What should I do? Newbie traveling to Europe

Hi- I am in the same boat, I recommend buying "Europe through the back door" by Rick Steves. I also got all the guidebooks for the specific countries I am going to. The others here are much more experienced than I am, but I know by now one of them will make the above suggestion. Happy planning!! Kathleen

The bad news is that it's way too much to try to do in a month. The good news is that with that amount of money you can stay long enough to do it. Skip the tours, do it yourself and just wander. What I really dislike about tours is you sepnd too much time looking at what the guide wants you to see. Study hard, go alone.

Hi Kathleen, thanks for your reply. I've ordered Rick's book and I've done quite a bit of research into tour companies and Europe travel related stuff. Now I just need to decide whether I'm going to do a tour or travel alone. When are you going? Happy planning to you too!

Ed, unfortunately I can't get away for much longer than a month. As far as money is concerned, I'm just budgeting that amount so I would be able to do everything I wanna do and not regret missing out on anything. Which places would you suggest I take out to make my trip better? The only reason why I thought of doing a tour is because it saves me planning and coordinating everything and it does quite a number of places in a shorter time period. i'm still working my itinerary out and hopefully I will have a better plan soon if I decide to do the trip on my own.

If you plot the dots you've listed, it looks like a upside down 'Y'. Elimate one leg so it looks like a wiggly line or a 'v'. I'd suggest eliminating Spain since there's only two dots there and you probably know the least about it (since you only picked two cities, both unrelated, and neither the essence of the country - - sorry, I'm the guy with no tact). For the stops, ignore what anybody suggests about it takes X days for Y city. Decide what you want to see and how long it will take you to see those things that interest you. (I've been to Paris maybe a hundred times and London half that many - - I haven't seen all that either has to offer and don't intend to, ever.) Plus save ten percent of your time for each place to see something you, don' t think you'll like one bit - - that's how you grow.

Debbie:
Many of us here find planning is half the fun. Perhaps once you get into that mode, you will too! I love the research: reading guidebooks first, then digging deeper on the Internet. Rick has a section on planning, and even vidoe on the same. You can Google "Rick Steves video Plan Your Trip" and get some good results. (Actually you'll get HOURS of options to help you plan.) You can do it alone! Stay in B&Bs where possible so you meet other travelers, connect with locals, get advice. You'll find in many restaurants you will be seated so close to others you will have dinner companions, a nice way to share your day and discoveries. I agree with Ed: cut out one country anyway, and Spain is off your main track. England, France, Switzerland, Germany and Italy: What a trip!!! And FWIW, once I have my flights, I get my itinerary roughed out with number of nights per city, then start figuring out my transportaiton between cities so I know times, cost, options. That sets me up for filling in my ideas about activities and sights in each place on a more-or-less day-by-day basis. You may want to make your reservations for lodging as soon as you have a city-by-city plan. You'll want to minimize problems finding a place when you arrive.

Debbie, Another comment I would add is regarding Switzerland. You indicate you plan to do Interlaken. Interlaken would be very low on my list of places to spend time in Switzerland. I recommend you simply use Interlaken as a jump off point and go up into the Berner Oberland ( either Grindelwald, or go to Murren, Gimmelwald, etc ). Another option is a couple of days in Luzerne. A beautiful little city, with the added bonus of Lake Luzerne boat tours, Mt Pilatus tours, etc. A great place to get a sample of what Switzerland has to offer.
Glenn

When I first read your post I thought skip Spain and I see that others agree. It is totally out of your way and you will spend time and money making the detour. It really doesn't make a lot of sense. Paris is the furthest west that you are planning on visiting and Spain is sort of out on a limb.

I think I saw an Australian based web site for travelers looking for companions I will try to find a link. Salzburg, Austria is a short hour or two train ride from Munich if you wanted to peek in. Have fun planning your travel and plan on coming back, don't feel if you miss something you will never see it, you are young, you'll be back. You Aussies are good travelers! Here is the site I mentioned:
http://globetrooper.com/

Hi Debbie, I did my first time to Europe in September and everyone told me I had too much planned too. I went Paris, Munich, Salzburg, Krakow, Hamburg, Amsterdam, Bruges, Bayeux, Caen, Paris. Initially, we had planned on going to Italy too, but decided that we'd save that for another trip. Obviously, your first trip is just a taste of what is over there. If you plan really well in advance you can probably do ok. I traveled with my partner, which allowed for sharing costs and lightened the budget a bit. But if you stay in hostels you should be ok. I meticulously researched before we left. See what people say about each place you are going on here, some places more than others you will need to exercise more caution traveling alone than others. Just use common sense and be alert in crowded situations and after dark. Also, check out some budget airlines to cover the larger distances. We flew to Germany from Krakow to save some time and it cost less than the train would have. I hope this helps! You're going to have such a great time!

Like the others here I agree about cutting out Spain. It is worth seeing but the detour eats up time and money. I have actually done a 4 week European trip for less than AUD$10000, but I think this is at least partly due to my dislike of shopping. On that trip I spent 10 nights in Youth Hostels. It is worth joining the YHA for the cheap accommodation and the opportunity of meeting other travellers. Fortunately we now have a great exchange rate relative to both the Pound and the Euro. Most people on this site including myself are biased towards independent travel. I have also done one tour in Spain and they do see more places than you could on your own. But they do this by making early starts (leave the hotel about 7am), and spending long periods of time driving from one place to another. On my own I prefer to have 4 or less hours travel time between the places I want to see. This way I do not waste large amounts of time on the road.

There are heaps of resources to help you feel better as a woman traveling alone--look at your local bookstore or online and you'll see dozens of books for/about solo women travelers. I remember when I was planning my first solo trip, and I read an essay by a quadraplegic woman who traveled across Australia alone. That made my own apprehensions seem a bit ridiculous. Also, you are the prime age for hostels. Most people there will be your age. You will never want for sightseeing partners, dinner companions, or people to go out at night with. And I agree, cut Spain. You have too much without it. Sit down and actually plan out your stops, including travel time, and I think you'll see how crammed your trip is even without Spain.

I agree Spain might be a bit much...there is so much to see in the other countries you have listed. I think everyone has a different idea of travel and I have done long stays and whirlwind trips and loved them all. But, my first trip I landed in Amsterdam, had some money, a rental car, a map of Europe and three weeks and just took off. Oh, and also my copy of ETBD. No reservations, just a dream of where I wanted to go, and it was the trip of a lifetime and the beginning of my love for Europe. So, yes you can spend a month in one city, but I will never regret seeing 9 countries in 3 weeks. (including Lichtenstein, does it count?) You could decide to take a city tour once you arrive someplace, but I think the freedom that comes from traveling alone is wonderful. Have a great adventure!

I would say go on your own. I found that most tours do not do a great job in big cities. I did Paris on my own when I was 20. In Italy it is very easy to travel on your own. I did Rome , Florence and Venice a few years ago and used the train. I was happy to be able to wander in each city on my own. Madrid and Barcelona have great tours offered by the tourism office that let you see part of the city if you want a tour. Once you get your trains down the rest is easy. I booked all my trains in advance but next time I an not sure I would do that next trip. I wanted to spend more time in some places but had a train booked to leave. Have a great trip.

Hi Debbie- I am taking my little girl to London, Paris, and Ireland. We only have 17 days. We originally had planned on Italy, but we decided to save that for it's own trip. This is my first time, and I have been researching for months. My daughter is 13, and this trip is in place of the one her french class was offering, which was only 7 days on the ground, 2 Paris, 2 Brussels, and 2 Amsterdam. My husband and I decided it would be kind of a waste to go over there and be rushed, so I am going to take her instead. I have no hotel costs in London, since my best friend from high school lives there, so our budget isn't as big as yours. You should follow the advice here- do it on your own! That's how the best times happen. Smart girl doing it before you have kids! :-)

Debbie, You'll have a much better idea on how to arrange your holiday once you've finished reading Europe Through The Back Door. With good planning, it's quite easy to travel solo, but of course there are advantages and disadvantages to each mode of travel. You might consider the same method I've been using for several years, which is to combine travel on my own with about an equal amount of travel on a RS tour. That seems to provide the best of both worlds. A short tour would be an easy way to get used to travelling in Europe, and that would give you the skills and confidence to travel on your own in future. One tour you might consider is the 14-day My Way Best of Europe tour which is reasonably priced and covers some of the locations you mentioned. An Escort is provided on that tour, so you'd have to work out your own sightseeing schedule. There's also a fully Guided version available of the same tour at a higher cost. Click the "Tours" button at the top of this page for more details. I'd suggest using open-jaw flights for best efficiency, so you don't have to return to London. You could (for example) fly into London and return from Rome. I agree with the others that Spain would be better left for a future visit. A month is not a long time for travel in Europe, so a more relaxed pace would be a good idea for the first time. May is a good time to travel (spring shoulder season), and the weather should be quite decent (although no guarantees). As Laurel mentioned, many of us find planning to be part of the fun. I'm currently starting to plan for my next trip, and quite enjoying it. Good luck!

Lots of good advice already. I'll just add this: even if you prefer to travel independently (like I do), there's no reason you can't "cheat" by looking at tour itineraries and use those as a template or a starting point for your own. Rick has tours. His books suggest itineraries. Look these over and you will see patterns emerge that you can apply to your own, customized trip. One caution, though, on Rick's tours (especially), they move fast (and all the details are taken for of for you); as this will be your first time there, expect many things to take a bit longer (you will get lost, have to do mundane things, etc.). Nothing wrong with that, but don't plan to mimic the "blitz" pace of a guided tour. You won't be able to move quite that fast. The other advice I'll add is that as sure as the sun rises, first-time travelers seem to always try to pack in too much. Remember that every time you move from one place to another, it easts up at least half a day, even when you're moving smoothly and efficiently. Be realistic with travel times. When you start to see things like this in your plans, you need to step back and stop trying to cram in too much: Day 4: Up early, see museum in morning, take train to next city, visit famous site after lunch, tour something else after dinner... Minimize (or eliminate) 1-night stands; if you're coming or going every day, you never have enough time to actually be anywhere. This is hard to resist, but you'll have a much better trip if you slow down a little. Have a great trip!

Thank you all for your great advice. It looks like the general consensus is to do Europe on my own and take Spain out of the equation. My friend has decided to join me on this trip so it'll be us two girls! I know Spain is out of the way and I appreciate the fact that I would spend more time and money traveling there. But if I had to forego a country I do not want it to be Spain. I really want to go there and would trade Switzerland/Austria to fit it in. What do people think about starting in London, then making my way to Germany, Italy, France and flying out of Spain? Will that be doable - taking into consideration travel time (might take the train/fly if it's required)? Or should I take another route? I'll definitely be doing more research and will try using other tour templates. Might even do a small tour to start me off so I can ease into independent travel. Gosh I know I want to do too much with too little time! Really appreciate all your input! I'm getting more excited as the days go by (even though I have more than a year to go!)

Your choice, Debbie. Its your trip. All we do is give you the benefit of our experience and you pick. What I might do, after reading up, is think about what it is about certain places which excite you and what you think is negative about places. Then decide which are more important to you and your friend. Then run it past us again. Just because we all think that time is money and Switzerland is unique doesn't mean that you wouldn't find snow capped mountains boring and much prefer to wander Barcelona and look at unfinished art, despite the inconvenience. Happy planning.... a year to dream can make one big dream!

With all the Brits traveelling to Spain to get their annual does of sun, I would expect there have got to be loads of cheap flights from London to Spain- then you can wander from there up into France (south Coast or to Paris) and do the rest of your trip

Yes, good point Ken, budget airlines always check (in my experience anyway) weight allowances, so weigh your case before travel or expect a high penalty if it's over the limit. When my mother died I brought back on a flight with me some of her personal letters which put me slightly over the weight allowance and I had to pay an extra £40.00! Generally too, it is advisable NOT to take their travel insurance policy. The flights are so cheap that the insurance can often be as expensive as the flight, even more in some instances. So make sure you check what you are paying for before you make payment.

Nigel, haha your comment re unfinished art really cracked me up! I guess I've just always wanted to go to Spain so I feel like i will really lose out not going there. But that being said, I still have lots of time to plan and figure it all out, so you never know what my trip would end up looking like. Definitely glad there are so many helpful people on this forum! Brian, cheap flights sound good to me! Will definitely check them out. Thanks!

Take a look at Busabout.com. Busabout is a network of hop-on hop-off backpackers buses that travel through much of the places you mention (you can supplement the rest with cheap European airlines). The concept is very similar to the Australian/New Zealand bus networks of Oz/Kiwi Experience or Stray. Most travellers are in their 20s-30s. If your friend backs out of your trip, you can still go it alone as you'll meet loads of people and you aren't tied to the same group of people as it's not your traditional guided tour. They will help you arrange lodging with their preferred vendors if you need it, but it's not mandatory. You can buy a pass based on how long you'll be in Europe and what countries you hope to cover. It also gives you flexibilty as you can stay as long as you want at each overnight stop. Hate a place on the route? You can be out of there the next day. Love it? Get off the bus and stay til you are ready to move on.

Debbie, if you really want to include Spain and if you then decide to fly from UK to Spain as a starting point to travelling on the continent, check out Ryanair and Easyjet flights from UK to most Spanish tourist destinations. They tend not to fly out of Heathrow or Gatwick, but the added inconvenience of getting to Stansted or Luton is outweighed by the cost of the flights. If you then decide to fly from Spain to lets say Germany or Austria it can often be cheaper to fly Ryanair/Easyjet back to the UK (from Spain) if there is no direct flight from Spain, and then on to Frankfurt/ Munich/Vienna or which ever destination you chose. Someone I know who lives in Frankfurt travels regularly to Pau in France by Ryanair via London. It is still cheaper than a direct flight by Lufthansa or British airways. Hope you understand this. I know what I mean, but whether anyone else will is doubtful!

Debbie, As Spain is important to you, it should be possible to fit it into a one-month time frame. Which route to take will depend on the best availability and cost of open-jaw flights from Australia. I might consider something like this: > D1: Depart Melbourne > D2: Arrive London - jet lag recovery (try to choose a flight that arrives mid-afternoon - use LGW if possible as it's easier to navigate) > D3: London > D4: London > D5: London > D6: EuroStar to Paris > D7: Paris (2-day Paris Museum Pass might be worthwhile) > D8: Paris > D9: Paris > D10: Train to Interlaken / Berner Oberland - time ~6H:33M. 1 change (Lauterbrunnen or Murren would be a good location to stay) > D11: Berner Oberland - hike, visit Schilthorn & Piz Gloria, Paragliding if you're adventurous > D12: Berner Oberland > D13: Train to Munich - ~7H:13M, 1 change in Karlsruhe > D14: Munich > D15: Munich - possibly day trip to Salzburg > D16: Munich > D17: Train to Venice = ~7H:09M, 1 change in Verona > D18: Venice > D19: Venice, morning / train to Florence - 2H:03M, direct > D20: Florence > D21: Florence > D22: Train to Rome - 1H:35M, direct > D23: Rome > D24: Rome > D25: Rome > D26: Flight to Barcelona - consider Vueling from FCO to BCN - fares currently about €40 for travel in May > D27: Barcelona > D28: Barcelona > D29: Train to Madrid - ~5H, probably 1 change > D30: Madrid > D31: Flight home Note that there are numerous trains available each day on the routes you'll be using. I tried to balance shortest travel time with fewest number of changes, since this is your first trip.. continued......

Debbie - Part 2.... A few points on budget flights. > It's a good idea to book early, as they often use a "sliding scale", so the prices increase as the flight fills. Be very sure to read the Terms & Conditions carefully, so that you understand the baggage and other charges. > There's usually no seat selektion possible. If you want a choice, get to the gate early! > Rules for carry-on are more restrictive in Europe than some other places (I don't know if Australia is the same?). Usually only one carry-on item of the approved size and weight is permitted (they'll probably check). This doesn't mean one item plus a "personal item" such as a Laptop case or Purse, it means ONE ITEM ONLY! > In some cases, budget airlines provide really cheap rates but may operate from somewhat "out of the way" airports. RyanAir frequently does this (ie: they use Beauvais as their "Paris" airport - it's a considerable distance outside Paris). While the rates are attractive, you'll have to consider the time and cost (and aggravation) in getting to and from these more distant airports. For the flight from Rome to Barcelona, I felt the main airports in each city (FCO / BCN) would be easier for you, as easy transportation is available. This Itinerary is a bit more than a month - you'll have to "fine tune" according to which cities are most important to you. Cheers!

Thanks so much for your advice regarding my trip. Ceidleh, I have looked into busabout also and might be something to consider if I do Europe on my own. Shoni, I think I get what you mean. I might do Spain towards the end of my trip once I do a short tour. I am planning to spend maybe 6-7 days there and was looking to travel independently. But if I decide to do Spain first, then I will definitely look into your suggestion. I had a look at a few tours and one that I am really interested in is the Trafalgar Paris to Rome (8 days) which starts in Paris and goes to Lucerne, Venice, Florence and ends in Rome. Now as I am planning on starting my trip in London, I was thinking of flying budget from London to Munich to meet my friend for 4 days (perhaps throw in a side trip to Salzburg) and then take an overnight train to Paris to start my tour? After the tour I would then fly from Rome to Barcelona as per Ken's suggestion, and fly home from Madrid. I would obviously need to fine tune this to take into account travel time etc, but does this itinerary seem a little more doable? Also, thanks for the advice about the budget flights in Europe. I would definitely look into their terms and conditions more carefully. Cheers,
Debbie

I have looked at Trafalgar itineraries before, and it seems that most of their tours actually start in London. If you could do a London to Rome tour, then fly to Munich then to Spain, it would save you from using the overnight train.

If your tour statrts and ends in London (as a lot of them do), you could always leave them on the last day in Europe

Hi Ted and Brian, Thanks for that. I've looked at a number of tours and you're both right. Most of their tours start or end in London which makes it easier if I'm starting my trip in London. I think I might do one of those and leave the tour on my last day since the last day ends with breakfast and a transfer. Then I can fly or take a train to my next destination. Cheers,
Debbie

One additional suggestion: Even if you opt not to do a full tour (and I personally would not want to lock myself in to a tour), make use of the many walking tours available for some of the cities you are visiting. I am most familiar with those in the U.K. Most have been very interesting. You don't have to commit yourself to a big investment of time (or money) so if a particular tour doesn't strike you as being very good, you haven't lost much.

Debbie, I don't know if you're still researching tours ... have you checked out Contiki Tours? They run tours for 18 to 35 year-olds so you'll be traveling with people your own age.

Paul, thanks for that. It is a good idea especially since it does give one some flexibility. I have checked out a couple of short tours and walking tours in the cities that I am planning on visiting. Definitely one of the options I'm looking at. Cheers! Hi Audrey, yes I am still doing plenty of research (and reading this board for more info). Initially I planned to do a Contiki but the more I read and talk to people, the more I find that contiki is probably not for me mainly because of its party bus reputation. But if you have been on one, could you probably shed some light on how the tours are like?