Rental car

I think a compact or larger should be fine. A small wagon would be even better for headroom and luggage ease.

Last year we had a Fiat 500L, I was surprised at the leg room that car had in the backseat. More than my Ford Escape and seemed roomier than my Explorer(leg room wise not cargo area) This year we had a Renault Scenic. Less legroom but cargo space was plenty for 4 of us.

My wife and I usually get the next to the smallest car available when traveling Europe.
Once, we got a mid size station wagon when the 2 children went with us.
It was a good thing travelers are limited to one 22" rolling bag and a small backpack when traveling with us. That's all the vehicle had room to handle without having luggage in the back seat.

Where are you going? I don't think you need to worry much about a vehicle not fitting on the road (unless you plan to rent a massive US-sized truck or SUV), but you may have trouble fitting a particularly large car into a space in a parking garage.

And how are your winter driving skills in Europe? If you're driving near the alps are you prepared for chains on the tires which are required in some areas for winter driving.

I say this because it sounds from your question that you are a first time traveler to Europe and you might be under the false North American impression that you just must have a rental car to see and do whatever it is that's on your itinerary. Trains get you where you're going cheaply and safely and without getting lost and all of the other pitfalls of car rental.

Tim, I think I will be able to handle most road conditions, I f I can but chains on a semi-truck I think I should be able to put them on a car
I plan on using the car mostly in Germany for day trips from Ramstein AFB then drive to Lucerne for a few days then back to Germany.
I have checked train prices and I don't see how it is affordable with four people compared to a car that will only cost 300 dollars a week with unlimited mileage
My real concern is leg room and head room
My daughter is 6'-4" and everyone else over 6'
Thank you for all your replies!

"I have checked train prices and I don't see how it is affordable with four people...My real concern is leg room and head room"

Tim is absolutely right about the trains. You will have NO head room problems, of course, and they are safer and CHEAPER. It's difficult to find the right information sometimes... but that's what this board is for...

"I plan on using the car mostly in Germany for day trips from Ramstein AFB" - So at $300/week your rental cost is about $43/day for plus gas (around $6/gal. now) plus parking, plus incidentals.

But your cost per day for local day trips by train from Ramstein is €36/day - which is perhaps less than the gas alone will cost you - no matter where you travel or how many places you go, for trips within the state you are in:
http://www.bahn.com/i/view/USA/en/prices/germany-regional/rhineland-palatinate-ticket.shtml

"...then drive to Lucerne for a few days then back to Germany."

Your gas alone will cost about €180 round trip. Add rental fees at €43/day, and a vignette for driving in Switzerland, and maybe some parking fees. So you're approaching €300-400 total. The same trip can be done by train with a day pass to Freiburg (€68 each way) plus a DB pre-purchased saver fare for 4 adults from there (€76/4 at current prices) for a total of €288 round trip.

Interstate day pass - the Quer durchs Land Ticket or on Sat/Sun the Happy Weekend Ticket (which is €52/4 adults so knock off €16 from the above price for one day on this ticket.)

All the day passes can be bought in Germany on the day you travel. The only train ticket you'd need to pre-purchase is the Freiburg-Luzern-Freiburg round trip. Check the fare for Freiburg-Luzern for your travel date at the DB ITINERARY PAGE.

Russ I am confused
From Ramstein we are planning two day trips
1. Cologne (nov27)
2.Heidelberg(nov 28)
So just the saver price roundtrip to cologne and back is 290 EUR  
and 152 EUR for Heidelberg
so 450 bucks if i can get the saver fair or 572EUR at standard fair

So how can I do this cheaper?

"Russ I am confused
From Ramstein we are planning two day trips
1. Cologne (nov27)
2.Heidelberg(nov 28)
So just the saver price roundtrip to cologne and back is 290 EUR  
and 152 EUR for Heidelberg
so 450 bucks if i can get the saver fair or 572EUR at standard fair
So how can I do this cheaper?"

You are looking only at prices for the DB high-speed trains. (See below.)

About your choices... you said day trips from Ramstein... A day trip to Cologne will mean SIX plus hours round trip in the car and about €70 in gas, not what I would really call a reasonable day trip myself, whether by car or by high-speed train. A reasonable day trip might be Heidelberg, Speyer, Neustadt an der Weinstraße, Mainz, or maybe Bingen (Rhine) or Rüdesheim (ferry across the river from Bingen.)

I trust you have your prices right. But like I said, that trip (or any other trip to any other city in Germany) is possible using the day pass option for €68, or the in-state option for €36. You can find these prices (and travel times and connections) at the DB website by clicking on "only local transport" under "means of transport" when you do your search. If you choose Cologne you will find the trip takes even longer than 6 hours, however. You can find itineraries of 2 hours or less each way to all the towns I named above on your travel dates. Neustadt is less than 1 hour from Ramstein.

Speyer has an outstanding Romanesque cathedral and the Technik-Museum among other interesting things:
http://www.romantic-cities.com/Speyer.5622.0.html
http://speyer.technik-museum.de/en/

Bingen scene: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e3/Maeuseturm_Burg_Ehrenfels_Bingen_Rhein.jpg
Ruedesheim: http://www.theathertons.info/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/dscn0960edit.jpg (also has a fantastic Christmas market)

Mainz is a fine town to explore and has a really fun Christmas market that opens 11/26:
http://www.romantic-cities.com/uploads/tx_shfrgallery/profile_removed/Landeshauptstadt_Mainz_weihnachtsmarkt_Pyramide_2013_gallery_02.jpg

Some day trips will be cheaper than I quoted above. For Heidelberg: a 4-person group train ticket for your day trip there and back costs only €27.70 from the local transit authority (VRN) and you can buy this ticket at the station from a ticket machine. It's the same price for Neustadt. (However, you won't find these prices at DB as the VRN controls these prices and ticket sales.) Here's a page on Neustadt.

lazybum: Use this DB page and you will see the "only local transport" option: http://reiseauskunft.bahn.de/bin/query.exe/en

LazyBum, try looking for a Ford C-Max or similar. These are tall compact cars. Renault, Citroen, and others make similar vehicles. If you are near a Ford dealer consider stopping in to see how you fit in a C-Max Energi. The rear packaging will be different from the Euro version due to the space that the energy cell occupies.
When renting a vehicle in Germany in the winter time you must ask for a vehicle equipped with winter snow tires. It is my understanding that you could incur a fine if you are outside of the city on regular tires. The rental agencies have a few vehicles equipped with snow tires so you may not be able to pick the type of vehicle you would like to have. We were in Germany on Thanksgiving weekend years ago and ended up with an Audi A4 wagon. That was the only vehicle in the class that I rented that was available with snow tires. Perhaps others could confirm if what I say still applicable.
In my 5 or 6 trips to Germany I have always driven and it has not been a problem. I am intrigued though by the cost of the train. I too have not been able to find a train ticket that would make me choose that option.
Anyone know how to get Lee from Colorado to chime in on this?

"I too have not been able to find a train ticket that would make me choose that option.
Anyone know how to get Lee from Colorado to chime in on this?"

Train fares are not a state secret - it's just that Raileurope and other middle-men tend to dominate English-speaking web-users with railpasses and inflated fare offerings while knowledgeable Germans pay much less for their train trips. Fare for how many travelers (ages?) from where to where, John, and when? (I used to rent cars on occasion but have been using trains and the occasional bus for the last 13-14 years in Germany.)

Leg and head room aren't horrible in any four-door. The biggest concern you will have once you're on the ground is luggage space.

Most four person or small five-person economy cars have enough space for two smaller bags (a bit bigger than carry-ons), not much more than that. If you only had lightly packed soft-sided carry-ons, you might be able to stuff them into a "mid-size" car.

My advice is don't leave the rental agency unless you're sure the car will meet your needs. Go back to the counter and ask for another car so you can travel comfortably. I also much prefer a trunk (or at least a covered area for bags) so you're not leaving bags in sight when you stop.

Power is another concern. I'm always happy with a standard transmission diesel engine. The diesel gets beyond great gas-mileage and the standard transmission performs better with the smaller engines.

I agree about the headroom and legroom in many cars - in the front seat. In the back seat (if I'm driving when I have the front seat back) legroom in my large car (Honda Accord) is virtually non existent. You need to try the car as you will be configuring it for driving before you drive off.

Trains have lots of space for long legs, especially if you avoid rush hours.

Sorry, I was offline for a few days (flew to Reno to visit my brother, came back on the night train - California Zephyr).

If you look at the German Rail schedule website for Ramstein to Heidelberg, you will find that most connections shown are by regional trains (RE/RB), and that the time (1¾ hr) is about the same as it is if you choose a route with an express train (ICE/IC/EC). A Rheinland-Pfalz-Ticket, for 36€ will cover your travel for four round trip between Ramstein, which is in Rheinland-Pfalz, and Mannheim Hbf, which is in Baden-Württemberg but is considered a border station for the RL-P-Ticket. From Mannheim Hbf to Heidelberg, there is an S-Bahn. The individual fare on the S-Bahn is 5,40€ per person each way, 43,20€ round trip for four, but there are less expensive fares.A Baden-Württemberg-Ticket for four costs 38€ and will cover all of your travel round trip from Mannheim Hbf to Heidelberg.

However, Ramstein and Heidelberg are both in the same transit district, the Verkehrverbund Rhein-Neckar, which is one of the largest Verkehrverbünde in Germany. A VRN Tageskarte (day ticket) for four people is only 27,70€. And, the VRN Tageskarte does not have the 9 AM start time limit that the RL-P-Ticket has, so it would cover all of you travel no matter how early you want to start. (I see Russ already covered this.)

I agree with Russ that a day trip to Köln would hardly be worth it. You'd spend as much time getting there as you would spend in Köln. However, if you have never seen the Rhein gorge (Bacharach, St. Goar, etc) it would take about 2½ hrs to get there and you could do it with a 36€, 4 person RL-P-Ticket. I think there are more interesting things to see on that part of the Rhein than there are in Köln.

I think most northern Europeans are generally on the tall side. So I would think you would haven no problem finding a car. You say your daughter is 6'4. If there are taller men you might want to look for a mid sized vehicle.

Thanks for all the information
All the information and decision making is daunting your input is welcomed
living in South Dakota driving 2.5 hours anywhere is a normal occurrence
only three more weeks till we travel
what an adventure it will be
Thanks

living in South Dakota driving 2.5 hours anywhere is a normal occurrence

Since driving everywhere is the norm in the US, you see a lot of US travellers on this forum and others, for whom the car is the default mode of transport. Because it's normal for them, that they have to use the car to get anywhere, they automatically think that they HAVE to rent a car to get anywhere in Europe. However this is hardly ever the case. For travelling in Western Europe a car is usefull if you want to go to the countryside or visit nature, but in most cases it will loose out compared to trains when travelling between cities.

I would rely on the train with all the good advice you have gotten above and maybe consider renting a car for a day if you want to get to the countryside.

Morten - you are SO very correct. Most Americans just immediately "rental car" when traveling anywhere out of the USA. Rental vehicles are my last choice in all situations...even in the USA.

I took lots of trips to Europe before I rented a car. I lean toward a rental now primarily because of my itineraries. I'm spending more time out of cities, making short stops and moving on. These kind of stops don't work well with public transportation; each stop requires a connection to move on. In smaller towns there can be significant waits (loss of valuable vacation time) for the next bus or train.

If my itinerary was built primarily around cities, I'd definitely opt for trains. Trains get you conveniently into city centers (especially if you avoid rush hours) and the center generally has the sights you came to see. If you pack light and choose lodging relatively close to the main train station, you can travel really comfortably by train where a car would be a pain (downtown traffic and expensive parking).

Renting a car in Europe can make sense or not depending upon so many variables. If sticking only to central city locations cars make little sense.

When you have a group or family of 4-5, a car normally works out to be the cheapest way to go (but not usually in Germany with its group rail all you can ride for the day tickets).

Renting a car is practically required for Ireland, Scottish Highlands, Normandy, and the Dordogne where public transportation is problematic. Public transportation in places like Denmark, Netherlands, Germany, and Switzerland is so convenient that driving may not make any sense. Paradoxically these are the same countries that are easiest to drive with wider roads even in the older towns. Normally I would recommend not renting a larger car (e.g. a Passat) in Europe but Germany is just more spacious on the streets and roads so the larger size would work out fine.

"I'm spending more time out of cities, making short stops and moving on. These kind of stops don't work well with public transportation; each stop requires a connection to move on.In smaller towns there can be significant waits (loss of valuable vacation time) for the next bus or train."

Europe is not a monolith. This really depends hugely on the country. In Germany this big-city vs. little-city distinction is largely a false one. Take Nuremberg (500,000 pop.) and Würzburg (100,000.) Train service on regional trains, the sort you'd normally take on outings, is hourly. Want to stop off in attractive Iphofen (4,000) ? Service from there to Nuremberg or Würzburg is the same - hourly. And Germany's ubiquitous day passes mean you don't have to spend money or time buying additional tickets for stopovers and detours.

Indeed, visitors to France may often find themselves stranded in small towns for much longer.

Rental cars btw can involve a lot of unpredictables and time most renters don't count - time you spend getting to the agency and picking up/dropping off the car, traffic jams, finding parking, construction detours, accidental route deviations, filling up, potty stops...

What a fantastic trip in our rental car
Frankfurt - Ramstein AFB - Heidelberg - Ramstein AFB - Koln - Ramstein AFB - Rüdesheim - Ramstein AFB - Lucern- Neuschwanstein - Garmisch - Insbrook - Garmisch - Ramstein AFB - Frankfurt
In a small SUV that got us 38 mpg

When possible and not pressed for time we took longer routes and avoided the autobahn
Driving around lake Luzern going to Aeschbach Chocolate factory on a whim
The rental car was the ticket
Did I tell you how nice the roads were to drive on no bumps or pot holes
Smooth cruizin
And would you believe there was more leg room in the back than in the front?
An awesome trip of castles, cathedrals, mountains, and Christmas markets