My family and I are planning to travel thru Europe for one year. Anyone have any thoughts on how, where, what, when? Our theme is to visit the major WWI battlefields. We're experienced travelers but haven't taken on a trip of this magnitude previously. We are US citizens ranging age from 66 to 8. Will we need visas to stay in the EU longer than 90 days? Any advice is welcome. Thanks. Michele
"Will we need visas to stay in the EU longer than 90 days?" - Yes. As US citizens, you will need visas to stay in the Schengen Area for stays of more than more than 90 days in 180. The Schengen Area is most of the EU (less UK, Ireland, Bulgaria, Romania, Croatia, Cyprus), but including Norway, Switzerland, Liechtenstein and Iceland. The non Schengen countries have their own individual time limits.
You will need to plan your times in each country, and if necessary apply for visas as soon as possible.
If you were experienced European travelers or had followed this board you would know that you are allowed only 90 days out of 180 days in any or all of the Schengen zone countries. That is common knowledge but frequently overlooked when dreaming of living in Europe. Second, you can break up your year by spending the appropriate time in non-Schengen zone countries such as the British Isles for six months. Obtaining the necessary visas for extended stay can be time consuming with lots of hoops. Be prepared to demonstrate that you have a small fortune to support your stay. Requirements will vary with the country that you chose to apply for the visa. I think (don't know from experience) that France may be the easiest to obtain some type of extended stay visa. I once looked at Spain and it required a background check via "National Police" that probably means the FBI.
Good Luck. At lot of homework is required on your part.
Time limits weren't always so short, so you would have heard different advice 20 years ago. But that time is gone, as is the time when Switzerland was not yet part of the Schengen Visa Agreement, etc.
Michele
Different countries will have different regulations about the education of the little one(s). That would be worth checking.
You also may want to consider how you will provide transportation for a year.
Just so you can visualize, here is a map of the Schengen countries in blue. The darker blue countries are non-Schengen EU members.
If you want to stay in Europe for a year you just need to figure out how to spread out your time out in the Schengen zone and mix it with time in non-Schengen countries. It can certainly be done but you need to plan carefully.
England gives quite a bit of flexibility with it's 6 month limit - you could spend time there and then bounce around in the Schengen zone for 90 days which would total about 9 months of your trip. Other non-Schengen European countries like Croatia can be useful and very enjoyable places to hang your hat for a while, as well as north Africa, which would be a nice addition to your itinerary.
I think it is very unlikely that you will be able to get visas for a trip like this since long-stay visas for most Schengen countries are intended for those who are either studying or working in those countries or who are planning to establish residency for retirement or settlement on a long-term basis. The amount of paperwork and time is probably not worth it to you since you can divide your time between countries and still see everything you want to see without long-stay visas.
Sounds like a great trip! Good luck planning!
Michele,
The easiest solution would probably be to spend 90 days in the Schengen countries and then 90 days in the U.K., as no Visas or other special documents would be required. After 90 days in the U.K., you can return to the Schengen area to continue your touring.
Although there are no major WW-II battlefields in the U.K., there's lots of other history to see there.
In your question you say WWI battlefields. I can't imagine spending a solid year with that emphasis. Since most of them are in France, Belgium and Germany, I could see you spending 90 days in those countries.
How many people are in your family group? Is everyone equally as interested in WWI battlefields?
If not, are you all willing to split up and do different things, then get together later?
What are their specific ages? I misread your question at first and thought the ages were 66 to 68.
I have been to Verdun 3 times. The last time my husband and I spent 3 days there seeing everything. Having a car was mandatory. I expect the same would be true of the other battlefields.
The point is that your group will need a car. The size and makeup of the group will determine the size and type of car.
This could be a great trip for all of you, but you all definitely have a lot of work to do to prepare for it.
OFF TOPIC
There was an Eastern Front to WWI -- Russia-- which collapsed in revolution. The straw that broke the camel's back & began the war was the assassination by a Serbian of Archduke Franz Ferdinand the heir to the Austro-Hungarian throne.
There is more to WWI than the battles on the Western Front for those who feel the war raged only in France & plenty of ground to cover in a year. How to travel? I think the OP has it figured out.
I wish I were on this trip to see where my grandfather made coffins for soldiers who died of the Spanish Flu.
Getting Off Soapbox
Thanks for all the advice. We will be applying for visas and I'll post on how our efforts work out. Has anyone actually applied for a visa? I know how complicated they are if one is applying for a visa to visit the US so I'm expecting it to be fairly complex process. Happy New Year.
As far as I know there is no such thing as a Schengen area long term visa. Long term visas (over 90 days) are applied for in a particular country within the Schengen area. For instance you would apply for a long term visa for France (or Spain, Italy, etc) and that would allow you to move freely within and between other schengen area countries for the length of the visa. Each country has different requirements for issuing a long term visa so you would need to do your research to see which might be the most likely to grant you a visa. There are hoops to go through so you need to get started. You don't say when you plan to do this but from what I understand the visa process can be time consuming so plan ahead.
Your post saying that you were going ahead with applying for a long-stay visa peaked my curiosity. I started googling and found this link to the page for the French Consulate in Los Angeles that explains how to apply for a long-stay visitor visa for France. It actually doesn't look that bad - if you do go ahead with this please post how difficult it ends up being in reality and how quickly they were able to process it. What countries will you be applying to? I'm really looking forward to hearing about the process.
Good luck!
Thanks for providing the Long stay visa for Visitors (FRANCE and Overseas Departments) link (http://www.consulfrance-losangeles.org/spip.php?article799), Anita. I've often wondered about the long stay visa option. However, it doesn't look that easy to me, largely due to the documentation and many other requirements for each traveler 18 years old or older, as well as the requirements for any child 17 or younger.
Early on in the link, I was perplexed by this quote: "During the validity of their visa, holders of a long stay (D) visa are authorized to travel within the other Schengen States without a Schengen visa (for a maximum of 90 days within a six month period)." This sounds like you can have a long stay visa for France, but you still can't travel more than 90 days out of 180 in the other Schengen countries. I sure would want to have the correct interpretation of this statement in writing. That could affect the planning of the whole trip.
Also, the requirements listed below made me assume that every adult (18 or older) would have to make a separate application meeting these and the other listed requirements, and that children under 18 will also have to do most of this process with only a couple of exceptions. Something else to be verified and pay particular attention to.
...
"8 — STATEMENT OF PURPOSE
- A letter signed by the applicant describing the purpose of your stay in France. Please indicate on this letter the number of months you will stay in France.
9 — RECENT POLICE RECORD
- Recent Police Clearance to be obtained from local police station of residence (adults 18 years old or older) (+ ONE COPY)
10 — SIGNED LETTER PROMISING NOT TO ENGAGE IN ANY PAID OR COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY WHILE IN FRANCE
- Please make sure to indicate your dates of stay in France in the statement.
11 — PROOF OF FINANCIAL MEANS
- Your last 3 monthly personal bank statements checking and/or savings only (no investments, no stocks/bonds) showing monthly balance and your name.
Bank statements should show that you have enough money for the entire duration of your stay (+ ONE COPY)
12 — PROOF OF MEDICAL COVERAGE ABROAD
- A confirmation/certificate of coverage of your medical and travel insurance (minimum coverage $50,000) without any deductible during your whole stay in France (must indicate "valid outside of the USA or "valid worldwide" and indicate starting date and ending date)
13 — PROOF OF ACCOMMODATION IN FRANCE
- if you are the owner of the property: title deeds, recent "taxes foncières"
- if you are renting the property: official lease/rental contract signed by both parties
- if you are hosted:
— if the host is the owner of the property: 1) original invitation letter indicating exact dates of stay 2) recent "taxes foncières" 3) recent utility bill with name and address 4) copy of host’s valid French ID or residency permit
— if the host is renting the property: 1) original invitation letter indicating exact dates of stay 2) official lease/rental contract signed by both parties 3) recent utility bill with name and address 4) copy of host’s valid French ID or residency permit
(+ ONE COPY of each document)
For accompanying spouse
in addition to all the documents listed above, please provide:
- Marriage license (+ ONE COPY)
For all accompanying children
in addition to all the documents listed above, please provide:
- Birth certificate (+ ONE COPY)
- for all minors between 6 and 17 years old during stay in France : proof of registration / enrollment in a school in France"
...
The previous list isn't all that caught my eye on that link, but it was enough to make me think twice about any long stay.
I'll just throw in the need for travel insurance - specifically to cover any health-related crisis which might arise - as well.
Yes, a long stay visa is issued by the individual country. It is effectively a residence visa, it makes you a legal resident of that country for the period of your stay. You have to apply to the country you intend to spend most time in (and probably the country you would arrive in first). You can't get a visa from the French and then spend all your time in Germany or Italy.
AFAIK the 90 day in 180 limit still applies to visiting all other Schengen countries; though this would be difficult to enforce as there are no border checks, and no records kept, when you travel between EU/Schengen countries.
Except, if you book accommodation for more than 90 days, in many countries threre is a legal requirement to ask for proof of identity and proof that you are a legal resident. If you had a French visa you would have a problem trying to rent an appartment in Germany for longer than 90 days.
Hi,
My comments address your WW 1 interest after your "red tape" with Schengen requirements are in order. Failing that, it's easy to spend , say 100 days in England and the Schengen zone. Just count the days carefully , say 89-90 (in case you miscount) in Schengen first, afterwards go to England. With that 100 day time span, you could easily set up and track down an itinerary concentrating mainly on the war in Germany, France, Belgium, Austria, Hungary, and Poland.
It all depends on how extensive you want this itinerary focus to be and determined you in pursuing the diplomatic and military events as to military sites, the war cemeteries (in Germany and Austria too), military museums, statues, war memorials, battlefield plaques and markers,
Having a good reading knowledge of German and French will help you read explanations omitted by museum audio-guides or primary source material featured in museum exhibits (eg, political posters, newspaper headlines, document announcements, leaflets, etc) If you intend to track down war sites, day after day, it can be done, no doubt about that, esp if you get a rental car, say for northern France, all very easy in cities/towns such as Amiens, Compiègne, Albert/Somme, Peronne, Douai, Cambrai, Doulens, Arras, Vimy, Neuville St. Vlaast, Bethune, etc.
OK...here's one more thought. It's a bit beyond the query in the original post but it's something to think about.
The teacher in me is coming out since I see you have an 8-year-old child who will be traveling with you. If you are applying for a long-stay visa there may be issues with having a minor along who is not (I'm assuming) going to be enrolled in school in Europe while you are there. Homeschooling is difficult even for well-educated parents. Not that 3rd-4th grade curriculum is hard but it can be a bit of a grind keeping up the discipline to cover a year's worth of material, especially while you are traveling, so that he/she won't be behind when you return home after your year abroad. Truancy issues could also come into play either while you are in Europe or when you return home if some sort of legitimate schooling doesn't take place.
I suggest that you enroll the child in an online program. It's much easier than lugging books along and dragging them out every night or morning to cover the materials for that day. Here in L.A. we have lots of kids in the film industry or who are so into competitive athletics that they dis-enroll from regular school and enroll in an online program that can be done from anywhere. The most popular one is called Laurel Springs. It is not only legitimate, the quality is good and you can do it entirely online from kindergarten - grade 12.
Schooling requirements are something you need to ask about once you decide which country you will apply to for your long-stay visa - you wouldn't want to have issues with the authorities over this. I know that in France they will certainly ask about this when you register with the local authorities who oversee long-stay visas in the "departement" that is chosen. We have friends who live in France who homeschool their children and it is very tightly controlled by the government. I know that Germany is also very strict and would imagine that it will be the same wherever you choose to apply.
Again, good luck!
Education is paramount in our book and it is to some extent driving this trip now. My husband is a retired teacher and we already "home school" as well as regular school. We discovered that depending on school for a well rounded education wasn't fruitful. Taking the twins out of 3rd grade mid year and returning them 4th grade mid year should satisfy attendance requirements along with proof of enrollment in on line education. Thank you for mentioning it. It didn't occur to me that we would need to be concerned with any local considerations once in Europe.
After our own reading and study, we believe WWI (period just before and after) laid most of the groundwork for the rest of the 20th century. So, our goal is not just battlefields and monuments, but we'll be looking at art, architecture, social development. Granted it will be up to us to convey these concepts to 8 year olds; but we know it's easier to visualize history when standing where it happened. I was 8 my first trip to Belgium and I can remember clearly standing on the monument at Waterloo and listening to my mother explain that battle. I remember having an ice cream in Spa, Belgium in front of my great grandmother's house and hearing about my uncle who left for WWI and never came back. Don't ask me about the Spa water...I can still smell the rotten eggs!
Health insurance is another issue. We're pretty sure our Tricare medical insurance will cover the basics but we do plan to get additional travel insurance for med evac.
Thanks so much to everyone for your thoughts. We're just at the start of the planning (we hope to go in 2016) so we're open to ideas and suggestions they are much appreciated.
Hi,
Spa, Belgium was the site of the German Army Supreme HQ (OHL) in the West, located at the Hotel Britannique, which no longer serves as a hotel.
Hello again!
I found these 2 articles & hope they are of help.
Colette
Getting a long-term visa the Schengen Zone
Step 1
Apply for a long-term visa in France, Spain, Sweden, Italy or Germany. Research which country's long-term visa works best for your travel plans. For instance, some countries have longer application turnarounds than others. At the time of writing, other countries in the Schengen Zone don't offer long-term tourist visas. These visitor visas grant travel for one year at a time and while they don't require proof of study, they do require proof of sufficient funds. They want reassurance that you aren't going to seek work illegally, so you'll need to show proof that you can support yourself without working. No set amount is listed by any of these countries, but plan on having savings totaling at least a year's worth of your monthly expenses in the US.
Step 2
Give yourself ample time to collect all of the necessary documentation. Producing a hefty bank statement isn't the only issue at hand. Your passport should be valid for the duration of your intended stay, and for some countries you may have to provide proof of good character, which can include everything from a letter of reference from an employer to a clean criminal record.
Step 3
Make an appointment at the country's consulate. Applications for long-term visas require interviews and therefore can't be done via mail. Dress appropriately and leave tattered clothing or t-shirts with politically charged or offensive messages behind. Though such details may seem overly conservative, the fate of your long-term travel is ultimately up to the consulate official and a neutral appearance and compliant attitude may make all the difference between the rejection pile and a shiny, granted visa.
Step 4
Apply to be a student if your application for a long-term visitor visa falls through. Enrolling in a language school may cost you money, but it could be your only hope for travel within the Schengen Zone beyond 90 days.
http://traveltips.usatoday.com/longterm-schengen-visa-109082.html
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Cont
Three Visa Loopholes Anyone Can Use
. . . there’s no universal long-term tourist visa for the Schengen Area. Schengen allows for a D- or C-class visa (letter varies on the country), which is a semi-permanent residence visa for up to one year. But the specific visa and requirements vary from country to country. Some countries are harder, some are easier, and others are nearly impossible despite being in the same visa treaty zone. . . .
But there are a few countries that do offer long-term visas, and these countries are the way into Europe:
France
France offers a long-term visitor visa for a period of up to one year. The application process takes up to one month. According to the French Embassy, “The ‘visitor’ visa (or visa “D”) allows you to enter France and stay for more than three months. Long stay visa holders will be allowed to reside in France for up to 12 months according to the validity of their visa and purpose of stay.”
To get this visa, you must set up an appointment at the French consulate near you. You can’t walk in—you must make an appointment.
At this appointment, bring the following documents:
One application form filled out completely and signed.
One ID picture glued onto the application form.
Your original passport, which must have been issued less than 10 years ago, be valid for three months after your return, and have at least two blank pages left.
A letter certified by a notary public that promises you won’t engage in work.
A letter of employment stating current occupation and earnings.
Proof of income (you’ll need bank statements or copies of your investment portfolio).
Proof of medical insurance that includes evacuation insurance.
Proof of accommodation in France. (The French consulate never returned (the author's) emails, so (author)was unsure how you could have this before you even get to France. One could use a friend’s address or, lacking that, “rent” a place (one where you can get a refund) for the purposes of the interview. It’s a little fuzzy.)
Note: you can’t apply for this visa more than three months before your arrival
Sweden
Sweden also offers a long-term stay tourist visa for a maximum period of one year. The process is easy but long—up to eight months! It’s not something to do at the last minute. . . . (See link at bottom to check for documents needed.)
Italy
Like the other countries, Italy will let you in if you can afford it and promise not to work. You’ll need the following documents to apply:
A long-term visa application filled in and signed at the consulate. You must appear in person.
One passport-style photo.
Your passport, which has to be valid three months over the planned stay in Italy. The passport will be kept during the application process.
Documented and detailed guarantee of steady income. Proof of financial means, such as letters from the bank indicating the status of your account, including amount of money in the account.
Proof of lodging in Italy.
A letter specifying the reason for your stay in Italy, length of stay, and where you plan to reside.
A notarized background check.
This visa is issued solely to those who are planning to move to Italy & not work.
PS – Spain and Portugal offer long-term-stay visas, but they’re geared to people who are retired and have lots of assets. They aren’t meant for people passing through, but you can always apply and try.
http://www.nomadicmatt.com/travel-blogs/how-to-legally-stay-in-europe-for-more-than-90-days/
Very good info to know on how to qualify and obtain a long term visa for France, which I most likely will do in the next few years. Thanks!
Fred, you lucky dog. Can I be your friend!
@ Chani...That is a long term plan which I hope to do within the next few years, ie., stay over the max days allowed under Schengen, maybe 100 or so. We'll see.