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Series of questions from Europe novice

Hi Helpline posters. Am interested in your thoughts.. I see a series of at least five different threads from a Europe first timer Megan. They are all perfectly reasonable questions from a first timer. My question to other Helpliners.. - would it be of best service to people like Megan to encourage them to get and read a guide book such as RS ETBD, then come back if they still have questions? - I feel like there are a hundred add'l questions that Megan isn't thinking to ask, and her trip and planning will be much more enjoyable and successful if she gets and reads a good guidebook, and that by answering a sting of beginners question, we are enabling behavior that is not helpful to her. Thoughts...?

Posted by
9110 posts

Some people can't digest a book, they have to work through it on their own. Her problem is that she needs to quit thinking and get going. None of it's a big mystery for something as easy as Europe. You can figure it out as you go. Save the thinking for something that takes grampons, diving gear, mules, etc.

Posted by
3696 posts

I think plenty of people have suggested that she get some books... but this helpline is for asking questions of other people who have experience in the areas she is questioning... Actually, if you think about it... people could probably research every question asked here in some other way... but they choose to ask for help here. I guess if people don't want to answer her... then don't...leave the question for someone who does have advice to share.

Posted by
9110 posts

And what else: Some people lack confidence. Sometimes it's a bit hard to walk to the edge of the cliff and jump.........with the confidence that you'll figure out how to fly before you get to the bottom. The unending dire warnings about personal safety, moneybelts, bars, 'normal precatutions', and pickpockets don't help. If I thought the acts were as frequent as the warnings posted here, I'd see if I could convert my concealed weapons permit into an international one.

Posted by
23548 posts

I don't think Bob is raising the question of not answering her questions but from her questions it is obvious that there are a lot of other questions she should be asking but she doesn't know it. She hasn't a clue about what she doesn't know so the bigger question how to encourage someone to really do some background research/building to know the questions to be asked. It is how you research a topic. Asking random questions about a subject or series of subjects is not productive unless you have a matrix of where to put the answers. This is a basic concept of research that is often overlooked. The internet makes it easy to ask random questions and get equally random answers. It is a good question with no answer other than go do your homework. And you all know how we hate homework.

Posted by
3696 posts

@Ed... if I believed there were thieves and pickpockets on every corner I would be sitting on my sofa watching RS videos wishing I was brave enough to face Europe.

Posted by
712 posts

I can understand where she is coming from, both because her questions are very common for a new traveller and also because she seems a bit overwhelmed (no offense Megan if you are reading this!!). I was the same exact way before my first trip to Europe. However, I am the type of person that likes to read before asking. So that's when I discovered Rick's guidebooks and found that 95% of my questions were answered (and have been an avid fan ever since). The other 4% of my questions were answered by searching this site and seeing old posts with my same exact issue addressed. Then there was that random 1% that I did ask. I have spent about 8 months in Europe in total over the past 4 years, and I have needed to ask very little questions (relatively) because most of what I need has already been asked... However that's just me. Personally, yes, I think she needs to get a guidebook, read it, and take it with her, or at the very least, peruse this site for info, for her OWN sake. This site is an awesome resource, but it could "enable" someone into getting lazy and relying on just posting a question, and sitting and waiting for answers than to take 10 minutes and Google it. I think there is more benefit to self-research because not only do you (usually) finds answers to your questions, but you also find answers to questions you didn't know you needed to ask. Anyone who takes the shortcut is kinda cheating themselves... But to each his own, and I am sure I have been guilty of that same thing. At least she came to the right place :)

Posted by
262 posts

Information and other people's experience are very powerful tools in planning a trip. Reading guide books and blogs are also very good tools to use. What kind of drives me crazy is when people want you to plan their trips for them. Only the person knows what interests and activities they enjoy. It's ok to ask for hotel or city recommendations or even transportation questions. I find the electronic questions quite informative to. I am a pretty experienced traveler, and often feel like I can offer information that may help someone else. I also feel like there is so much that I can learn from others on this helpline. What I don't often understand is why people have to plan so much that spontaneity is impossible. Things happen, weather often changes and may affect a day or two.
I always have ideas of what I like to see and so on a trip, but is never set in stone. Happy Travels!!

Posted by
265 posts

Good Question. I have been thinking that there should be a "top ten" list of best things a novice European traveler should know. And any time a newbie come to the helpline we refer them to this list or something. I will propose the first "Best Things To Know About" as you plan your 1st trip to Europe. 1. Learn about "Open Jaws" airplane tickets. Open Jaws is when you fly into one city to begin your trip and fly out of another city at the end of your trip. Usually an open jaws ticket is no more than a roundtrip ticket into and out of the same city. Plus you can save money by not having to pay to get back to a city you have already toured.
Example: Fly into Paris and go home from Rome. Rather than paying to get back to Paris when your vacation time is up and you are in Rome. Please post your favorite helpful hint for the first timer.

Posted by
9369 posts

When we get a new poster/first time traveler, we often see series of questions like Megan's. And most of the time someone does suggest reading Europe Through the Back Door to start with, because it addresses so many of the basics of traveling in Europe. In fact, I believe at least one person has already done so. We also do encourage first timers to be as specific as possible with their questions so we can give them specific answers. We can't read anyone's mind to determine what other questions they might have and haven't asked. I would rather see a series of unrelated questions, asked separately, than 10 questions lumped into one post.

Posted by
3313 posts

I thought "Buy Europe Through the Back Door" was a standard FARQ here (Frequent Answer Regardless of Question). How is it possible that standard response has missed Megan???

Posted by
3696 posts

Well... looks like she wrote a Farewell note on her other posts so we probably don't need to worry about her anymore. Wonder why? Maybe because it was insinuated she was a troll, told to stay home, made to look naive and that her questions were stupid, told to do her homework, she might become lazy if we help her... People who become irritated with questions really need to remember they are not being directed at YOU...they are being put out to the RS universe and YOU do not need to read it, nor answer.

Posted by
712 posts

I have been told worse, and I am still here...
On a positive note, she may have sent a farewell because all her questions were very thoroughly answered by many patient people.

Posted by
23548 posts

And some feel it is important to take charge of the site and tell others how to behave. Sort of the style of, Do as I say and not as I do. Remember, the rest of us slobs really don't know much.

Posted by
14772 posts

New travelers (even experienced ones) should read Rough Guide and Let's Go.....very readable and informative.

Posted by
12040 posts

Wow. My internet goes down for 12 hours and I miss all this? Well, I hope Megan has a good trip.

Posted by
10515 posts

I stumbled upon this today, never having read a Megan question, so I don't have a dog in this fight. However, I looked through all the questions posted by Megan and saw nearly one hundred thoughtful answers that collectively took hours and hours and hours for people to answer helpfully and thoughtfully. I was impressed by how much people gave of themselves to help her, as they do hundreds of newbies every year. David, if you go back and read the threads, you'll see that you are wrong on this one. The OP has every right to walk away, but with such an overly dramatic, poor-innocent-me swan song, this was, IMHO, a pretty manipulative response to only one edgy answer. That this same swan song appeared on all the posts, in response to one irritated answer, after all the thoughtful help she received, confirms my opinion. Remember that Pat, who helps hundreds of people, blew her fuse after the standardized swan song appeared on all the threads, and after she received an unprovoked attack on the pepper spray thread.

Posted by
3255 posts

Her questions were legitimate and there was no need to ridicule her. There was a time in the US when many young women carried pepper spray for self-protection. I had a small spray thing on my keychain, so it was handy when I walked to my car at night. After a woman was abducted from the SeaTac airport parking garage I felt it prudent. And I was unaware that I could not take it into Canada. I "surrendered it to the Crown" at the border ( the border agent pointed to the trash can when he said that) and never replaced it. But for a few years there I felt reassured by carrying it when walking around alone at night. And Megan is not the first woman to ask about the availability of hygiene products abroad. I had to ask a friend before my first trip to Europe. Of course I knew that women everywhere have periods (that's for Pat), but I didn't know if they use the same things in Europe that we do in the US. I had my favorites and didn't want to change. My friend said yes, they even have the same brands. And guess what? At that time, the Tampax in Europe was different. So I wished I had brought my own. Maybe that has changed but I haven't tested it. And it should be OK to talk about these things on the forum. No need for her to PM a woman because the topic is supposed to be a secret.

Posted by
14772 posts

As expressed by Tom, I, too, hope Megan has a great trip. True, some people lack self-confidence and it certainly doesn't help when compounded by the fear of the unknown. She ought to withdraw her farewell posting and continue with questions.

Posted by
1026 posts

Hi Bob, I travel to and from work on a daily basis using a train that goes to Zurich airport, so I regularly bump into holidaying Americans on my journey. And based on that I would say the most of the regulars on here are not your typical American tourist, they are aware that there is a world outside of the USA, that it might not work like home and they possess the skills necessary to research it alone, but this is not typical! And we need to make allowances for that fact. The majority of the Americans I meet are going to Lucern or Bern or where ever because Mary or Joe or Tom was there last year and said they should go! And judging by the mint copy of the guidebook they will be carrying it is clear that the first time in was open was sometime after arriving in Europe. They are on a big adventure and we should try and help them on their way, rather than criticise them for what they don't know. I think the RS book is very good, but I also aware that even reading the newspaper can be a challenge for some people these days let alone reading a book! These days many people rely on visual media for all their information, so I would think recommending people to look at the RS travel skill videos might be a better approach. Jim.

Posted by
5678 posts

Wow, I'm with Tom on thisstay off the internet for a few hours and miss all this drama. There are many ways to research a tripbooks, attend lectures, ask friends, read newspapers, explore websites, read forums, watch TV shows, and yes, ask questions on forums. I am not calling out anyone specifically here, but there is a tendency to be a bit abrupt when answering novice questions. I answer a lot of questions about Scotland and sometimes I think, wow, yet another question about the train from London to Edinburgh! Can't these people google or look at a train schedule? On those days, I move on. There is a wide range of styles, backgrounds, travel experience, personalities and more on this site. I think that we all need to take that into consideration when answering a question or posting one. Pam PS When I went to Germany to study back in the dark ages of the 70's, I'll never forget the fountain of tampax that overflowed from my room mate's suitcase when she opened it up the first night. I panicked for a day or two and then found some products. But they were different from what I was used to, but I lived. ; )

Posted by
9110 posts

Maybe you two could delete the back and forth that doesn't have much anything to do with travel? And maybe clean up the banter on the other threads as well? And maybe quit doing it? Or just exchange phone numbers?

Posted by
10029 posts

Like Sasha and Pamela, I too found the question about feminine hygiene products not unreasonable. It's true that those items here are very similar and even some of the brands are the same, but if one has a certain favorite that she's really comfortable with, that's sure to be the one that isn't the same. Not to mention that trying to decipher the packages in a foreign language could take longer from one's vacation than you would want! Then you buy something, just to be disappointed, and wonder whether to keep using it so as not to have wasted the money you saved for expenses on your trip to Europe, etc etc etc. All of which is to say that in order to save time and money, I don't think it would be a bad idea at all to bring one's pads/tampons/whatever in your luggage. It's a question that merits an answer as thoughtful and honest as the next one. No, it's not the biggest deal in the world. But it's one discomfort that a newbie traveler could eliminate for herself by asking for advice and then coming prepared.

Posted by
10029 posts

Bets, as always, makes a very good point. It did strike me the language once she (Megan) got excitable and cross-posted the same response on several threads.

Posted by
638 posts

Since I didn't have anything to add to the original question about lady products available in Europe I didn't post on it, but as a couple of others kind of mentioned, it sure has been interesting. My thought goes to the possibility of people trolling on the site, the lady products question maybe, and the one about pepper spray I don't know. However there have been some strange questions I've seen pop up on the board over the past couple of weeks that made me think in that vein, that is troll. They have all been one sentence posts, some not even a real question, for example, one just listed a bunch of towns in capital letters, another that got my attention asked for a laundry service near a little known university in the Netherlands. There was one that simply asked how soon will my post show up on the board, yet they didn't ask any questions beyond that. Now today, there is a question on this section "General Europe" entitled "General Europe", though maybe not a troll question per se, but is so ambigious it is sure to the standard response, read a guidebook, which it deserves. But it also touches on something that always needles me a bit, "don't like doing touristy things", and travel cheaply. These type and please look at my itenerary questions I avoid, what I sometimes wonder is even though people on the board go through the effort of telling them their trip is undoable, do the OP really take that to heart? Sure, I'm sure some do, they come back with a revision, but I digress. Have any of you thought the same about some of these questions, questions that can easily be answered by the people that work in the hotels and schools when the OP is in Europe instead of posting it on a message board weeks or months before you really need to know.

Posted by
638 posts

After reading my post I've almost answered my own question. I think some people want instant gratification, that is they don't want to spend time doing something like research for example, they just want to know! Why spend an hour researching or reading other similar posts on this board when one can just type for a minute, come back 2 hours later and have an answer.But I still think some of the single sentence questions I mentioned earlier are trolls or at the very least not worth my time and energy.

Posted by
33464 posts

Boy, you turn your back for a day and look what goes down. I'm working too hard to keep up every day at the moment and this just blew by... Yes, there are trolls around. We don't always know who, and we can do well to answer those questions about which have answers and let the others chime in. Jo, pass the popcorn.

Posted by
10029 posts

Let's see if I can go provide any more productive answers/help to someone somewhere!!! I was happy last night to tell Christine about Pecs in Hungary . . .

Posted by
224 posts

I knew what she meant by "lady products" and I'm no lady. I'm concerned about "man products" on the plane. For example, beer and TV remote. Or has that been banned on the flight, too?

Posted by
712 posts

Beer and a remote sound good to me actually! So from now on, can we be politically correct and refer to those as "unisex products"? Otherwise I may get offended, quote Plato or Dr. Seuss and leave this site forever. You've been warned!!
In other news, this site is truly a fantastic resource and I learn something new everyday, whether it's from a new poster, an experienced poster (I'm using the number of posts to determine that), or whoever. It's my go-to site. And if a person does come across as rude or curt or blunt (which as was mentioned is easy to happen just because tone cannot always be determined) it still wouldn't justify turning my back on the wealth of information available here, in my opinion. Even a seemingly rude answer still took time to research and type, and for that alone I am grateful. So keep up the good work you guys! You have saved me tons of money and sanity!!

Posted by
224 posts

"No TV and no beer makes Homer something, something"- Homer Simpson.