, I have a massive bucket list.

Those that have seen my posts know that all trips have to end in Budapest. So that complicates things a bit. I don’t mind short non-stop discount flights in Europe so all my trips are based on where I can go and then reach Budapest directly or with one interesting one or two night intermediate stop. So, arrive Dubrovnik (2 nights), fly to Belgrade (2 nights) and the Belgrade to Budapest (10 nights). I will do a train up to about 4 hours, after that I am looking for a flight. Time is precious so I never backtrack and I never spend more than half a day going anywhere. If I have to then I haven’t thought out the trip well enough.

Time of year? I love to be places when something special is happening. A festival or a national holiday. So August would be arrive Kyiv for independence day, then on to Budapest. June, fly into Sofia for the Rose Festival in Kazanlak; then Sofia to Budapest. There is something happening, someplace, almost every week of the year.

The other interest that I plan trips around is fly fishing. Getting out of towns and cities, meeting locals in rural areas and sharing an interest (fishing) opens up a different type of tourism. Montenegro, Slovakia, Bulgaria; soon Ukraine.

Sometimes it’s about the guide. I can spend months interviewing guides. I know, you guys have a book and bus pass and you don’t need a guide. I thought the same thing until one trip we had to hire one. We ended up at the end of the trip in the home of her mother where she cooked for us and we talked about every conceivable topic for hours. It was a most excellent day. We still go back and visit. Since then I have been fortunate enough to build a few similar experiences with other guides.