We all travel differently

So true - there are some who are very car-phobic on here. Sometimes a car just works out better for seeing small towns and villages that would be harder or impossible to get to via a bus/train. We've rented twice in France, but generally trains work for us - about 90% of the time. But last year, some of the places we wanted to see in France I don't even think a bus went to - like Les Baux - where it looks like without a car, you'd have to taxi. When we went to Mont St Michel in 2012, I wanted to see it when it started getting dark, but the bus schedule just didn't allow for that, so a car was necessary.

I have been pretty much scared off of renting a car in Italy - too many ZLT's and crazy drivers. I don't think I could ever convince my husband to drive in the UK - he just can't wrap his head around driving on the opposite side. We may see about renting a car for a few days next year when we go to the Netherlands to see some more off the beaten path places, but I haven't gotten there in the planning yet. And I guarantee we will be renting in France again (with some trains thrown in).

I hope you enjoy the Xmas markets - they are def on my bucket list for some year. Next spring I'll be crossing tulip time in the NL off my bucket list.

Thank you for your kind words--you've said it all so well-- which remind me I, too, have benefited greatly from reading all these posts. I've learned a lot and even if something might not apply to me, it was interesting to learn different perspectives. The advice that did apply to me saved me money, time and stress. And the few times I was able to offer some small advice allowed me the pleasure of giving back.

I do agree with you that sometimes a car is the only way to get where you want to go. We did drive all over England and Italy. Quite challenging to say the least. Got stuck in Trafalgar Square, ran out of gas outside Orvieto, got lost in Rome. But they made for great stories when we got home.

Have a wonderful time at the Christmas markets! It's on my wishlist too. Please share what clothing you will pack for that weather.

Many thanks again.

We used to travel as far and to as many cities as we could--and hit just the highlights. $9.00 per gallon gasoline made me see the benefits of traveling slowly. We now stay in one place 3-4 days--doing day trips through the countryside.
We will take a train up to 3 1/2 hours. Otherwise, we are now taking budget European airlines from city to city. We still find automobiles the best way to explore outside the big cities--or in regions. It's just a very efficient way of travel where the trains don't go--like in the Alps. Tuscany is also best seen via auto.
And you're right about everyone having different travel styles. Everyone has different needs and interests.

David, you are right about different needs (I don't drive, for example), and interests - I prefer walking and villages to towns and sight-seeing. For me that's a difficult combination, that takes some ingenuity to plan. My advantage is that I can spend up to 5 weeks away, and don't have strict budget constraints, so I can mix in an occasional group tour with mostly solo walking.

Nicole: there is a bus that serves les Baux from St Rémy but it may be weekends only and/or only in summer.

I love trains. And I fell in love with them during my first trip to Europe in 1984. Love love love watching the world go by and day dreaming about what goes on in all those little villages you pass by - and dreaming of being spontaneous enough to just get off at the next stop and see what happens. I actually have done that a few times and once unintentionally and ended up stuck in a small Italian town. My best naps have been on trains.

But I also have had some great adventures driving and I went places that would have been much more challenging to get to if I didn't drive. I also have traveled a lot with my mom - and its nice to be able to get her from a to b without too much stress. (Although being in the passenger seat when I was driving on the small country lanes in western Ireland could not have been stress free... "Tourist Bus dead ahead!").

After 20 years of relying on public transport to get around Europe - the plunge to driving was not near as scary as I had imagined. But it does add some stress - navigating - street signs in another language - cryptic signs (does that mean I can drive down this street but not park - or park on this street and not drive?) So it depends on what kind of trip you want to have - when I just need down time - I travel by train - but if I have a little adventure in me and there is some remote place we really MUST see - car it is.

I traveled throughout Europe and Russia when I was a student and Asia when I was a young single in the Navy and it was more fun to travel on tours or take the train. When I got married I finally talk my husband into a month long car trip in the UK and he was hooked; he couldn't wait to do it aqain. But because of having to earn a living it was 10 years later. For quite a while we couldn't leave because I was looking after my Mom. Now we are seniors. We have enough money and time but not the will for any long trips. I really don't think I need to go on an arranged tour to see the "must-sees" because I've been there done that before you had to stand in line. Now I am tempted to take one of the RS Your Way Tours; because we could take time to see what we want or to just people watch. I encourage younger people to drive if they want to see the "real" places; but if you want to do the big cities, take the train. Sometimes you can book with a smaller tour to see such places as the Cotswolds. I was a little bit OD on quaintness there myself, so was glad I could drive through quickly. We used the National Trust Pass which did take us to some out of the way places such as Avebury that are harder to visit without a car. By the way, a Friend of mine took one of the River Cruises to do the Xmas Markets: she was by herself because her SO was not into it and had a blast celebrating with fellow Cruisers. This way you also have built in accommodations, food and entertainment. You can do this cheaper, but if you have the money, why not?

And don't forget one can see Europe, especially lovely rural areas, by bicycle.

We visited Les Baux last year...just about this time...early Oct. when I checked rome2rio if just shows bus to a certain area (St Remy) then a taxi.

Oh, Bruce, how I wish I had the stamina for a bicycle! My sorry attempt in Switzerland resulted in me locking the front brakes and flying head first over the handle bars. Didn't break or tear anything, but I was pretty bruised and sore. And my sorry attempts at biking around Central Park resulted in people 30 yrs my senior jogging faster than I was biking...lol.

Nicole P: there are more and more bicycle trips in Europe in which electric assisted bicycles are available. Also, some of the bicycle paths are quite flat so no need to brake hard resulting in an endo crash.

I encourage younger people to drive if they want to see the "real"
places; but if you want to do the big cities, take the train

Although this might be true for countries like France and Spain, with less dense rail systems than Germany's, the density of the German Rail system, and the number (almost 5700) of stations in Germany, most in small towns, augmented by an efficient bus system, make it a great country to get to the real places without the unnecessary expense of a car.

Nicole - re Les Baux: I think you are right - that bus may not run as late in the year as October. But Rome2rio, though I use it a lot, can be misleading about minor connections like buses, even if you include your date of travel, as you need to link through to the bus website to check the actual frequency of travel, first and last bus etc. to work out whether a trip is feasible.

The "being there" aspect is important to me also, where as the "must see" is relative. If the sight is a "must see" and I considered it as such, I go, regardless of the tourists. I may be at the site too but could be for different reasons, it's relative depending on each place. Getting a car particularly in Germany is usually unnecessary unless you are focusing on places known only to the locals, which are in the villages, off the main roads, at the edge of the city, etc. This applies more in eastern Germany, ie the villages I've seen in Brandenburg. If a combination of U-Bahn and bus gets me to the place, all the better, otherwise I'll put out the money for a taxi or be driven there..

@ John...I would suggest in regards to the auto sites Hockenheim bei Ludwigsburg, if that fits in the interest. Bottom line: it's all a matter of travel style, interest, and priority.

@Carole. We are midwesterners so we will be packing flannel pant(s), layer's of shirts, a 3 in one jacket for me and a shell and a down vest for my wife. We will be wearing waterproof hiking shoes. The kind that stop below the ankle. For socks we wear ski socks or warm hiking socks. Having done this area before at the same time of year I may only wear my shell or no jacket at all. It would have to be snowing for me to wear an ear band or gloves. My wife I am sure will have lightweight gloves, scarf, and ear covering.

@thistleamy5 My first trip over was in 1983. I took a bus tour and drove afterwards for 5 days. Since then I have always driven. Taking the train in November so we shall see how that goes.

@Kathleen. Driving in England & Scotland was more interesting (stressful?) than New Zealand. I did not find out about the National Trust pass until we were almost done with our trip. I will definitely get one the next time we are in England.

@Lee I will be in touch with you over the next few days with questions about the rail service in Germany.

@Fred when we drive in Germany it is most always the back roads and small towns. I jump on the Autobahn when we need to cover great distances or I need to get somewhere quickly. We like to stop when a place catches our eye or when it is time to eat we look for the little places.

I have to agree that each person and there preferences are different. Our first trip, our longest at 3,600km over six weeks and as many countries was by car. It was appropriate. Our last trip was one week by car in Italy, a two week escorted tour and one week using trains.

Why the difference? Italy was a trip to the heel and in rural areas. The escorted tour was in Croatia, Slovenia, Slovakia and Bosnian. The last leg was to three large cities and a car was a hindrance.

So do what is best for you. A car will be more flexible and more costly.

I have lived in Germany for almost 30 years and take the train exclusively. All the time, every day and on my vacations too. So, please let me know if you have questions about taking the train.

If you are going to Christmas markets it makes sense to use trains as you don't want to drive after even one glühwein. Picking out a hub to stay in and visiting nearby markets is wise. Frankfurt is ideal for this. From here you can visit the markets in Mainz, Weisbaden, Heidleberg, Rüdesheim, Limburg, Marburg, and if it is the weekend, Bad Homburg. Early in the Advent season, the markets in Idstein, Büdigingen, Gelnhausen, or Seligenstadt are nice to go to but they are only held on one weekend.

Head down to Stuttgart which has the nicest big market in my opinion. Then head over to near-by Esslingen which has a huge medieval market. You will want to be there when it gets dark and they light all the lanterns, torches and candles. Unique, hand crafted items will be found here.

So, thank you all from me and others like myself for your input. I
will help others when I can and view with admiration (and sometimes
envy) the responses from the many helpful people that visit this
forum.

This is very reason that I hang around these forums, even when my destination many times is "Beyond Europe." I have had some very negative experiences elsewhere on the Internet, and I haven't found the genuine helpful community that I've found here, even if the overall volume is a little low compared to other sites.

Recently, I accidentally made a post elsewhere that I was disappointed that the weather was so terrible on a recent trip. It wasn't just that it was raining -- we were prepared for that -- it was that there were winds over 50mph, hail, and rain so hard that you couldn't see out of the car even with the wipers on high. I just couldn't believe the vitriol this garnered. Instead of any sympathy or suggestions, I was told that it was basically my fault, that I gave up too easy, that I must not travel much, and that I didn't "get" it. I only learned one thing from this experience: never ever post anything to the Internet outside of the RS forums. In other words, thank you to those here who are helpful and who want others to have great experiences in their travel.

Hi everybody! Just a quick update. We had lovely weather and taking the train for the first time was without incident. We spent 10 nights across Germany, France, Czech Republic, Austria, and Hungary.
So, for those thinking that they need 1, 2, or 3 weeks for Europe. You do not. Go if you are going to go and enjoy yourself. You will go back.