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Posted by
11197 posts

This would probably be a good year to look for new "back doors"!

Good luck with that.

The inescapable fact is that the global population has doubled since 1975
.https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/world-population-by-year/

Finding an 'undiscovered' location is much more challenging., and there is still only one Eiffel Tower, Colosseum, Acropolis, Grand Canyon, Yellowstone etc

If you want the peace and solitude of your backyard, stay home; if you want to see/do something different/special accept the fact "you will have company".

Bon Voyage

Posted by
18022 posts

Ken there is a bit of hype in the article.

Yet in the midst of it all, the continent also saw record-breaking
tourist numbers—the highest since pre-pandemic levels

Which simply means more than last year, but not more than pre-pandemic. The people that track the numbers predict 2024 to be at about the same level, or even slightly below, pre-pandemic 2019. What is different is where people are going seems to have changed a bit as more appear to be choosing the old traditional destinations making them 2 or 3 precent more crowded than pre-pandemic.

But new backdoors are a good idea. Here is an old link with a few suggestons: https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/general-europe/back-doors-to-the-back-doors-of-europe

But my impression is that while the top 5 to 10 destinations in Europe (London, Paris, Rome, Barcelona, etc ) are doing as good or better than pre-pandemic, the secondary cities are struggling a bit this year. I know my city is still "recovering" at best, possibly Prague and Vienna too. So do a bit of research and shopping. Lots to see and do without the crowds.

Here is good reading if anyone is interested: https://etc-corporate.org/news/european-tourism-draws-close-to-pre-pandemic-levels-in-2023/

Posted by
1027 posts

Agree that outside of the major destinations tourism is actually down. There is a cost of living issue across Europe that is affecting people’s ability to travel, eg Germans booked significantly fewer package holidays last year which would typically be to places like Greece.

Here in the U.K. the ‘staycation’ boom is over with people taking fewer domestic trips. In Cornwall I’ve been told it was busy for the Easter bank holiday weekend but the rest of the school holidays have been pretty dead.

Posted by
18022 posts

And Joe, the world may have doubled but Europe is up less than 10% (676 million to 742 million) and the US is up about 50% (a lot to do with immigration). Even China (anothe big source of tourists) is only up 50% since 1975. But I suspect if you look at the demographics of all of the regions, Europe, US, China, you might find that the increase in numbers of those that can afford a trip might not be that large.

Posted by
7688 posts

We are in our 70s and have traveled a lot, so we are now looking for places that we haven't visited.
There are still great places to visit.
Examples:
1) Italy- We have been there several times and love it. Still, we haven't visited Umbria (Orvieto, Perugia, Assisi, Spoleto, etc.)
2) Great Britian-In 2017 we did four weeks exploring South Wales and England visiting smaller cities and towns (not London). We visited the Cotswolds, Winchester, Bath, Warwick, Cardiff, Tenby (and several castles in Wales), York, Hadrian's Wall, the Lake District, Durham and more.
3) France and Spain, we have a tour in a month to visit the north of Spain (including Basque region) and southern France (Carracassone and Bordeaux regions).

Posted by
18022 posts

geovagriffith you are correct, there are endless corners, not overly touristed, that make great destinations. A lot in fairly close proximity to the locations that are still among the top destinations. After all everyone should see London, Paris and Rome too, but its nice to mix them will less traveled locations.

You know I love Eastern Europe. I should keep my mouth shut I guess so I can continue to enjoy it without the crowds. The fact that they have beaches that rival any in the West and cities that challenge Paris for beauty and culture, and mountains still undeveloped in to high dollar ski resorts and natural beauty as good or better than most Western countries is totally unknown to most American tourists.

But I still, when someone says its their first trip to Europe and asks where to go I think the places to begin are London and Paris and Rome.

Posted by
4574 posts

Tell me if I am wrong about this thought, but wouldn't any place without an airport or train station be 'off the beaten track' for 99.2% of the non-European tourists to Europe? Take a bus somewhere. Of course, it may also take a bit more time, and a shift in approach and expectation, but maybe taking time to absorb surroundings after little research will give an appreciation and no box to tick.
The reality is there are more and more first time travelers and they want the sites they have seen on screen. So the normal top tier cities will continue to be clogged.

Posted by
664 posts

.. and cities that challenge Paris for beauty and culture.

Would love a list! Is this just Budapest or other places filled with museums & beauty? (Been to Prague, in the age of the Soviet Union) but curious what other cities make the list?

And agreed, Umbria is still off the radar and really rather glorious, spent some time in Spoleto, known for it's olive oil and local cuisine.

Another way of looking at 'off the beaten track' is to look at off-season; Sounds like Rome & Florence were pretty marvelous in late January, Southern Spain end October, my friends were in London in March, said it was a bit quieter than later in the year, and weirdly some friends said the Netherlands was quiet after the tulips had all been picked around mid May...

Posted by
18022 posts

Like Paris, Budapest sure ... better even. Then parts of Bucharest but you will need an orientation tour to discover the parts. Remember, only parts of Paris are like Paris. Kyiv (especially) & Odesa, parts of Prague, Vienna (not east, but on the way East). Amazing but uniquely different than Paris ... Sofia. If you like cities plenty to choose from in all flavors and with wonderful unexpected experiences. Not in the Paris category, but culturally unique and fascinating in every way is Sarajevo (third trip in May).

Posted by
1723 posts

The population of the world has doubled. But the population of people that can afford to travel has more than doubled. That is what is really driving the surge in tourist.

For a long time "Asian" meant "Japanese" in Switzerland. But now we get tourists from China, Kores, and India, and increasingly also from countries like Malaysia and Indonesia. These countries have made huge strides in lifting their populations out of poverty, and the new middle classes there want to travel. And they want to come to Europe...

Posted by
4346 posts

You also need to consider that major cities will have concerts scheduled that will take the cost of accommodations to extreme levels and may result in other things being booked up too.
https://www.taylorswift.com/tour/

Posted by
18022 posts

WengenK, I actually found some tourist arrival stats. Tourist arrivals have increased five fold since 1975. What that means in Western Europe is a whole different thing. In 1975 Eastern Europe, China, and the Far East were essentially closed. That's maybe a quarter of the earth. So that 5 fold increse is over a larger area. The source I found has the stats by region, buy for a cost, so i passed.

And is it the world is wealthier or travel is cheaper?

Oh and worldwide 2023 was still below 2019 tourism levels.

Posted by
4124 posts

What disappointed me about the article is that shoulder seasons are no longer the shoulder seasons as more people are travelling in early Spring and Late Fall.

Posted by
14540 posts

Thanks for posting. Interesting to read various views on summer travel in Europe.

I am looking forward to seeing the tourist percentage in Europe to return its pre-Pandemic level or, better still, exceed it. Still, no need to look for so-called "back doors" as the towns and cities I visit in France and Germany in particular do not witness in the summer swarms of foreign visitors, only locals, if even that.

If you're there in the summer, you'll get the heat and presumably the crowds. I know I'll get that heat, that broiler, the crowds, we'll see when I am there in June and July.

Posted by
6422 posts

There are many places that can be considered "back doors". If this forum is representative, there are vast areas of Europe that are still undiscovered by North American tourist.

Posted by
2945 posts

I'm done with Europe from June through August. It can be hot as blazes and super-crowded. I like Mr. E's suggestion of backdoor cities. Now that the Hot Wife and I are semi-retired we can travel off-peak, like November. Far, far more pleasant in most regards except weather north of the Alps.

What sealed the deal was a comically dense, sweaty, stinky group of people in Versailles on a hot July day. I bumped up against someone with foul body odor and then the smell stuck on me the rest of the day until I could shower. That did it. The Louvre was not much better with groups acting like they owned the place stomping from one place to the next without much consideration for others.

(Blank) that.

Posted by
14540 posts

If 1975 is used as a travel year marker concerning Eastern Europe as was defined then politically in the cold war days, then I have only one travel experience in that region , that of Prague in July of 1973. Not until August 1984 would I have the next opportunity to cross over into the Soviet bloc again , this time on an exclusive East Berlin bus tour and East Berlin again but on my own in the summer of 1987.

Regardless, of the crowds , real or apparent, and that stifling, oppressive heat likely to be experienced in the summer, lots of places in central Europe can be labeled as "backdoors" if ducking out on swarms of tourists is important to one's enjoyment. I'll find out in about a month.