"Postwar: A History of Europe Since 1945" by Tony Judt

Yes, I read it and it was one of the best non-fiction books I've ever encountered. I didn't realize prior just how closely Europe teetered on complete collapse immediately after WWII. I now can truly appreciate that the last 70 years was one of the most truly revolutionary eras in European history. All the more remarkable that this revolutionary transformation of society was mostly peaceful... even though it was preceded by two of the most destructive wars in human history.

If you really want to understand the Europe of today, forget about what Mr. Steves says about visiting art galleries. Read this book instead.

What Tom said.

Thanks for the suggestion, it's now next on my reading list.

Thanks for the recommendation, Kent. I just put a "hold "on it at the library. (it's likely right up my alley, as it were.)

Thanks for the info, Kent. I'm a history buff, who goes to Europe a lot, and this book sounds very interesting to me.

Just put it on hold at my library today also. I sometimes enjoy the non-fiction history better than the fiction but I like both.

Kent, the book looks great. Unfortunately, I tend towards audio books and the reader of this title is not what I would call dynamic. At forty three hours, well I may have to actually read it.

A couple months back I did listen to Ken Follett's Century Trilogy, covering approximately WW1 to the fall of the Berlin Wall. Historical fiction, to be sure, but the understanding and perspective gained is tremendous, and the reader, John Lee, did an excellent job. I could have paid better attention in school ;-). The value of learning the history of places we visit cannot be overstated, in my opinion.

Thanks for posting, Kent.

You can hear an audio sample here:
http://www.audible.com/search/ref=a_search_tseft__galileo?advsearchKeywords=tony+judt+postwar&x=0&y=0

Don't worry Dave about paying attention in school. The twentieth century was always crammed into the last week of class, along with turning in your books and taking home your art projects.

I must admit that historical fiction is more my speed, but have passed along your thoughts on this book to my husband who loves history of all things WWII. Thank you. I just most recently read All the Light We Cannot See by Anthony Doerr and it was just a beautiful book that touched on the physical and personal destruction of the war albeit through characterization. It oddly does a nice job of showing the devastation to the German people as well.

Kent , Thanks for bringing this up . It sits on my shelves and has been getting pushed back by other literary distractions . That was the kick in the ass I needed . It's definitely now in first place . Just finishing the Huntford biography of Fridjtof Nansen in advance of Norway this coming autumn . I am greatly looking forward to it !

Hello Kent !
I am now in a public Library. I will ask for that book written by Tony Judt. If that book is not owned by the Libraries in this city, that book can be borrowed by my public Library, from a Library located in an other part of this state, or from a Library located in an other state. I think I would pay for the postage for having a book mailed to my Library from an other location. I think the postage would cost less money than the price for buying the book (plus sales Tax) from Barnes & Noble book store.

To Dave: if it helps, I got the book on my Kindle for, I think, the low price of $9.99.

To each of you who has replied:
I agree with Dave's: "The value of learning the history of places we visit cannot be overstated, in my opinion."

Someone famous said: those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it. I think Europe, with the EC since the 1950's, finally paid attention to history. Took them about a thousand years, maybe two thousand, depending on how you count.

Last week I was reading a European history that covers the last couple thousand years, but I stopped because the history (not the book) was too repetitive and depressing--constant wars in Europe, the powerful few making life truly miserable for everyone else--so I stopped reading it, and that's when I went to Judt's book.
I guess what I'm learning is that, after a thousand years of repeating history, they must have finally paid attention to history, starting with the EC in the 1950's.

To all of you, enjoy the book! It's not a light read but worth it for those who are interested in taking the time to learn some history that helps to appreciate what we're seeing on the ground in Europe in the 21st century, and what it took them to get to this point.

Not that there aren't problems now.
Their history is so different from ours. Their cultural and historical inheritance has been so different. I think differences are interesting and one reason to travel.

I like AbeBooks for used books, and they have it starting around $11 delivered.

http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?an=Tony+Judt&sts=t&tn=Postwar-A+History+of+Europe+Since+1945

" Someone famous said: those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it. " --- George Santayana , My best , Steve !

I am at work at my library (dinner hour) and see our copy is in so as soon as I eat I'm going upstairs to get it.

Ron, thanks for the plug for ILLO service (Inter-Library Loans). I used to work in that department. The farthest we ever got a book for a customer was from the USA, and the farthest we loaned a book was to Ireland. We don't charge for postage either! Charging for services contravenes the Public Libraries Act here.

Dave, I just finished the Century Trilogy on talking book too. I commute so I do a lot of my reading by listening.

I also got the distinct impression from the book that the creation of the EC (later the EU), was less a matter of idealism, and more a matter of commerce and power politics. Particularly from France's perspective, who wanted to counter the growing influence of the US and UK over the emerging economic powerhouse that West Germany was becoming.

Hi Tom,
Your insights are helpful to me as I'm reading the book.
Re your most recent post, I guess money and politics trumps idealism, as usual.
But at least the starvation and (most of) the killing was stopped; and total collapse was avoided in the immediate post-war period.
It's difficult to imagine what Europe would be like today, if there hadn't been the EC and the EU.

I never really liked history until we started planning for our upcoming trip. I've re-read Anne Frank, The Hiding Place, and am currently reading A Train in Winter. I've watched documentaries (Ken Burn's The War, and The Sorrow and the Pity).

Thank you for this book recommendation. I am obsessed with European history now!

Off to put a request for this book @the library or I may just get it for the kindle.

Have to agree that reading a historical book prior to one's visit elevates the trip a lot more. Based on the previous book I mentioned, I am mentally preparing a trip to France and St. Malo.

Also, trying to get the spam to go down.

I also am currently reading the last book in the Century Trilogy. I am a little disappointed because of the release date between the last books as I can't remember a lot that happened with the characters, but it is an excellent series. I also loved the Hiding Place and have read it several times. Corrie Ten Boom is one of my favorite historical characters and her story is fascinating. I am surprised no one mentions that they visit her home (museum) when in Haarlem on Rick's tours.

I'm reading with interest each of your posts on this topic.
I thought this post would quickly fall to the bottom of the stack and go into obliviion. But no so.

@Steve, I loved The Hiding Place. What an amazing family! I wanted to very badly see the house but we are in Haarlem on a sunday and they are closed. If you go to the Corrie ten Boom museum's website you can do a virtual tour......even walking thru virtually and reading various plaques on the walls. I'm sure it's not the same but I feel like I was actually there, sans the emotion.

Reading the Postwar book has made me realize how little I know of Europe.
I've seen the "sights" but it was almost like Disneyland, see EuropeLand.
Their history is so different from ours. For example, as an American with only a superficial interest in history, I tended to see WW2 in terms of the military events that the US was involved in. Reading this book has helped to open up my perspective of how close Europe was to total collapse after the war. I'm on the "Retribution" chapter now, lots to go.
I have 2 months to go before my next Europe trip. I'm hoping I have a larger perspective of the last 70 years of European history, by the time of my trip.

Hey Kent, I don't remember. Does the book talk about the Morgenthau Plan? We in the US tend to pat ourselves on the back for the generosity of the Montgomery Plan, conveniently ignoring that our first idea for post-war Germany was to completely dismember the country and transform it to little more than a pre-industrial agrarian penal colony.

Thanks, Kent for the suggestion. It's always nice to learn about titles I have not come across. Your book is now on my list to order from the library.

Anyone planning a trip to France and particularly Paris should read "When Paris Went Dark" by Ronald C. Rosbottom. It is a history book, not historical fiction which I know is easier to read, but this book is very well written and doesn't read much like a text book as it contains personal stories about individuals and addresses all aspects of French culture and how the Germans dealt with it. It is, obviously, about the occupation of Paris from 1940- 1945.

You got me, Tom. What's the Montgomery plan? Are you referring to the Marshall plan?

EDIT And fortunately the Morgenthau plan was only proposed and never really seriously considered.

Tom,
Yes, the book discusses the Morgenthau plan and describes it as you do. The book has a memorable quote regarding the plan: in 1946 former President Hoover told President Truman, with respect to the plan: "You can have vengeance, or peace, but you can't have both."
It also says that the Morgenthau plan was replaced in 1947 by a new American policy of economic unification of the western zone of Germany; it says for the US "Germans were rapidly ceasing to be the enemy." This was in the context of the developing Cold War conflict between the US and Soviet Union.

Sorry, yes, I meant the Marshall Plan.

The complete idea of the Morgenthau plan was never carried out, but parts of it were, particularly the dismantling of German industrial capacity. Remnants of it even continued long after the implementation of the Marshall Plan.

Great suggestion Kent, my library has the e-book (and soon it will be mine, for 21 days at least).

Another suggestion in this vein is "Ghosts of Spain" by Giles Tremlett. Written in 2006 it focuses on Spain from Franco era into the mid-2000s. The opening quote by Frederico Garcia Lorca set the tone: "In Spain, the dead are more alive than the dead of any other place in the world: their profile wounds like the edge of a barber's razor." It really put my 2010 trip to Spain in perspective - Picasso's Guernica painting, for example. And when I visited, we were not allowed to see the Valley of the Fallen because the Spanish government was struggling with a discontent among the people and they thought the monument might be a central point for protests (so they shut it down).

I'm now to the part of the book where it explains what America did for Europe in the Marshall Plan. We kept people from starving in the postwar years. I think this puts the lie to the phrase "Ugly American". Something we can feel good about. The generation in Europe that knows about this is now dying, and we're not going to meet them in the tourist industry employees that we interact with. But maybe our knowing about this is something worthwhile, for those of us traveling there.
This part of the book helps me to understand that our country did good and decent things in the immediate postwar years in Europe.

Tony Judt's books are not without their critics, and the professor was a contentious figure during his life, sadly ended nearly five years ago by the always-tragic disease ALS. Postwar certainly presents a viewpoint, especially of Eastern Europe, that contrasts with some popular assumptions in North America. Even those of different political persuasion can learn a lot from it, agreeing or disagreeing. Wikipedia has more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Judt

Southam,
Thanks for the info and site, it's helpful background for a reader to assess the book.

Thanks Kent, I just bought this book on Amazon and received it a couple of days ago, I look forward to starting it this weekend.

To quote you: "I'm now to the part of the book where it explains what America did for Europe in the Marshall Plan. We kept people from starving in the postwar years. I think this puts the lie to the phrase "Ugly American". Something we can feel good about."

That's true, but it's not just the Marshall Plan - my grandmother comes from Brittany and in the weeks after D-Day her family "adopted" a young American soldier who was stationed nearby. He came round for dinner a few times during the period he was there. Obviously it wasn't for the food (American soldiers had better nourishment than the locals after four years of occupation), but from what my grandmother recalls he really enjoyed the opportunity to sit around a table with a family and get away from military life just for a few hours, especially as the poor guy had probably not been able to do the same with his own family for a long time.

Anyway just to say that while the Marshall Plan did undoubtably do a great deal for Europeans post-war, for many of the generation who lived through it, it was the contact with US soldiers that really stick in their mind - proof is I "remember" this little family anecdote to this day despite having been born decades after.

Thanks to all for this topic and for the additions. I was going to ask for a good read on Spain and CL has already done it. I will try to get through both the original selection as well as CL's before our trip in May.

Ian,
Thank you for sharing that anecdote. It touched me and I'm sure will touch others.
When I think of the special relationship between France and America, I always remember the fresh flowers the French nation has placed at the American Cemetery above Omaha Beach, every day for 71 years.
And the plaque nearby the flowers that says:

"A grateful French nation thanks the Mothers of America for the sacrifice of their sons on this beach, which they call Omaha Beach, in June 1944."

In 1972 I stayed with a woman in Amsterdam who still had the wrapper from her first American loaf of bread she scrambled to recover that had been dropped from the sky during WW II. That was why she had invited me to stay with her. Then in France, the same time period, people who had lived through the Occupation would again thank me as if I were a personal representative sent by the sitting President. Of course later in the conversation they'd also tell me to get out of Vietnam as if I were responsible. Bottom line: we're all representatives when in another environment.

Yes, thanks Bets for sharing that. Of course the generation of French people is almost gone who have personal memories of this time, as is the Greatest Generation here.
But look at Ian's post! A younger generation French person who has had the memories passed down!
And the French still put a fresh bouquet of flowers, every day, at the American Cemetery above Omaha Beach (see my post above).

Kent,

I sent you a PM but perhaps it has not got through as I recently had a similar problem sending PMs from my side to another member of this forum.

Anyway I just wanted to let you know that the American soldier that I referred to in my post above survived the rest of the war, as he and my family exchanged letters for a while once he had got back home. To add a bit of context to my post, my family wanted to show their gratitude to these young men in whatever small way they could - needless to say, in the four years that occupation forces were in Brittany my family did not invite any soldiers to dinner, but straight after liberation forces arrived, the table was set for any representative of these deserving guests.

Edit - by "my family" I mean of course my grandmother's family, which is also mine but just to clarify my own generation.

This reminds me of one of my dad's regular tales of when he went to Paris in the late 1950s with some friends. They went into a bar somewhere near the Moulin Rouge and had a beer. They were about half way though when the waiter turned up with another round of drinks. They said they hadn't ordered these and the waiter pointed to an old man in the corner sitting in a big chair more like a throne, wearing full evening dress including a cape looking completely like Dracula except he was smiling and waving a glass. 'He buys any English or American man who comes in here a drink'.

Ian, I got your PM last night and sent one in reply.
Thanks again for sharing your personal memories and thoughts of this time.

Marco,
I had a similar experience, with what sounds like the same gentleman, in a resort at Les Baules.

He bought my wife and I drinks. I'm not quite old enough to be of the WW2 generation, but I guess look old enough to have been.
So this gentleman had drinks sent to our table, he was dressed more or less as you describe; and then at my invitation, he joined us at our table and told us he buys all Americans drinks "who are of that age and showing respect for the local customs." We were dressed appropriately and were at least trying to speak French with a passable accent.
A special memory. Thanks for bringing this up.

Hello all

for those of you who are interested in the immediate postwar state of Europe, another book I'd highly recommend reading is 'Savage Continent - Europe in the aftermath of WW2', by Keith Lowe. It's available in softback and is a well-written but not too dense tome. It describes the background of many of the underlying ethnic tensions that did not simply disappear when the war finished, some of which linger on and influence events right up to today (for instance Ukraine).

Well worth a read if you can get it: UK amazon link

Kent, thanks for the recommendation on the book. I just finished A Train In Winter and The Hiding Place and just started Quiet Hero. I put these on my Nook but wondered if there are a lot of pictures in Post War 45. The nook does not do pictures well so did not want to download it if there are a lot of pictures that are interesting.
I lived in Germany 1957-59 and at that time there was still a lot of devastation from the war. When I later lived in Frankfurt in 64 and 65 things were much better but some areas still had nothing done to them. So just wondered about the book and if there are a lot of pictures.

Hard copy or nook, it will be my next read.

Tony,
There are some photos but not a lot, in Postwar.
I'm reading it on my Kindle, which also doesn't do graphics well, the screen is too small--but I don't feel I'm missing much.
It's really all in the text.

One of the best books I've ever read. Check out this lecture he gave (audio only) discussing the book in more detail. I've found it incredibly fascinating. Don't skip the Q&A at the end of the lecture.

https://libwww.freelibrary.org/podcast/?podcastID=172

-Matt

I'm reading "Postwar" now, more of a project than my usual light fare but I'll get through it. Brilliant analysis and synthesis of so very much material.

I experienced the immediate WWII aftermath as a 2-year-old in Berlin in 1946-47. My father was in the military government and after a year my mother and I were able to come over. My very earliest memories are of the old house in Dahlem where we lived, the old gentleman whose house it was (displaced by the occupiers) who came over to tend the garden, the devoted housekeeper and cook who helped take care of me, the "black market" that I thought was a very dark place where you bought things, saluting the flag at our little Army school, breaking a little statue on the terrace (accident of course), and (not a memory but a family story) sitting gleefully on the step between upstairs and downstairs that was rigged at night with an alarm. Also the ship that brought us home when I was 3. I still have my parents' "home movies" showing Berlin rubble, people picking through it and pushing carts. It was a life-changing experience for both parents. I have the address of the Dahlem house and I'm pretty sure it's still there, I want to visit Berlin to see it and much else of course.

Dick, that post puts us both in the same age range but I was 9 before I was there the first time. I lived in a small town with a small military base called Leipheim. Very close to Ulm. I travelled with a little league baseball team to several other bases in Europe but remember lots of the devastation even at that time. I also lived in Yokohama in 52 and as a cub scout we travelled several places and remember lots of damage there, but not near what I saw in Europe. I was in Berlin twice but much of it had been rebuilt or just cleared off by the time I was there in the mid 60's. Memories that I will never forget. Hope you get back to see where you lived. I am going to try to get to Leipheim next year. The German's had a small airstrip there that they used for bombers and fighter planes that was about 200 yards from where I lived. Was still used for some glider training when I was there.

I had experiences similar to what Dick and Tony describe, in both Europe and Asia, as a young person with my family, my father was in the US diplomatic service.
I also remembering seeing block after block of rubble.
When young was a good time to pick up languages over there.

The 1950's and 1960's was a very different time to be an American in Europe or Asia.

Romania came up in a post today.
I'm just now at the part of the book (Postwar: A History of Europe Since 1945) that points out that the Soviets had 1,600,000 military in Romania and Hungary in the late 1940's.
I haven't been to Romania, but wonder whether there is a legacy, even now, from the huge presence of Soviet military at that time.
It's 60 years ago, but I wonder if it has an effect even today.

I can't say about Romania, but here's part of the legacy of the Soviet presence in the former DDR:

Tropical Islands Resort

The former airbase on which it is built probably wasn't this much fun during the Cold War.

And from the BBC, a much darker legacy that has resonance today:

Putin in Dresden

That's a really good article about Putin, incredible, really. How many "world leaders" have done what he has, with regards to the nuts and bolts of spycraft and all of it, the mind reels, at least mine does. I treasure the time when GWB said he had looked into Putin's eyes and “was able to get a sense of his soul”. I do believe he's one of the really dangerous people in the world today-Putin, that is ;-).

A while back, as I mention above, I read Ken Follett, (historical fiction) which went through the fall of the wall, etc, what a time and what a scary place to be.

As for the Tropical Islands Resort, it looks horrible.

Thanks Tom.

I do believe he's one of the really dangerous people in the world
today-Putin, that is ;-).

Why? We, the west, bombed dozens of countries all over the world in the last 15 years, killed thousands of people, often based on faked evidence, and destabilized entire countries just to weaken geopolitical opponents. That's exactly what happens in the Ukraine now.

To Kent - OP
Thanks for recommending this book. I have it now, and just started reading. This will fill the gap in my understanding of European history.

"As for the Tropical Islands Resort, it looks horrible." What? It's awesome!

Don't get me wrong-what the last U.S. administration did in killing tens of thousands of innocents will stand as one of the worst foreign policy blunders (to put it charitably) of all time, and there's plenty of current examples of bad people out there, but Putin locks up and seems to get rid of his critics regularly. I take your point though, Martin.

With regard to the Tropical Island, I'm just not drawn to that sort of thing, perhaps I overstated it ;-)

Look at Tropical Islands from the perspective of living in a country where you can swim outside for, at most, perhaps two months of the year, and not even consistently. Indoor water parks (usually with a thermal bath and sauna area) are quite popular, and Tropical Islands is one of the biggest.

Back to the topic, the location of Tropical Islands is kind of interesting. It sits very deep and isolated within the Spreewald. There's virtually no towns and only a few scattered farms in the area. Makes you wonder what the Soviets were trying to hide when they chose this location for an airbase (or maybe they just used a convenient ex-Luftwaffe airfield). No intact buildings remain from the Soviet period, but you can still see the outlines of the runway, and the remnants of several bunkers. The other current occupants of the grounds? A large herd of goats and sheep.

Hi Kent,

Re: Romania, it's not just the Soviet troop presence, but the later economic and social policies of Ceaușescu that have a substantial legacy on Romania. I think if you read about what happened during the mid-60s and up the revolution in the late 80s (as well as the political corruption that continues through today), you'll get a more complete picture of that country's history.

Just for comparison, here's a link to photos from the country I grew up in - Poland. I think these photos really paint a picture of what life is like residing in a Soviet satellite (they were all called "People's Republics", whether Poland or Romania). You'll see common themes: misallocation of the entire economy, martial law, constant shortages of basic goods, black markets for imports, mistrust and spying on citizens, etc.

http://culture.pl/en/article/communist-poland-in-10-astonishing-pictures

Well, I'm almost through the 900 pages of this book.
They say you don't know what you don't know. This book has given me at least a slight idea of how much I don't know about Europe.
I guess you can't know a country until you've lived there, at least for awhile.
I guess, most tourists/travelers don't really need to know a country--we mainly just want a change of scenery, and to have fun, and have our perspective broadened by travel.

I ordered it from Amazon and have been reading it. I have learned so much! One of the things I now understand much much better is how Stalin ended up with so much of Germany and half of Berlin. I used to think, how could they "let" him have so much??!! Well, now I understand they really didn't have much choice.

Thank you, Kent, for bringing this book to my attention. --- I hardly ever read nonfiction, but am really engrossed in this "learning experience". :)

Hille,
I'm glad you're enjoying it.

Okay, dissenting opinion here. I admire the tenacity of those who are willing and able to stick with this for the long haul. I made it about 150 pages, gave up and took it back to the library. Way too dry and 'wordy' for me. I have read a lot of non-fiction history books that I enjoyed but this one is not on my list. I thank you Kent for suggesting it and I did give it the ole college try.

Hello Kent. I think that book is not boring. A book that is boring is "The Autobiography of Mark Twain", published two or three years ago. This history book written by Tony Judt is easy to read. I read at a slow speed, when I read most books. I am able to read the History of Europe book by Tony Judt, at a very fast reading speed. Near the beginning of that book he explained the commerce between Switzerland and the military of Germany during World War 2. I did not know about that. He said Industrial businesses in Switzerland sold very much equipment, including optics (lenses and mirrors for periscopes in German navy submarines ?) to Germany. The government of Germany gave gold as payment. Switzerland was required to sell things to Germany, as part of the agreement for Switzerland having the privilege of being neutral during the war. And Germany paid gold to Sweden for steel. The government of Germany stole the gold from Jewish European people and from other countries. I think it is ironic. Switzerland sold military equipment to Germany during World War 2, while Switzerland was making artillery and other weapons and underground army forts in the Alps mountains for Switzerland to be prepared for an attack by Germany's military. (Swiss people did not trust Adolph Hitler).

I don't know about payment in gold by Nazi Germany to Sweden, may well be. What the Swedes delivered to the Germans was iron ore, which is why Sweden was vital to the German war effort.

I have just finished the book and it is a very interesting read, I appreciate how it gives details as to why things happened as they did, and indeed why things are as they are now. Kent, thanks for the recommendation.

Not wanting to hijack the thread, but in a similar vein there is a book called "The Pursuit of Glory - Europe 1648 to 1815" by Tim Blanning, and it actually came to my mind while I was reading "Postwar" as there are some similarities, in this case Europe picking itself up after the Thirty Years War and going on to greater (but in many cases bloodier) things.

Blanning is a good historian, ...yes, the crucial period from Westphalia to the Congress of Vienna to put it in the realm of diplomatic history.

Ian,
Thanks for letting us know that you found Postwar to be an interesting read.
I also found the book helpful in explaining why things are as they are now.
Regards,
Kent

I have just recently begun to realize what little I know about the history and think I must have been in a coma during those classes, but realize it was the educational approach that was wrong. My grandkids who go to a Steiner school are my tour guides when we travel. The amount they know is astonishing, and maybe retained a bit better as Europe is now attainable for them. I will have to get the book. I am only sorry my interest peaked too late for me to hear the stories from my dad who was in Paris and Luxembourg during the war.
I also recently watched The Rape of Europa... heart wrenching, but lots of joy too.

Well, I finally finished "Postwar," thanks for recommending it, Kent. I checked it out of the library but ended up buying for my Kindle because I was taking so long reading it (interspersed with mysteries and periodicals of course). So the Judt estate got a little money off me, well deserved, and I've got a permanent reference.

Very interesting mostly (though the cultural subchapters left me pretty cold). I liked his conclusion that the "idea" of "Europe" might be a middle-ground model for other parts of the world, between the US and Chinese extremes -- democracy, free economy, a real safety net. I didn't like his late-stage observation about the House of Terror in Budapest, which he thought underplayed the abuses of the pro-Nazi government before and during WWII, compared to the Soviet occupation. I thought the museum gave plenty attention to both regimes, as well as pointing out that many of the players were the same. I also appreciated the background he provides for the current debt crisis centering (now) on Greece. Ten years ago Germany and France blew through the EU-imposed deficit and debt limits, getting away with it because they were (not his phrase) "too big to fail." Now Greece, admittedly having blown much further through the limits, is getting lectured by especially the Germans.

Anyway, thanks again, Kent. Now back to the comic pages..... ;)

Dick,
Thanks for your thoughts on this.
It's a serious and lengthy book. I surprised myself by finishing it. Congratulations to you and the others who have made it through.
I've been told Prof. Judt's views are not without controversy.
But hanging in there with his book helped me to get a better understanding of why things in Europe are now the way they are.

I bought it on my Kindle about a month ago, based on this thread. I just started it this week and was shocked to see that it was something like 20,000 pages! What have I done??!! I think Kindle must be counting paragraphs. When I look at the hard copy, it lists a little over 900 pages. Whew.

I'm about 1 1/2 hours in. There sure are a lot of numbers. 22,000 of this, 53.4% of that, etc. I appreciate the factual basis but I tend to skim over all that. I tend to read mostly fiction. So far this is keeping my interest. And yes, I'm the one that said Ken Follet was too light. Too light, too factual-no pleasing some people.

Karen,
The hard copy (regular hardbound version) is 831 pages, not including the index.
I skimmed some of it. I spent more time on Part 1 (1945-1953) and Part 4 (1989-2005).
Some people might want to know that it cuts off at 2005.