There was a recent thread in which a statement was made, to the effect, that we need to stop just blaming the destination and take some personal responsibility.
Responsible tourism relative to and response to over-tourism (can we keep it that narrow please) sounds like a perfect subject for a forum based on tourism.
But what does that even mean? How?
I have thought about Responsible Tourism although I did not call it that.
I think Responsible Tourism might include not taking public transportation during the hours when the locals are going to work or coming home from work. This is if possible because if you have to get to the airport during those hours, you srill have to get to the airport.
Similarly lunch time. Perhaps tourists could eat before or after the lunch hour for the locals. Perhaps. I know that that is not always possible but it might be considered. Eat a late breakfast or brunch and or eat a late lunch or afternoon snack.
I grew up in an area popular with snowbirds from the Midwest in the winter months.
Many years ago someone wrote a letter to the editor of the paper addressed to our winter visitors. The writer pointed out that since they are on vacation, they should enjoy sleeping in a little later while everyone else struggled with traffic during rush hour. Also to use the frontage road instead of the freeway since they typically liked to drive at a leisurely pace and look at the farmland and orchards as their morning outing.
I prefer travelling after or before rush hour because I don't like heavy traffic and I know I'm "in the way".
I also usually eat a bigger breakfast when travelling and then eat a late lunch. Again to avoid the crowds and to be out of the way of folks who need to get back to work.
How about considerate tourism?
It certainly requires a level of self-awareness and respect for others that is in short supply. We're uninvited guests and need to act accordingly.
My goals:
- dont block the sidewalk. People who live there need to get through.
- don't take photos of people, homes, vendors, etc., without asking permission. They are not props for a slide show.
- don't treat places of everyday business, like farmers' markets and churches as photo ops. Be discreet and respectful.
- be aware of all the language, customs (e.g., shop greetings) and civility issues (e.g., loud talking) we talk about here everyday
- recognize that at best I am being tolerated, not celebrated for just being there in their space.
- don't expect to be entertained.
- there's always something else to do or someplace else to visit, if its just too crowded. In the end, nobody else really cares what I did on vacation and if I saw the "must sees".
The people on this forum are the most responsible group of tourists I know. If most tourists coming to Barcelona were Rick Steves' type tourists, we would not be having the overtourism issues we are having now in my hometown.
For me, a Rick Steves' type tourist is someone who seeks immersive, authentic travel experiences by researching extensively the local culture and traditions, often prioritizing meaningful interactions with locals over major tourist hot-spots. They tend to favor staying in family-run accommodations, dining at local eateries, and exploring off-the-beaten-path destinations (that don't specifically cater to tourists). They value learning about history, art, and daily life over sitting on a beach and sipping sangria. They travel with a light footprint, being respectful and considerate of the local environment, both cultural and natural.
The main piece of advice I have is to check your attitude, you are not a "customer going to disneyland", locals aren't some kind of workforce who owe you some spectacular tourist experience. Think of yourself as a guest at someone's house.
bostonphil7, Thoughtful and it is the sort of attitude if all tourist put some thought to would improve the tourist / locals relationship.
Maybe a responsible tourist doesn’t take the public transportation to the airport at rush hour; maybe he hires a taxi. Sure, 10x the cost, but is there a price limit on being a responsible tourist? But do you take a taxi? Rush hour traffic can be a mess too, so you in your taxi is making things worse. So maybe the solution is never book a flight that requires you to travel at rush hour. By the way, is rush hour the same in every location? No idea. More research.
We have two public transportation lines in my town that are among the most used tram lines in Europe (Tram 4 and 6). But we also have four lines that may only exist because the tourists make them viable (M1, and Trams 2, 47, 49). Without tourists they would be more than half empty and might cease to operate for the locals. So should one avoid all public transportation in all cities at rush hour or should one research the occupant load and the local vs tourist use on each line before visiting a city?
Excellent thoughts. Here are a few more on the same train of thought.
Do these things and you will flow with the locals and no one will even notice your existence.
At lunch, would it be okay if one only visited an establishment in a tourist zone at lunch time? Again doing some research to avoid places that locals enjoy? What if there are empty tables in the local’s restaurant? I assume the owner wants to fill the place, otherwise some local restaurateurs may find themselves out of work? Where I live at least very few places, especially the non-tourist zone places, are at capacity at lunch, so I haven’t really given it much thought.
Stan, I always say, jó napot ya'all. (translated from two languages: good day to all of you)
dont block the sidewalk. don't take photos of people, homes, vendors,
etc., without asking permission. Be discreet and respectful.
This isnt about tourism, its about common courtesy in your home town too.
don't treat places ... as photo ops.
That’s a bit hard core for me, but It doesn’t hurt.
be aware of all the language, customs ,,, and ... civility issues ...
You have to do a bunch of research to understand the customs. Like I am respectful and understanding when a person from another country visits me in Texas, I sort of expect that people in France are equally as understanding. So, should your wife say thank you and shake the Rabbi's hand at the end of the tour? Sometimes impossible to know what you dont know.
recognize that at best I am being tolerated, not celebrated ...
Maybe, maybe some appreciate the business you bring them. They are big kids; they know the cost of that business is a lot understanding of people that don’t know their home. I lived in a tourist city in Texas and that’s pretty much the attitude there. I hope for the same in other places.
don't expect to be entertained.
Sitting and watching the people go by is one of my favorite forms of entertainment. So is talking to waiters and taxi drivers.
there's always something else to do or someplace else to visit, ....
In the end, nobody else really cares what I did on vacation and if I
saw the "must sees".
I don’t travel for other people either. I do it for myself and I go where I am interested in going.
But there isnt a single point you made that is wrong in my view. They just require a bit of thought. .
But what does that even mean? How?
This is a great question. Thank you Mr E.
Since many of the protests are coming from residents being forced out of city centers by tourists staying in apartments, I belive that one starting point is to be responsible regarding where we stay when traveling. For starters, this means staying in hotels or hostels, rathern than short-term rental apartments. Yes, these buildings do compete with apartments for ground space in a city. But I doubt they significantly change the economics of apartment ownership. Additionally, I would expect that there are at least a few more jobs associated with a full-service hotel than with a few short-term rentals in a building.
Second, and I'd like to hear thoughts on this, is to consider staying outside of the city centers. My personal experience has often been one of being a visitor in a part of a city that doesn't get as many visitors as the city center. The local restaurants and shops aren't croweded and I imagine that the few extra dollas I bring are more appreciated than spending them at the over-priced and over-filled establishments in the tourist zones. You may need to be prepared with a few words of the local languare and a menu translator, but that's a good thing. Of course this means more time on public transit, and as had already been stated in this thread, we should avoid rush hour travel when possible.
Finally, and I know this will get some disagreement, we tourists should be prepared to pay full price at publicly-supported museums. No asking for senior discounts, going on free days or pay what you can days. If you can afford to travel, then pay the full fare and let the locals have the discounts.
Since many of the protests are coming from residents being forced out
of city centers by tourists staying in apartments,
The intent you convey is very good. But you are assuming that all cities in all countries face identical issues. For instance in Germany about 15% own their home, the rest rent. Where I live over 90% own their home. The dynamics have to be different between the two locations. I am not saying some cities are not having significant problems. I am saying that it’s not my place to establish the values for another city. Let them decide and then support their decisions. Quite a few have taken very strong action, others still get a good net benefit from the short-term rentals and some, like my home town, are addressing the issue brilliantly.
Yes, [hotels] do compete with apartments for ground space in a city.
But I doubt they significantly change the economics of apartment
ownership.
In some instances the impact is profound. Maybe not in others. My gut is that eliminating 50 apartments to eliminate 5 short term rentals isnt a good thing in a lot of places.
Second, and I'd like to hear thoughts on this, is to consider staying
outside of the city centers.
Excellent topic.
Finally, and I know this will get some disagreement, we tourists
should be prepared to pay full price at publicly-supported museums. No
asking for senior discounts, going on free days or pay what you can
days. If you can afford to travel, then pay the full fare and let the
locals have the discounts.
Another good topic. I suspect that the reason that ALL seniors here travel for free is that it would cost too much to set up checkpoints to enforce. But do remember that a German in France is a tourist. If the French give French seniors free something, I believe the EU dictates that all EU members must get the same free something. So now you would be hunting for 20% of 5% of the tourists. But again, I respect their right to choose.
Mr É, I was thinking of our visit to Venice on a RS tour, where the group was constantly gaggling up in front of something the local guide was speaking about. Human nature and the desire to hear. The RS tour leader was constantly telling the group (otherwise civil) to move aside and let people get by on the narrow streets. In Amsterdam, the killer bicycles were a potent reminder. As an individual, I'm not much of an obstacle.
Very basic, but many people who visit our island in the summer apparently identify as "trash" because they throw theirs everywhere, including in the yards of people's homes. Leave a place cleaner than you found it.
It seems that in recent years we largely heard about over-tourism in three cities: Venice, Amsterdam, and Barcelona. Just recently, as evidenced by the number of threads on this and several country forums, talk of over-tourism has exploded. If any city or country wants to take measures to limit the number of tourists, go for it. The market economy provides any number of tools to limit tourism such as hotel taxes and limits on cruise-ship access.
But tourists from other countries are visitors. That they want to come to your city or country is a compliment. And if tourists or visitors should be responsible, so should be the people in the city or country be visited. Yes, I am saying they should be responsible and gracious hosts.
And that an extremely high percentage of foreign visitors visit only few places in a country is true everywhere. I suspect that most from Europe visiting the US go to New York, Washington, Disney World, California, and Las Vegas.
It seems that in recent years we largely heard about over-tourism in three cities: Venice, Amsterdam, and Barcelona.
It seems that a hearing aid would help to see all the dozens or maybe hundreds of area fires in Europe regarding this topic; e. g. for not hearing from overtourism in Dubrovnik (one of the top 3 cases in Europe imo) ...
Main drama is that tons of tourists want a picture from "Game of Thrones" town - so the inhabitants play no role on tourists' interests - therefore the number of old town inhabitants dropped from 5,000 to 500. When tourists are gone the old town is a dead place.
Great topic. The one mention that drives me crazy is people not just tourists getting off a train or plane and stopping right there to get their bearings! Responsible tourism to me is treating your temporary "home" with all the respect you would want in your "home". We straighten our hotel.rooms, walk close to buildings and treat the " locals" politely, they are not there to cater to us. Also tourists should treat other tourists respectfully as well. We were in the Louve once several years looking at some.statues and a group of tourists taking pictures of themselves in front of the statues kept telling me.to shoo shoo we want our pictures here! I politely slipped in the back of the group at several of their stops and smiled and waved for the camera. I smile when I think of how they explained this stranger in the background. Travel is fantastic and as someone pointed out this group is super polite and gracious. Certainly not like some.other ones.
"Responsible tourism relative to and response to over-tourism" is well formulated but to decide if responsible tourism helps against over-tourism (article) depends on the definitions of both I guess.
Some approaches to define over-tourism are only number driven, e. g. # of visitors to 1,000 inhabitants ratio.
I think it can be an indicator but not a single criteria.
Over-tourism has five aspects for me - I list only one / two example of every aspect although there are probably dozens:
From there the question is how responsibility of a traveler can help at these points?
Feel free to add better and / or more examples.
Finally: responsible tourism (better responsible behavior of tourists - there is also a lot of not responsible behavior by tourism providers) can address partly all aspects of over-tourism to improve the tourism experience of all stakeholders.
Can more / better responsible behavior of tourists erase over-tourism in total? No.
Are tourists the only stakeholders that need to better act responsibly? No.
But are improving a bad situation, other people's life and my own travel experience not enough?
Well, the biggest problem with responsible behavior of human beings seems to be that a lot of us humans are not capable or willing to reduce own needs of present to an own higher value in the future (see marshmallow experiment). But we can try.
Gail, most of what has been discussed is nothing more than common courtesy that should be practiced daily, tourism or no tourism. It’s a little interesting that we are defining courtesy as a requirement of a special case, that of tourism. Says society needs to take a look at itself.
KD, part of the reason for the post was to illustrate that almost everything that a responsible tourist does is equivalent to what a decent person should be doing every day, even at home. The few things that have been brought up that are tourism specific are either to overly generalized to be useful or will have zero impact beyond making one feel good about themselves or represent a guy in Denver trying to impose his values on a person living in Istanbul.
My take?
To Do:
- Be loving
- Be kind
- Be considerate
- Be respectful
- Be aware
- Be on your best behavior (in the old traditional sense)
- And do these things with added intent as you are a guest in someone
else’s home.
Not to Worry About:
- All of the social issues. I have enough respect for the citizens of
Vienna to believe that they know what is best for themselves better
than I do. And I have enough humility to know that I do not
understand the issues at state in each and every location, much less
have the answers. So I will let the locals set the rules for my
visit and will follow those rules.
As somebody who lives in one of those "over touristed" areas I can give you my list of things I would like tourists to do:
The people who come here to stay and hike, and chill, and enjoy some downtime are not the problem. Those how drive their AI car up the valley, dump it somewhere, and just want a quick selfie in front of the waterfall I can do without.
One of the things I do when I am in another city is figure out what it is like to live in that city. So I take public transit, go shopping in the local grocery stores, get up early and see the morning markets etc... And often we also spend time just in our rental, and have a nap in the afternoon. Holidaying is winding down, not ticking boxes.
The world's population growth is slowing. Most places are at below replacement level now. So the population is expected to peak at about 9 Billion somewhere mid century, and then will slowly decline.
So overpopulation is not the issue. No need for draconic population control.
What is happening is that the world is getting richter. There are a lot of newly middle class Indians and Chinese that are now able to travel. We see them around here in the Bernese Oberland a lot. Often with their whole extended families in tow. They want to enjoy their newly found wealth and I do understand them.
One problem is that India and China itself are still developing their tourist infrastructure. I find it myself a tad odd that Indians for example come to Switzerland, given India has some impressive mountain ranges as well, with astonishing landscapes. I think it is only a matter of time and there will be enough infrastructure in India itself for their children to go and play in the snow.
Maybe in the future we will be going to India and China to ski. Who knows.
Okay so far the suggestions break down into tese catabories.
Common politness and consideration:
Requiring a lot of knowledge of the destination ... often unreasably so:
These might be reasonable considerations to consider when seen, but
as a rule seems a bit overly genralized and in some cases might do
more harm than any good.
Dont use the public transportation at rush hour. What if it isnt
full? How do you know? What if toursim is subsidizing it (providing
enough riders) to offer the line for the locals? If not public then
what? If the public transportation is full then I assume the traffic
is heavy as are the sidewalks .... stay home during rush hour .... or
maybe stay in a museum? Or assume that the city is properly managing
transportation within the city and dont worry about it. I guess one
glaring exception is the bus lines that at least one city is trying
to hide from the tourists. Sure, if you leran of that, avoid it I
guess. But in general terms how do you know or do you just assume
every city in Europe has inadequater transportation? Thats a
stretch.
Dont stay in short-term rentals. So we are assuming that every city
has the same issues as Amsterdam and Barcelona? What if I told you
there were cities where the short-term housing was solving problems.
Impossible? Visit Eastern Europe you might find a few. Which? You
could spend a few months researching it or you could assume that the
citizens are self regulating in a way they find best for their values
and priorities. But nothing wrong with recognizing he few high
profile situations in the news all of the time.
Dont eat lunch at lunch time? Again, you just dont know what you are
going to walk into to have a rule.
Only travel on shoulder season. You are assuming that every location
is overtouristed in the Summer. Some locations are still building
their tourist market. You arent helping any. But individually its
not hard to figure out the probable hot spots for tourism in the
summer and avoid them.
I suggest common courtsey and politness and very strict adherance to the local rules and laws along with enough research to understand how the basics functions in a city work so you dont hold up the lines or cause a lot of inconveneinces. Otherwise, not sure there is anything else you can do.
The people on this forum are the most responsible group of tourists I know. If most tourists coming to Barcelona were Rick Steves' type tourists, we would not be having the over-tourism issues we are having now in my hometown. - Carlos
I think you are correct and I appreciate Rick Steves championing a different approach to tourism.
The posts here have been thoughtful and interesting. At the risk of patting ourselves on the back, I don't think those of us here contribute that much to the problem.
A recurring theme here is basic decency and consideration, things that seem to be disappearing. I took my first trip to Europe in 1966. It was a high school "People to People" tour. It was July/August, but we were required to wear slacks. They boys had to wear a tie and sports coat to most dinners. The girls had to wear a smart dress and nice shoes. We studied the norms and customs of the people who lived in the countries we visited, including appropriate dress and behavior in places of worship. I know I'm a fuddy-duddy, but I miss the general civility of earlier times. When traveling now, I see too many people who weren't "raised right".
My guess is 99 percent of the people on Rick Steves forums are "responsible tourists."
If people anywhere feel that their communities are suffering because of tourism, they have the right to take responsible measures limiting the number of tourists who visit--higher taxes, fewer licenses and permits, whatever.
But I offer two other comments.
One, I think some complaining about over-tourism are blaming tourists for economic issues that tourism only marginally affects--economic inequality, the cost of housing, profits earned by large companies that is sent to corporate headquarters located elsewhere. There are American cities where the cost of housing has soared because those cities have economically grown and because people want to live in the central city. And chances are you have your money at a bank with headquarters in another state. It's the world we live in.
Two, if tourists have an obligation to be "responsible," then those living in the cities and countries visited have an obligation to be responsible hosts. In fact, I suggest we henceforth talk about "responsible visitors" and "responsible hosts."
Responsible tourism relative to and response to over-tourism
or just
Responsible tourism in general
We are saying we are or RS tourist are, but beyond being polite and courteous, which, yes, is a lot these days, we havent defined what makes a responsible tourist "responsible" unless its just being polite and courteous.
One other idea to ponder beyond all the numerous rules/advice/experience proposed here is stay home.
There's one big flaw with that plan. To quote Mark Twain:
The gentle reader will never, never know what a consummate ass he can become until he goes abroad.
Mr. E, I think being a "responsible" tourist or visitor is acting as I would anywhere in the US and at home, which means being courteous to all and respectful to those who do things differently.
Only once when in Europe did I rent an apartment. That was a long time ago in London when my family was traveling. I do not use short-term rentals. I prefer to stay in hotels. But if a city allows Airbnbs, I do not think it a moral transgression to rent one, though I expect anyone renting one to respect the neighborhood and his neighbors.
I agree with you. Let the locals set the rules, and I will follow them.
I am not sure to whom the question is posed.
For me, though I understand the argument that there is overlap, the terms are different. "Responsible tourism" is how individuals act. "Over-tourism" is a number reflecting how many visit.
Sadly, this debate has political overtones. On one side, there are the professed concerns for the planet and the effects (which may be more nuanced and less clear-cut than some argue) on those less wealthy in the cities that are most frequently visited. On the other, there is a bit of virtue signaling that is taking place.
My take:
If a city or a country does not want tourists, I probably won't go there. Fortunately, I have visited Spain; I saw largely what I wanted to see; and as much as I enjoyed my trip, I have put Spain lower on my list of places to visit in the future. As far as Europe, I still need to visit Prague and Budapest. But with future European travel, I am quite content to focus on the UK, France, the Low Countries, Germany, and Austria.
Again, it's your city or country, so you make the rules. Knowing them, I will decide whether to visit. And if I visit, I will follow them. If you make the tax on a hotel room 50 percent of the price of the room, I have an economic decision to make on whether I want to visit. And you have every right to impose that type of tax and other governmental barriers to visiting your city or country. You make the rules.
But the argument that my visit might raise the cost of housing there is not part of my decision-making. (The dollars I spend may also be keeping a restaurant, a tour guide, or a restaurant in business.)
And a notable undercurrent anywhere that my visiting is deleterious and not welcomed is a deal-breaker. I will spend my dollars elsewhere.
Any of you who are on the RS facebook group* should check out a video clip that was posted yesterday. It's Rick walking in Sorrento with a dour look on his face, lamenting the impact of AirBnBs and over-tourism on the scene there and other European cities. He points out how the cost of rentals has driven out locals and especially local shopkeepers and thus the main drag there is primarily tourist-oriented shopping for limoncello and lemon souvenirs. Of course this is not new information to this group, it's just interesting to hear Rick acknowledge this. I cant tell if the clip is from a show or something else.
*i am not proud of looking in there on occasion, or Facebook in general. I note that the level of discussion there is way below anything here.
How do you define irresponsible tourism relative to overtourism?
Absolutely no idea. But I kept hearing how responsible RS travelers were in general and once pertaining to over tourism. Even heard RS was a leader in the movement. Don't doubt any of that, I was curious what people were referring to. But your reverse on the question is fair game. We find it easier to be critical, so maybe that will uncover some clues.
Stan told the story of the RS tour group being chastised by their guide that clumping around him on the side walk was making it difficult for others to do their daily tasks.
One of my best friends in college in Missouri had a father who was an English immigrant. She shared his intervention if she and her sisters were blocking the door or cash register
"Do NOT impede their commerce!!!!"
On our most recent trip we chose to not do an iconic hiking trail because of the crowds at the trailhead. We instead did 2 lesser known hikes in the area. We had the trails to ourselves.
US National Parks have been over touristed for decades. We found that if you get even 1/2 mile from the parking lot, the crowds thin out. Take a lesser known trail a couple of miles in and you might see a few others.
We've had similar experiences in Europe. We stayed a week in Loches, France that's maybe 1/2 hour to 45 minutes from the Loire Valley. We saw very few tourists there. On another trip we spent a wonderful December morning in Radda, Italy. There was just one other tourist couple there that morning.
Eatsrootsandleaves (interesting name) above raises interesting questions. It is perhaps impossible to say whether our visit to a heavily visited city like Barcelona or Venice helps or hurts that city. Those wielding water pistols say please stay away. Those owning a restaurant or hotel, or supplying that restaurant or hotel, will likely say please come. And if tourism shrinks but is replaced by, say, tech companies, watch what happens to the price of housing. There are too many variables.
But this is an underlying question with visiting cities and other places that are heavily visited. Should I avoid a city or region claiming it receives too many tourists because the crowds diminish the place's charm and appeal (Cinque Terre comes quickly to mind)? Or should I avoid it because I think my visiting is a morally questionable act? And yes, one can say both.
I admittedly ask the first question and largely disregard the second. If I visit a popular city in the offseason, the reason will be my belief that an offseason visit will be more satisfying and less expensive, not that I am burdening the city's infrastructure or hurting its populace. And regarding the second question--at least with regard as to whether I should visit--I am going to suggest the question contains so many variables that no one can clearly answer it. The real world with its political and social issues is extraordinarily complex.
Where do you guys hang out? Clearly not among us budget travellers lol. - eatsrootsandleaves
Not sure who you were addressing but to go further off topic, we find money separates us from the experiences we enjoy. In Scotland we stayed mostly at farms. It was usually empty nesters who rented out a spare bedroom. When we were in Ljubljana last December we stayed at a hostel that was a former jail. Our room was a jail cell with one men's and one women's bathroom for each floor. When we were in Paris on a business trip we paid $90.00 a night for a top floor room that was our host's grandfather's art studio. In Cuba, New Mexico we stayed in a small house down a dirt road. We had to wait for the cows to move out of the driveway. It was a "bed and breakfast" with the breakfast served at the gas station that had a small kitchen. Breakfast was scrambled eggs and fry bread.
'. . . Those owning a restaurant or hotel, or supplying that restaurant or hotel, will likely say please come. . . "
The thing is, many of those businesses are owned by outside investors, even foreign companies. Not the mom & pop locals we like to think are benefitting. I remember a newsfeed article a few years ago quoting an official with the City of Venice, saying that 90% of the restaurants and tourist shops in the Grand Canal / St Marks area were owned by outsiders.
I really don't believe it's the responsibility of tourists to do anything more than be courteous, dispose of and recycle refuse properly, consider their carbon footprint (without obsessing too much) and generally trying to be a net economic positive to the communities we visit. The other stuff really needs to be addressed by those communities themselves, whether through higher fees, entry visa limits or other legislation.
Nick
https://youtu.be/ORbseYAkzRM?si=nrlXFl714l10h16h
Stan,
The thing is, many of those businesses are owned by outside investors,
even foreign companies.
And what is wrong with that?
Eatsrootsandleaves, et al:
Off topic? Have at it. If i complained i would be a a hypocrite.
