Sharing a recent WaPo travel article on tourist bad behavior in which Rick Steves is quoted

Good article, the comments on the Washington Post's page are also interesting. It got me thinking about what we are doing about it besides being outraged. I was disappointed that this post from yesterday didn't get more traction https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/italy/no-grumps-no-chumps
It asks what you would do if you saw something. My thoughts go to that Brit who carved his initials into the Colosseum. It was videoed and posted but what was done on the spot by the people that watched him?

How about Spring Break in Florida, has an entire generation or two been trained to take bad behaviour around the world? But let's not just blame the Americans, the comments to the article has its share of Americans attacking Americans, but it's readers from other countries coming to their rescue by stating that their countries have their share of idiots too. Sadly, my fellow kind and polite Canadians aren't immune as the article also quotes an idiot Canadian's behaviour in Japan.

Entitled tourists are simply persons who feel entitled now traveling. They are selfish. self centered, and obnoxious at home and so they are when they travel.

What did parents not teach them? It began in the home a long time ago.

And a lot of entitled tourists being young, I assume that mommy and daddy are financing the trip

You must be careful when you say something to any of these persons directly because they might stab you or punch you in the face or use a rock or gun on you.

Perhaps a group can stop one stupid individual or one can go to security if you can find or get to security.

These entitled tourists need to accept responsibility. Their passports should be taken away and they should have to spend X amount of days trying to repair the damage they have done if it can be repaired. If the damage can not be repaired, they should then be sentenced to X amount of days giving back to the community they damaged through community service.

Or they can be put on public display as The Fool who did such and such, i.e. be publicly shamed.

I am one of those persons who do say something. When I see people put their feet up on the seats of the train, I tell them it is not ok, that people have to sit there. If they are smoking in the station, I say something. If I see someone throw trash on the ground, I say something. If they are peeing in a public space, I say something. If I saw them carving their initials or doing anything else they shouldn't, yep, am gonna say something. The idea that they would shoot me or stab or hit me with a rock is not very likely. People don't carry those things around with them here.

It is called civil courage and everyone needs to step up and do what they can to stop people from bad behavior that affects the rest of us.

Unfortunately, due to social media or whatever, this trend of "entitlement" doesn't seem to be limited to tourism. In terms of carving things into priceless historic sites in Europe, the only short term solution I can think of would be prosecution, heavy sentences and restitution.

More visitors, more bad behavior. That's just the way humans are.

Old graffiti is one of the things guides here love to point out, like the 900 year old Crusader graffiti at the entrance to the Holy Sepulchre Church in Jerusalem, or the 2000 year old Roman soldier who carved his legion number on a pillar nearby.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying today's bad behavior should be ignored, much less tolerated. Just don't get your knickers in a twist about it.

More visitors, more bad behavior. That's just the way humans are.

Yes. Bad behavior is nothing new or unique to our own time. There are more travelers along with the desire to share everything on social media and media's want to create clicks with rage inducing headlines; more clicks better revenue and advertising rates.

Entitled tourists are simply persons who feel entitled now traveling. They are selfish. self centered, and obnoxious at home and so they are when they travel...And a lot of entitled tourists being young, I assume that mommy and daddy are financing the trip...

It's too simplistic to blame everything on "entitlement". I know it fits into our preconceived notions of who is misbehaved and who is not. There's just not this great class of entitled greatly misbehaving people and in my experience it all too often just a normal visitor not thinking, caught up in or lost in the moment -- and once pointed out to them, they're horrified or embarrassed at their transgression. And about the young tourists that's just a tired trope.

I am 75 years old and have lived overseas for 9 years, 4 in Germany and 5 in Saudi Arabia.
Also, I have visited 81 foreign countries.

I have not seen such bad behavior during my travels. Much of my travel earlier in my life was done on my own, not on tours or cruises. As I have aged, tours are more appealing, since someone else takes care of all the individual tours, transport, hotels, etc.

I have noticed changes in Worldwide tourism. Many more people are traveling these days. Back in the good old days (say 20-30 years ago and more, you didn't have to pre-book the Eiffel Tower, Sistine Chapel or Rijksmuseum. Going to the Anne Frank House was just showing up.

Not sure of the correlation between bad behavior and increase in tourist, but perhaps there is no correlation.

I do think that my generation was more respectful of others. For example, no way would I place my feet, shoes on or not, on an opposing seat on a European train. No way would I throw trash on the street or damage an antiquity.

I suspect it is representative of what I see these days from a decline in our culture of respect for others. Years ago just walking down the street in a city, I was taught to stay to the right, like you do driving a car down the street. Foot traffic flowed much easier that way. these days, no-one does that anymore. Therefore, you keep facing someone that is coming right for you.

Yes a real problem. But I dont think it's restricted to travel. Recent articles have pointed out the general decline in public behavior, from people throwing things at concerts, freakouts in stores, children attacking teachers, etc., all caught on convenient videos and becoming fodder for social media. It's a decline in civilized behavior, the public good, and the promotion of personal entitlement over respect for others.

I dont know what the solution is, but it starts with the little things, like manners. It seems like people are reluctant to effectively, punish bad behavior, and certainly to show good examples.

It's not that human nature has changed, but the circumstances in which humans develop has changed. People growing up now are exposed to social media at a young age and it affects their motivations. Events and activities are unironically planned in the context of social media and how something will look on an insta post or tiktok.

In a way it's not really their fault that they were born in a digital wasteland instead of wholesome Xth Century. Mommy and daddy have been posting their pictures on social media since they were born. Timmy and Sally in class have iphones and go to tropical paradise on vacation, why don't you have an iphone?

The problem is not that human nature has changed, it's that it hasn't changed.

Two years ago my daughter and I were hiking at Mt Rainier. It was a very windy, rainy day. Sideways rain pelting you in the face. We got an early start and were on our way back down when we encountered a large group of men, easily about 40 of them. They were not on the trail, but trampling the wildflowers, despite numerous signs. Not one of them had a jacket, and all were in jeans and t-shirts. A few had a water bottle. I could tell they were a military group, so I asked. It was a group that had just come from a base on the east coast. At an area where most of them were congregating, I could easily spot the leader and I spoke to him. He did not say a word, but basically rolled his eyes at me like he was not going to let a woman tell him that what his group was doing was wrong. I knew better than to pursue it, so when we got down I went and found a ranger. Trampling wildflowers is one thing, but these guys were going to get in trouble as they were not prepared and the weather was worsening. I was more worried for their safety, but was also just ticked that they had no respect for the national park. The ranger said someone was on there up to talk to them. I could not just let it go and not find a ranger. I still cannot believe their "leader". My daughter commented that it was good my husband was not with us as this would have escalated up their chain of command.

The "It's all about me" attitude isn't new; it's been around several decades but it's never been as bad as it is now. It does seem, however, that social media has caused it to increase by leaps and bounds. What happened to cause people to stop speaking out when they see such things? Fear of being thought politicaly incorrect? Fear of violence? Fear of litigation? Lack of being "raised right" as grandmother would say? In the end, we are all just mere specks in the universe, and need to get over ourselves. Is is after five o'clock yet?

If you don't have at least six social influencers you follow you're not cool. At least that's what I heard from some younger folks at work.

So I'm following one of the Kardashians so I'm not left out. I'm learning about how to pose on a beach in a thong.

"Stealing land?" That's been going on since the dawn of civilization.

I have been fortunate in my 21 visits overseas. Only once did I witness truly atrocious behavior from a tourist in Heathrow Int'l Airport. And only once was I the recipient of abusive behavior from a merchant in Milan.

A couple times I was the recipient of pretty bad behavior, but the situation was resolved. Once a waiter in Venice put his hand on a dish as he was walking by my table without serving and mostly ignored my sister and me during the course of our meal. I complained to the maitre d', and the gratuity charge was waived.

I have seen plenty of bad behavior among tourists that falls below the level of brazenness: laziness, boorishness and a lack a preparation. That amazes me as travel abroad is a privilege.

Traveling with grace is mark of a civilized man or woman. I am sure I have fallen short a couple times, but I hope people abroad have come away with a good impression of me overall. I hope this decaying world keeps up its dignity amid trying times.

There is very rarely any consequence for bad behavior even if it is of a sort like carving on a monument that is actually against the law. And, if the law is enforced the penalty is paltry compared to the deed. So if it is $100 fine for vandalizing a monument, if, that is if, and only IF I get caught, what’s the real risk there.
Look at the appalling behavior on airlines now, even assault. The stats on prosecutions and conviction and penalties is very low. Despite our outrage and the cost to airlines for deviating and disrupting flights.
It is a losing game for civilization. The Barbarians are not at the gate they are inside.

In Frankfurt, they have a campaign: "See Something, Say Something"
Hopefully it cuts down on vandalism.

Years ago just walking down the street in a city, I was taught to stay to the right, like you do driving a car down the street. Foot traffic flowed much easier that way. these days, no-one does that anymore. Therefore, you keep facing someone that is coming right for you.

Thanks for this. One of my biggest pet peeves. Also those groups who cover the entire sidewalk and walk towards you and think you should somehow blend into the building.

Just got back from seeing "Arrival from Sweden," an ABBA cover band, in Durham NC.

Man "playing with himself" two rows in front of us cleared all of the women, as it were, from the aisle. I thought they were just going out to the aisle to dance, but then my wife found out the truth. Two of the women were visibly upset. The ushers didn't seem to know what to do and until we left just kept an eye of the pervert.

Announcements were made to turn off cell phones, which didn't work at all. People were illegally videotaping the show and others just taking pics of otherwise being annoying with the phone and light on. One lady in the front row stood the entire time taping the show. An usher went over and told her to put it back, and she did for about 30 seconds. Apparently the ushers are not allowed to physically remove someone unless it's a danger to life and limb, so nothing happened.

At the hotel someone above us was apparently doing a walkathon all night. I don't know what was going on in the hallway, but there was yelling and so forth from adults well after midnight. I did get up to see what was going on but they went into their rooms at about the same moment.

The rules need to change to allow ushers to physically restrain or remove rule breakers (after a warning) and then deny them future entry. What other answers are there? There are plenty of ex-military guys who could easily have picked the women (and pervert) up and throw them out on their butts.

I've been enjoying the responses to this article. Keep 'em coming.

In Tucson we have "See something, Say something" billboards. I was glad to hear that it's not just a local or US thing.

The people who walk abreast all across the sidewalk also annoy me. I've experienced that in so many locations that I can't help but think, is this global? I've been both forced into the wall of a building and out into the street.

I will say that I was pleasantly surprised one time in France when a youngish parent had his son (about 10) get up and give me his seat on a bus. Hope is not lost. Maybe that kid will grow up to consider others and not be so self-absorbed.

On the street art tour in Rome, I was very disappointed to see that the jumping wolf mural had been defaced by graffiti. (Scroll down the link to see the best picture I could find of it.) I expressed my dismay and asked my guide why someone would do that to a work of art when they could scribble their name in any number of other locations. He said that some young men (and that's the demographic that typically does this) have an overwhelming need to proclaim their existence. Sounds like some passive-aggressive you-know-what-kind of contest to me. 😉

I must admit that I found the graffiti carved into the Pont du Gard interesting due to its age. I see that as part of history. And I was the only person on a tour of the interior of the building at the Nazi Party Rally Grounds in the early 1980's before the US Army turned "Soldiers Field" (as it was called by us) over to the Germans. I remember it being damp and drippy in there.

Something that had been left inside and I hope will stay is the graffiti I saw that was left by American soldiers in 1945. Most was in pencil and just had their names, where they were from, the date they were there and sometimes their rank. Assuming that they were participants in the Battle of Nuremberg in April 1945, I also see that as part of history.

Threadwear,

I stay to the right when I walk. I am old and I am slow. Do not mind admitting it at all. When I walk, I tend to cause a traffic jam of younger and healthier people coming up behind me. I hate people breathing down my neck so I have learned to stay over to the right when i walk.

I just posted something about walking on the right on another discussion.

And I also hate a group taking up the whole sidewalk not being considerate of those needing to pass. I hate having to pass them but worse, I hate when they come up behind me. I often stop and let them go by me.

But I also do not like it when a slow person like myself walks right in the middle so that you can not pass on the right or on the left. You have to come up behind them and say "excuse me" so that you can get around them.

I think "See Something, Say Something" is a national if not international phrase. We also use it in Austin. It is everywhere. Wonder if the person who came up with it gets royalties.

Calvados

Not to excuse rude, ignorant and selfish behavior but the man you are speaking of may have been having a health issue or an emotional issue.

We only see what we see and never really know what is going on with another.

So I just came across this article on BBC News.

https://www.bbc.com/travel/article/20230821-is-this-the-summer-of-bad-tourists

Bostonphil7, thanks so much for sharing that BBC piece. I wasn't registered with their free BBC access and now I am, thanks to you.

But..."shouldn't you now be Austinphil?" ... says the old TexasEx with the 1967 (yikes!) BFA from UT Austin. 😉 🤘

Lo

you warmed my heart.

I identify very strongly with ny Boston and New England roots even though I have been in Austin since 1972.

I have loved Austin and I still like it but not like when I came in 1972. It is all grown up, for better or worse. Some is good and some is bad. .

And you, Class of 1967! You know what I am talking about.

Call me old fashion. Only because I am, I guess. But, parents are to blame for all this bad behavior. No matter whether my kid was 13, 23, 33, or 43, they are never too old to learn to respect others and the property of others. It isn't social media. It is plain and simple lack of respectfulness to others and the property of others.

Also, there are no consequences. A few $5,000 fines for these bad behaviors and people just might pay more attention to what they are about to do.