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Help with Itinerary for Friend

A friend of mine has asked me to help him put together a sightseeing/business trip for about 3 weeks. He needs to be in London and want to experience Scotland, Wales, Ireland and Luxembourg. (He's in the financial industry). He is a city guy who doesn't want to do any hiking and says he can see scenery from a train. He prefers trains and ferries but will take a plane if it means backtracking the same route and wasting time. Here's what I got so far:

Fly to London--3 nights

Train to Edinburgh--3 nights

Train to Inverness--2 nights (I insisted he go to the Highlands.)

Fly to Belfast--1 night

Train to Dublin--3 nights

Ferry, train to Liverpool--2 nights (He's a Beatles fan)

Train to Cardiff-1 night (he wants to go to Wales.)

Train to GAtwick, Flight to Luxembourg--3 nights

Train to London--he wants to go through the chunnel--how many nights up to him

Fly home.

He's already been to Oxford, Bath and York, and may use some of the time in London for a day trip or two. He's also been to London a few times.

Any suggestions?

Posted by
588 posts

Doesn't the ferry go from Dublin to Wales? Why backtrack from Liverpool although the distance is not that great unless the ferry route is better. Is he flying from Luxembourg to Paris to take the Eurostar to London?

Posted by
16031 posts

Ferry goes to Holyhead in north Wales which is only about 2 1/2 hours to Liverpool. The train station is practically next to the ferry terminal.

He wants to take the train from Luxembourg to Brussels and then pick up the Eurostar there. He's been to Paris a few times but never to Brussels (not that he wants to see anything.)

Train from Inverness to Liverpool is about 8 hours. Flights from Dublin to Cardiff do not suit him. (Too restrictive carry-on rules.)

Posted by
1717 posts

I guess the reason he would want to be at Belfast only one night is that the only thing he wants to see in northern Ireland is the view through windows of a train, of part of northern Ireland, while travelling in the train to Dublin. Why would he want to be at Cardiff only one night ? Is he absolutely not interested in visiting St. Fagans' Welsh Folk Musuem ? If he will be at Cardiff 2 nights, he could visit that "museum" and eat lunch there at either Gwalia Tea room in the park, or at the Plymouth Arms pub. I would try to persuade him to not go to Liverpool. For most people, I would recommend : instead of sleeping at Liverpool 2 nights, sleep at Coventry one night, and sleep at Moreton-in-Marsh one night (at Treetops B & B). The next day : ride in a train from Moreton-in-Marsh to London (Paddington Station. a 1 hour and 45 minute trip). During the day of travel between Coventry and Moreton-in-Marsh : ride in a Bus from Coventry to Warwick (30 minutes), visit Warwick castle, ride in a Bus from Warwick to Stratford (15 minutes), and ride in a bus from Stratford south to Moreton-in-Marsh (1 hour and 25 minutes). That bus ride has scenic views of farm land in southern Warwickshire and northern Gloucestershire. He could get off the bus at Chipping Campden, walk through it (if he wants to see Chipping Campden), and ride in the next bus going south to Moreton. The train ride from Moreton to London offers some beautiful views of green hills, especially between Moreton and Oxford. For many American people who travelled in the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland, that day that I described (Warwick castle to Moreton-in-Marsh), was the best day of their trip. (I did that, going the opposite direction). And, the Treetops B & B is very good. The only reason I suggest sleeping at Coventry is that hotels in Coventry are better than hotels in the town Warwick. Coventry has a major train station. I think he could travel from Dublin to Coventry (via Chester) in one day.

Posted by
1717 posts

In my previous reply I forgot about Cardiff. Travel from Moreton-in-Marsh to Cardiff. (A possible route for that trip is : ride in trains from Moreton-in-Marsh to Cardiff, via Oxford and Didcot). In my recommended itinerary (in my previous reply), the only complication is finding a place for parking a travel bag while visiting Warwick castle. I think a travel bag can be parked in the hotel in the town Warwick, for a fee. At Warwick castle, I think walking through the building that was built in the 1800s is not important. It has a wax statue of Lady Dianna, and a wax statue of Winston Churchill as a young man, and a guest room for a lady in approximately the year 1898 or 1900. I do not recommend spending time in the torture chamber at Warwick castle. Do walk to the top of the big tower. Rick Steves said "The tower is a one - way ...250 step climb ...". That is not correct. I counted 55 steps. Some days,in Summer, there are demonstrations of medieval archery, Falconry (?), ..., a catapult, etc., outside the castle walls. In what month will your friend be at the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland ?

Posted by
16031 posts

Thanks...

He's going to Liverpool because he's a Beatles fan. Non-negotiable.

He's not riding in buses more than...once. He might do a day trip to the Cotswalds while in London. (If he doesn't hire a private guide and car.)

He's not staying in B & B's. He hates them.

You have to understand, this is not some guy who is counting pennies. It's a mixture business/pleasure trip so some of the places are non-negotiable.

He loves trains and likes to watch the scenery go by. He also likes the fact that he can get up and move around--something you can't do on a bus.

Posted by
12313 posts

My two cents: if he's only going to one night in Belfast and three in Dublin, he should skip Ireland entirely and visit when he can take in more small towns. He's likely to come away thinking he doesn't like Ireland at all. The charm in Ireland is the people in the small towns, it's all but lost in the cities.

Use those days to see more England, Scotland and Wales.

Posted by
2349 posts

While he's in the Scottish Highlands, he might enjoy a horseback ride. We took one from Aviemore, into the glens, and it was wonderful. It's a good way to see the scenery without hiking.

Posted by
811 posts

Hi, Frank,

First of all, this is very nice of you to help him plan his trip. I'm thinking for all the effort you should be able to go with him on the trip as a personal tour guide...

I am just curious as to what your friend would like to see with three nights in Luxembourg and wondering what sort of transportation he will use there. My cousin lives there and we have visited her, but spending 3 nights could be a long time for a country you can just about drive around the entire perimeter of in a day. I only mention this in case he wanted to take one of those nights and use it for time spent elsewhere.

Lastly, if he is flying Lux Air from Gatwick to Luxembourg, he is in for a treat - it is a great little airline!

Posted by
16031 posts

He's flying BA from LGW and LUX. Luxair's carry-on policy is too strict. (It's strange...their carry-on dimensions are 22 x 14 x 6. 6? Who's case is that thin? and only 15 lbs.)

I think part of his trip to Luxembourg is business. He'll be arriving late the first day so he can't do much. That will leave him two full days for business and sightseeing before taking an early train back to the UK.

I'm sure some of his trip will change before he goes. He doesn't even have exact dates yet. But he told me his likes and dislikes. It's not easy.

Most of my friends ask me to help plan their trips as I used to work in the travel industry and know a lot of the "ins and outs."

Some of the reasons for the places he wants to visit are absurd, but to each his own. As in the only reason he's going to Cardiff is to go to the "New York Deli." (He lives in Manhattan.). He can't wait to tell his friends he went to a New York Deli in Wales.

Perhaps not your typical RS type traveler, but, if what he does makes his happy, then who am I to criticize. Or any of us for that matter.

Posted by
811 posts

You must have been very good at what you did in the travel industry because A) your friends still ask you for help and B) you regularly give good advice on this forum.

Thanks for answering my curiousity about Luxembourg - it just struck me because not many people would make such an effort to fly there from the UK and back to sightsee. Not that Lux doesn't deserve it, but...

If he has time and transport, the castle in (and town of) Vianden is kind of cool, but he might be castle-d out by this point in the trip.

Good luck!

Posted by
811 posts

Oh - and how could I forget?! The American Military Cemetery (where Patton is buried) near Lux City is pretty awesome. Nearby is the German Military Cemetery, and is worth seeing if for nothing other to see the stark contrasts between the two cemeteries.

Posted by
16031 posts

Vianden was mentioned as the Wall Street Journal did an article on the town about a month ago.

I know Luxembourg has three official languages, but between French and German, which one is spoken more?

Posted by
811 posts

I seem to recall being in the train station and speaking (broken) German to the attendant and then ordering a coffee from the cafe in (even more broken) French. Luxembourg is such a melting pot, it almost seems rare to find a native Luxembourger.

I just emailed my cousin to see what her opinion is, and will let you know what I find out.

Posted by
1717 posts

Frank : Your friend does not need us. But, the travel suggestions in replies here could be helpful to other people reading these replies in this discussion thread. I do not know what is the total number of people reading the replies in this Traveler's Helpline/General Europe

Posted by
16031 posts

Thanks...as you said, the country is small and I think English plus a few key phrases in both French and German should be fine. (And a good multi-lingual phrasebook.)

Posted by
811 posts

Frank,

I asked my cousin who lives in Luxembourg the question of which language is more predominant, and her answer came back as such:

"Short answer is "it depends". Outside of Luxembourgish, German is the predominant family language since that is the first language taught in the schools. However the villages closest to the French and Belgium borders are heavily influenced by the French language. In fact you will see the road/street signs in German along that border and French along the French and Belgium borders. Since many of the workers in the retail, hospital and other service areas live in France or Belgium, but work in Luxembourg, French is the predominant language in the stores and among the service providers. Although not an official country language, English has a strong influence in the financial district, as well."

So, as you can see, her assessment is that there doesn't seem to be a clear answer or defined "winner." Not sure if this is any way helpful in answering your question (and perhaps others have more insight), but Luxembourg is a complex little country!