Please sign in to post.

Restrictions on Travelers' Activities/Visas, etc.

There was a recent post about a woman who planned to volunteer. I understand that because volunteering possibly replaces paid workers, permission must be granted first. The post made me think of two scenarious: 1) Like many on vacation, I like to imagine that I'm moving to a location I like. This time, though, I might be able to put the plan into action. Does anyone have experience applying for jobs or university programs, or merely making inquiries? I suppose I could store my CV online and send it later, but I'm the sort of person who would be honest later (say in an application for a work visa), so I would like to avoid mistakes, rather than explain them. I also find that having an activity or a purpose other than the happy enjoyment of museums and the like usually provides me with my happiest memories. So, to bring my question into focus, does anyone know if negotiating for a job violates the visitor status of convention countries? Would accepting a job, if you didn't receive any money until after you return, and you didn't start performing the job until after your return (whether or not you work in, say, Italy, or not) would get a person into trouble? 2) There's a good chance I'll spend several full days at my grandchildren's Italian school. Am I clear to do that and not have it called volunteering? I might want to list it as an activity that I have done.
Thanks!

Posted by
23281 posts

Still not sure what the question is? Obtain a work permit is extremely difficult and time consuming so it would be impossible to apply for a job, get a job, and then get a work permit. If that is what you are asking.

Posted by
2829 posts

I don't think there is a problem applying to jobs or academic programs in person with a tourist visa, but you can't start them without proper visas. You will not be allowed to enroll in an university program without the legal proceedings that vary a lot from country to country. Often, taking instruction in short-term courses doesn't require visas for Americans, e.g., things a person would normally PAY instead of BEING PAID for. As for other "activities", each country has its own rules. Some countries like Netherlands, Norway or Switzerland are extremely tough on "volunteer" rules involving foreign work. In Italy, if the activity you are performing is typically something a person would be paid for, it is classified as work regardless of whether you actually get paid or not - the threshold is actually the labor liability law. Again, in Italy you (American citizen) can study up to 3 months in a non-degree program without a student visa, provided you can pay for the program and for your own expenses. You can't do farm work legally though. All schemes promising work-for-accommodation or similar are illegal, be them hostels letting young students stay in exchange for bartendering and reception work, be them farms offering the "experience" (sic) of working and getting 90% discount on B&B rates (there was a huge crackdown on this around 2003-4).

Posted by
223 posts

Thanks, Andre. You have helped a lot. I know you have to go home before you start work, and now I'm clear that I can check around. I'm not an entrepreneur, but having something to do, even to explore pipe dream options, is fun for me. So, I'll play on! Thanks

Posted by
9363 posts

I'm not at all sure that a potential employer would even let you apply for a job without a proper work permit first.

Posted by
223 posts

Nancy, I'm sure that there are differences, but I know from experience that it is possible to be offered a job from another country. I just have never been in the other country to talk about working there.
Thanks, everybody!

Posted by
9363 posts

Being offered a job is not the same as applying for a job. If you were offered a job, I would assume that the employer would take care of the work visa issue.

Posted by
12040 posts

Some knowledge of the Schengen Agreement employment rules would help here. Besides allowing for freedom of movement within most of the EU and limiting how much time non-citizens can spend in the Schengen Zone, it also, more or less, harmonized some employment regulations. Specifically, it allows for any citizen of a Schengen Agreement signatory country to work anywhere else in the Zone without any special working permits, so long as they meet the qualifications for the job. The other side of this rule, however, is that if an employer wishes to hire someone from outside the Schengen Zone, they must be able to justify in writing why this person is uniquely suited to the job over an EU applicant, and then the request is subject to approval by the government. For certain highly skilled career fields, like medicine or scientific research, this requirement is waived. But for just about everyone else, you would have to offer some unique skill for an employer to even consider going through all the paperwork to legally hire you. And with the sky-high unemployment rate in southern Europe right now... that probably won't happen.

Posted by
10201 posts

There is also illegal age discrimination. I was set to sign papers for a 6-month gig for a specialized job for which I was uniquely qualified. When they saw I was over 55, the offer disappeared. Oh, and I hold dual US and EU citizenship.