Luxury Airline travel

"You get what you pay for," applies to a certain degree in air travel.

What class of seats are you looking for?

Certainly - but to a great degree it depends on your definition of "better".

From where to where (what cities)? Exactly where you are coming from (and going) makes a big difference in your choices.

There are certainly significant differences between airlines (and specific aircraft) when it comes to premium cabin comfort and amenities (prices, too). And the definition of "luxury travel" can be pretty subjective, too.

You need to be a lot more specific. Or else the answer you'll get will be equally un-specific (eg "Yes, there are").

We are traveling from Anchorage, Alaska to Munich. Condor offered “business class” with “lay flat” seats. Seems like a great way to travel but, again, I read many negative reviews about Condor.

Disclaimer: I've never flown Condor, so have no personal experience with their business class seats/experience. That said, I believe all of the following is true...

Condor was something like a low-cost/charter airline for years, featuring low prices and no frills. In recent years, they have been becoming more mainstream, and have added business class seats. You would want to research exactly what their seats are like while shopping.

Most international airlines have some kind of "business class". But they vary quite a bit, both in cost and in the overall quality of the seat and service. Note that "First class" is generally going away - modern business class is essentially replacing what used to be called First Class (and many modern Business class is much better than old First class, so don't lament it's passing too much).

There are still some old business class seats out there that do not feature a "lie flat seat" (the old standards used to be "recliners" like a big fat easy chair, and "angled flat" which are kind of a hybrid where the seat goes kind of flat but you're still at a slight incline, which makes it hard to sleep). Most modern airlines have updated most of their business class seats to lay-flat (it's what most people expect). I can assure you, it's a much, much better way to fly if you can manage it. But every airline is different (they specify the details of their interiors), and even within a single airline, not every business class seat is the same (American and United, for example, have business class seats that vary significantly - some planes have the "good" seats, some have the old "bad" seats). You need to check carefully to see what you're shopping for.

IMHO, the top priority (by far) when comparing business class options is all about getting some good sleep on your flight - the seat. The food, the service, the extra goodies...,all just icing on the cake. You want pre-departure champagne? Warm nuts served in a bowl? A little caviar? Pajamas? You like being addressed by name by a smiling flight attendant? Access to luxury lounges at the airport? A massage? Get driven to your gate in a fancy car? Those things are all nice, but are minor extras - on a 10-16 hour flight, personally I want a good sleeping environment, everything else is gravy. So other things being equal, it's all about a comfortable, spacious seat, a little privacy, and getting solid sleep.

Personally, I try hard to get a long nonstop from somewhere on/near the US west coast all the way to Europe (rather than connecting in the midwest or east coast) - that long flight gives you the time you need to settle in and sleep. If you're stopping in Chicago, Atlanta, Newark, etc., that breaks up your flight and kills the chance to sleep.

Coming from Anchorage, going to Munich, I assume you will need to connect at least once, maybe twice. Connecting in SEA you only have a few airlines that go nonstop to Europe. Check Delta, British Airways, Lufthansa. Delta has a decent flight SEA-AMS (I took this flight in Business class a few weeks ago, it's good). You could also connect in YVR, PDX, SFO, SJC or LAX bit that adds distance and maybe another stopover, so SEA probably makes sense (also consider Portland, Delta has the same nonstop to AMS from there). Given the choices, I'd look at Delta. ANC-SEA (Delta has a great lounge in SEA with good food, too), then SEA-AMS, AMS-MUC. This would be a very good way to get there, IMHO, although you'll need to check prices (these nice seats aren't cheap, but the way I look at it, you arrive rested and happy, ready to hit the ground running - so even though it's spendy, it effectively buys you an extra usable day...which is worth a lot to me).

Hope that helps. Good luck and enjoy the flight!

Relevant to what David said about sleep-my favorite perk when flying business class on Delta is that you can choose to get your complete meal when they bring out the appetizers. That way you can go to sleep sooner.

Have you used SeatGuru before? It's not a guarantee, but if you plug in the airline and flight #, it will give you dimensions such as seat width and pitch. You plug in a couple of airlines and see whose flying what. There is a caveat that planes can change, but it will give you a general idea. Any direct flights out of Anchorage to Europe? We have lots of friends that fly Icelandair out of Seattle, but their business class is more like premium economy with no lay-flat beds. We've done British Air, Delta and American business class out of Seattle. There are pros and cons to all 3, but Delta tends to come in 3rd for us because they have changed our itinerary on us, sending us back through Atlanta rather than a U.K. /European transfer, which means we lose the lay-flat for a significant distance. Just our preference.

Good point, Cala. I think Delta calls this option "Express Dining" or somesuch. It does speed up the food presentations, compressing what might be a 90 minute ceremony into a one-stop dining. Getting a solid block of sleep time is important, IMHO - but that's a lot easier on a 10.5 hour nonstop from Seattle than it is on a 5 hour (I'm estimating) flight from Atlanta or JFK. Still, worth doing. BTW, if you do end up flying DeltaOne (their name for business class), you can pre-order your preferred meal a couple days before departure, too. On the flight a few weeks ago, I thought the inflight food was OK - not incredible, but good enough (the food in the SEA Delta lounge was actually better - that lounge is excellent).

I've flown Condor in all three classes from SeaTac. Business class with them (as of last year, at least) was a 170 degree seat - not quite lie flat. Given that I usually travel Premium Economy, I thought it was fantastic. I'm sure there's fancier ones out there but, for me, given the price, I was extremely happy.

I've booked their Business class again for my next trip. And as to bad reviews - well I think most airlines have them - people with unhappy experiences tend to post reviews and so the situation can seem worse than it is.

I've had random poor experiences with all sorts of airlines over the years - from Delta to Frontier but I would still fly them if the routing and pricing worked.

My goal in a flight? General safety, as few flights as possible and as much space as I can afford. The rest is pretty irrelevant to me.

Delta tends to come in 3rd for us because they have changed our itinerary on us, sending us back through Dallas

It’s very unlikely that Delta would route anyone via Dallas, that’s an American hub.

Most comments here are not helpful. From Anchorage you want to go right over the pole on Condor or Icelandair or sim. Coming down to the lower 48 is wildly out of the way.

We surely appreciate all your responses. Despite the lack of lay flat seats we are leaning toward the Icelandair option as they allow a free layover in Reykjavik which we would like to take advantage of. I really enjoyed my last experience in Iceland but that was 1986 which seems like a million and a half years ago.

Most comments here are not helpful. From Anchorage you want to go right over the pole on Condor or Icelandair or sim. Coming down to the lower 48 is wildly out of the way.

I could be wrong (haven't checked lately) but I don't believe there are any nonstop flights from ANC to anywhere Europe other than Iceland - gotta get to a hub in the Lower 48 first, then head for Europe (market size...). Sure, a direct flight from Alaska would surely be faster, but AFAIK none exist. OP was talking about business class (with a lie-flat seat), so that leaves out options like Icelandair, Norwegian, etc. Nonstop flights to Europe are rare enough even from major cities on the west coast, from Alaska, I don't think so. The geography works for direct flights but the economics apparently don't.

"Anchorage is a suburb of Seattle" is only half in jest...

We flew Condor premium economy from PDX direct nonstop to FRA. The flight (nonstop to Europe) and the fare are the reasons for taking Condor. But regular economy is going to get you stuff to gripe about—extra charges for everything. If you are considering business class, I’d say take the “risk.” Have a great trip.

David, your post was full of great, helpful info. Thanks!

Here in the midwest if we want to get to Europe in any kind of efficient manner, its Delta or Icelandair. Depending on the city, sometimes we can get to Europe on a direct flight with Delta. I have taken Icelandair a couple times, too. About the only difference is that Delta provides food and drinks. I did do a Iceland layover, it worked well for me and I had a fantastic time in Iceland. That layover is quite a perk of flying with Icelandair., for me the maximum number of days I could stay was 7.

Here is some insight into Condor biz class.

https://thepointsguy.com/2017/05/condor-767-business-flight-review/

If a stopover in Iceland is important, then Condor will not work

I have flown with Condor three times on the ANC-FRA-ANC route (2012, 2016, 2017) and they are one of my favorite airlines with fairly new aircraft and good service. Other than the seat size they reminded me of the old Alaska Airlines Gold Coast service (where they used to give you a real gold bar! Ok, a gold wafer then, but it looked like a small gold bar). The only problem I have with them is they only fly during the summer and they didn't start early enough (May 12th) for my trip this year. It is a great flight for us Alaskans as we don't have to fly 3-1/2 hours to Seattle just to get a flight to somewhere in Europe in another 9-10 hours plus layover time. We can just go direct to Frankfurt in 9-1/2 hours.

I have always purchased the cheapest ticket on Condor as I can put up with anything for 9-10 hours. I have found that they will discount the Business Class & Premium Economy seats on the Frankfurt - Anchorage flight. On my last flight back I decided to see what the deal was. The day before my flight I could upgrade from Economy to Business Class for 900 euros on the website. The next day when they made the announcement I went up to the counter to inquire the cost to upgrade to Business Class. The gentleman said it would be 600 euros, "but wait, you are a pensioner correct?", I replied that I was and then he said for you it is 310 euros! I accepted and I was impressed with their business class.

This year I flew to Seattle in early May and spent the night. The next day I started my second round trip with my other favorite airline, Norwegian Airlines.

Couple comments:

OP: both Icelandair and Condor only price one ways so you can fly one airline over and the other back if you want that Frankfurt nonstop one way and the Iceland stopover the other.

Everyone also gets the Icelandair free stopover deal wrong, it’s that there’s no surcharge for staying up to 7 days. That doesn’t mean it won’t cost you more. For example let’s say Tuesday’s ANC to AMS fare is $350 and Thursday’s fare is $450. Then if you fly to Iceland on Tuesday for a 2 night stopover your “free stopover” costs $100. My experience is you really have to take a lot of time and play around with different days to get the stopover at no charge.

Here in the midwest if we want to get to Europe in any kind of efficient manner, its Delta or Icelandair.

Jules, Condor has done the summer MSP to FRA run for 4 years now.

Tom, I don't travel to Europe in the summer. Many European destinations are crowded in the summer and Minnesota is lovely in the summer. I wouldn't say everyone misunderstands the Iceland layover. I understood it and used it. With their policy, a person can book a roundtrip like Minneapolis to Paris. On one of the legs or both, which are indeed priced separately, you are allowed to extend what would be a stop to connect to your final destination for a vacation in Iceland which you will need to pay expenses like hotel and transportation and not have to pay as if this was a multi-city flight. I did price many scenarios, and obviously prices are different depending on the day of the week that is chosen for travel.

Tom, you're correct and it was Atlanta. I edited my post to reflect that.

Iceland: Maybe I was unlucky but I once spent over an hour playing with different departures over a week and different stopover lengths and couldn’t get anywhere near a “free” stopover.

Mine ended up about $30 cheaper than it would have been had I not day the 6 day layover. I always look at the calendar they provide for the days that are less expensive.

Regarding the bad reviews on Condor, it seems most of the ones I have seen concern customer service at the Frankfurt airport, particularly with connecting flights and schedule changes. And a few more about the flatbed seats that are not truly lie-flat.

Since both my husband and I have to sleep semi-propped up (he due to back issues and I for vertigo), the lie-flat seat is not a great priority for us. And since we won’t be taking a connecting flight, we can disregard those complaints.

We will be flying Condor in Business Class FRA to SEA on our current trip. ( Going over on British AirwYs with miles). I’ll let you know how it went.

I always look at the calendar they provide for the days that are less expensive.

That didn’t work for me since the days with the cheapest thru fares didn’t have the cheapest segments. Did you print out 3 calendars, one thru then one for each segment and work from that? I was about to go to that level, then gave up.

What is an "empty leg flight"?

Lola- re: 'empty legs"

https://www.flyvictor.com/en-us/flights/#/

Thanks, Joe. That is interesting. So you save 75% over the cost of a private jet charter, but that still must be pricy. And it appears to be all short flights, not trans-Atlantic ( the planes are pretty small).

And it appears to be all short flights, not trans-Atlantic ( the planes are pretty small).

Don't let that size fool you. There are some private jets that do have the range to cross the Atlantic-- and some that can cross the Pacific. Since they are carrying much less weight than a passenger jet, much less fuel is needed to cover a certain distance.

A six-month-old post. Dragged back up by a poster who has only 3 posts in his history, 2 of which appear to have been removed (probably as spam). And his post that brought this thread from last July back to life - it's a link to a commercial service (one which I'd bet my lunch money nobody here would ever be able to use, despite the poster's claim).

I think I smell a pink processed meat in a square can. Reported as such.