Itinerary Gap!

Jeff,, my thoughts are you are rushing about like chickens with your heads cut off.

One example I will cite,, but how on earth does 1.5 days and 2 nights in Bern equal the possibility of "side trips" to possibly three other town/cities?Even if you only picked one,, how is it a side trip,, since in 1.5 days you basically have left yourself 1/2 day to see one place and one day for other,, really , these are truck stop touring.

I personally think one night stops are a waste of energy unless its just a transit stop.. and those I would try and avoid anyways.

Actually, I am a bit confused,, you mention London in your thread header, where would that fit?

Do remember,, train travel takes time .. and you may end up with a tour of train stations in Europe rather then a tour of Europe.

I think you and wife need to sit down, and be realistic. Each jot down their top four must visits.. and hopefully they are the same,,and then map those and see how you can connect the dots. Remember, trains may not run directly, so check train routes as you map this all out.

At 23 you have to assume you will have time to take another trip ( or two , or ten) in your lifetime, you don't have to cram it all into one.

Good luck,, I am envious,, I was 23 when I took my first extended trip around Europe with a friend. Had been to France and Netherlands,, but with family. A trip at 23 is something you won't forget.

PS,, This is totally random,, but Greece is super fun.. the islands were one of our favorite places,,besides Switzerland.

Woah - easy there Victoria. The London and Paris portions of the trip are prior to May 28 and have already been planned (includes 4 nights each in London and Paris BTW).

As far as the side trips from Bern - by train, Fribourg is 15 minutes away and Murten is 30 minutes away - though Lucern is an hour away. I only plan to pick 1-2 of those side trips, not all three. I think trying to do Venice AND Cinque Terre is probably too much. On the other hand, I think 1 full day in Florence and most of a full day in Siena is sufficient - I should probably mention I have been to Italy before and I thought that 1 full day in each was enough to see Florence and Siena. I have mapped out every possible train route and travel time among these cities and the maximum time to get between any is 2.5 hours - I think this is totally doable when you start to consider catching a 7:00AM / 8:00AM train and arriving in the next destination at 10:00 or 11:00AM. Part of the reason I wrote this post is that I want help making choices - Of the hill towns should I visit Orvieto, Assisi, or Arezzo, etc? (BTW, I lean towards Orvieto since it is on the train line to Rome). Also - I have seen Pisa, Ravenna and Milan and think those three are overrated, so we will definitely be skipping them. In the end - I think 10 full days is enough time to do Bern / Alps near Bern and hit the highlights of Northern Italy (keep in mind that Rome has already been covered - so we really are just talking about Northern Italy)... Also, take a look at Ricks 3 week tour highlights of Europe - he covers it surprisingly quickly - only 2 nights each in Paris, Rome, Cinque Terre, Venice, Florence and many others.

Whoa, Philidelpia(or, Jeff, as would more polite to address you by name) , it is true that RS tour cover alot quickly, but they are tours, where the bus is ready after breakfast to take one directly to next spot. No waiting on train schedules, and getting to and from stations. Can't really compare time wise the two methods.

As for other comment, your post was not clear to me that you were NOT including London or Paris in your three week timeline but that they were extra.I misunderstood.

Finally, I understand that you feel one day is enough in a place like Florence, but you have have to also understand many people would not agree. Its simply a matter of interests.

There is no place on your itinerary where you would be in any way bored staying longer than you propose to stay.

There is the risk that you could shortchange yourself, and discover (and regret) that you had spent a good chunk of your disposable time getting to a destination that you had to leave too soon--that you did not get your money's worth from.

For instance, suppose you arrive in the Berner Oberland but on your one whole day there it rains and although there is plenty to do in that case you consequently don't get to visit the Schlithorn or Jungfrau or similar.

The more of these tight tight scenarios you put into your itinerary the greater your chances of disappointment and regret.

These are world-class destinations and I think you are better off spending a bit more time at each of them even if you have to save one for your next trip.

Setting priorities is hard but is the basis for a great time--which I wish to you and yours.

I think I am going to go with 2 nights in Bern, 3 in Murren, 2 in Venice, 2 in Florence, 4 in Rome (adding one to my original 3 in Rome). I think it's too much to fit in Cinque Terre. I have been to Florence before and don't feel the need to spend that time in the museums, so I really do think 2 nights will cover it. On the way to Rome, I can easily stop in either Siena or Orvieto. Also, the train will put me in Venice by 2:30 or so, so I should have a couple of hours of walking time left and be able to focus on the sights the following full day. Thanks for taking the time to read and Pat I am sorry I upset you.

Jeff, don't worry, you didn't upset me.. I am old and a) would never rush about like you ( old)
b) like to be called by proper name( old),,

but I am glad to hear you cut out CT( although it would be nice, it can go on the list for another trip) since the trip you now have sounds a bit more civilized. It's true that sometimes rushing about can sabatoge a trip, you know, I have a friend who "hates Paris",, but shes only been once, for 3 days. She has now been asking about coming back to visit with me, she has finally figured out that her rushed visit didn't give Paris a fair chance( of her 3 days there, 2 were monday and tuesdays, when the museums she wanted to see were closed,, and she had not researched that) and since she was in such a rush she missed things and the things she did enjoy she felt she had to rush away from to do the next thing on her lists!

So, go and have fun, but build in enough flexibilty that if you are having a great time in one place you can throw away the schedule and stay an extra day somewhere.