Help with Eastern European itinerary

The countries you mention vary in terms of accessibility. Americans need a visa to visit Belarus for example (unless you fly into Minsk and then only for five days, as I understand it).

In Czech Republic and Austria, don't worry about the language. I don't speak anything but English either - many locals (especially younger) speak at least a little, and I've been to Poland, Hungary, Austria, and Czech Republic as well as Russia and the Baltic States - never had a problem getting by, even if sometimes I encounter a non-English speaker. You can find some way to communicate if you must!

It's generally easy to get between cities in Europe by train and bus. Renting a car within one country sometimes makes sense, but often it costs a lot to do a one-way rental where you rent in one country and drop in another. An "open jaw" itinerary makes the most sense where you fly into one city from Atlanta (maybe with a change somewhere in Europe) and fly home from another city - not a "round trip."

You first need to narrow down where you want to go in Europe. How much time do you have? Yes, it can be done independently if you are willing to do the planning, but the longer the trip the more complicated it can get. This is where guidebooks help, too. But I would set down some parameters like a time constraint. Do you have two weeks? Two months? Obviously you can see much less if you have just two weeks so will need to choose a more limited itinerary.

FYI, if you want to plot a basic itinerary, search for them in Google Maps and get directions between each (even if won't drive, it helps you see where they are). Use a site called Rome2Rio to check the transportation connections between places (not always 100% accurate but gives you a rough idea). Once you have picked a basic itinerary, you can search for flights (look for "multi-city" to do an open jaw on one airline ticket instead of two one-way flights, which would cost a lot more). Try a website like Google Flights to check flight costs and travel times. From Atlanta, Delta might be your best bet as they have direct flights to a number of European cities. Sometimes you can fly on your own from a European city on to a less popular destination that Delta doesn't fly to.

Andrew, many thanks for your thoughts. We like to travel independently, have rented cars & driven around Western Europe, taken trains, do guided historical walks locally sometimes. Have never had difficulty with language barriers but I don’t know if English is as widely spoken in Eastern European countries, especially in the small towns of Poland, Hungary & Ukraine. And, that’s where it’s most important to be able to communicate & ask questions & get a real feel for the places my grands were born & raised.

Time...no limit, though 6-8 weeks would probably work best. I would like to do this in September but don’t know if I can pull it all together by then. Will certainly start working on it.
We could also go next spring, maybe April or May.

Off hand, I thought of flying into Poland, then to Belarus, down to Lviv & further south to a small town. Over to Hungary going east to west, into Austria & ending in Prague. I will have to research flights & train connections.

Thanks again & I’d welcome any further comments or suggestions.

You mentioned about including Prague. Good news: Delta flies direct nonstop Atlanta - Prague.

I haven't been to Ukraine or Belarus, but as I said, I really wouldn't worry about the language especially given your travel experience. Like me, you've probably encountered people who don't speak English (even in Germany and France). You find a way to communicate, even if you can't really have conversations. If on the other hand you really hope to have conversations with locals in English, you may well have a more difficult time in some of these countries than in western Europe. I wouldn't skip the trip just because of that - just set your expectations. (I also suggest taking a phone or tablet with Google Translate on it to communicate in a pinch - I used it a few times in St. Petersburg. Very handy a few times!)

Obviously you could rent a car in Prague and drop it in another country at the end and just pay the steep one-way fee, if it's worth it to you. Not everyone has the budget for that or wants to drive so much. By train and plane, here's a basic skeleton itinerary:

Fly into Prague.
Train to Vienna
Train to Budapest
Fly to Krakow or Warsaw (then train to Krakow)
Train to L'Viv
Train to Kiev(?)
Fly into Minsk (only option without a visa, 5 nights I think)
Fly from Minsk home or fly out to some other city and fly home from there.

--

Obviously with 6-8 weeks you can add plenty of time and detours - more time in any country you like. The more you want to do and see, the more difficult to plan, obviously. You might as well start planning and see how far you get and then decide whether you want to try to do it this fall or next spring. I suggest you work on an itinerary and post something more specific again. Maybe you can find people who have been to Ukraine and Belarus who can help you with those countries. There should be plenty of posts dealing with Prague, Vienna, Budapest, and Poland here if you search the forums.

Hi,

Don't count on English being widely spoken in Poland, eg, in cities like Lublin or small towns. A woman from SF I know went there last Sept, spent close to a week there, and observed that English was nowhere. That was her experience. My own most recent experiences in Poland are in 2016 and 2017 in border places across the Oder River in a couple of cafes and restaurants, ie east of Küstrin. They readily spoke German.

My experience in the Czech Rep has been most recently in 2016 and 2017 in Brno and Slavkov in Moravia. Those locals I encountered either spoke German, or if not that, then English. I encountered locals in the service industry not knowing English, even at train station ticket counters or museums. Then I used German, which usually worked, one time neither language worked. That ticket counter was in Brno. I went to another counter.

Many on-line agencies will show you possible flights. Google's matrix.itasoftware.com is as good as it gets although it does not sell tickets. Type in possible cities and it will show lots of itineraries. For flights inside Europe, www.skyscanner.com
For trains, www.seat61.com
Rule of thumb for both airlines and long-distance trains: Buy tickets as early as possible. Prices to only one direction, up, and can more than double if bought last minute.

In many of these countries, English is common in tourist areas, but less so in the outlying areas. I visited Serbia in 2014 on a family heritage trip. I engaged a local guide from the TI to help, and he was of course able to speak Serbian with the other Serbs. This is probably a good plan in the countries you mention - go to the TI, and inquire about guides. You may also be able to get them to drive you various places.

One other note: In areas where few speak English, this includes the police. Getting pulled over for something by a cop who does not speak your language does not appeal to me. Nor does seeking automobile repair help in such areas strike me as sensible. I would think carefully about the notion of driving in such areas. Public transportation is reliable, inexpensive, and does not involve discussion in Russian about wiper blades.

Thanks to all of you for your most informative suggestions! I will work on this & post a more definitive plan for review as soon as I can. I think trains are probably the way to go & hiring a private guide into those small towns is definitely taking hold.
If anyone knows of or can recommend guides for Poland (Badkowo), Hungary (Viszak), Ukraine (Velyka Byyhan not too far from the Hungarian border), please let me know.

Again, I really do appreciate all the feedback...thanks!

If you do fly into Minsk, send me a private message. We went to Belarus 2 years ago to visit my husband’s grandparents’ home towns. I will be happy to give you more details.

I'm sitting in Lviv right now. Love it! Andre H has a good itenary, except I would fly from Lviv to Kyiv. Second trip to. Ukraine for us and I suspect we will be back next year.

Fly into Prague, 3 nights
CK Shuttle to Cesky Krumlov, 1 night
CK Shuttle to Vienna, 5 nights including Melk and Wachau Valley day tours.
Train to Gyor/Pannonhalma, 1 night
Train to Budapest, 7 nights including over night side trips to Eger and Pecs and day trip to Szentendre.
Fly to Krakow or Warsaw (then train to Krakow), 4 nights
Train to Lviv, 3 nights
Fly to Kiev, 3 nights
Fly into Minsk (only option without a visa), 3 nights
Fly from Minsk home or fly out to some other city and fly home from there.

Been to all but Krakow and Minsk. We generally take Delta out of Atlanta, but found a great deal on Turkish Air out of Houston. They fly more places than any other airline. Terrible food, but good service. That would also allow you to see Istanbul, 4 nights. With the time available a couple of nights in Odesa would be great.

The nights are sort of my idea of a minimum. You could stay longer and relax and get deeper into things or do more daytrips from each hub. For that an apartment is great. leave the heavy luggage and bring overnight bags. Really makes the trips more enjoyable. Oh, I dont think you will find a car rental company that will let you drive to Belarus or Ukraine.

This trip we flew Houston, Istanbul, Lviv, Kyiv, Budapest, Istanbul, Houston: just under $1000, but departing 1 week later would have been $1500.

Annnnndddddd..mid September to mid/late October is almost ideal in this part of the world.

Self guided is great, but when you get to Ukraine a full time guide is under $100 a day. Many in the small towns of Hungary and Ukraine speak English and those that don't are not so burned out by tourists that they are generally pleasant and helpful. If you can't tell, I love Central and Eastern Europe. Budapest is a good discount airline hub and from there you can reach all sorts of amazing places.

Barbara, you mentioned that it was important to you to be able to communicate/ask questions/get a feel for the places where your grandparents had lived...

A few years ago I did a similar trip in western Ukraine, to visit the area where my grandfather had grown up. In retrospect, the best planning decision l made was to contact a local genealogist working in the area in advance. When did your grandparents emigrate? Do you already know if you have family still living in the small towns you mention, or in Minsk?

The genealogist made advance calls, drove me down to the town, and we spent the day talking with people who share my last name (in my case most of the village) although only very distant relatives. All of these people spoke only Ukrainian, and I'm not sure that a general tourist guide/driver would have known the right questions to ask, to encourage them to open up about the village/family as it was in my grandfather's youth. We even uncovered the local baptistry book, which the school teacher with my last name kept in her bedroom.

I wanted to see houses, churches, cemetery, and places that would have been there in my grandfathers time, and the genealogist found the lady with the church key, etc.

A qualified genealogist is no more expensive than a guide in these places, I discovered, and I contacted his references in advance. It was the best investment I could have made for the trip.

Good Morning!
I’m overwhelmed with the wonderful info & suggestions & am smiling from ear to ear! I am so encouraged. Thank you!
Paul, Barbara...if either of you have any contacts for the local genealogists &/or guides, especially those you may have personally employed, please send them.
A short while back I contacted guides, one in Poland, one in Budapest, & while both seem very professional & knowledgeable, I’m not sure about the fees. The Budapest guide proposed a driver & guide to drive us into Ukraine for an overnight visit plus the same going into western Hungary. Including accommodations her fee was $2000.

This guy is an excellent driver out of Budapest, but I don't know if he is willing to go to Ukraine. I suspect you will be more pleased with a Ukrainian driver in Ukraine : http://silverwings.hu. so fly to Kyiv and start Ukraine from there, in which case I know a good guide there who has her own car: https://kyivexplorer.in.ua/new-page-1/

I found my guide by going to the Beograd TI - I simply asked "Are guides available?" and they got us a really good guy in Serbia. He was reasonable. I'll use him again. I guess I am naive and trusting, but my belief is that someone you get through the TI is probably OK.

Thanks James, Paul, everyone!
Will keep you all posted...

We did a similar trip last summer with the exception of Belarus. I didn't speak any of the languages and we managed just fine in Hungary, Czech, Austria and Poland. My son is in the Peace Corps in Ukraine, so he served as my interpreter there. In Ukraine we would have be ok in the larger cities (Kiev and Lviv) without him as interpreter, but in the smaller city.... we would have had to pantomime.

I used airbnb for almost all of the lodging, and even that worked very well.

As far as car rentals, last summer I was told that most agencies won't let you take their car into Ukraine. We used trains, local buses and taxis (no Uber in small towns in Ukraine). I purchased all travel from one destination to another by trains/buses/airlines/car rentals ahead of schedule. I purchased all local trains/buses on site (e.g. a day trip to Auschwitz) . Also, my international SIM worked in the other countries, but I had to buy a separate one to cover Ukraine.

We loved everywhere we visited and are going back this summer. Enjoy!

Hi Everyone,
AMAZING information, tips & guidance!

We’ve had a bit of a setback (health related) so I haven’t begun the planning yet but I will! May have to break this vast itinerary up into two trips because of that.
So...I am thinking of how best to do that & when.

Prague, western Hungary near Balaton, Budapest, then eastern Hungary into a small town in western Ukraine, Lviv in the fall. Can I get it together by September?

Then, late spring Poland, Minsk & north to Estonia, St. Petersburg & Finland?

OR, just plan & do it all next spring, taking as much time as we need/want?

One disadvantage of long trips (which is what I take these days) is that it is harder to optimize for expected weather. If you split the trip, you'll probably feel you have more time for each country, which is virtually always a good thing.

Three weeks, using the last weekend too, is 23 days…
I would go independently and use air to get from country to country. Hungary and Ukraine are two of my favorite places.

1. Fly from Atlanta to Lviv on Turkish Air. With stops in Toronto and Istanbul this could be part of an open jaw for well under $900 depending on the time of year.
2. Arrive Lviv (great city and a good jumping off place if you want to see the Ukrainian Carpathians)
3. In Lviv
4. In Lviv
5. Lviv to Kyiv on Ukraine Air (about $60)
6. In Kyiv (Another great city with so much rich current and past history. Well worth a few days and a gateway to Odesa – another great stop)
7. In Kyiv
8. Kyiv to Minsk on either Ukraine Air or Beliva (about $80)
9. In Minsk (don’t know a thing about Belarus except if you fly in and out, no visa is required)
10. In Minsk
11. Minsk to Warsaw on Beliva (about $90)
12. In Warsaw and in and around Poland (I imagine you might want to see a lot more than Warsaw.) In Warsaw and in and around Poland
13. In Warsaw and in and around Poland (I imagine you might want to see a lot more than Warsaw.) In Warsaw and in and around Poland
14. In Warsaw and in and around Poland (I imagine you might want to see a lot more than Warsaw.) In Warsaw and in and around Poland
15. In Warsaw and in and around Poland (LOT also has cheap flights from Krakow to Budapest so you could fly into Warsaw and out of Krakow)
16. Warsaw to Budapest (Wizzair for about $75)
17. In Budapest and Hungary
18. In Budapest and Hungary
19. In Budapest and Hungary
20. In Budapest and Hungary
21. In Budapest (my choice to end a trip because its such a beautiful, rich and laid back sort of place)
22. Budapest to Atlanta on the other half of the Open Jaw ticket.

I might ordinarily quibble with James's suggestion to fly from L'viv to Kyiv, but I'm not in the mood to argue about it today. I just arrived in Kyiv via the express train from L'viv, which was supposed to take a bit less than 6 hours. It was about 30 minutes late. The carriages looked new, and they had air-conditioning and comfortable seats with just 6 people per compartment in 2nd class. However, it was an extremely herky-jerky ride, reminiscent of the nightmare night-train journey to Sicily I experienced in 2015. Pretty much impossible to write or enter anything on a phone or tablet (and there was no Wi-Fi). Now, if money is an issue, that train is fine (it had a/c, after all), but I can't particularly recommend it. Note that I have only flown a European budget airline one time (EasyJet), and I have not experienced the problems that can ensue when that means of transportation is used.

acraven, i'm jealous, i do so love Ukraine. I have a funny feeling i will be back in the fall...

Ukraine Air isn't exactly a discount airline; its the national carrier. Probably a BabyFlot. Service has always been good and flights pretty much on time. I think I paid $68 in May to get from Lviv to Kyiv; took about an hour. Taxi fare to and from the airports was maybe another 600 to 800 UAH combined.

Ive been flying Wizzair a lot lately and other than it resembling more of a bus service than a flight, its been fine. On time, really pretty good service on board, comfortable. No complaints.