Traveling for weeks

This board works best when you can ask specific questions. You are asking someone to lay out a four week program without a clue as to dates, budget, likes, dislikes, etc. etc. Get a copy of Rick Steves's, Europe Through the Back Door, -- Read it twice, makes lots of notes, have your friends read it (libraries have multi copies), discuss in great detail with your friends, and then come back with specific questions.

Definitely read Rick's Europe Through the Back Door. A good place to start would be to get a map of Europe and start mapping out an itinerary.... where can you go logistically with the amount of time you have?

I read his book front to back on our last trip and we were going with one of his tours! Train travel might be the cheapest way to go so keep in mind what cities you can get to by rail. Also, try to stay in each location a minimum of 2 days each....3 would be better and some areas would require more.

What are your interests? Museums? Outdoor activities? Just hanging with locals?

Then there's the all important BUDGET! You dont mention your ages.... hostels would be more reasonable for your lodging.

Thanks Kathy :)

Our ages are from 23-25 years old. We would be departing either from Montreal or Ottawa, Canada. I've read the rick steves europe through the back door, quite interesting! We are still figuring out exactly the places we want to go. We know that some cuts will have to be made in order to fit in with time. We mostly want to visit europe for sightseeing, adventures, wine & beer tours, etc. Museums are not really on our list since we have a budget. We were thinking maximum, 6000$ can. Everything included. But some of us are students and might not be able to arrive to that amount, but we did give ourselves about less than a year to save up. Leave around 2017 april-May.
Since we dont have much experience on planning sutch a big trip, i was wondering if our plan would work out. As for places to stay, we thought about hostel and airB&B but since we are going to be always on the move its hard to reserve a place to stay without knowing anything could bring us off route. I am having a planning meeting tomorow and will have more information about our route plan. I will get back to you :)

One thing this forum is really good at is reality-testing itineraries. Not so good reading your collective minds and hearts to achieve greatest thrills for greatest number!

So figure out your collective priorities, connect the dots, and return here.

One thing i will note is that for a 4-week trip you don't all have to travel together all the time. You can split up and then get back together in another city, which can be fun too.

I'll echo Frank: spending quality time with a variety of guidebooks (Lonely Planet is a good one for student travel) is the first place you should start to get a handle on what you want to see, where to stay, how to get around, where to eat, and how to afford all of that on whatever budget you have. Actually, getting a handle on what you will need to save for a 3-4-week trip is another piece of the puzzle.

London and Amsterdam are cities; Germany, Italy and France are countries There's a big difference between the two in amount of ground to cover. So go check some guidebooks out of the library, spend some more time researching your locations of choice, and then come back with specific questions about each.

I'd also recommend not getting hung up on the "as much as possible" piece 'cause cramming too much into too little time can not only cost more in moves from place to place but also leave your memory of those places in a blur. And don't look at it as the only trip you'll ever take abroad 'cause there are years and years ahead of you for more of those. A lot of us are living the dream in our 50's, 60's, 70's and beyond!

hi,

If you are willing to do the trip as cheaply as possible, staying in hostels and university dorms is the best solution. You'll meet others doing just as you are. Re: travel ...use the train and buses. You have to be flexible, be prepared to split up and rendezvous again so that your varied interest are met. Some cities are more expensive than others. Berlin is one of the cheapest, likewise with Budapest. What are you willing to put up with or not put up with, the more "comforts" you require/want, the more you pay.

All 4 of you need to do the following: Look at a map. Do some online research. Decide when you're going to go which can affect everything else. Decide on your specific locations. Decide what you want to see and do there. Decide where in Germany, France and Italy. Realize that you all will have to make priorities, choices and compromises. Even if it is a life dream, also realize that you can go back.

Figure out your budgets. Let me say that again, figure out your budgets. IMHO, nothing can cause more problems than not having enough money, both for the person who didn't plan for how much would be required and for those who did.

London is VERY expensive. Amsterdam isn't cheap. In fact, traveling in Europe anywhere isn't cheap, starting with getting there and getting home.

It's a long way from London to Italy. Those are your outliers. You could drop one or the other. In some cases traveling by train or bus will be cheaper or the only option. In others, flying on European airlines will be cheaper and/or faster. Flying to your first stop and home from your last one may be a bit more expensive, but it may not if you have to backtrack to fly round-trip, and it definitely saves time.

Three to four weeks is not much time for 5 countries if you truly want to see anything. Keep in mind that traveling with 4 of you will slow all of you down to the pace of the slowest one of you, if you think you all need do everything together.

Finally every single one of you should get your own copy of Rick Steves' guidebook, Europe Through the Back Door -- https://store.ricksteves.com/shop/p/europe-through-the-back-door -- and read it thoroughly. Then discuss what you learned and what it means for your trip.

April to May is stormy season in Northern and Western Europe. Expect rain, rain, rain, hailstorm, rain, rain rain, a glimpse of sun, rain, rain, another hailstorm and rain. Italy, Spain, Greece etc. are fine from April to May.

So, if you want to do mostly outdoor activities, either go in June or September, or focus on South of Europe.

Easter is mid April next year, when schools are on a long 2-3 week holiday, so places get busier and therefore more expensive. Likewise, there are Bank Holidays the first and last weekend in May, so avoid expensive places at this time, as prices will be ramped up even further. The weather is likely to be better in May.

Although the temptation will be to move on every night, you will get more satisfaction from the trip if you stay a few days in most of the places e.g. a week wasn't long enough to see everything in Berlin for me, so even rushing this, you need 4 full days there. It's also good value. Amsterdam, London (although less so due the pound plummeting) and Italy are all expensive. Better value places are Spain, Portugal, Croatia and central Europe. You can't see much of 3 countries and 2 capital cities in 3 or 4 weeks. Try not to spend half your time in transit. Whichever way you travel, most of your destinations are going to be 5 + hours apart door to door, so that's half a day lost in transit.

The best option is to look at some routes using rome2rio.com. If you want flights within Europe, the best prices will be c October this year once their spring/summer schedules are released. For train travel, use seat61.com. Best prices are c 3 months out, but longer for the Eurostar.

Car hire is probably not the best option, as a one way drop would be expensive.

If you are moving constantly AirBnb is unlikely to be a good match. Most places prefer longer stays, and check in and check out times are likely to be much less flexible than other places. Many AirBnb places have fairly strict cancellation policies so there goes your flexibility, and the cleaning fees add up quickly on short stays.

You might prefer to focus on hostels and small hotels.

It is unlikely that you can get 4 adults into many hotel or pension rooms; in Europe you pay by the person not by the room.

Others have provided some great advice to you and I will try not to repeat what they say.

1) If you plan to visit large cities, rail would be your likely choice for travel, since you don't want or need a vehicle while staying there. Parking is hard to find and very expensive. Also, you can venture out from cities on day tours or even rent a car for a few days to take in some countryside if you desire.

2) As many people do, they plan on visiting too many places on a trip. You have listed too much to see for 3-4 weeks. Try narrowing your choices. Look as a map and try to keep your travels as short as possible. My first trip to Europe included stops in Rome, Florence and Venice then visiting Bavaria for a few days before moving on to Paris for a week. That was a three week trip. Example if your first choice is visiting London, then combine it with a trip to Paris and perhaps Normandy and perhaps Belgium and Holland.

https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/budget-tips/money-saving-tips-for-traveling

Hi do_leduc7
If you "would be departing either from Montreal or Ottawa", you likely live near me. I have researched and planned several trips to these places over the past few years. I've sent you a "private message", if you'd like to have a chat in realtime.

Just some general points to consider, since you say it is your life dream (and dreams are very individual things):

Although you may plan to do this as one group trip, as you move ahead with your plans, some of your group may want to split off to spend some time that is important for them, but not something the whole group wants to do. This splitting up could be hours, or it could be a week. As you firm up your itinerary, keep in mind that most compromises leave someone feeling that they gave up something. It is better to build this in (and a map and transportation timetables will be helpful) rather than have it happen spontaneously (perhaps accompanied by a bad mood).

It's important for relationships that everyone "buys into" the plan, whatever that turns out to be.

Rome2Rio.com is good for a reality check of distances, travel times, and types of transportation. In three weeks, you will probably be moving around every 2-4 nights in order to fit in London, Amsterdam, a couple of cities each in Germany, Italy and France. You could also look at 21-day "Best of Europe" itineraries for efficient routes for travel, but keep in mind that doing a trip on your own is much more labor intensive in both planning and execution than joining a tour. You will have to arrange your own transportation, no big bus will be waiting for you; you may have to change trains or buses for your destinations; these are the types of things to figure out in advance so you don't waste time on the ground.

Lonely Planet, and the Thorntree Forum, might be helpful for you. The Rick Steves guides for the cities/countries you list are more turn-by-turn guides, which can be very useful as well.

Have a great trip!

April to May is stormy season in Northern and Western Europe. Expect rain, rain, rain, hailstorm, rain, rain rain, a glimpse of sun, rain, rain, another hailstorm and rain. Italy, Spain, Greece etc. are fine from April to May.
So, if you want to do mostly outdoor activities, either go in June or September, or focus on South of Europe.

We traveled the entire month of May from Barcelona to Amsterdam to Budapest to Venice and places in between - the only real rain we had was on weekend in Southern Germany. Weather is always unpredictable

Spring weather would not keep me from traveling at that time if that were the time I had available.

Are you wanting to wing it or have a scheduled itinerary with reservations mad in advance? After hotels/hostel transportation will be your next most expensive thing. If all are 25 or less check out the youth rail pass. There are also buses that are generally cheaper.

Hi,

As you are planning the trip, (is the planning done by one person primarily or all of you participating and contributing?), look into the various bus companies (Eurolines, Berlinlinienbus, Flixbus, in Austria the train and bus combo with Westbahn) as another but cheap way of transportation. If you're not older than 25, look into getting EurailYouth Pass. If you could stretch the vacation to 4 weeks, all the better.

We traveled the entire month of May from Barcelona to Amsterdam to Budapest to Venice and places in between - the only real rain we had was on weekend in Southern Germany. Weather is always unpredictable.

I remember having read the OP don't wanted to go into museums too often. But that requirement magically disappeared.

The museum disinclination is in the OP response, third down from the top, not in the original question.

Planning a longer trip is not different from a shorter trip, if you break it into steps and tackle a piece at a time.

Museums and authentic local activities are not the place to trim your budget. That's a primary message of Rick's guidebooks. In Britain, the nationally-owned museums are all free and in other areas you can find some good-value city passes. Hotels, meals, and drinks have the biggest budget impact, so be careful with those.

More countries (or at least more distance) tends to mean more transportation expense, although there are cheap flights between major cities (www.skyscanner.com). Rick’s Train Travel Time & cost Map gives you an overview of faster train travel times in hours, as well as regular (full-price) 2nd-class fares. Of course, you may pay less by reserving train tickets ahead or by selecting a well-tailored, youth-rate rail pass.

Although maps give more prominence to big cities, your trip should include smaller towns in the mix for many reasons, including variety, walkability, traffic, historic preservation, friendliness, etc. That message will also be well reinforced in Rick's books, as well as excerpts on this web site.

It's rarely discussed on this site but there are several bus lines in Europe that target student and budget travelers. My daughter Kate used Eurolines bus when she spent a month backpacking in Europe following university graduation.

You purchase a bus pass for 15 or 30 days. They have about 50 Euro cities in their schedule. You pre book your first city and then you just hop on and ride from City A to City B. Hop off spend a day or two or three and then hop back on the next bus going to City C. You pick where you want to go.
Eurolines.com is the website. It's easy to plan your itinerary on the site based on the schedules. As I remember there are associated hostels in most of the cities usually within a close distance to the Eurolines stops. Kate did several night buses and saved on accommodations for those nights. She had a lot of flexibility and changed her itinerary a couple of times on the fly.
It's a budget-friendly way to travel.

I agree with Kathy. Lonely Planet Europe is a great travel guide for student travel.

Is that $6,000 budget per person or for all 4?

As others have mentioned, I'd suggest reading Europe Through the Backdoor. In your reply post you mentioned $6,000 dollars(Is that for each person?). For a 3 week trip that works out to about $285 pp/pd for lodging, food, transportation, extras and travel(when travel is necessary). For a 4 week trip that works out to about $215 pp/pd for lodging, food, transportation,extras and travel(when travel is necessary).

You mentioned London & Amsterdam I would look at flying what is called Open Jaw. Flying into one city and back home from another.

I would also suggest looking at a map and possible picking 2 or 3 cities between London and Amsterdam.

For airline flights and prices try www.kayak.com use the multi-city option to get an idea on price for open jaw tickets.

For train travel in Europe try www.reiseauskunft.bahn.de/bin/query.exe/en.

To save money look at staying in hostels. check out www.hostelworld.com or www.hihostels.com.

My technique is never travel more than four hours a day. When you add in all the stuff you have to do (check out, check in, get meals, make connections, find bathrooms, etc.) it will be a very full day.

I find myself renting cars more these days only because the sights I want to see are more off the beaten path. If you're going into the bigger cities, cars are a waste of effort and money. Trains are the best to get you into the center (where the main sights are). Buses can be an option but connections can be slow so they're best for point to point with no stops (making lots of short stops is the best reason to have a car).

If a train ride is over four hours, I either break up the trip or look at cheap flights around Europe.

No matter how you go, packing light is huge. Cheap flights get expensive when you need to check lots of luggage. Luggage makes you take taxis instead of local metro/trams/buses around town. Plan to wash often and carry much less than you think you need.

I hope your friendships survive, travel is a great test. You will end up either friends for life with a great shared experience or secretly despise each other by the end of the trip.

Pretty sure that May (and June) are the sunniest months in far northern Europe, Scotland and Norway anyway.

Train and bus is the way to go. Besides Rick Steves books, check out The Man In Seat 61s website for train info. He is accurate about prices and times. Note how long it takes to get places. Rome to Rio is a good resource too. There are good group ticket deals in England, Germany and Austria for small groups traveling the rails at off peak times.

Generally, small towns are cheaper than big cities. London and Paris are expensive. Amsterdam isn't cheap. Rome and Florence cost less.

Wherected particularly do you all want to go?

My daughter ( aged 19, but turned 20 on the trip ) and her two friends ( 19 and 20) did a trip this year.

April to mid june.
3
They did it for about 6,000 each.. so quite a bit longer then you for same amount of money.

First.. hostels are not always cheaper.. in some big cities ( like Paris for instance) they found hostels were charging up to 40-50 euros per person .. a bit less for the 14 bed dorm rooms.. but still not cheap) so they rented an apartment.. cost them way less.. by that part of their trip our other daughter joined them, so they rented a one bedroom apartment for the four of them and took turns.. two of them in bedroom for 3 nights, then other 3 nights they switched .. so each got a chance to enjoy the sofa bed, lol
Cost of apartment was 99 euros per night.. divided by four !.. best part was they were able to shop for food and cook at the apartment,, they still ate out.. just not as much. It was in a good area.. but was basic and was a SIXTH floor walk up.. lol

Amsterdam was very expensive.. they stayed at the Flying Pig and didn't sleep much for the 3 nights there as that is a party type hostel.. still it was an "experience ".
Their hostel in Rome was good, got a three bedded room,, but it was expensive.. they said it was most expensive one on trip.

In Greece they stayed at a good cheap hostel on one island ( Corfu) and on Santorini they rented an awesome apartment .. ( I saw the pictures).. that was cheap too.. but it was on the quieter part of the island.. not the caldera top towns you see in photos.

London is super expensive.. there are good cheap hostels but they book up months in advance, so get on looking for one there .. Good think about London is most major musuems are FREE!!!

They had many "meetings" to plan trip.. and it was not all smooth sailing.. a lot of compromises had to be made.. One girl really wanted to do Norway and Sweden.. so she did.. on her own splitting with my daughter and the other girl after 8 weeks.

They narrowed their list down to places that were their "must sees".. then tried working out logistics and budget. They dropped Venice because it was too pricey ..

They flew on several cheapo airlines,, and took trains.. its all about comparing time and money.. For instance they of course flew from Greece to Munich, not wanting to waste all that time on ferries and trains.. the flight was short and cheap ( booked months in advance) but took trains from some places so they could have a looser itinerary..

It was a great trip .. they had a ball and met lots of fun people, and saw sights.. but they ate cheaply and they spent hours in advance of trip finding cheapest and fastest routes , either by train or plane, they didn't take buses.. they are cheaper but they are slow..