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Tickets for Trains in Italy and France

Rick talks on his programs about using a 1st class railpass and if there is no reservation required just hopping on any train going your way. I've bought three 1st class saver railpasses for [previous] family trips to ensure no complicaitons for us, but on the solo trip I'm planning I have been advised to buy point to point tickets in the station for each leg of my journey to add flexibility. Little nervous about that since I've never done it.

Are there trains with 1st class that actually do not require reservation or if 1st class requires them can I ride in 2nd class on any train without one if I fail to get one in time? The P2P seems complicated to me. My 21 day itinerary includes Rome to Florence to Venice to Milan to the Cinque Terre to Provence to Paris (six rail days).

I'm also considering starting with the RS Venice/Florence/Rome 10 day tour to get used to being alone in Europe, then leaving from Rome for the CT and on to the France part from there (three rail days).

With either I plan to rent a car in Provence. for four days before taking the TGV to Paris. Thanks for any pointers.

Posted by
8889 posts

Point-to-point (as you call it) is simple, It is the normal ticketting system, which normal people (not overseas tourists) use.
It is passes which are complicated because of the need to get separate reservations

When you buy a normal ticket, from A to B, if a reservation is required you automatically get a reservation, and your ticket says the train you have chosen, and the number of the coach and seat. There is no difference in the procedure between 1st and 2nd class, just that your reserved seat will be in a coach of the correct class.
If a reservation is not required, your ticket will be valid on any train (often any train on the same day).

You can buy tickets from the manned ticket counter (in larger stations), or from ticket machines. Either way it is the same price.
In Italy "Regionalle" trains do not require reservations, long distance and high speed trains do.
Similar rules apply in France, "TER" trains do not require reservations, TGV (high speed trains do).
All trains have both 1st and 2nd class, except for a few local ones which have 2nd class only.

For the longer legs (especially the one to France), you can save money by buying your tickets ~2 months in advance on the internet.

Posted by
32345 posts

Jim,

"Are there trains with 1st class that actually do not require reservation or if 1st class requires them can I ride in 2nd class on any train without one if I fail to get one in time?"

Most of the trains that I've encountered that have first class cars are either InterCity, EuroCity or Freccia, and those always require reservations, whether travelling in first class or second class. You can't ride in any "class" without reservations if that train requires them. Most Regionale trains only have second class and those don't require reservations even if they do have a few first class cars.

Some thoughts on the trips you'll be making.....

  • Rome to Florence - that will be via Freccia high speed, so if you're willing to commit to a specific departure you can save money by purchasing tickets online well in advance. Otherwise just buy tickets from a Kiosk or ticket office at the local station, although you'll likely be paying "Base fare" which is the highest price tier. You could also use Italo on that route, although you may have to depart from Roma Tiburtina station.
  • Florence to Venice - again Freccia high speed. Same terms as above and you could also use Italo for this segment.
  • Venice to Milan - Freccia high speed, as above. You could use Italo although you may be arriving at Milano Porta Garibaldi and not at Milano Centrale. If you're staying in Milan for a few days, that may work. If you're connecting directly to the C.T., my preference would be to arrive at Centrale.
  • Milan to Cinque Terre - this will involve a combination of trains. If you use one of the direct trains such as those to Monterosso, it will likely be InterCity so you could again pre-purchase a ticket and save some money, as long as you're willing to commit to a specific departure.
  • C.T. to Provence - this will likely involve a variety of trains and a few changes, depending on which departure you choose. Some may be Regionale, so just as easy to buy tickets for those locally (DON'T forget to validate prior to boarding the train on the day of travel). You'll most likely have to change trains at Ventimiglia and after that you'll be on the French rail system. You could perhaps buy tickets for that portion from www.capitainetrain.com.
  • Provence to Paris - you will require reservations for the TGV to Paris, so you could again buy tickets from capitaine train. Where in Provence will you be travelling from?

With all your rail journeys, be sure you're aware of the proper names for the stations you'll be using. If you'd like to pre-purchase tickets for some or all of your rail trips in Italy and have "issues" with the Trenitalia website, you could also try www.italiarail.com as their website is more user friendly (I believe they charge a small fee).

Posted by
16895 posts

In some countries, most trains don't require reservations (e.g., they're optional in Britain, Germany, Austria, Switzerland), so a rail pass can add hop-on convenience for nearly every train ride. In other countries (e.g., France, Italy, Spain), most longer distance or faster trains do require reservations, which are built in when you buy the train ticket (same as an airline ticket), or which you buy separately if using a rail pass. Faster tracks and reserved trains are expanding their reach all the time and provide most train service between big cities.

Point-to-point tickets have these advantages for your current trip plan:

  • Most of your trains require reservations. The process to buy a ticket is the same as the process you would follow to make pass holder
    reservations. The French TGV trains limit the number of places for
    pass holders, making advance reservations quite important for those.
  • Those reserved trains also offer advance-purchase discounts, if you're ready to book them about 1 - 3 months in advance of travel. I believe you've already told us that price is not your main concern.
  • There is no deadline to buy tickets at regular price if you're not committed to a date and time. It's not likely for most routes to sell out, although the trip back to Paris is one that I'd want to lock in at least a few days ahead.
  • You are traveling solo and don't qualify for a group discount that passes offer.
Posted by
5293 posts

Jim,

You may want to research this very helpful website for travel options from point A to point B: http://www.rome2rio.com

Once you type your destinations, click on the travel option icon (bus, train, plane) to see the agency you'll need to book your tickets in advance if you so choose.

You may save $ when you buy some of your train tickets in advance.

For example:

  • the Freccia ( high speed) train from Rome to La Spezia (you can buy this ticket up to 120 days in advance)
  • the TGV train from Provence to Paris. (you can buy this ticket up to 3 months in advance & sometimes up to 6 months in advance for certain destinations within France)

I'm also considering starting with the RS Venice/Florence/Rome 10 day tour to get used to being alone in Europe, then leaving from Rome for the CT and on to the France part from there (three rail days).

To reach Cinque Terre from Rome, you will travel via freccia train to La Spezia then you will transfer to a Regionale train to reach the village you choose in CT.

You do not need to buy Regionale train tickets in advance as the price is fixed & there is no advantage for doing so.

Use this website for train travel in Italy: http://www.trenitalia.com

Use this website for train travel in France: http://www.sncf.com/en/passengers