There's lots of discussions of pickpockets and thieves on these boards.
But there also seems to be certain areas more prone than others--Rome, Barcelona, Paris over say Berlin, Copenhagen and Dublin. Tourists are in all of these places so it has nothing to do with tourist areas over residential areas.
I don't want to start fighting or trouble here, but I am seriously interested in trying to find out why some countries seem to attract more thieves.
Any ideas or thoughts?
Unemployment rate, state of economy, governments' ability/willingness to provide support to unemployed (or unemployable) persons who may otherwise turn to petty theft, sheer volume of opportunities in terms of # of tourists and other easy targets, coupled with perception of police presence or any other deterrents. For the Roma (gypsies), some cultural traits, unfortunately, keep them out of the workforce (avoidance of education for upward mobility and very hard to assimilate given nomadic preferences) so they turn to petty theft. Some governments have a very hard time coping with certain categories of thieves, especially underage adults who are typically not punished and just repeat their bad behavior. Instead of focusing on why certain people do it or where (you'll never get accurate enough statistics due to under-reporting, or be able to control any of the factors that lead some people to theft), I think it's better to focus on not being a victim - which isn't that hard to do. Tourists' own lack of precautions and preparation fuels some of the activity - it's a two-way street.
My understanding in Barcelona is that theft under something like $200 isn't a crime until you are caught over three times. So there isn't much of a deterrent to not pickpocket.
Sorry Agnes, crime is not caused by unemployment. In the welfare states of W. Europe, people have a safety net. The high rate of pickpocketing in the Mediterranean cities frequented by tourists is largely a product of poor law enforcement or crime laws. As one poster commented, in Barcelona, for relatively modest amounts the thefts are not treated as crimes. I lived in Germany for four years and learned how efficient the polizi are there. Northern Europe has a legal system and police that do their jobs. That is the difference.
Also, the thieves do target tourist areas. I have been to 3/4 of the countries in Europe and rarely go into residential areas, unless my taxi takes me through there to my hotel.
I think Agnes is pretty much spot on.
Sorry Agnes, crime is not caused by unemployment. In the welfare states of W. Europe, people have a safety net.
Crime is correlated with unemployment rates - two variables can be correlated without implying causation. Unemployment varies between European countries quite a bit. I grew up in Europe so I experienced the safety net directly. But safety nets only extend so far with some groups of people, especially the marginalized. Obviously they don't hold everybody in or provide enough incentive for everyone to be law abiding. That's not an argument one way or another - just a statement.
Here is a report on the subject, which I provide the link and Conclusion to the report:
The paper has analyzed the relationship between unemployment and crime, and the analysis has demonstrated that the relationship is in general ambiguous. More importantly, the relationship depends on the apprehension rate. This result suggests that the effect of unemployment on crime would vary with enforcement policies and legal systems that differ across jurisdictions and cultures. Thus, it appears to be useful to include the apprehension rate in empirical analysis of the issue to shed a light on empirical studies. Many studies have examined the effects of apprehension on crime (for example, Levitt (1998), Glaser and Sac- erdote (1999), Kelly (2000)), but researchers have rarely related the effects of unemployment on crime to the apprehension rate.
http://www.economics.uci.edu/files/docs/thdworkshop/w10/klee.pdf
Crime rates in the USA have been dropping for the last twenty years or so and even with higher unemployment in the past 8 years.
I can see in extreme cases, where a country has a 60 percent unemployment and the economy is near failure that crime overall is more likely, however I don't see the direct correlation with far lower levels, especially for the crime of pickpocketing.
Effective law enforcement is a far more significant factor.
http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Labor/Unemployment-rate#
Compare the crime rate in the Baltic States of Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania to Spain and Italy. The Baltic states had unemployment rates close to that of Spain in 2010, but double that of Italy.
In 2007 I found robbery data that shows the Baltic countries will a far lower rate than Spain or Italy.
A good question to tackle and very pertinent on traveling. If you are "not-so-with-it"/ relatively new at European travel, doing a 4-5 week trip in the summer amid the crowds plus heat, where you visit Rome, Barcelona, Prague, Paris, Munich, Frankfurt, Dresden, it may be just your luck that you come out unscathed, ie not being pickpocket. But, if you are a pickpocket victim, you can bet it took place in Barcelona, Rome, the Paris Metro or in front of the Louvre, Notre Dame, or Sacre Cour, Prague ( say on the Charles Bridge). Sure, you can be hit in Frankfurt too, say, on crowded Kaiserstrasse or on the U-Bahn, or am Marienplatz in Munich, but the main question is what are the odds relative to first three places listed.
Even though I 've been to Paris over and over, solo or with others, taking the Metro, the bus, like every one else, I am much more on alert, wear the hidden pocket, being aware of the surroundings, etc in Paris than in Munich, Dresden, or any other German city. Would one be on the same level of awareness/alertness in Dublin as in Barcelona?
In late 1990s the unemployment rate in France and Germany was not so different, both in the 10% range. Where were the odds greater to be hit as a pickpocket victim...in Paris or in Frankfurt or Munich, or Hamburg, if you were less than careful?
On Berlin and the thimble games: the difference between Paris where that activity goes on too, go to Montmarte, as you go up the stairs, I stood there as an obvious/blatant tourist watching that and noticed every time someone "won" the winner was a woman from the same ethnic group as were the players...certainly not a very subtle set-up in deception, if you want to be ethnic about it. I saw the same thing in the 1999 on Kurfürstendamm but there it was different from Paris since there were bilingual signs in German and English warning people not to play, saying it was organised crime activity from Romania....the country was spelled out for the reader to see. I didn't see it at Alexanderplatz, will look if it's still going on in June. .
Thieves have to go where the people are. This summary of top 10 cities for foreign visits in 2015 does not happen to include Berlin, Copenhagen and Dublin.
The answer is of course the simplest: because the police and people of Rome, Barcelona, Paris don't mind tourist crime as much as most other places, and perhaps think tourists even deserve to be robbed.
http://www.thelocal.fr/galleries/travel/twelve-things-tourists-to-that-annoy-parisians "Stop getting robbed: Visitors (to Paris) need to realize, according to one reader, that they are giving the city a bad name by getting pickpocketed all the time." I guess the actual pickpockets are blameless.
Frank II,
I'm only speculating, but I suspect there are several reasons for this.....
I would say be aware of situations where you are crammed in like sardines. Rome for instance. And places with advanced social conscience where it is understood that it really is the thief's fault; Barcelona possibly.
Worst Cities for Pickpockets Around The World
1. Barcelona, Spain
2. Rome, Italy
3. Prague, Czech Republic
4. Madrid, Spain
5. Paris, France
6. Florence, Italy
7. Amsterdam, Netherlands
8. Athens, Greece
That top ten list of cities only surprises me a little with Amsterdam. On my first trip in 1971 my intention was to stay at the HI hostel in Amsterdam since I had go there anyway because of the charter flight back to Calif. Numerous backpackers (US and German) I met in the hostels in Germany advised against it, heard this over and over, ie, you'll have your stuff stolen in that hostel. In the end, I didn't stay there.
Maybe Amsterdam is really about smoking too much "_" and not remember where you left the wallet?
Back then you didn't hear of grass/weed or what ever name you gave it. You heard only about hash from the Europeans if the drug culture topic came up. The Dutch authorities were strict on smoking that "funny" stuff, you got a barrage of questions thrown at you at the border crossing, which admittedly at the time I couldn't care less since in literally three days I would be airborne from AMS to Calif.
References to Eastern Europe may be an impression that Roma originate from Romania and adjacent Eastern European countries. Roma or Romaini people: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romani_people
The Romani (also spelled Romany; /ˈroʊməni/, /ˈrɒ-/), or Roma, are a
traditionally nomadic ethnic group, living mostly in Europe and the
Americas and originating from the northern regions of the Indian
subcontinent.... The Romani are widely known among English-speaking
people by the exonym "Gypsies" (or "Gipsies"), which some people
consider controversial due to its connotations of illegality and
irregularity.
The Romani issues in France and Italy and elsewhere are complicated and political:
http://cambridgeglobalist.org/2013/11/27/french-and-roma-incompatible-identities/
An example of how pervasive the view that the Roma cannot be
integrated in France has become is an eight-page report on
pickpocketing in Paris published last March in the popular French
magazine, Paris Match. The magazine is not known for holding
particularly right-wing views – in fact, François Hollande’s current
partner, Valerie Trierweiler is a regular contributor to the magazine
– nor has it clearly advocated a discriminatory policy to deal with
Roma immigrants. Yet, the report was full of anecdotes and photos
describing techniques used by young Roma children to steal from candid
tourists and Parisians.By exclusively choosing to focus on crimes perpetrated by Roma
children, the report implicitly suggested that there is a link between
belonging to the Roma ethnicity and resorting to petty crime, hence
giving credence to the view that Roma identity is incompatible with
French values.
http://berkleycenter.georgetown.edu/posts/the-roma-people-and-the-italians-a-strained-relationship
While the Italian government has not done much to help the Roma
people, they certainly have not done much to help themselves. It is
true that many gypsies roam the streets looking to pickpocket
unknowing tourists and civilians, which endears them to no one. Roma
people have a culture of male superiority, which not only looks bad to
outsiders but also actually keeps them from advancing their status in
society. It is very common for the Roma people to wed as teenagers and
have multiple children, which is an economic strain on people that
have very few ways of earning a legitimate living. This is why many
zingari resort to a life of crime, so they are able to support their
young and growing family. Roma people are very distrustful of the
government, for good reason, but they are distrustful to the point of
crippling themselves.The real answer to this problem lies in rectifying the combination of
the male superiority within the Roma culture and the government’s
abuse of these people. The money that is allocated for the Roma needs
to be spent on them, not siphoned off to other projects. It needs to
be spent, however, on educating the women of the Roma people. Studies
have shown that education is much more of an effective method of
decreasing the birthrate among cultures than contraceptives are. If
the Roma women were afforded an education, the birthrate decrease, the
inequality among their own people would begin to disappear, and their
families could start later and not have to resort to lives of crime.The education of women, however, is a difficult issue to begin working
on. There has to be a complete change of perspective towards women in
their own society, and a change in opinion towards the Roma by the
Italians and their government. It is time for the Italian people to
assume responsibility for their mistreatment of the Roma people and
work to improve their standard of living in their country, and it is
time for the Roma people to push themselves towards better lives.
These are primarily crimes of opportunity. There are enough easy marks out there that they probably don't mess with anything complicated so just hold your stuff tight and add at least one layer of protection (like a zipper) and odds are they will skip you for the other guy with the wallet hanging in the back pocket. I have spoken to or have pretty first hand knowledge of 3 victims and they were all easy marks. The only time I got hit was in Paris; and the brash young lady tried to unzip the back pack that was on my back. I don't want to fool with a lock so now I hold the zippers tougher with a cheap spring loaded carabineer clip.
The current "professional' pickpockets seem to possess a high skill level to execute craft crimes. The multi-generational "professional" pickpockets appear to have a long learning period as skills and tactics are passed from generation to generation in lieu of skills that would contribute to a productive society.
It's one of those "arts" I feel guilty about admiring.
All I can say is that the Paris Match article in question (and several others I've seen in other local press) focused on and took photos of some of the people that I see all the time trying to pickpocket on the Line 1. You can't write a report or provide photographic evidence of someone who's not there doing the deed to be photographed.
On the other hand, I will say that the fellow I caught trying to pickpocket my mother once on the same Line 1 was a Caucasian dressed in a business suit, so it takes all kinds.
I'm reminded of John Dillinger, the infamous American bank robber of the 1930s.
He was asked why he robbed banks, and responded by saying, "Because that's where the money is."
Yes, that's where the money is.
The most important factor when you go fishing?
Go where there are fish.
In Paris, I've noticed a huge increase in visitors who are automatic targets for pickpockets. Partly due to the overall increase in tourists, and partly due to the fact that a lot of them are first-time visitors who think Paris is Disneyland and nothing bad will happen to them.
Here are some things I've noticed:
First, they often travel as a family or in a group.
Staying busy keeping track of your loved ones is easier than keeping track of your possessions. Thieves are counting on that.
Appoint someone to be in charge of directions ahead of time, and also appoint someone to keep track of bodies. Each person should be responsible for securing his/her own valuables. Never leave for the day with more money than you are prepared to lose, and leave passports, extra credit cards, photos, etc back in your hotel safe. Not everyone needs to bring all their gadgets along - the less you have to lose, the better.
Second, they tend to look like they have something worth stealing.
A real giveaway is a female wearing a cross-body bag and a frown, clutching the bag to her chest in a death grip - even when there is absolutely nobody around. This is not normal behavior, and will make you stand out like a target.
Men are worse, because they tend to "forget" where they are, rely on comfortable habits, and you can spot the wallets/gadgets in back pockets from a mile away. Vests or other special clothing also make you stand out like a target, and are really not necessary.
Backpacks are more interesting to thieves than you might think - even if you don't keep anything valuable in them. While you're busy fishing out a bottle of water, someone can easily help himself to your wallet or phone, which you're leaving unprotected.
If you look as if you have something valuable on your person, someone will be interested enough to check you out when the opportunity presents itself, and that someone might follow you for quite a while before you notice him/her.
Third, they don't look like they know what they're doing.
One person standing in the middle of the sidewalk trying to get his bearings won't attract much attention.
Two or more, especially with children involved, who stand in the middle of pedestrian traffic and are trying to look at a map, a gadget, or are busy arguing with each other will be easy targets. Quite often someone has a purse hanging wide open, too.
Everybody needs to figure things out, but you should move out of the way with your back to a wall, or go sit in a cafe while you get yourself oriented.
Fourth, they get "too comfortable".
Tired tourists will have a seat on a cafe terrasse, inside a nice restaurant, and forget that they aren't safe at home where there are no pickpockets. Professional pickpockets look just like anybody else, and will even tell you to have a nice day, after they have lifted your wallet. Kids who have been trained to grab and run are also very good at what they do. Never put your gadgets on a table if you aren't actually using them. Always keep your purse on your lap in front of you - looping the strap around the chair leg won't keep it safe. Always keep wallets inside front pockets, preferably with zippers or even a safety pin.
As far as the politics in Paris go, there are simply more illegal immigrant minor children than the city has resources to deal with. But this is not Paris' problem alone - it's everywhere in the Schengen Zone.
So many fascinating areas are prone to pickpockets that if your strategy is to avoid these areas, you may very well be ripping off yourself, robbing yourself of valuable experiences, that is! Follow Rick's advice and keep the main important stuff under your clothes (passport, large cash, one of your two cards, etc.) If you take your laptop, protect your info with a password and back it up before you leave home. I've been ripped off in Oakland, California and in Mesa, Arizona, and yes, once while traveling. The main thing is to keep the important stuff under your clothes. Yes, it's irritating to have to duck into a restroom and put that passport back under your clothes, but from experience I can tell you it is way, way worth it!
I traveled with a woman who had her purse snatched in a ritzy hotel breakfast room, by the way....
@ chexbres...thanks for your accurate, on target observations and comments.. They are some of the very reasons tourists, especially North Americans are specifically targeted. I have observed the same with Americans in the highly frequented tourist areas. Of course, I can be targeted here in SF or Oakland too but what are the odds. The odds are a lot greater in Paris
Your comments/observations are also reasons I don't use/carry a day pack/bag, no matter how it looks, made more obvious when the person is clutching it, thereby betraying yourself that you have something of value, ie making yourself a target.
One other observation about backpacks is that, due to the fact that Paris is on the highest security alerte, museums and some other attractions will not store them for you, so you won't be allowed to enter - which would be a colossal waste of time.
If you desperately need to carry stuff around, the best day bag to carry is about the size which would contain a Vogue magazine - but not the September issue...a larger bag just begs to be filled up.
Those of us who live here carry some sort of plastic or fabric tote bag every day that can be rolled up to the size of a fist and put in a pocket, because stores are charging for grocery bags - and some no longer provide them at all. This is guaranteed to draw absolutely no attention from a pickpocket.
At most I carry one of those types of plastic "bags" which can be rolled/folded up where it fits neatly in your summer jacket pocket, just in case I need it. You're quite right that given the acute security atmosphere extending to museums, it's obvious that day bags/packs will be thoroughly examined prior to entry....more time wasted for that tourist. We all know some cities are famous/infamous for pickpocketing, the likelihood of it happening to you, etc while other cities/capitals are much less so, which doesn't mean it cannot take place...but the odds. eg, Paris vs Berlin or Munich
We just returned from Barcelona and fully expected to see pickpocketing activity. I have to say I was oddly almost disappointed that I didn't see or experience anything like that.
I had been anticipating it so I was intrigued and wanted to witness it for myself. While we were extremely careful ourselves I just didn't see anything out of the ordinary.
Now one thing it was a bit dreary rainy and gloomy during the time we were in Barcelona and the crowds weren't likely as packed as they might otherwise be during the summer or in a little bit better weather.
Better luck next time!
