Help with itinerary of trip to Switzerland, Italy, and France In June

I certainly would not do a day trip to Venice. You'll be riding the train for as long as you have time in Venice, and then you'd just be another one of the hoards of day-trippers, all trying to see the same sights.

The places you're planning to stay are all fairly small and don't require extended stays, but I'm not sure you've adequately accounted for travel time between them. I'd use ViaMichelin.com to get driving-time estimates, but keep in mind that they do not allow for stopping, getting lost, looking for parking, etc. So a 4-hour drive could turn into 6 hours. In addition, you'll have 5 or 6 people to get moving every morning. You've selected very attractive places, but I think you're going to end up with the bare minimum of time at each stop except for Lauterbrunnen.

For example, I would definitely not count your time in Annecy as 2-1/2 days. You have one full day there plus settling-in time on your arrival day and a morning on your departure day. But you'll probably be eating both breakfast and lunch (as well as the obvious packing up) before you leave Annecy, so how much time do you really have before heading off to Geneva? I count any 2-night stop as just one day.

If you take a day from Annecy to go to Venice you'll have essentially no time left for Annecy at all. While Venice is a lot more interesting than Annecy, it's not the sort of place I'd care to visit for just a few hours; it will seem like a tourist-thronged nightmare if you are only there briefly. No sense going to one of Europe's great destinations only to be disappointed. Furthermore, Venice is a 4-1/2 to 5-hour train ride from Stresa.

I wouldn't want to drive for 1-1/2 hours after a (for me) sleepless night on a plane, either. Be sure all potential drivers are adequately documented. They'll need to be on the car-rental agreement. I imagine each also needs an international driving permit (from AAA or CAA), but I'm not up on procedures for driving in Europe.

Thank you, where would you advise us to stay first day as maybe we could fly out late Monday the 15th and stay near and rest Tuesday . Then get a good start Wednesday to Werdenberg . We planned on staying in Lauterbrunnen and making some of those day trips within Switzerland from there Do you think that's too much ? My brother does drive in Germany for his job so he has some experience. We do know about international license.Will keep Stresa at 2 day and Annency at 2and half. I understand what you mean about the driving time, thinking driving as part of seeing the countryside. I don't want to rush too much. thanks

Stresa and Annecy are both beautiful, and I have really enjoyed staying at both of them. But personally, I think you’re picking two locations that are too similar compared to other places you could see in Europe. I would skip Annecy and select Venice that you mentioned, BUT select “multi-city” for your flight instead of round-trip. You could fly out of Venice instead of spending hours driving back to Switzerland, which would give you an extra day of fun.

If you want to keep Annecy, I would pair it would Lyon, Paris, or another non-lake town and skip heading to Italy.

I haven't driven in Europe, much less in Switzerland, so I don't know what work best for you--picking up the car and driving just a few miles (before the adrenaline wears off), or hopping on a train to go to somewhere, spending the rest of the day in recovery mode, and picking up the car the next day in that city/town. I've spent a night in Winterthur (ages ago), and it seemed an attractive, laid-back town. Don't know what the car-rental situation would be like. Or you could take the train to Appenzell itself, which is a really attractive place, and enjoy the rest of Tuesday and part of Wednesday morning there. Again, I don't have any information about car-rental options. If you're looking for an automatic, you may need to pick up your car at a very large rental outlet--or maybe all vehicles that will hold 5 or 6 people and their luggage are more likely to be automatics (I'm not a car person).

The day to Gruyeres, Chillon and Trummelbach will be quite a full one, I believe. The drive just to Gruyeres is estimated at 1 hr. 50 min. Otherwise, the side-trips sound doable, but I fear you may be racking up some rather high parking fees. Still, that will presumably be less expensive that Swiss rail fares unless your family group includes a lot of children.

You'll want to retain maximum flexibility for your time in Lauterbrunnen so you can use the days with the best weather for the most outdoor-oriented excursions.

Thanks for that advice, I am glad we're not going till 2020 so we have time to really plan this out .Such hard decisions since this is our first time traveling to Europe! Any thoughts on best way to go to stresa from lauterbrunnen. We were thinking of going over passes thru Locarno and down to Stresa. How many days for Venice? thanks

I hope one of our Swiss experts comes along to offer routing suggestions, because I just don't know what's best. I always recommend a visit to viamichelin.com, because if you zoom way in on the routing map, the especially scenic roads will be highlighted in green.

For me, Venice calls for a minimum of three nights so you have two full days there. An extra night or two would be helpful. Venice is a magical place when you get off the too-well-trod path from the train station to the Rialto Bridge to San Marco. Short-term visitors don't have time to get beyond the jam-packed tourist zone and often leave Venice disliking it.

Arriving mid morning the 17th, we will be renting a auto and plan on
driving through Appenzell region to Werdenberg and staying for the
night.

I strongly advise against driving after a long flight. You will be very tired and driving with that amount of fatigue is tantamount to driving drunk. Take the train from Zurich to your first stop and get rested, then rent the car.

I once rented a car in Dublin after a long flight and drove straight to Kilkenny. Although nothing bad happened it was still foolish. I won't do it again.

As you have plenty of lead time you can compare rental car rates vs trains for many of you location. To haul 6 people and 6 or more bags will require a sizable van ( be sure to look at luggage capacity as well as head count). Are you comfortable with mountain driving with a large van?

A day trip to Venice is a poor idea. If you cannot spend at least 2 nights in Venice, save it for another trip.

Stresa to Venice is about 4 hr one way. Most of the day would be spent traveling. Doubtful you would have happy memories of the experience.

If you rent a vehicle in Switzerland and plan to drive it to Italy be sure to find out beforehand a) is it permitted by the company and b) what, if any, extra charges apply. A recent post recounted an unhappy experience a traveler had when he learned at the rental counter his cost was doubled because he was taking the car to Italy ( apparently due to insurance charges).

I see additional info that this will be your first time in Europe. I would suggest looking through some guidebooks for both France & Italy since you have plenty of time. Once you are finished traveling in Switzerland, it may be advantageous to take the trains in the other countries. We travel a lot in Europe and really enjoy traveling by train in those countries- very easy and relaxing. Also, consider something besides lake towns for your last four days to see the uniqueness of Europe. Look at Venice or Paris for your last four days (and then fly home from that city) .

We are now thinking of flying out late the 15th and arriving later the 16th and sleeping . Then we could get a fresh start on vacation. I've been thinking about traveling by rail too,so have to do some calculating and talking to group. Just not sure how to get to small village of Guggisberg(great grandparents home before coming to Wisconsin). Don't understand how post buses work to get to small villages. We are still trying to figure what to do about 2 nights in Stresa and on to Annency for 2 nights and then get to Geneva for flight home 2 days later.We are going to have to decide whether to see more of Italy and give up Annency or vice versa???? Unless we still do it that way, thank you all for your help and if have any advice feel free to add. Jo Ann

Just use www.sbb.ch/en and put in destination Guggisberg. The 612 bus goes at least every hour from Schwarzenburg train station and it is about a 15 minute ride. There are actually 7 bus stops in Guggisberg. See which is closest to where you want to go.

I have taken a fair number of postbuses in Switzerland. They tend to be used in mountainous areas (I don't know Guggisberg), and I am very, very happy to let a professional driver negotiate those roads. At one time the Swiss used large orange objects along the edge of the road where there was a sheer drop-off. They were highly visible but made of plastic, so they presented no barrier to an out-of-control car.

You have lots of time to research, but on our recent stay in 3 Swiss locations we found the Post Bus app on our smartphones to be invaluable. It addresses all transport option: train, bus and boat. Very easy to use on-the-fly/

If you do rent a car for this, you will need something big, like a van to hold 5-6 people and their luggage. Nonetheless, Swiss trains are expensive, so there could be some cost savings there. Guggisberg is a pretty big district, area wise, so if you are researching old home sites, a car would be handy to have.

If you went straight from Zurich airport to Werdenberg, it is only about a 1 1/2 hour drive. I would not be too concerned about driving that after landing, but it depends on what time you land and where you are coming from. It is that "driving through Appenzell region to Werdenberg" part that would worry me. Sounds like a day long sight seeing drive that you, not the car, will run out of gas.