please help, travel first timmer.

I'd suggest getting a few European guide books and starting to compile a list of places you want to go. You can also look at itineraries for tour groups, to see what major sites they hit. However, remember that you'll need more time than a tour group to do the same things... they have all the logistics arranged, and you'll need more time to do that yourself. Regarding how to arrange bookings, the book, europe through the back door, is a very good practical resource for logistics. I don't like to spend vacation time looking for lodging, figuring out transport, etc, so I reserve before I leave. You may have different preferences (although, in August, you're going to be competing with lots of other vacationers, so you may have to do some hunting for lodging). You mention 8 places; that's a lot to cover in 8 weeks, so you'll need to decide how much of your vacation you want to spend getting between countries; with what you've identified, it will be a lot of time in transit. I'd probably only visit 4 countries in that time (eg, England, Scotland, Netherlands, France; or England, Italy, Germany, Greece), but I prefer to get to know a few areas, rather than cover lots of miles.

I agree with Sherry that you should limit yourselves to fewer places; presumably since you have family in GB you'll start there on future trips as well, so you could visit there in less depth. Since budget isn't a major concern I suggest you wait to buy train/bus/ferry/air tickets once you get there. Same for accommodations, unless when you look through your guidebooks you find an event you really don't want to miss. I use booking.com for reservations, and I'm signed up for last-minute deal notices for hotels. You can always book hotels online the day before you want to arrive somewhere - if you don't bring a tablet or smartphone with you, your hotels will probably have computer access for you, or a Western Union office can rent you computer time for a couple of euro per hour. Remember to check threads here about how not to get charged roaming fees if you do bring a phone or pad with you. As you continue to plan, keep posting questions here or search existing threads for help.

8 weeks? I'm jealous. I think you should do it all, you got the time. A week chilling on a Greek island will make up for a week of seeing every cathedral in France. I'd say lock in certain parts, like the Greek island, and leave gaps for freeform traveling. Most people try to do the whole continent in 3 weeks, so 8 will make it seem leisurely.

I agree with Sam that you can visit all the destinations in mind. You'll have a great trip with the amount of time you have allotted and a generous budget as well. To the extent you know your itinerary, reserving rooms as soon as possible in popular areas would be wise given the prime vacation time. I too like booking.com, but there are other websites as well. Of course, my first preference is to book directly and a little research should yield suitable accommodations. Be careful and fully realize cancellation policies. E-mail and phone calls work well to make reservations. Skype (or equal) is wonderful both in making reservations from home and while in Europe. To make Skype calls and use e-mail in Europe, I just connect my smartphone via WiFi which is widely available free or generally at modest rates if not. Do as much research as possible utilizing (paper/electronic) guidebooks and forums like this one. Happy travels!

hi, this is how i see and do things. you are traveling for a reason right? to see and do things and im sure your not the 1% and can take 8 week vacations any day as you please, so i try to make the most of my time. Not that im running to/from each thing i want to do, but i try to PLAN my time so i make the most of my time there. Not that i wont be back, but if you dont do SOME planning, i think you will waste some of your limited time even though you have 8 weeks, it will fly by. So, spend some time cracking open some travel books, googling and such. Google is really handy too. try googling "things to do and see in ( city name here)" and see what comes up. then read and start listing them. If you are sure of where you are going, then go get a city map and start plotting things on the map so you have an idea on WHERE you are going in the city. You can find maps that are laminated so that you can mark/erase it too. also, by reading up, you should have an idea on how much time you need at each attraction and that will translate to how much time you may need in the city. Also, by planning you can minimize back tracking and running arond helter skelter and wasting time traveling over your path over and over again. since you will use the UK as a "base" it can be of benefit. Im not knowledgeable of the airports in your base, but i would become really fast so you know where you need to fly out of or if there are others in the area or nearby citys. I like using the train system since its soooo nice and conveient. but i try to PLAN my path and areas to visit that are in adjacent countries to minimize my travel time. after all, when youre warming a seat on a plane or train, thats all youre doing. happy trails.

I tend to travel more spontaneously than lots of people here, however there are also times I want to know where I am staying and that I have a room in the location I want to be. If I were you, and you don't mind doing some last minute looking for a room (it's really not that difficult) I would decide on a few key places that you want to just relax and make a few of those reservations and be sure you can make it to those locations. Otherwise, it is a lot of fun to just ramble about and go where you feel like going. Planning 8 weeks and knowing where I want to be every day would make me crazy. You can use booking.com as those reservations are typically easy to change if you need to without penalty. It's a lot easier to travel without a plan if you have a car and are not tied in to train schedules, but you would not need a car for the city parts of your trip. But, definitely if you want to visit Tuscany or the south of Spain or Provence a car can be an asset.

Thanks so much everyone, great info. We have taken in into consideration and have been busy planning this week and have come up with this draft itinerary; 5 August 8:05AM - arrive Manchester, UK 6 August flight to amsterdam 7 August amsterdam 8 August amsterdam flight to Berlin 9 August Berlin 10 August Berlin 11 August flight or train to Cologne 12 August Cologne 13 August Flight or train to Munich 14 August Munich 15 August Munich 16 August Flight or train to Venice 17 August Venice 18 August Venice 19 August Flight or train to Florence 20 August Florence 21 August Florence 22 August Flight or train to Rome 23 August Rome 24 August Rome 25 August Rome 26 August Flight to Athens 27 August Athens 28 August Athens 29 August Flight to Santorini 30 August 2013 Santorini 31 August 2013 Flight Back to Manchester 1 September Travel around UK 2 September Travel around UK 3 September Travel around UK 4 September Travel around UK 5 September Travel around UK 6 September Travel around UK 7 September Travel around UK 8 September Travel around UK 9 September Travel around UK 10 September Flight to Barcelona 11 September Barcelona 12 September Barcelona 13 September Flight or Train to Nice 14 September Nice/Monarco 15 September Flight or train to Paris 16 September Paris 17 September Paris 18 September Paris 19 September Paris 20 September Paris 21 September Flight Back - Manchester 22 September Manchester
23 Flight to Singapore - for 4 days then home

At the moment we are trying to decide where we will fly or train between certain places. We are leaning more towards flying most places to save time so we can spend more time in our destinations rather than travelling to them. Open to any suggestions, we havent locked anything in yet but will be booking some things soon. We have also done a list for what we want to see in each place so there is more detail than just "travel around UK" this is just to give you an idea. Thanks again, very appreciative of all your advice!!

When deciding whether to fly or take the train, keep in mind that the rail system in Europe is extensive and fast. So decide by comparing not only flight vs. train time and costs, but time and costs to get to and from airports (never in the city) or train stations (almost always in the downtown/city center area). Also factor in time for security checks at airports, and the cost of checking luggage (some airlines have very tight baggage allowances inside the cabin), and finally waiting time to retrieve your luggage. Have a great trip!

Why do you keep going back to England?

yeah that's a very good point. we were thinking of leaving suitcases in Manchester and just taking carry on hand luggage for the most of it as we are both light packers but, i think we will be using flights for the longer journeys i.e. if on the train itd be 6/7 hours we will probably fly but train for the shorter journeys and in places we wouldnt mind seeing more of, even if it's just passing by on a train. The flights we have been looking at nearly all range from around 40-100 AU dollars which for us is extremely cheap because it costs more, even triple the amount, here to fly much shorter distances. Going back to Manchester because we have family there who we will be staying with and able to leave luggage with etc and seeing whenever we are back there and also able to drive us to visit other family around the uk who we will also be staying with.

Looks good to me then. It'll be a heck of a trip.

Without having looked at schedules, I'd consider train a better choice than flying from Amsterdam to Berlin to Cologne to Munich to Venice to Florence to Rome. Those are all fairly short distances where Zoe is probably right about the time and convenience. Plus the train lets you see the country at eye level instead of miles below. Seems like a great fast-paced trip for young light packers! Hope your UK relatives show you something of London.

hi again, in the first part of you trip you have : Amsterdam > Berlin > Cologne > Munich you may want to look @ Amsterdam > Cologne > Berlin > Munich i dont know the flight/train times between but to me its more of a direct route. however the trains or planes may not agree. happy trails.

I'll give a general tip: don't overdo your itinerary because you have plenty of time. Enjoy the blessing of a long trip by devoting more time to explore places that interest you, instead of feeling a sort of "obligation" to visit as many sites, cities and countries. Europe is big, it has enough interesting places for several years of travelling. I had some friends that went for long European trips on a fast-pace to "see as much as possible" and they came back stressed out by having raced so much, slept so little and ate so hastily they missed the best part of long trips: enjoy the experience at a slower pace. What I'd do, Elle, is to focus on reducing the amount of hotel changes (they come with transportation issues, time lost, the whoel pack-unpack thing) and focus more on exploring a smaller number of regions.

If you want to save money, you really have to lock into trains and flights early to get the cheap tickets. When you are choosing between land and air travel, take into account that train stations are generally in or very near the center of the city and airports are generally quite far. Also the budget airlines sometmes fly from airports that are even farther away. This means: 1. You need more time to get to and from airports than train stations 2. It costs more to get to/from airports 3. You need more lead time to check in and go through security at airports 4. Flights can be delayed by weather conditions (fog, etc.) which don't affect trains.
5. Read the airline baggage terms carefully. The budget companies often tack on fees to make up for the cheap ticket - charging for just about everything except the toilet, and they are usually very strict about maximums pieces, weights, sizes. You may find that the carry-on limit is too low (maybe 5-8 kg) so that you'll have to check bags - that means more time pre-flight and then waiting for your luggage at the other end. Also keep in mind the liquids restrictions on flights, if you are taking just carry-ons. When you move from one city to another, you use up a lot of sightseeing time - packing, unpacking, checking in/out of hotels, orienting yourselves to a new place with different language, signage, bus/tram routes, etc. A 3-hour flight can eat up 8-9 hours, from hotel room A to hotel room B. Train or plane, a good rule of thumb is 1/2 day for each destination.

I agree with Chani. At Munich, for example, the airport is a 45 minute train ride away from the main train station. You've got a lot of research to do but that's part of the fun. Have a great trip.

I'm not in my 20s anymore but I don't take a rest day once a week, and I travel for three months at a time. Some destinations are more restful than others - smaller towns like Ravenna as opposed to Milano. Everyone has a different travel rhythm, though, so taking "a vacation from your vacation" might be exactly what you need. For me, travel is invigorating while doing laundry is stressful.

hi all thanks heaps for the advice, we have factored in rest/lazy days in some places where our list of things to see/do is shorter than others and so on. we are prepared for the trip to be full on and busy in some parts but others are a bit slower so it should weigh out ok hopefully. does anyone have any suggestions for getting around germany? at the moment we are flying into Amsterdam, train to cologne -> train to berlin -> (cant decide between train or flying) to munich then venice then florence then rome. At the moment i am thinking that train would be easier as most have suggested but with rail passes etc it is making it hard to decide if flying or if the train is better especially because at the moment we will be using trains to get form barcelona to nice and then to paris and around paris with the uk in the middle, a month rail pass might not be exactly long enough. i think i have also forgotten that we will use trains on some days to get to the sites we want to see. i have been looking at the DB site as rick suggests and i cant really figure out their passes with the card 25 and card 50 does anyone know how they work or have any experience with them? thanks!

Hi Elle, An 8 week trip is a true luxury, especially with ample funds. I know you want to see a lot of the continent, but I count 14 train or plane journeys in your itinerary. You can plan on each journey occupying at least a half day, so you are giving 7 days to exchange of location. The train and plane trips can themselves be a part of the experience, but 1/8 of your trip for exchanging places is a lot. The other thing I see is that you, even in your 20's, will be exhausted upon arrival in Manchester. If you have never experienced jet lag, it is very real. It is quite different from just being tired. It takes at least a day to begin to recover and a week for your biological clock to adjust. For that reason, I would stay in Manchester at least 2 days before moving on. Also, ask locals about things to see and do. That has afforded us some unique experiences. One of these days, I'm going to come see your country. Have a great trip.

Hi, Going from Berlin to Munich can be done by train day or night. By day if you time it right, there are departures Berlin-Munich direct on the ICE train. If you prefer doing this by night, the Berlin-Munich night train is the CML, the best in night trains. As with everything else, going by day or night has its advantage and disadvantages, depending on your priorities and what you're willing to put up with. I've done the CNL night train to Munich but from Hamburg...no problems as well as by day on the ICE. Feeling the effects of jet lag depends on the person, esp at your age. When I was in my twenties, on none of my three trips did I feel the adverse effects of jet lag, basically didn't know what it was after a 10+ hr flight. So, you may have to deal with it, or maybe not at all.

Your planned itinerary is indeed incredible. I'm jealous that you have the time for such an odyssey. My suggestion would be to roll with the flow and don't plan so far ahead of time. As young people, there's no telling what experiences you're going to run into and what characters you'll run into. Just don't set your schedule in stone. If you have a laptop or notebook with you, you can make easily make plans for the upcoming few days on the fly. Booking.com always has rooms available in virtually any location in the world.
Grab all the gusto, and have the time of your lives.