Thoughts on this route?

Berlin is a long way from your other goals, and one full day isn't enough to see much. You'll be spending a lot of your precious time moving from place to place instead of enjoying the places themselves.

re Berlin I'm thinking -- arrive, get our bearings, spend the night, spend the next day, spend the night, spend the next day, take the night train. So... basically 2.5 real days in the city, assuming we're pretty pooped the first day... yeah, I'm not as excited about Berlin as he is, but he is a real history nut!

2 nights in Berlin might not be enough for a very eager husband: there is a lot to see and do there! More than in Munich, for that matter. I'd aim for 3 nights, at least.

Otherwise, your proposed "dip" into Switzerland unfortunately misses most of what Switzerland has to offer. The Glacier Express is not worth the days of travelling, in your case - it is a very long train ride, expensive too, and you won't have time to explore at either end. Likewise, Basel is fine, but certainly not the top destination in Switzerland.

Instead, I'd skip Switzerland entirely and aim towards the Bavarian Alps after the Black Forest. You could just drive to, say, Garmisch-Partenkirchen or a smaller town in that area, where there are plenty of mountain rides including the amazing Zugspitze. Or, perhaps better, head straight to Berchtesgaden, which you can use as a base to visit Salzburg and to have your Alps "fix". If the neighboring castles (Neuschwanstein and Hohenschwangau) interest you, throw in a night in Füssen beforehand. Then return the car in Munich.

The plan could be (counting nights):

Berlin - 3 to 4n
Black Forest - 4n
Füssen - 1n, opt.
Berchtesgaden - 3 to 4n
Munich - 1 to 2n

Balso -- thank you. interesting idea!

Berlin is worth a full week, or at least half of your nights in Europe...just sayin'...Berlin >> Munich

Your itinerary needs a lot of work. Switzerland and Salzburg? Save for another trip...stick to Germany on this one.

Your husband is correct to be excited about Berlin! WWII history and Communist East German history all are on full display with many museums and memorials. I never cared too much for Germany ; we had visited Bavaria twice. I loved Berlin! Hire a guide to point out historical sites related to both eras.
Book reservations ahead for the Reichstag to go up into the dome.

So we have been married for 30 years and this will be our first European trip together except for one week in Ireland! I’m so nervous that it will be the only one. Between Covid and rising costs… our kids’ needs… I love the idea of doing a dozen different trips— all over the world— but am so nervous about keeping it small and then never going again! Is that nuts??

I take it that you intend to drive in Switzerland? But then it doesn't make sense to be on the train to Chur and continuing eastbound without going back for the car?

You won't want to hire the car (rent in Americanese) in Germany and return it in Switzerland. It will cost a fortune to drop in Switzerland.

If you do decide to take a non-Swiss car into Switzerland count on buying a CHF40 (about 40€) vignette for the toll roads (all with green signs, including almost all motorways and many expressways).

Of all the Swiss scenic trains (and I've been on all of them) the Glacier Express impressed me the least. Some people love Zermatt but not me (and I had free transportation there).

Basel is only a very short drive (and even shorter train trip) from Freiberg im Breisgau. Hardly half way to Zermatt. I like Basel very much but your tires will hardly be warm.

We only planned to use a car in the Black Forest... otherwise planning to take trains which we really enjoy. to be honest, taking trains is part of the adventure for us. I am excited about the Glacier Express!

But we would need to stop in Basel and switch trains if going from Freiburg to Zermatt and I thought "if we have to stop anyway, why not actually SEE the city?" Bottom line, a lot of the choices are based on where we can catch direct or at least semi-direct trains... I looked at Frieburg to Interlaken, but it's quite tricky.

If you didn't like the Glacier Express, which train DID you think was worth the time/money in Switzerland? I know there are several!

We need some additional information please..............
Excluding the night of the flight to Europe, how many nights do you have to "spend"?
What time of year are you planning to make the trip?
Please pull up Google maps and gain an understanding of the scale of the geography your first itinerary is covering.
Consider the concept of "being there" in lieu of "seeing there".
The more connections, the greater the travel stress = probability of more memories about modes of transport than great memories of a first journey to Europe.
https://www.viamichelin.com
above web link is an excellent route planner
Ancestral roots, have you conducted family research to determine where, when and who lives(d)? Point is this concept requires a good amount of research to make the time and money spent on site worthwhile.
Berlin offers huge menu of opportunities to explore and participate. Minimum three nights, better four.
Comparison, how many nights would you spend discovering Boston as a first time visitor?
From Berlin to Munich via high speed train, five hours and leave the driving to them. Essentially a downtown to downtown trip experience without hassle of driving and parking (plus gas).
Munich is worthy of three nights.
You now have the Bavarian apps at your fingertips to explore.
Fly out of Munich.
Long ago our first trip to Europe was for 28 days covering Italy (Rome, Florence and Venice) Salzberg and then Germany (Garmish, Freiburg and Munich). We drove the entire time and we still say we should have slowed down for trying to cover too many destinations.
I get it, this is a long awaited first trip and the desire to "see" overtakes the ability to "be". Invest in slowing down and being there as part of the formula to create wonderful memories.
Highly recommend using apartments in lieu of hotels.
Slow down you move too fast, you got to make the moment last!

We need some additional information please..............

CAPS FOR CLARITY -- NOT SHOUTING!

SOME CONTEXT: WE DO WANT TO SEE CITIES, TOWNS, AND COUNTRYSIDE... NOT JUST SPEND TIME IN CITIES.

WE ALREADY CUT OUT BERNINA EXPRESS AND A VISIT TO NORTHERN ITALY AS BEING TOO MUCH...

WE LOVE TRAIN TRAVEL AND HAVE FIGURED OUT THAT WE ARE REALLY GUNG HO TO SEE BERLIN, BLACK FOREST AREA (HAVE FIGURED OUT THAT FREIBURG IS A GOOD PLACE TO STAY FOR OUR NEEDS, i THINK), AND SOME GERMAN AND SWISS TOWNS AND ALPS (ESPECIALLY ZERMATT (WHICH IS WHY I THOUGHT WE'D LOVE THE GLACIER EXPRESS).

WE ARE DRIVING ONLY IN THE BLACK FOREST SO WE CAN GET TO SPECIFIC SMALL TOWNS; OTHERWISE IT'S ALL TRAINS. TRYING TO AVOID LOTS OF TRAIN-SWITCHING AS POSSIBLE.

Excluding the night of the flight to Europe, how many nights do you have to "spend"? 16 AT THE MOST.

What time of year are you planning to make the trip? MID JUNE

Please pull up Google maps and gain an understanding of the scale of the geography your first itinerary is covering. I HAVE DONE THAT!

Consider the concept of "being there" in lieu of "seeing there". WE ARE TRYING TO DO BOTH. WE ENJOY TRAIN TRAVEL IN AND OF ITSELF, SO THE IDEA OF A FAIR AMOUNT OF TIME SPENT IN TRANSIT DOESN'T REALLY BOTHER US TOO MUCH.

The more connections, the greater the travel stress = probability of more memories about modes of transport than great memories of a first journey to Europe. I AGREE, WHICH IS WHY I'M LOOKING FOR A SET OF OPTIONS THAT HAVE FAIRLY DIRECT CONNECTIONS. I HAVE BEEN TO EUROPE AND USED EURRAIL BUT IT WAS MANY (40!!!) YEARS AGO... I LOVED IT THEN! HUBBY HAS NEVER BEEN.
https://www.viamichelin.com
above web link is an excellent route planner

Ancestral roots, have you conducted family research to determine where, when and who lives(d)? Point is this concept requires a good amount of research to make the time and money spent on site worthwhile. YES: HUSBAND HAS MULTIPLE BOOKS WRITTEN BY FAMILY AND KNOWS EXACTLY WHERE HE'S GOING IN THE BLACK FOREST. MY ROOTS ARE IN THE SAME AREA, BUT NOT AS WELL RESEARCHED (I KNOW THE TOWN AND A NAME!)

Berlin offers huge menu of opportunities to explore and participate. Minimum three nights, better four.
Comparison, how many nights would you spend discovering Boston as a first time visitor? RE BOSTON ETC IT'S EASY TO SPEND ANY AMOUNT OF TIME ANYWHERE -- I COULD GIVE YOU A TWO-DAY TOUR OR A THREE WEEK EXPERIENCE OF THE BOSTON AREA! I'M KINDA COMPROMISING WITH BERLIN CUZ I COULD EASILY SKIP IT MYSELF BUT HUBBY IS EXCITED. SO I FIGURED 2.5 DAYS IN THE CITY WOULD COVER THE HIGHLIGHTS.

From Berlin to Munich via high speed train, five hours and leave the driving to them. Essentially a downtown to downtown trip experience without hassle of driving and parking (plus gas). YEP, WE ARE PLANNING TRAIN TRAVEL...

Munich is worthy of three nights. IT IS, BUT IT ISN'T ONE OF OUR MAJOR "MUST SEES," SO WE ARE OK WITH JUST SPENDING A LITTLE TIME THERE.

You now have the Bavarian apps at your fingertips to explore.
Fly out of Munich.
Long ago our first trip to Europe was for 28 days covering Italy (Rome, Florence and Venice) Salzberg and then Germany (Garmish, Freiburg and Munich). We drove the entire time and we still say we should have slowed down for trying to cover too many destinations. YEP, THAT'S A HUGE TRIP!! I THINK I MIGHT GET OVERWHELMED! BUT WE DID A ONE-WEEK TRIP TO IRELAND WITH ONE AND TWO-NIGHT STAYS IN 4 DIFFERENT PLACES (DRIVING) AND DIDN'T FEEL TOO OVERWHELMED. WISH WE'D HAD MORE TIME, BUT MADE THE MOST OF WHAT WE HAD...

I get it, this is a long awaited first trip and the desire to "see" overtakes the ability to "be". Invest in slowing down and being there as part of the formula to create wonderful memories.
Highly recommend using apartments in lieu of hotels.
Slow down you move too fast, you got to make the moment last!

THANKS!

ENJOY AND SAFE TRAVELS!

Hi,

It would be better if you could add another day to Berlin. Going to Freiburg from Berlin can certainly be done by night train, which is what I would do too. That gives an extra day for Berlin before boarding the night train to Freiburg.

Because you have this pressing time constraint, decide which place is of top priority, aside from Berlin. Which historical sites does he plan on tracking down?

Re: driving in the Black Forest for relly search.

I didn't see where Boston came into it, but if you are from Boston you won't regularly do narrow, winding, very steep roads. Some of the Black Forest area is relatively level, but there are parts which are quite steep and require hairpins. Best to remember to come down in the same gear you go up in. Hopefully you'll be driving a manual?

The north and south areas are somewhat different. Can I assume since you close Freiburg im Breisgau you both came from the southwest of the area? I'm fairly familiar with the area and if you could say where you are heading might have some hints...

My problem with the Glacier Express (and its local train cousins who do the same route at the same speed, every hour) is that so much of it is so much the same. Pretty much a straight line, so no bends to see different angles, no spiral tunnels, very few trees, so it is hour after hour of the same. That's how I remember it - fine for an hour but I got bored doing it for a whole day.

My personal favourites are the Brünig Pass route between Luzern and Interlaken (or reverse, although I prefer the sudden vistas on the westbound route a little better) which includes mountains, cog railway, lakes, waterfalls, woods, and vistas; and I like Luzern to Lugano on the old line with the spiral tunnels and 3 views of the same church. And I really like the Albula Line which is part of the exceptionally scenic Bernina route.

I hope that helps.

Basel is a lovely town, and I especially enjoy the motorless ferries across the Rhine. There is a Tinguely modern water installation which is beautiful (and I am not a modern art aficionado) https://www.basel.com/de/attraktionen/tinguely-brunnen-f6161be6f6 and I enjoyed one year seeing the toy museum had put dolls on top of a bunch of Roomba robot vacuums in a large room and let them all run around. Great fun. The trams are great, and if you have trouble on hills, very helpful. Beautiful area around the market. An overall nice place. Quite different from other Swiss cities - that might be to your liking or you might prefer others.