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Unexpected realizations in Europe.

I don’t know what else to call it. It’s not about good or bad or right or wrong, but that may come in to it on occasion, its more about different.

Some may be universal but very little in Europe is universal so I will say it’s either country specific with the two-letter abbreviation of the country or I wont if I think its representative of what I experience on the whole of my travels (go to my information page to know what that means).

Some starters

  • Eggs don’t have to be refrigerated (let’s not go into it, there are already threads).
  • Service is culturally different, in that you own the table all night for instance, but also service is not as attentive to real needs as in the US (like getting someone to pay attention long enough to understand you want to pay and go).
  • Public Healthcare is free, but you gotta bring your own toilet paper. (HU)
  • Private Healthcare is a lot more enjoyable than US private healthcare (HU)

I have a hundred but would rather hear from others…..

Posted by
7036 posts

Bidets in many of the hotel rooms and apartments.

Hotels/inns in historic old buildings (some over 400 years old) will often not have elevators and bathrooms will be shoehorned into part of the room space. For me this is not a negative, I love these old places. But it's an adjustment.

Posted by
1099 posts

In some older buildings, hitting my head on the ceiling and needing to sit sideways on the toilet since there was not enough room for my legs (knees hitting the wall).

Posted by
7036 posts

In some older buildings, hitting my head on the ceiling

Ha, had to laugh at this one. I'm short, only 5'2", and I still hit my head on the ceiling of one of the attic rooms I stayed in.

Posted by
4859 posts

There are exceptions of course:

People having quiet conversations in nice restaurants.

People actually acting civilly to others in shops.

Public transportation that actually works.

Posted by
1322 posts

Rarely screens on windows that will open for fresh air

Posted by
1322 posts

Proprietors at food market choosing your food/fruit/vegs for you

Posted by
2505 posts

In addition to those already mentioned:
Squat toilets. Have run into these in Greece, Italy, and Serbia.
Showers. We have encountered bathrooms without any door on the shower, hand held shower heads that can’t be hung up at height for a shower. Both Greece and Italy.
Not flushing toilet paper- Greece.

Posted by
1692 posts

Not having the toilet in the bathroom. Something I always considered self evident (I grew up in Belgium) but have now realised isn't necessarily.

Posted by
516 posts

Smaller everything (not always but…): meal servings, elevators, hotel rooms, hotel beds, grocery store items, fridges in homes, cars,

Posted by
2267 posts

The lack of (turning) doorknobs on apartment doors.

Crosswalks that don’t have lights or stop signs for drivers. (But they respect them and stop…mostly)

Posted by
88 posts
  1. wandering around the Carrefour supermarket in France- "where in the world is the milk?" Oh, it's not refrigerated, it is all UHT shelf stable :)
  2. No electrical outlets or light switches in UK bathrooms.
  3. Tub/Shower combos with a tiny partial glass screen that in no way stops the water from getting out on the floor. (every European country I've been to so far)

Hmmm, does #3 suggest that #2 has some merit?

Posted by
2945 posts

Maybe Europe and the U.S. could merge their best qualities.

We used one of those all-in-one washer/dryers, which was rather comical.

The toilet thing is a little puzzling. Even in my no-name tiny town we have free, clean toilets in our parks. No need to worry if you have a quarter or whatever when you gotta go now. Also, I get a kick out of long lines in Paris waiting for one of those modern porta-potties. By the time those in the back of the line get there the day is getting away from them. Plus, the stench of urine is something else in some places, like the allies of Heidelberg in August. Whew!

Posted by
3123 posts

Hanging out your washing over the edge of a balcony 5 floors up and hoping you have enough pegs to keep it there! 🇮🇹
So many great choices of different public transport: Tube, bus, tram, train etc all in one city. 🇬🇧

Posted by
27156 posts
  • Derriere-squirting toilets. (Turkey; haven't been to Japan so can't compare)

  • Toilet paper missing from public toilets later in the day because there's no planned restocking. (southern Italy)

  • Doors on toilet stalls that extend all the way to the floor. (many countries)

  • Long-handled squeegees hanging in the shower to corral the water on the bathroom floor in the absence of a shower enclosure. (Norway)

  • Long-handled (roughly 24") shoehorns in hotel rooms. (northern Europe)

  • Wasa crispbread in the bread aisle rather than with the crackers (northern Europe)

  • Prevalent "cash not accepted" signs (especially in Norway, but not exclusively there).

  • Elbow-level door-openers mounted beside entrance doors (especially in Norway and Sweden)

  • Toilets on buses that are kept locked. (Spain, but not every bus)

  • Staircases without hand railings. (not limited to specific countries)

Posted by
32805 posts

Toilets in hotel rooms in tiny cubicle rooms by themselves and the rest of the bathroom elsewhere in the room or suite (FR)

Posted by
2041 posts

A bathroom enclosed by clear glass, in Copenhagen.

Mini size sinks, where there is barely enough room to wash your hands. Numerous places around Europe.

Showing our passport at the hotel reception.

Posted by
2355 posts

This, times 50:

I continue to be fascinated with how many different ways there are to
flush a toilet.

A few more:

  • Leaving your room key, typically with a giant fob of some kind, with the front desk when you go out (Italy, mostly)
  • Potato chip/crisp flavors that are actually interesting and taste good (all over, but I still crave Prague ham flavor)
  • Train travel is actually efficient, easy, and affordable
Posted by
11335 posts
  • Locking your door on the inside with the room/apartment key and remembering to leave it there in case you need to make a speedy exit
  • Stairways with no/insufficient handrails (things OSHA would squash in any lodging)
  • Door release buttons on apartment buildings, not always obvious
  • Lighting/power that only works when you insert a card in a slot by the door (so smart!)
  • Hall and stairway lights that time out
Posted by
8458 posts

In large cities in France, Italy, & UK, the most desirable and expensive places for upper middle class people to live, is in the core central city, as opposed to the suburbs, as in most (not all) US cities. An RS tour guide explained that to me, so it's not just my observation.

Most US homes I've been in that have been built within the last 40 years (including mine) have had the toilet in a room separate from the "bath/lavatory" area. We used to call that a "California bath".

Posted by
755 posts

Those bathrooms where the shower is in the bathroom but not enclosed so the water goes everywhere and there’s nowhere to put your towel or clothes to stay dry. And bath towels made of thin cotton that are not absorbent whatsoever. (Italy)
Also bathrooms enclosed with glass so there is no privacy. (Germany)

Posted by
2186 posts

@Laurel - AND public bathroom lights (restaurants, etc.) that time out!

Posted by
11335 posts

@Janet

AND public bathroom lights (restaurants, etc.) that time out!

Yes!!! Sometimes waving your arms from a seated position is useless. 😉

Posted by
10207 posts

Some surprises, some epiphanies and a lot of grousing on this thread.

Posted by
2369 posts

Rarely screens on windows that will open for fresh air

That ain't grousing, that's just a fact.

Posted by
2369 posts

Ice cubes

Bartender's Gold.
.
Often times when I've asked for tap water in Europe, they'll just take from the tap and serve it without ice ... I've simply viewed it as my penance.

Posted by
494 posts

I don't know if it's still the case but back in the day, not all pensions in Germany provided soap, shampoo or washcloths. I learned to carry these, always.
Also back in the day, toilet paper that could remove skin.

Posted by
1692 posts

Also bathrooms enclosed with glass so there is no privacy. (Germany)

The reason is usually to get daylight in the bath room. A German is more likely going to complain about lack of daylight than lack of privacy.

Those bathrooms where the shower is in the bathroom but not enclosed
so the water goes everywhere and there’s nowhere to put your towel or
clothes to stay dry.

I used to have that in my first flat. Made cleaning the bathroom a breeze as I could just use the shower head and some soap, and then would let it dry. I put my towel on a hook on the entrance door.

Posted by
3907 posts

If you criticize something in Europe it's your fault or you lack proper "context". I think Americans take criticism better and more constructively than Europeans generally.

Posted by
770 posts
  • European tilt and turn windows that open vertically or horizontally depending on how you turn the handle
  • Weighing and tagging produce yourself in the produce section of the grocery store
  • Not touching the produce at markets because that's the vendor's job (hat tip Linda in Seattle)
  • Way fewer outlets in a room than in the U.S. (bring your long charging cords)
  • In spite of the reputation for environmentalism, the continued reliance on bottled water at restaurants and refusal to drink tap water (starting to change, fortunately, but surprised there hasn't been more of a linkage made between these)
  • Small bars in Germany that still allow smoking (don't know if this is true in other countries)
  • Sensitivity to "cold" i.e. coats, hats, and scarves when it is in the 60s or even low 70s (Spain especially, but France, Italy, and Germany too). Also the ubiquitous black puffy coat -- men, women, children, elderly, teens, nuns (o.k., maybe not that last one) -- but a sea of black puffy coats in every city!
Posted by
6355 posts

Service is culturally different, in that you own the table all night for instance..

James, that used to be the case, but I'm finding more and more restaurants that assign you a specific amount of time when you book your table. Or once you are booked, you get a notice telling you that you have the table for 1 1/2 hours.

Small appliances
Washer in the kitchen
No dryer (but I never mind hanging up wet things to dry)
Heated towel racks are more common (love this!)
Duvets that fit on top of the bed exactly and do not hang over the edge
Different shaped pillows
Electric showers (these were pretty cool).
Adults (including men) giving each other a kiss on each cheek in greeting (such a wonderful PDA)

Posted by
11335 posts

European tilt and turn windows that open vertically or horizontally depending on how you turn the handle

I’d like to have my house so-equipped! So smart!

Posted by
1021 posts

Often times when I've asked for tap water in Europe, they'll just take from the tap and serve it without ice ... I've simply viewed it as my penance.

It’s the norm to serve water at the table without ice. You will rarely get iced water anywhere in Europe. I think it’s just what you’re used to. I always ask for no ice in soft drinks because I don’t like them being super cold. That’s quite a common request here.

Posted by
17961 posts

Carlos, I think every one but one or two are just having a good time. Not really critical, just "different".

Mardee, my hangouts I can sit all day for a cup of coffee. But my legs go to sleep so the bigger issue is the poor service. European waiters go to a special school to learn how to look the other way and to walk through a crowded room and see nothing.

Laurel, they dont have bug screens.

Posted by
10207 posts

I think Americans take criticism better and more constructively than Europeans generally.

That's because this is how we live and we don't complain; in fact, we laugh about things. When I first got to France, many people didn't have their own toilets in their apartments or farmhouses, few telephones, much less large fridges and large washing machines as were found in the States. There was a different standard of living, which is still carried over. Therefore, a few of the "realizations" sound cranky. Today, not having screens (which could change with climate change), drying my laundry on racks in the living room in winter and having to iron the clothes, having my washing machine in the kitchen, having our toilet in a room called la toilette and the bathtub in a room called salle d'eau are part of life, in fact a luxury, compared to before. (Ugh the idea of toilet spray near where we keep our toothbrush.) Delivery people still climb six floors to deliver furniture if the elevator is too small. That's life. So the "surprise" that washers and dryers aren't monstrous like the one I had in the in the US, or assuming we all have small fridges (mine is larger than any fridge I ever had in the US), and fewer plugs than in my US McMansion, are just part of life. We don't complain, we just get on with life and learn how to hold that shower head so the water hits the wall not across the room. Just keep waving those arms while on the throne and hitting those buttons in dark hallways to keep the lights on.

Posted by
2369 posts

It’s the norm to serve water at the table without ice

YET, the bottled water always comes chilled.

Posted by
2715 posts

I can only speak for me, but I don’t view these as criticism, just things that are different. I don’t like ice in my drinks, so I did not mean the shortage of ice cubes as a bad thing.

Posted by
427 posts

I think the first time a waiter ever came to the table with a hand-held credit card machine was in Europe. As was I believe my first unisex bathroom. I recall the smaller size of hotel rooms in Europe too. And Nutella--It was my first time in Europe. I was 17, and on a summer exchange program, living with a West German family (1983). I came upstairs the first morning for breakfast and there was this jar of chocolate icing on the table. This is for my toast? I couldn't believe it--dessert for breakfast! Also, In West Germany, I remember my host brother's English teacher going out to drink in a tavern with a group of his students--I thought that was unimaginable in the US!

Posted by
17961 posts

But healthcare is FREE!!!

A few things that most won't recognize are
Sales tax is 25 to 27% (yes, VAT but it drains the purse like a sales tax ... still I love the concept) My country of residence has a 15% income tax on top of that.

Then there apartment HOUSE FEES, that renters generally pay.... think HOA.

Electric is a solid twice the cost in Texas. But for most that's okay because there is no A/C and homes and appliances are less than half tge size.

Cable and internet less than half my Texas cost, but they all speak the wrong language.

When you balance everything, I am pretty comfortanle. Just "different"

Posted by
17961 posts

Good one ... Unisex Resttooms. I love to watch the expression of Americans

That and exterior doors that push in. I've sat and watched a number of Americans try to enter an ATM but gave up when the door didn't open out. Finally I yelled "push"!

Posted by
7307 posts

There’s so many fun unexpected realizations when traveling!

I do love those windows that open like a door and especially tilt because we like to sleep with the window open.

Observing how a line of people in Italy…..what am I saying? There’s no lines. ; )

How much walking is the norm, and how we feel so much better after a few weeks.

We both love the restaurant social culture in Europe where the staff are not bothering us during a meal with the “Is everything fine?” repeated type comments in the US.

Smaller quirky hotels - love them!

My favorite is how people of all ages gather in the town squares & piazzas in the evening and eat later in the evening.

The amazing ancient sites, architecture, church interiors - so beautiful!

Posted by
3123 posts

My friend in Scotland has her washing machine in a cupboard in her second bedroom, because that’s where the plumbing lines run through, but generally they are in the kitchen.
Easy to then go out the back door to hang up the laundry outside.
I’m always amazed when the washers are found outside on a balcony in Italy.

We put in a heated towel rail when we redid our bathroom here at home.🙂

Posted by
2041 posts

I don't read these unexpected realizations as criticisms at all, just differences.

When we lived in military housing, our washer and dryer were in the kitchen.

Posted by
6909 posts

Delivery people still climb six floors to deliver furniture if the elevator is too small

"What elevator 😂", was my thought from my 6th floor walk-up with dodgy plumbing, lead gas mains, and a working fireplace. At least I have piped gas; the corner stores still sell gas canisters... Everything is so old in Paris!

Posted by
17961 posts

Funny, there is another thread where an individual says they dont worry about voltage surge protectors because the electric in "Europe" is so good. And another that said they dont think a carbon monoxide detector is necessary because Europe is so modern and has gone electric. Personally, I dont worry too much about either, but the statements supporting it are sort of off base. I am just lazy and a tad reckless.

Posted by
17961 posts

So for context I left my 3000-sf hilltop self-designed and self-built home for a 700 sf flat in Europe.

I left my top of the line stacking front loading washer / dryer that holds a weeks’ worth of laundry for my washer / dryer combo that is advertised at 5kg but if you truly want it dry in under 4 hours you are limited to about 2kg (1 jeans, two shirts, two skivvies and two pairs of socks). No, I refuse to do the drying rack in the living room.

I left my central air and central heat for a thru wall AC that doesn’t work too terribly bad and wall mounted electric heaters that do a great job as long as the outside drop in temperature is slow and predictable.

My dish washer is replaced by ………… well, elbow grease.

My garbage disposal is replaced by ……….. well, to be honest, the toilet.

Daily shopping for essentials is so charming ……………… and so necessary because my refrigerator is about a 60-liter capacity (think large back pack). Good thing the eggs and milk don’t have to go in it.

I can make ice, or I can use the space to keep frozen two USDA NY Strip steaks I just paid 25.000 ft /kilo ($37/lb) for.

My cook top (hob to you brits) is a single induction.

My oven is a combo convection, standard, microwave that will hold a very small chicken.

My bathroom does contain all the fixtures in an America arrangement but that’s because I did the renovation. Prior to that it was the shower wand in the tile room.

My windows don’t open three ways, they open out to the street, but I put up a barrier down low so the people cant look in. No bug screen and impossible to add one.
In the summer my electric bill isn’t much lower than my home in Texas because I run the AC in the uninsulated pre 1900 building. And because electric is so dang expensive here.

Electric? I have 6 outlets in my entire home. Thats not 6 duplexes thats six single outlets.

In Texas I had a two-car garage with a wood shop and with a Land Rover and a Jensen Interceptor. Now I have a metro pass.

My Common Fee or House Fee or HOA fee is less than my property tax in the states by about 75% but still ain’t cheap. (why does spell check reject ain’t?)
Healthcare is free, but I am on a 9-month waiting list for a cardiac procedure that I could get done in the states in 3 weeks.

All said and done, I really enjoy my life here. But it isnt better than the US, just different. Actually, if you are under 45 you would need to think twice about such a move. I would say not to,.

Posted by
755 posts

What I really wish was the norm here in America is shutters on windows. To just fling open and have fresh air and light! No drapes or blinds or curtains!

Posted by
4527 posts

Well, this is intended to be a bit critical:

Being charged the equivalent of $3 by a restaurant for a SMALL leftovers box (Prague)

Being charged about $2.75 for 1-1/2 liters of tap water in an open carafe sometimes with an orange slice thrown in (frequently in Prague, I believe also Budapest).

Also: Clothes dryers without venting that have a water bladder that needs to be emptied.

Posted by
17961 posts

The water, never seen but believe you. I guess the tiurist traps are becoming more aggressive.

The dryer .... is called a condensing dryer. Common where historic codes don't allow vents out the wall. I own one but has a proper drain and not a collection bag.

Posted by
4527 posts

Mr E: The handy thing.about the dryer water bag is that it can be brought to the restaurant to avoid tap water charges.

Posted by
6355 posts

I don't see these as criticisms either. I find the differences interesting. And in fact, some of these differences can be found here in the states. For example, my cousin's 5th floor walk up in NYC has the bathtub in the kitchen.

And James, I have a single induction cooktop and a small convection/toaster oven in my kitchen (plus a separate microwave). I've found that's all I need for my cooking needs, although I will admit that if need be, I can always walk upstairs to my daughter's part of the house and use one of their two gas ovens. 😊

Posted by
2945 posts

I can understand the bus toilet being locked. We had a guy who destroyed the bathroom on one trip. I don't know what he ate or drank, but it was rough, my friends. A fresh-air dealer could have made good money. Whew!

Posted by
1099 posts

And would it have been any better if the bathroom was locked? Makes me a bit nervous for an upcoming trip where I am taking the bus instead of the train (Spain). Might be a rough 3 hours.

Posted by
2369 posts

I try hard as H to eliminate as much of the quaint and quirky as I can when I travel, by staying in upper scale lodging.

Posted by
7377 posts

I can make ice, or I can use the space to keep frozen two USDA NY Strip steaks I just paid 25.000 ft /kilo ($37/lb)

Is there anywhere in Europe that actually sells USDA inspected meat? And is it Prime, or Choice? Are steaks truly advertised as “NY Strip,” instead of “sirloin?”

Posted by
7377 posts

Another thing that’s different from in the USA is so many businesses (stores, restaurants, hair salons, gelatero shops) that have a pull-down metal cover when the place is closed. Especially in places in Italy, France, and Spain, if you didn’t know that there was a business behind that graffiti-covered metal wall, there’d be no clue, save for, perhaps, a sign above it.

Posted by
333 posts

I have to chuckle when I read some of these posts.

The washing machine was in the kitchen of the house I grew up in. Dryer was outside-called a clothesline. I never used a clothes dryer until I moved into my current apartment 1.5 yrs ago. I always used a clothesline-winter and summer and miss it to this day. (I'm 68).

I never had curtains in my house but did use insulated window shades for comfort, not privacy. Didn't need the privacy piece when living smack dab in the woods.

I have always loved the European window that tilts and opens and was thrilled that this window is in the building I now live in, esp since I love to crack open the window in winter.

Things I miss from Europe from when I lived there 1975-78:
-small water heaters for the kitchen and bath so you can heat what you need and not a 300 gallon thing
-bike paths between villages that are shared with tractors and other farm equipment but never cars
-seperate toilet room and bath room
-abundance of local food and open markets

Posted by
1692 posts

The dryer .... is called a condensing dryer. Common where historic
codes don't allow vents out the wall. I own one but has a proper drain
and not a collection bag.

This is not so much about code, but about energy. Blowing lots of hot air outside is wastefull.
Anyway, I am always amazed by how the topic of dryers comes up. We have a dryer too. Its. as is the norm i Switzerland, a non vented dryer as well.
We do not use it a lot. My wife would kill me if I put her clothes in the dryer. So all it is used for is towels and (when the wife isn't looked) sometimes some of my stuff.

Posted by
17961 posts

Cyn, yes. Prime. But you pay an arm and a leg. The ones I have bought have been excellent.

Funny about a strip and a sirloin. I went to a nice steakhouse in Budapest a few nights back and ordered a NY Strip (Argentinean beef) and a round piece of meat was delivered. I complained but the waiter pretended not to understand. But we do have a another steakhouse that has nice American beef.

Okay, another difference is Europeans butcher beef substantially differently.

Posted by
10207 posts

The handy thing.about the dryer water bag is that it can be brought to the restaurant to avoid tap water charges. LOL
Nearly blew the Bialetti café across the kitchen.

-Can speak only for France for all the following, but : Yes, meat is cut along the muscle rather than across muscle. I tell the butcher what I'm making and he sells the me the appropriate meat.
-No dryer, never had one in France and I don't know any French people who do, even higher income folks, only the American ex-pats. Agree with Wengenk's wife about not putting her clothes in the dryer.
-Live on the Mediterranean and had a large heat pump air conditioning unit installed that cools the whole 1,000 sq ft place. Had additional electric sockets installed. Had 3,000 sq ft in the US.
-Had a Bosch dishwasher in the US; our French Bosch is smaller. Will be replaced. Fridge is a giant 4-door. 3-burner induction cook top. Oven too small for US cookie sheets or a turkey. I don't have to host Thanksgiving.
-Over the stove exhaust fans in apartment building don't exit the air. It just circulates.
-Every room with water in newer buildings, has mandatory air evacuation systems running 24/7 to avoid mold.
-Garbage disposals are illegal. Have little baskets in the drains to catch chunks. Bio-waste is now to be recycled at bins in the streets, as in Italy. New law just took effect. 30% of waste is bio. Speaking of bio, had a Villeroy and Boch toilette installed.
-Heavy groceries are delivered every two weeks, UHT milk, water because ours is too hard for anyone who has had kidney stones, canned, packaged, foods, bottled drinks. OTOH, I drink the tap water because it's hard with calcium.
-Always had one car in the US, now no car. Loved my hybrid SUV. Now we have trams, buses, two train stations, an airport.
Yes, agree about age, career, and moving. Earning money to save is not as easy in Europe. So, take advantage of the best both places have to offer.

Posted by
2369 posts

We have a dryer too ... We do not use it a lot.

We / I have been using a clothes dryer from the day they were invented. I haven't seen the wear on clothing that Europeans claim occurs from using clothes dryers. In high humidity Europe, clothes can take decades to air dry - no thanks.

Posted by
17961 posts

I didn't realize that Europe was more humid than Canada? Good to know. Thank you.

The hand-cranked clothes dryer was created in 1800 by M. Pochon from France. In 1892, George T. Sampson developed and patented America's first automatic clothes dryer.

How old are you?

Posted by
1021 posts

I have a condenser dryer and use it about twice a month in winter. Clothes do shrink in it so only use it for towels and things like school uniform which is indestructible. In decent weather I dry outside and have an indoor airer that I use the rest of the time.

Posted by
4527 posts

I haven't seen the wear on clothing that Europeans claim occurs from using clothes dryers.

I went rogue at home and went to clothesline drying years ago, and yes, clothes will last much longer when air dried, especially thick weaves like denim or towels. Towels turn to boards though so need 10 minutes in the dryer on the air fluff cycle.

I don't understand the humidity comment, even in very muggy weather clothes will dry. It's only on dark windless humid days that clothes won't dry in just a few hours. For those interested in the arcane: when faced with a choice of hanging clothes up in freezing morning weather, or waiting till it's above freezing, the clothes will dry faster if hung up early; they will freeze but they give up a lot of moisture in the freezing process and will be dry earlier in the day than if you had waited.

Posted by
3857 posts

In our Croatian apartment there is no heat or A/C. And it snows there frequently. Gets pretty cold, which is one reason we don’t visit after October. The heat I can deal with cause we usually get a nice breeze, we’re off the sea.
The combo washer/dryer is only used to wash because if the clothes are dried it would take a can of spray starch to get the wrinkles out. We hang the clothes on the balcony.
We also are in the 5th floor, no elevator. And no screens on the windows, but shutters. Never had a problem with bugs, too high up.
To use the stove, we have to open the gas, then light the burner, then turn off the gas afterwards.
Complaints?, no, just differences. Differences we can easily live with.

Posted by
2369 posts

clothes will last much longer when air dried, especially thick weaves like denim or towels.

I guess I just purchase higher quality items that don't sufffer that fate

Posted by
6355 posts

For those interested in the arcane: when faced with a choice of hanging clothes up in freezing morning weather, or waiting till it's above freezing, the clothes will dry faster if hung up early; they will freeze but they give up a lot of moisture in the freezing process and will be dry earlier in the day than if you had waited.

Tom, that's very interesting. I always hung my clothes out to dry when I lived in Colorado and Ohio, but haven't tried it in Duluth because of the weather. Looks like I might need to try that out. Thanks!

Posted by
4527 posts

but haven't tried it in Duluth because of the weather

I have done crazy things like stand in deep snow and hang up clothes to dry, because in February the sun is strong enough to dry clothes even if the temp is barely above freezing (I am closer to the equator than the north pole, unlike most of Europe, although on a bitter cold day it is hard to believe it). In the last 9 months I have line dried everything except one load during a chilly wet week, but it has been exceptionally mild. I guess I do it because of climate change guilt over all of those airline flights I take.

Posted by
2041 posts

Even within the US there are so many differences. When we lived in base housing and in upstate NY, we did not have a garbage disposal. We had a well when we were in NY, so when power went out we were in a bind, so we kept gallons of water on hand just in case. When we visit our relatives in Alaska, there is no running water, no indoor plumbing, no roads, etc. The only way there is by float plane and then hike for 5 hours or their bush plane. The outhouse does not have doors, just two sides and those are half walls and then a roof. No refrigerator of course, so the flooring was cut and under the house is where we put the perishables. You do not go outside without a gun and a dog. No cell service. We take our Garmin Inreach for emergency, and out family has a sat phone as backup. Doing laundry with a washboard and then hanging everyrrhing to dry. Elastic items like bras and underwear have to be hung inside unless it is summer as elastic will break when it freezes. Outside of summer we use a laundry line in the covered porch. I took a picture one year (mid Sept) of my husbands socks that he had wrung out and hung, and in the morning they had long icicles on them. Yes, this is all a bit extreme as it is so far up in the bush. but there are still quite a few people that live this way, so it is not out of the norm by any means.

Posted by
1692 posts

For those interested in the arcane: when faced with a choice of
hanging clothes up in freezing morning weather, or waiting till it's
above freezing, the clothes will dry faster if hung up early; they
will freeze but they give up a lot of moisture in the freezing process
and will be dry earlier in the day than if you had waited.

We actually learned this in primary school. As an example of how some things may be counterintuitive. And to explain why our mothers would indeed hang laundry out to dry in winter.

I now live at a much higher altitude, where in winter the air is cold, but dry. And stuff does dry outside almost as fast as my dryer could...

Garbage disposals are illegal

They are actually legal in most places, but there is no interest. Maybe we just have better garbage collection.

Posted by
4527 posts

Garbage disposals are illegal

With organics weekly pickup becoming more common in the US, we have that and so only use the disposal when the rinsed off stuff starts to back up the flow of water in the kitchen sink, just 10 seconds every week. In general I think the US is ahead of Europe in pickup of recycling and organics. This is one of the AirBnb things, when you "live like a local" you deal with this stuff. Both Prague and Budapest have perplexing recycling, like metal goes in the receptacles marked "plastic only," etc, and it all felt half-hearted. Both our hosts told us to not bother with recycling. I am sure some countries do better.

Posted by
17961 posts

I remember a magazine they passed out in elementary school ..... Scholastic .... or something like that. It had a cartoon picture of a kid that put hot water in the bird bath in the winter and the birds found it frozen. The caotion was hot water freezes faster than cold water. I remember that from nearly 60 years ago.

My trash pickup in Bpest is daily. I don't understand the recycling codes so everything goes in one.

Posted by
10207 posts

My cousin lived in an Alaskan village north of Norton Sound. She told me her babies' cloth diapers took only a few minutes to dry. She'd hang then outside and a few minutes later shake off the ice crystals, bring them inside and fold them. Freeze dry, just like instant coffee she taught me.

Posted by
1692 posts

European thing that might perplex Americans: Teenagers drinking beer and wine, and nobody finding that a big issue...

Posted by
317 posts

One I've noticed more lately...no top sheet. Only the fitted or bottom sheet and a duvet. Not sure why?

Posted by
1654 posts

Most of what I have to add has already been mentioned, but a few that stand out for me (and some, I've adopted at home):

On-demand water heaters that need to be switched on and off (Paris, Hong Kong). (Thought on-demand heaters were such a good idea that we got a Rinnai in our home, although it does not need to be turned on/off manually.)

Those wonderful European windows that tilt and turn also tend to be wonderfully sound-dampening. (First encountered in Vienna.) Loved these so much, we tried to get them for our home when we replaced our windows, but that proved to be difficult, so we settled for crank-style triple-pane, instead.

Workers expect to be greeted before you ask them a question (Hungary, and other places).

A king bed is usually two twins pushed together. (Ours at home is now like this, because we have latex mattresses, which are heavy.)

Induction hob (first encountered in Hungary--loved it so much, we got an induction stove).

Toilet in separate room--makes so much sense. I've seen people complain about this in reviews, but when we first encountered this (in our apartment in Paris), we found it a lot more convenient for our family of five than having everything in a single bathroom.

Great public transportation infrastructure. Makes so much sense, and makes life easier, less stressful, and less expensive.

Mixed-gender public bathrooms (first encountered in Munich). Makes sense and is probably more practical and economical than duplicating everything.

Espresso makers at most breakfast buffets.

Three things I don't like: eating dinner later (I have reflux, and need to avoid eating a certain number of hours before bed, as a rule). Undercooked ground beef (Mainz, among other places). Pissoirs on the street (Lisbon).

Posted by
2041 posts

Bets-Our family is a ways north west of Coldfoot, within hiking distance of the Gates of the Arctic park. No village, just a few family cabins that are within about 18 miles of each other. We love to go visit as it is so unique.

Kaye--We love the duvet with no top sheet! We adopted that a few years ago. We brought the duvets home from Iceland with us since they are not a size that we can easily find here.

BB--Our toilets are in separate rooms from the rest of our bathrooms. I do love that it is easier when multiple people are needing to get ready.

Posted by
1692 posts

One I've noticed more lately...no top sheet. Only the fitted or bottom
sheet and a duvet. Not sure why?

Why would you want a top sheet if you have a duvet? I have all my life always slept under a duvet at home (with a fitted bottom sheet), and those occasions where I had to deal with sheets I actually did not like them.

Undercooked ground beef

What is considered the right way to cook beef is of course as matter of debate. I actualy like raw grond beef (tartare) and will make that myself. When I order a hamburger I want it medium.
Many restaurants will show you the door if you dare order meat "well done". Or at least, they should :-)

Posted by
1654 posts

I don't mind steak done medium, but I cannot bring myself to eat ground meat that isn't well-done. If there are any bacteria on steak, it is on the outside, and the heat kills them. However, when meat is ground, any bacteria on the outside gets transferred throughout. If it is not cooked thoroughly, that bacteria is not killed. I know there are people who eat steak tartare, and I know there are people who eat hamburger that is pink on the inside, but I cannot and do not.

Posted by
5273 posts

Is there anywhere in Europe that actually sells USDA inspected meat? And is it Prime, or Choice? Are steaks truly advertised as “NY Strip,” instead of “sirloin?”

Yes but it's expensive. It's always Prime, I've never seen Choice available most likely because why would you bother importing it? The cuts I've seen for sale are labelled as the US cut. I've never bought any as I think Scottish beef is better and it's a lot cheaper.

As for dryers, I have one and I had one as a kid in the 80's. I know plenty of people who have them so they're not as uncommon in the UK as some people believe.

I also don't recognise any of the issues with bathrooms, showers etc that have been described. I've never experienced any of them anywhere I've travelled in Europe other than the non flushing of toilet paper in Greece and other Mediterranean countries. It sounds like those places require significant modernisation.

Posted by
17961 posts

Steak Medium? No, RARE to medium Rare at worst. Ground beef? It appears to me that the temp control for cooked and uncooked food seems to be a tad lax in the parts of Eurooe where I have observed it. So, please cook the cr-p out of my burger.

Posted by
2369 posts

One I've noticed more lately...no top sheet. Only the fitted or bottom sheet and a duvet.

I can't remember ever having a top sheet in Europe - nor do I want a top sheet - nor do I use one at home.
.

I actualy like raw grond beef (tartare) and will make that myself.

If Tartare is on the menu - first question ALWAYS, is that chopped or ground - if it's ground, I want nothing to do with it.

Posted by
4527 posts

I was entranced by the men’s room urinals in the German parliament, each urinal in its own room with walls and door with knob. A thing of beauty. Absolutely no chance of embarrassment from tardy flow or escaping gas.

Posted by
406 posts

When we lived in a German apartment for 4 years we had no closets but each bedroom had a freestanding armoire. Our single bathroom had two sinks, one large deep tub, and a separate glassed in shower stall. We had 2 small kiddos then and it was the best family bathroom ever. This was 1980-84 so many years ago now. We loved the dual windows and no screens, never had bugs. Most, but not all, of the 6 apartments were rented to American Air Force folks. It was the best tour by far of our 20 years. Changed our lives I’m convinced, to have had that experience. So important to realize your ‘way’ isn’t the only or best ‘way’.

Posted by
10207 posts

In France, at the butcher shop, the beef is ground while you watch. You tell the butcher how many ounces and the machine is adjusted to what you want. You are then supposed to serve it at the next meal, not let it hang around to develop bacteria. There's no package hanging around in a fridge for a few days. There's no such thing as 70% meat with 30% fat, or 80% or 90%. It's all extremely low fat, called biftek haché--another difference.

I would never buy steak haché in a supermarket, though many people do.

To use steak haché for ground beef doesn't work unless you add some fat. It's too dry for those US recipes. We have to add cubed bacon, called lardons, when making a spaghetti sauce or chili. Another difference.

Posted by
1413 posts

Laurel mentioned the hotel rooms that your room key card need to be inserted to power the room, I've seen that in Ireland, on my first low budget trip to Europe I remember staying in a place in England or France where we literally had a coined meter in the room for lights. On the same trip I had a huge "well, DUH" moment that many of the buskers in the Tube played Beatles music.

being born in 1963 I heard Beatles and Monkees music always in the background played by my older siblings and I missed the whole British Invasion part of the story.

Posted by
2047 posts

Have booked many hotels with an elevator only to find the elevator starts up a flight of stairs. Understand why this occurs in historic buildings, but have also encountered this in several newer hotels. I use a wheelchair, but luckily can still climb a flight if there is a railing.
Likewise, I’m often surprised to find a handicap bathroom intge basement.

Posted by
4119 posts

Becky, I am NOT a handicap user, so for me it is only a matter of interest - not of usage. But I had forgotten about two hotels I stayed at this year (one in Salzburg and one in Budapest) where I took the elevator up several floors as far as it went - and then had a flight of stairs beyond that.

Posted by
1692 posts

I would never buy steak haché in a supermarket, though many people do.

I buy mine frozen. You can buy it here in little frozen "sausages". I suppose that where the produce it they directly grind it in to the sausage tube. They are in small portions so I need several if I am going to make a steak tartare. I just squeeze the meat out of the tubes still frozen, add the spices and condiments (usually also a raw egg) and server it still cold.

To use steak haché for ground beef doesn't work unless you add some
fat. It's too dry for those US recipes. We have to add cubed bacon,
called lardons, when making a spaghetti sauce or chili. Another
difference.

For things like spaghetti sauce I have always bought "half and half". Half beef, half porc. Works a charm. Every butcher should have that.

Posted by
4156 posts

So many of these observations brought back what I learned on my first trip to Europe (late September to mid-January, 1977-78). And what I lived on the "economy" in Nürnberg while working for the US Army 1982-85.

I was on the top floor of an old building that survived WW2 with minimal damage. Each floor had one large apartment on it. Above me was a storage area with no insulation. Even with radiators and a space heater I took from room to room, it was never warm.

The toilet was on a platform in a separate room with a tiny cold water only sink. The bathroom had the tub and larger sink with warm water. The tub was huge with only the typical hand-held shower wand. That was no problem for me but perplexing to my Chicago friend who visited. I quickly learned that if I wanted to bathe on Saturday, I needed to get up early or else I'd need to heat water for the tub.

There were no laundry facilities. I tried to do my laundry on more than one post, but even getting there early, all the washers and dryers would be in use. I finally gave up and bought a washer at the PX that hooked into the kitchen sink and heated its own water. It fit in the tiny kitchen between the sink and stove and worked as a counter space. The previous tenants left open shelves in the kitchen. I got a workbench from IKEA and put it under those shelves. That completed the kitchen.

There were 3 open closets of simple wood framing with shelves and a rod also left by those tenants. They were in each bedroom and in the entrance hall. I got long lace style curtrains from IKEA and attached them to the closets. At that time, anything that was enclosed was counted as a "room" for taxing purposes and Germans moved their kitchens, cabinets and all, with them.

Did I mention that there was no elevator? When my mother visited, she counted the steps, something that never occurred to my then 36 year old self. There were 99. The stairwell was quite wide with handrails on both sides. Anything that needed to go to my apartment was carried up those stairs.

When I brought the workbench up it was in a flat box that wasn't very big, but was very heavy. I had to go one step at a time with it. When my household goods were delivered, they were carried up by very strong German men, often strapped on their backs. Anything I got from the Army's free resources or bought was brought up the same way, including the clothes washer.

There was a tiny balcony off the kitchen with clotheslines. The times they worked for drying were rare due to the consistently gray, cool and damp weather. The sheets were too big for it, period. So I rigged up a clothesline in the extra bedroom from the closet to a part of the window structure. Regardless of season or weather my sheets and anything else I hung on it took 2 days to dry.

My windows were modern like the ones others have described with the tilt opening option. I loved them. I cat sat for a friend who was in a ground floor duplex in Erlangen. She had a patio door and windows that were like that. Neither of us had any screens, but being on the ground floor, she had metal roller shutters (rolladen) on all windows and doors. They were good for keeping the bugs out and for security. I had no window coverings at all, but the previous tenants did leave the apparatus for pull shades. IKEA to the rescue again with cute shades in a blue sky with clouds pattern.

My absolute favorite thing about living in Germany and about traveling in Europe is the wonderful dogs -- especially being able to see them not just outside, but also inside pubs, bars and restaurants. In Instanbul, it's the "feral" (not) cats that beg for food or snuggle up to you when you sit down.

Posted by
17961 posts

I have yet to enter a country that addresses the needs of those with physical challenges to anywhere near the degree that they are addressed in the US.

Posted by
1692 posts

I have yet to enter a country that addresses the needs of those with
physical challenges to anywhere near the degree that they are
addressed in the US.

in Switzerland public transit is pretty much entirely wheelchair accessible.

Posted by
17961 posts

Not Swiss, but the European Accessibility Act (EAA), in dealing with facility accessibility, doesn't come close to the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA). But the EAA does address a lot of non-facility issues that the ADA was not designed to address

I just walked about a kilometer through Budapest and not one of the 50 or more shops was accessible by ADA definition. Nor was the sidewalk or the street crossings.

And I am not picking on Budapest. I have seen places that are somewhat better, Paris for instance, but still no where close to meeting US requirements for, by and large, unassisted access to all public and private services.

If you are in a wheelchair, I suspect the best place in the world for you to be independent is the U.S.

Posted by
501 posts

One I've noticed more lately...no top sheet. Only the fitted or bottom sheet and a duvet.

The key point here is that duvet covers are changed and washed when the bottom sheets are, so they are basically your sheet.

Posted by
501 posts

But it’s so much more work to stuff a duvet into a cover!

More work than making a bed with an upper sheet and blanket?? ;-)

Posted by
6418 posts

If you are in a wheelchair, I suspect the best place in the world for
you to be independent is the U.S.

Maybe, but only if you have a car and are able to drive. Good luck trying to be independent in North America if you can't drive.

Posted by
17961 posts

In my city you call a bus for the disabled (really a van). They come to your housr. From a door that you can actually open by yourself to the street that is fully accessible where the bus picks you up and takes you to the mall or to work where the sidewalk from the bus to the door and the door is fully accessible. Once there if you need the WC it is also fully accessible.

Here, in Budapest you will also need a car or bus as the walks are impassable. Then you will need two people to come along and lift you into the door and carry you down the stairs to the WC and carry you into the WC and sit you on the pot.

Nope, no comparison.

Posted by
333 posts

Eating pizza with a knife and fork. No pre-sliced pizza anywhere.

Bagging your own groceries at the store after the cashier (sitting) moves items from one cart to another. Then you wheel the cart to the counter where you pack up your stuff in reusable bags (even in the 70s) or purchased bags.

Posted by
427 posts

This thread is so interesting! Since I have just wrapped up a trip with kids, I’ll weigh in with some observations mainly based on family travel:

-More diverse, interesting playgrounds including playgrounds with riskier elements (Switzerland, Italy, Germany).
-Excellent discounts for kids. For my 4 year old, I don’t think we ever had to buy her a ticket on any public transit. Her tickets on the Flybus and our Iceland day tour were both free. Ages 6+ was often half price or a reduced fare.
-Family passes for museums often cost about the same price as 2 adult tickets
-Kids menus were not always available, but when they were they often had some smaller versions of a regular meal (like schnitzel in Berlin).
-Family lanes at airports which allowed us to bypass most lines and board earlier if we wished
-Not kid related, but all corner stores seemed to have a coffee machine that made a decent cappuccino for a great price. Coffee lids are made of cardboard and not plastic.
-Lots of interesting Haribo flavors all over. I was the only one in our group who liked the salty, black licorice Haribo that I found in Iceland.

Posted by
981 posts

-More diverse, interesting playgrounds including playgrounds with riskier elements (Switzerland, Italy, Germany).

The answer is pretty simple - most European countries have civil law not common law. So insurance is only required to restore you to the position you were in before the accident occurred. And in most countries healthcare for kids is covered by the state. Kids bones heal quickly and the medical costs are covered by the state, so the owners of the playground are never likely to have to make a big payout, hence kids can be kids.

You might be in for a nasty surprise if you are not a European citizen and your kid had a serious accident as you are probably going to be left footing the bills.

Posted by
10207 posts

Another difference spouse and I discussed this am: the door to the toilet room, the WC, is always kept shut in France even when not in use. Instead, you lock the door when you are using it. (Maybe not for just close family, but if guests are in the house, you lock it so no one will walk in on you).
It's very faux pas to leave the WC door open after you leave the room.

I have a mixed group of Americans and French coming over tomorrow, so I am warning the Americans to lock the door for privacy, and to close the door afterwards.

Posted by
770 posts

More diverse, interesting playgrounds

In Spain, one park had a playground where everything was made of chrome steel, black leather (probably leatherette) and black rubber, chains, and grommets. I'll let you decide what that sounds like, but it definitely did NOT look like a kid's playground to our American eyes!! Still, the kids and parents were enjoying it as much as any other playground we've seen, but we were trying so hard not to laugh as we walked by. Wish I'd taken a picture, but not with the kids there. But YES to more diverse and interesting playgrounds; that would never have flown in the U.S.

Also hat tip to whomever said eating pizza with knife and fork. I've also noticed (this was in Switzerland) that gourmet burgers -- the kind stacked with a few ingredients -- also were eaten entirely by knife and fork. No picking it up and shoving it in the mouth!

Posted by
1692 posts

Also hat tip to whomever said eating pizza with knife and fork. I've
also noticed (this was in Switzerland) that gourmet burgers -- the
kind stacked with a few ingredients -- also were eaten entirely by
knife and fork. No picking it up and shoving it in the mouth!

It is anyway impossible to pick those up without creating a huge mess.

Posted by
2369 posts

It is anyway impossible to pick those up without creating a huge mess.

First off, tell them to hold the excessive mayo and ketchup then, cut the burger in half then, put the burger in a two-handed grip and enjoy.

Posted by
10207 posts

First off, tell them to hold the excessive mayo and ketchup then, cut the burger in half and enjoy.
Then continue eating it with the knife and fork. LOL

Posted by
7036 posts

First off, tell them to hold the excessive mayo and ketchup then, cut the burger in half and enjoy.

Then continue eating it with the knife and fork. LOL

I'll never understand eating a hamburger with knife and fork. What's the point of putting the meat in a bun if you're going to eat it that way? The whole idea of sandwiches (including hamburgers) being in a bun or between two pieces of bread was so that you could pick it up and eat it without utensils.

Oh well, viva la difference!

Posted by
17961 posts

No, Nancy, a burger with a knife and fork crosses the line. Unforgivable. I ask for a second plate then I use it to rectify the situation.

Posted by
4758 posts

Back to the risk factors, and it's an individual's responsibility to keep one's self safe in Europe-
A guy in Switzerland said the Swiss don't have many warning signs in ski areas. His rationale was that if the ski resort started to tell skiers what to do, they would have to assume responsibilities for warning everyone about all the possible poor decisions folks could make.
Does that seem plausible?
I find it interesting in Europe that castle walls, cliffs, etc have no fences, no signs, no protections keeping folks from making dumb decisions. If you walk on the cliff wall, and go over, it's Darwinism in play.....

Posted by
17961 posts

A guy in Switzerland said the Swiss don't have many warning signs in
ski areas. His rationale was that if the ski resort started to tell
skiers what to do, they would have to assume responsibilities for
warning everyone about all the possible poor decisions folks could
make. Does that seem plausible?

That is actually 100% a risk in the US too.

Posted by
5530 posts

All said and done, I really enjoy my life here. But it isnt better than the US, just different.

This was exactly my feeling when I lived in both Sweden and the UK. Some specific things were better than the US, some specific things were worse, but overall it was mostly just different. You get used to the differences.

With regard to why one might want a top sheet, sometimes the weather is too warm for the duvet. I prefer to have a top sheet so that I can remove the duvet from the bed and sleep under only a sheet when in a hotel room with no AC and no fan and a temperature over 30 degrees C.

When I lived in Stockholm, my apartment had a laundry room in the basement. You had to reserve a time for the room. There was a board in the laundry room with all the days of the month and 3 timeslots of 4 hours each day. You had a lock with your flat number which you locked on the board to reserve your timeslot. The laundry room had 3 washers, 2 tumble dryers, a ”closet” dryer, some rollers (for pressing tablecloths), etc. When it was your timeslot, you got use of the entire room. You typically could only find a timeslot 2 weeks out which meant I only did laundry every other week and I washed everything. It wasn’t uncommon for someone to decline an invitation for a social event because it was during their laundry time. This was 20 years ago and I suspect more people have compact washers in their flats now.

I think the toilet in a separate room makes sense, but it drives me crazy when there is a toilet in a room with no sink and you have to go a different unconnected room to wash your hands.

Posted by
406 posts

Back in the 80s when we lived in Germany and visited other places, like Spain, I was shocked about food on platters in tapas bars sitting out for hours with no refrigeration. It gradually dawned on me maybe my mother being paranoid about botulism occurring rapidly in non refrigerated foods was a bit overblown.

I also continually notice, as a present day tourist, that Europeans take the stairs; elevators are frequently small and out of the way in public places because unless you are in a wheelchair or 102, you take the stairs. It’s not unusual to see parents hoisting strollers up flights of stairs in a very practiced manner. I also notice people in Europe seem slimmer than my fellow Americans.

Posted by
2041 posts

Growing up, the only thing I can remember eating without a fork and knife were tacos. Everything else was fork and knife. My grandmother went to finishing school and after that to Paris for several years to learn to cook. So manners were very much followed in our household, to the "T". I each burgers with my hands, and sometimes pizza, but can still feel my parents and grandparents giving me the look.

Posted by
2076 posts
  • You might be in for a nasty surprise if you are not a European citizen and your kid had a serious accident as you are probably going to be left footing the bills.*

Of course I would be responsible for the bill.

Posted by
333 posts

Curry in the ketchup (Germany).
Airing your duvet every day but hanging it out the window.

Posted by
4527 posts

Back to the risk factors

The fact that the entire Budapest riverfront has no railing is pretty wild. The Danube is one of the few rivers in Europe with a lot of flow and velocity, too.

Posted by
17961 posts

The San Antonio River Walk is the same. Of voutse only about r feet deep. Also wild in Budapest are the trams trhroughbpedestruan zones with no barriers. Stairs down to metro stations with few or no hand rails. Standing on busses that are traveling at 40mph+ and stopping quickly with little notice. Finally, a lack of lawyers who chase after aĺ of this.

Posted by
4527 posts

Just checking other cities for fall protection: London and Prague have a wall or railing, Paris does not but the Seine bank slopes and bollards discourage walking right at the edge (and this walkway along the river is separated by stairs from the main riverside walk that has a wall), the San Antonio Riverwalk is mostly protected but there are walks along the edge— but this is really similar to a situation where a person can walk along the edge of a manmade water feature like a fountain or reflecting pool where a railing is not expected. The Danube in Budapest has a least a 12’ sheer drop into fast moving water with debris like brush floating in it with no protection at all, for miles both sides. There is also that popular shoe memorial right at the brink. It’s inconceivable to me that the occasional person doesn’t go it.

Edit: In looking fruitlessly for an account of someone falling in I read an English language Budapest news site. Joseph Goebbels would be proud, the US coverage is lies.

Posted by
1786 posts

Public urination

Naked children

Occasionally combined

Posted by
1786 posts

Did I just write the first draft of a haiku?

Posted by
4117 posts

Lack of ice and ice machines in hotels. My wife always has a glass of ice water by her side at home. Our first trip to Europe was to Rome in 2014 and she asked the guy at our hotel for some ice. He was immediately concerned that she had hurt something and needed to ice it. My wife; being naturally charming explained what it was for and every evening of our stay the hotel had a glass of ice cubes ready for her.

In Scotland in 2022 I really would have liked a fridge or an ice machine. I'd bought a couple of beers from a craft brewery but never could get it cold enough to enjoy a frosty brew.

Narrow roads and tight parking. I've only driven in the UK, and I found narrow roads much more challenging than driving on the left. I'm curious what driving will be like next Fall in the Dordogne region in France.

Posted by
209 posts

Almost no shopping on Sunday in Germany. Everyone deserves a day off!

No Costcos or Sam's. You shop small multiple days per week and their "big" supermakets are about the size of typical US grocery store.

Posted by
1786 posts

There are many massive supermarkets in the ring suburbs of most major cities in Europe. Walmart like affairs. It's just that if you're a certain type of traveler, you don't see them

Posted by
1823 posts

"I'm curious what driving will be like next Fall in the Dordogne
region in France".

Allan, there's no need to worry about driving in the Dordogne as long as you don't hire a bus, because most of the roads you'll take and the villages you'll pass through were built in the days of horse-drawn carriages.

Some examples:

http://tinyurl.com/32cvcp7y

http://tinyurl.com/ybaa68dw

Posted by
406 posts

Way back in the day, the 80s, there used to be ‘long Saturdays’ for stores in German small towns. I don’t remember if it was the first Saturday of the month but it was the one Saturday you were allowed to be open full hours instead of half a day. And of course closed on Sunday. I sort of figured that would be over by now.

Posted by
770 posts

At the risk of relaunching this thread, we're in Switzerland now, and I've re-remembered another one. European appliances are NEEDY!! Our appliances at home will beep once when finished -- maybe. Sometimes they don't beep at all. In Europe, they seem to beep and beep and beep until you pay attention to them -- open the washer when done or else you hear endless beeps. Open the dryer; open the dishwasher; open the microwave. Maybe we have had weird experiences, but I swear this happens a lot.

Posted by
1674 posts

Rarely screens on windows that will open for fresh air.

This one has always puzzled me. I guess Europeans tolerate bugs more than Americans.

Posted by
6418 posts

For the record, there are 37 Costcos in the United Kingdom and Europe
– 29 in the U.K., four in Spain, two in France and one each in Sweden
and Iceland.

I did look it up, and that is correct. But I also found out that the store in Sweden so far has been a disaster financially. Last year it lost almost €20 million.

Posted by
1692 posts

Rarely screens on windows that will open for fresh air.

Depends. I have never lived in a house without screens. But then I am a bug magnet. In our current house I installed fixed screens on a few windows, and a sliding one on the balcony doors, so I can keep these open in summer...

Posted by
80 posts

Lack of ice and ice machines in hotels.

The other side of this: in the UK personally I and my wife always ask for drinks without ice (what is the American obsession with ice about?). This is ignored probably 80% of the time, and probably 80% of drinks are sent back, but with the “no ice” thing reiterated.

I don’t even think I even bother asking for no ice in the US. I just assume it’s some law that you have to have enough ice in your drink to sink the Titanic. (But I suspect it’s really about filling glasses with cheap frozen water rather than what you actually ordered).

Posted by
1674 posts

I just assume it’s some law that you have to have enough ice in your drink to sink the Titanic.

In the US it is a way to make a greater profit for businesses. You jam a 16 ounce cup with ice and then fill it with soda and you will barely use enough soda to even fill 5 ounces. If you ask for no ice in the US, the owner freaks at how much product he has to pour because it will be almost 16 ounces. That would be almost 3 separate sales.

That is why the US has ice in drinks and the fact we just prefer cold drinks to tepid. It is what you get use to having. Like ice cold beer rather than just tepid beer or eating pizza with your hands instead of a knife and fork. Different strokes for different folks.

Posted by
80 posts

Different strokes for different folks.

Not sure that paying for a litre of cola and getting a third of a litre plus two thirds of a litre of iced water is a good enough deal to make me accepting of the rip off because of cultural differences.

Posted by
1589 posts

"(But I suspect it’s really about filling glasses with cheap frozen water rather than what you actually ordered)."

No, not really, because in most US restaurants non alcoholic drinks are "free" refills. You can get as much as you want and it all will come with a lot of ice.

Posted by
1413 posts

The ice thing bugs me almost as much as mosquitoes on a hot summer night through an unscreened window. The flaw in Bob's logic is when you get food from the drive-thru (no refills) I always ask for No Ice, and I'd say my success rate is about 90 percent. (Fountain soft drinks in the US are already chilled)
I cheerfully and adamantly tell the order taker
"CAFFEINE is more important to me than ice cubes"

Posted by
1692 posts

There are several things to the whole "ice in drinks" thing.

I grew up in a time where soda (coke, fanta etc...) was for kids. I had my last coke when I was 12. After I had my confirmation I had beer and wine, as adults are supposed to.
The whole concept of adults drinking sweet drinks is still a bit weird to me. Adults drinking Coke? I never saw my dad or my mom do that. I will never drink a sweet beverage with a meal.I like fruit juice with breakfast though.
That is how I was raised.

The younger generations do now drink soft drinks. Mostly duet to US influences, And I fear for the health of the population.

And wine and beer you do not drink with Ice in it. You drink it, depending on the type, at fridge, cellar or room temperature.

I think that the US obsession with Ice has the same root as the US obsession with AC. A probably stems from a desire to control the environment, whereas in Europe the attitude is more to adapt.

Posted by
353 posts

I eat sensibly at home, but stuff myself with pastries, beer, frites, and chocolate when I'm in Europe. When I come home I've always lost a significant amount of weight. I guess that walking thing really does work.

Posted by
8458 posts

It is pretty hard to explain to a foreign visitor why, when it's 0℉ outside, we still expect drinks to be full of ice. Many foreigners (and singers) I've met don't think ice-cold drinks are healthy for you.

From my fast food days, I know that fountain dispensers (where syrup and carbonated water are mixed at the tap) are supposed to be calibrated to provide a ratio of syrup to water based on the expectation that there will be some dilution due to the ice. Whether they do that right or not is a different question.

This is my new tell-tale sign that a restaurant overseas is touristy - if they recognize you're an American and automatically bring you a drink with lots of ice.

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1674 posts

doric8, apparently you never met Leo Getz (Lethal Weapon 2)

One of Pesci's great comedic rants. OK OK OK.

Posted by
7377 posts

In Europe, I’m reminded that smoking (and now, also vaping) is still practiced by lots of people. If you want a table outside, you’re going to be in the smoking section. Getting into a restaurant, cafe, or pub may require getting through a cluster of smokers outside the doorway.

I just don’t encounter many smokers at all at home anymore, even with seemingly a marijuana dispensary on every other corner.

Posted by
1692 posts

Many foreigners (and singers) I've met don't think ice-cold drinks are
healthy for you.

I don't think it is about too much ice being unhealthy. It is about serving drinks to cold rendering them tasteless. I think it is one of those things everybody does in the US because everybody does it...

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1692 posts

As a European I just learned that some people cannot even conceive of the concept of having a pizza delivered to your table that is not cut...

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17961 posts

An Aggie walks into a pizza parlor and orders a large pizza. The clerk says do you want that cut into 8 pieces or 16 pieces. The Aggie says, "better make it 8, I dont think I could eat 16".

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17961 posts

I don't think it is about too much ice being unhealthy. It is about
serving drinks to cold rendering them tasteless. I think it is one of
those things everybody does in the US because everybody does it...

If the Brits drink warm beer, its a cultural thing. If Americans drink cold drinks, its wrong? By the way, ice in beer is common in Thailand. Guess they are wrong on two counts, the ice and it not being warm.

Posted by
5273 posts

If the Brits drink warm beer, its a cultural thing. If Americans drink cold drinks, its wrong?

But we don't drink warm beer. Beer that isn't lagered should be at cellar temperature, ideally 11 - 13c as that's the optimal temperature for cask conditioning. I don't know anyone who would ever claim that 11c is warm. Lager should be served between 5 - 8c. The darker the beer the less cold it should be served in order to fully appreciate the flavours. Serving beer below 4c and you're simply blunting all the flavour so what's the point in drinking it? So yes, Americans drinking ice cold beer can be considered wrong in terms of appreciating beer.

Posted by
17961 posts

Well, maybe I should have said "warmer" and "very much warmer if its an ale" But you made me brush off another often repeated falsehood. And learning is always a good thing. But the point remains.

Posted by
1692 posts

If the Brits drink warm beer, its a cultural thing. If Americans drink
cold drinks, its wrong?

I do not seem to remember getting an ice in my beer in the US. And btw. you have some great beer. You have some awful stuff to (but so does even Belgium).
But the thing that surprised me was always a) lots of ice and b) adults drinking soft drinks and c) people drinking soft drinks with a meal.

Posted by
1692 posts

But we don't drink warm beer. Beer that isn't lagered should be at
cellar temperature, ideally 11 - 13c as that's the optimal temperature
for cask conditioning

Lager is a product of the industrial revolution. It is only after we had mechanical cooling that it became widespread. Ales are the traditional beers. And I love to try out real ales when in the UK. And yes, they should be hand pumped and cellar temperature.
The same thing with lots of Belgian beers which should not be too cold either.

Posted by
17961 posts

What little I know about beer includes that American style larger was developed so that large breweries could ship long distances in warm weather (or I am wrong?). But admittedly not a big beer drinker. Now with American adults drinking soft drinks .... can we call that cultural and be accepting of it? I dont do that much either. And I am not a big fan of liquior either. So maybe wrong discussion for me LOL. But tonight I am off to a birthday party where my choice will be red wine out of a recycled 2L coke bottle (refilled at a shop a few blocks away) or a can of one of the local beers. Guess ..... It will be served with sushi and KFC and probably a few things so hot that there is no way i could eat.

Posted by
1295 posts

"But the point remains" says "Mr É (economy, confused)"

I'm not sure what point you are making. In Spain there are beers which are not great but are sold cold because it is refreshing in the heat. But there are also better beers where nobody in their right mind would want them served with ice. There is no assumption that British beer is "warm". Or, so far as I know, that Thailand beer is iced.

Posted by
17961 posts

I wish I could do some laughing emojis. I know I can be obtuse. Sometimes, for some people when one group does something unexpected out of the norm or just downright confusling it is "wrong" but when another group does something just as confusing, its "cultural" and we shoudl step back and think about that even when it is yucky. That was the point. I screwed it up by being too illinformed to go down the beer rabbit hole.

Egészségére!

Posted by
7377 posts

So, Mr. James E… not so much beer, wine, soft drinks, et. al.. If you’re not then downing mass quantities of tap water, isn’t that what Palinka is for? I suppose Dr,. Pepper is out of the question, but what about tomato juice? Or tea. for God’s sakes?

Posted by
7377 posts

adults drinking soft drinks and c) people drinking soft drinks with a meal.

@WengenK, I just got back from dinner in Sardinia (Italy), at a fantastic restaurant. The people at the table behind me, likely Italians but definitely not Americans, left a Coke can as they went away. Sardinian wine list presented, and somebody had a Coca-Cola with their meal?!? America’s great gift to the world isn’t Freedom, or Capitalism, or Nike shoes, or New York Yankees caps in the wrong colors, or even Marlborough cigarettes (ugh), it’s Coke, apparently. Chilled, in the can, no ice, thank you. Now for spaghetti with clams …

Posted by
135 posts

Unexpected realizations…… none. I have traveled extensively and lived in Europe at one point for 13 years. I learned about living in Europe so I’m sorry but I didn’t have to “realize” anything. I’m an American and always will be but I have a sense of place when I drive down a narrow village street far away from America and know the little house up ahead is home.

P.S. took many years to remember to buy milk at the local Rewe in Germany on Saturday night since the stores are closed Sunday. Oh well…..

Posted by
4117 posts

left a Coke can as they went away. Sardinian wine list presented, and
somebody had a Coca-Cola with their meal?!? America’s great gift to
the world isn’t Freedom, or Capitalism, or Nike shoes, or New York
Yankees caps in the wrong colors, or even Marlborough cigarettes
(ugh), it’s Coke, apparently.

Thank you America, I'll take a cold coke (well, diet Pepsi for me) any day over wine. Ive never had a glass of wine that I've enjoyed, ever.

Posted by
1099 posts

Thank you America, I'll take a cold coke (well, diet Pepsi for me) any day over wine. Ive never had a glass of wine that I've enjoyed, ever.

You're very welcome.

Posted by
6418 posts

I eat sensibly at home, but stuff myself with pastries, beer, frites,
and chocolate when I'm in Europe. When I come home I've always lost a
significant amount of weight. I guess that walking thing really does
work.

It certaibly does. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KPUlgSRn6e0

In Europe, I’m reminded that smoking (and now, also vaping) is still
practiced by lots of people.

Smoking is one of those topics where you really can't talk about "in Europe". The rate of smoking varies a lot between different countries. In general, the further east and south you travel, the more people smoke. https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php?title=Tobacco_consumption_statistics

Posted by
1654 posts

Same, Gail. I loathe the taste of both beer and wine.

Posted by
17961 posts

Someone posted on buildings being too hot in the Winter. They are generally to hot in the Summer too.

In the summer its less than stellar air conditioning and it’s the high cost of electricity to run the units.

In the winter, most of us tourists hang out in historic parts of town, and those old buildings have some peculiarities when it comes to heating. Once you heat up those three-foot-thick masonry walls they hold the heat and release it back out when the radiators are switched off. No way to rapidly compensate for changes in outside temperature or changes in the number of occupants (who generate quite a bit of heat). Then they are a bit stuffy because there is no enforcement of indoor air quality measures like we have to deal with in the US these days.

And totally off subject who knows how the ventilation system in 100 year old theater works?

Posted by
1692 posts

Same, Gail. I loathe the taste of both beer and wine.

I haven't drunk coke since I once got violently sick from one as a kid. To me all those sugary drinks are well, far to sugary. I also do not put sugar in tea or coffee, or even in yogurt. There is far to much sugar nowadays in the Western diet.

So it is a good thing to raise kids so that they are not so dependent on sugar. We were raised that way. I am currently in Florence, and do not see a lot of soft drinks on the tables. We just went to Lucca today, and half way there a whole group of teenagers boarded the train. Half of them were Dutch, the other half Italian. We later saw them in a bar, all with a big pint of beer in front of them. Looks like the kids will be alright.