Should I drop Vienna from my itinerary?

If it were me, I would pass on Munich in order to add time to a visit to Vienna. Munich is interesting, but big. And if the "beer culture" does not appeal, the real culture of Vienna should be a perfect place to see. The quality of the museums and the relative coziness of the city make it one of my favorites. I must say, Salzburg is a good one-time destination. I have been there multiple times as a tourist but even more often due to work. It is quaint and worth a visit, but it is (my opinion) over-hyped as a destination. Arguably, that is due to the surrounding areas and activities, but for me, given a choice, I would add days to Vienna and skip Salzburg if my time was limited. I will confess to enjoying the Viennese "drinking culture". I also love the museums, food and music.

It’s hard to say without more information. How long do you have for this trip? That’s a lot of travel days and a big footprint for a trip, unless you’ve got a longer trip planned.

Valerie- It's about 19 days at this moment.

I mostly love learning new things (historical, cultural) and seeing beautiful scenery, anything outdoors and absolutely love churches.

If that's true, then Vienna is a perfect fit for you. Munich has a lot going for it, but I would drop Munich, and add that time to Vienna.

I second everything that Mack said.

Have you already bought air tickets into Edinburgh and home from London?

If so, have you already explored Scotland and England? Is this your first trip to Europe or have you been to a lot of cities already? Your name on this site indicates this might be your first trip?

If you’ve not seen any of the UK and you have air tickets into Edinburgh and out of London, you can easily fill that time there and see some great cities and smaller towns.

I always try to avoid mid-trip flights when I can. I keep my overall footprint smaller by trying to connect cities by train.

Your second plan works better. Have you been to Paris? Edinburgh>London>Paris works well by train, but if you fly home from London, you end up backtracking to there. But from Paris, you could then take the train over to Munich on a direct train in under 6 hours.

It’s still hard to give you feedback without more info about where you’ve already been and what your MUST cities are.

Another Steve - I will look into Rosenheim. I haven't heard of it. It definitly is easier to stay in a central place and take say trips to other areas to see the most possible in a trip. Thanks for the suggestion!

Valerie - It is my first time to Europe. It's a nice long trip, however, I'm not sure if I will ever get back to Europe so this might be my only chance to see as many things as I can, but I also don't want to overdo it. Scottish culture has always interesting me, hence why I want to go to Scotland and then instead of just travelling the UK, I figured I wanted to see another very different cultural feel from the 2nd half of my trip hence why I am going to Bavaria etc. I have NOT bought plane tickets yet.

reducing my plane travel

Not sure how dropping Vienna reduces your plane travel, unless you were planning to fly from Vienna to Salzburg. Original plan would be E-V flight, V-S-M train, M-L flight. Right? New plan would be E-L fligh or train?, L-S/C flight or train?, S/C-M train, M-S train, then S-L flight or fly home from S?

Also, IMO Vienna hits your interests in history, culture and churches as much as any other city on your list. And I will add the Munich is much more than beer, even though I will be there twice this year to enjoy the beer.

I mostly love learning new things (historical, cultural) and seeing
beautiful scenery, anything outdoors and absolutely love churches.

So, with 19 days during an undisclosed time of the year by an individual or individuals of indeterminate age, sure. The trip looks fine. Currently you have 5 stops in 19 days which for now I will guess includes travel days. So, you have roughly 3 days per stop. The days include the day you travel between stops so you have 2 or 2.5 days of tourism in each stop.

You know, everyone sees the world differently so don’t think I am trying to say this is how it is. No, not at all, this is how some of the stops on your list impressed (or didn’t) me personally.

Edinburgh, only spent one day, should have stayed for four or five, but the purpose of my trip was to get to a place for fishing. The city itself does not speak of anything outdoors or beautiful scenery unless you are referring to architecture. Churches, sure, but any on the Europe top 20 list? No, don’t think so.

London, I have returned a few times. For me it’s that good and if you stayed 10 days you could do the essentials. The city itself does not speak of anything outdoors or beautiful scenery unless you are referring to architecture. 2 Churches that should be on Europe’s top 20 list.

Strasbourg, never been.

Munich, never been except to change planes and that doesn’t count. But since I live not too terribly far away and because of some personal interests I have researched the heck out of the place and always come back to ….. sure, maybe someday. The city itself does not speak of anything outdoors or beautiful scenery unless you are referring to reconstructed architecture. Churches, sure, but any on the Europe top 20 list? No, don’t think so.

Salzburg, I was there about 9 months ago for a few days; and a few days did the trick for me. Ehhhh, very, very interesting and a great stop on the way to someplace else. The history of the city is presented very well and for history buffs that’s a good thing. The city itself does not speak of anything outdoors or beautiful scenery but the trip in and the trip out has its moments. And if you are referring to the architecture, yes, but not as much as London or Edinburg for my interests. Churches, sure, but any on the Europe top 20 list? No, don’t think so.

Vienna the one you want to drop. I don’t find anything cozy about the place. Here is the public transportation map, don’t you just want to hug it: https://c8.alamy.com/comp/BENYEC/vienna-metro-map-the-austrian-capital-city-underground-network-map-BENYEC.jpg But parts, okay, most of it, are fascinating. If you are a history buff it’s hard to imagine skipping the city of museums. You could spend a lifetime and not see all the dead stuff under glass in Vienna. Culture? They put it in cans and market it and sell it like no other city on earth. The outdoors? One of the finest parks in Europe is in the center of town; but that’s not really the same as looking out over the alps … but today I learned the park is full of cute tiny rodents. You can make a very serious dent in understanding and seeing the history, culture and beauty of Vienna in 4 full days. But alas, no top 20 churches. Here is my favorite Vienna tourism video: https://youtu.be/1nd5AtZIrTk?feature=shared

So, to go over your list, where I would go to answer the interests.

• I mostly love learning new things (historical, cultural): London, Paris, Rome, Athens, Vienna, Budapest.
• and seeing beautiful scenery anything outdoors: Switzerland, Austria, northern Italy the Balkans, north Albania, Poland/Slovakia Tatras
• absolutely love churches: London, Paris and a lot of France, ROME and all of Italy.

You need to think about why Vienna is a lower priority for you. With my love of music and art, Vienna and Paris would be way ahead of Munich for me and I also enjoyed Vienna more than Salzburg. If you love churches, you must go to Paris-Sainte Chapelle, Notre Dame and Chartres. I have never been to Munich because it doesn't fit my interests, or yours, unless it has some history that interests you.
EDITED:
So based on my experiences and your priorities, and assuming you haven't yet booked your flights I would go to Edinburgh(Rabbies day trip to Highlands), York(easy train from Edinburgh then to London, York (Minster for original stained glass and evensong service, possibly a day trip to Yorkshire Dales for scenergy), London(British Museum is a must for you), Paris(maybe a day trip to Chartres-but Sainte Chapelle is my #1 must see church in Paris), Vienna , Or take out Vienna to add more time to the others . The fewer places you go, the less time you will waste traveling and checking in and out of hotels. If you don't have tickets yet and end your trip in Paris, fly home from Paris so you can put all your UK trip into the same segment of the trip.
.

Very exciting that you’re planning your first trip!!!

It’s great news that you don’t have plane tickets yet - your possibilities are endless then!

If you’re set on Scotland, then I guess that’s your starting point. Do you have a non-stop flight to Edinburgh from your home city? That always makes travel way easier.

You’ll need to sit down and pencil out how many nights you need for Edinburgh. I do this by making a list of sites I want to see and assigning two sites per day, leaving the rest of the day open for wandering around and enjoying things I happen to cross paths with.

I just spent 8 days in Edinburgh - I had a long list and wanted to see it all. Your list will likely be shorter but I would assume you’d spend 3 nights at least, not counting your arrival day.

Train routing for Edinburgh>London>Paris>Strasbourg>Munich works well. Strasbourg to Vienna is too long for a single day of train travel, I think.

It sounds like you might be able to add a few days to the trip length? If so, you could do Edinburgh>London>Paris>Strasbourg>Munich>Vienna. This is way faster than I normally travel - but it would give you an interesting - but fast-paced - trip. If you could do 3 nights, 4 nights, 4 nights, 2 nights, 3 nights and 4 nights - Plus one night for your flight over - this is a 21 night trip with varied cities, varied scenery, lots of interesting history.

Ideally, you would fly into Edinburgh and home from Vienna to do this.

My final note - each travel day eats up more time than you realize - checking in and out of hotels, waiting for trains, transiting to and from train stations etc.

Valeria, Edinburgh>London>Paris>Strasbourg>Munich>Vienna is a very nice trip. And if tge OP extended it to 23 days (three weeks and the last weekend) it would be wonderful. The OP could even do the train the whole way. A bit tedious, but not terrible.

jkh - Essentially I was trying to drop the flight from Edinburgh to Vienna, so I could slowly make my way west by train, however, I do see that doesn't likely help much anyway. Perhaps I will cross of Munich as a stay and keep Vienna instead. I think I originally only added Munich as it was close to Salzburg and I could fly home from there, but I am no longer planning on using the airport there. It definitely is the city with the least I wanted to do.

Mr E - It will be for 2 adults in the summer. Dates are still kind of up in the air. Most likely May or June. Thanks for all your input on the cities that you have been to, it helps greatly! :) I would love to extend it to 23 days, but I don't think it's possible for my husbands time off from work. Bummer for sure. I love what you came up with for that though.

Cala - Thanks for your input on the churches. I just love seeing the different architecture in all the beautiful churches.

Valerie- Yes, my current thought is flying into EDI non stop from US. Yes, I realize travel will likely eat up some time, originally I thought that flying would take up more time...with getting to the airport ahead of time and what not. Would you say train travel even though the trip is longer usually takes less time?

Since many distances within Europe are not large, trains are usually easier than planes and located in center of town instead of an hour away like airports and you get to see the countryside.

A personal note since it seems like a focus on "churches" has come into play. I have been to most of the best of the best throughout Europe and many of them several times. In the UK, in Germany, in France, in Spain, Italy, Poland, Austria, Hungary, most everywhere except Russia. I have learned that even the so called "best" are often challenged in construction, art, beauty, serenity by many of the simpler and less frequented churches that are everywhere throughout all of Europe. It's like temples in Taiwan, they are everywhere and each has something to offer. I sometimes think that a lot of visitors walk within inches of great houses of worship as they beat a path to the "big ones", the must sees. My habit for the last 55 years has been to stop in at any church that has an open door, and that is almost every one of them. Some of the best little churches are amazing for their simplicity and the obvious associated history. Bigger is not always better. Having said that, the crypts under some of the churches in larger cities are literally mind blowing. Walking in the dark on a spongy loam that is decomposed humanity is pretty crazy, and especially if the lighting is from a handheld candle, as I once experienced at St. Stephens in Vienna. Due to construction, they offered the tour with candles because there were no working lights. When the door was opened, all of our candles blew out. Mega creepy.

Edinburgh ... The city itself does not speak of anything outdoors or beautiful scenery unless you are referring to architecture.

Clearly, Mr E, you've never taken the Water of Leith Walk. It's stunning along much of its course from the Leith Harbor all the way to the Museum of Modern Art. I hope to take it further west from there next summer. And of course the waterfront east through Musselburgh to North Berwick is beautiful.

jphbucks, I will grant you that and grant you that in each of the cities there are natural oasis. I may have guessed wrong, but I was thinking larger scale like the Alps sort of thing.

Would you say train travel even though the trip is longer usually
takes less time?

Up to a point, yes. Even though Vienna-Munich is no longer on your itinerary, it is a good example. One hour flight vs 4 hour train. With security, etc. it would likely come out the same time either way. Add many more departure time options and often times an easier trip to the train station, then train jumps ahead. Also, in this example I find the 4 hours on the train more relaxing than the 4 hours at the airport and on the plane. You can also have a lovely dinner in your next city with the price difference.

Conversely, if I was going Vienna to Frankfurt I would opt for the plane due the the travel time difference.

Regarding Edinburgh, I used to live there, so I may have a slightly different perspective to someone who has visited for one day, but I don't think I would agree with this statement: "The city itself does not speak of anything outdoors or beautiful scenery unless you are referring to architecture."

To begin with, Edinburgh is built on seven hills (like Rome) and you can explore and climb them- the most popular ones are Arthur's Seat and Calton Hill (I believe the hill the castle is on also counts as one). You have the Water of Leith walk as mentioned above, then you have the coast out into East Lothian which is also beautiful for walking. Regarding churches, just out of town you have Rosslyn Chapel which is beautiful and has some very interesting history. Plus many other churches in town, including ones that are no longer serving as churches. Just some things to consider, but all the places you are considering will have things you will enjoy.

Cat VH, if you will read above, I already apologized. I thought the OP was talking about the Alps sort of outdoors not just green. I have been and yes it was beautiful. Just different words bring to mind different meanings to different people. Sorry I offended you.

I actually think its the best stop on the OPs list and I would love to go back and I still kick myself for only spending a few days, but the OPs list doesnt reflect the OPs stated interests as well as a lot of other places do.

No offence taken, just wanted to correct the record :). And yes, you should definitely go back when you have a chance! It's a truly special place.

Good timing
https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/scotland/edinburgh-5-day-trip-report-here

I want to throw in Amsterdam, which is accessible by train from London. It's a unique city and well worth including.
Next stop, Vienna (I haven't been, but the others think it's for you) or Munich (or other German destination; Bamberg is on my list) by train with an overnight in Cologne (talk about churches!). See the advice of The Man in Seat 61 here: https://www.seat61.com/international-trains/trains-from-Amsterdam.htm#Amsterdam-Vienna
Then overnight train to Paris, which connects back to London via Eurostar.
Scotland, England, Netherlands, Germany/Austria and France. It's a classic combo.