First Europe Trip (4-5weeks) July 2016

Could u clarify your time for france , you don't really mean 3 days for Paris AND Nice?

And Greece in 4 days,,,that's a long way to go for 4 days...if you mean the islands it makes even less sence. Then Spain,, 3 days! You will be spending a lot of time and money in transit, ,cut a bit more and enjoy your trip.

We are doing a month this site May- June. We are covering a lot of ground ourselves, flying into london, then to Mykonos and Naxos, then Mallorca, Dublin and Paris and flying home from Amsterdam. We have been to most of these places before, we are experienced travellers and not on a super tight budget, but even we feel that covering our 5-6 places is hectic considering the spread of our choices is a bit crazy.

You have 11 places listed! And they are not close together ( except for you Italian stops) .

Travel between places can take almost a full day away from sightseeing.

You are going to loose ALOT of time moving around so much. You really need to narrow things down much more. Considering the heat, I'd save Italy, Greece and Spain for another time. Then think about prioritizing the rest- maybe narrow it down to 3 or 4 main destinations. London, France and Ireland would make a good combination for your time period. At your age you must plan on returning. Europe will still be there.

That's quite a blazing pace. Unfortunately such a trip might be a blur.

You're wanting to go to some really great places, however such cities are worthy of more time than you've allotted. Budget European airlines are often very inexpensive and faster than trains when distances are great.

I suggest you start in London and then take Easyjet from Gatwick into Amsterdam.
After Amsterdam, take a train down to Munich. From there, you can get down to Italy easily via train--starting in Venice. I would suggest you take a fast train (reservations required)) down to Rome. Then take a budget air carrier to Paris. You can fly home from there.
Young adults often enjoy the Bohemian lifestyle of many large European cities. The nightlife is great in so many places that it's difficult to choose the cities to visit. My favorites are Amsterdam, Munich, Prague, Vienna and Budapest. I also understand Berlin is quite a place that's full of life.
You're going to have a great time. But be careful as times are changing,

Give some justice to your destinations ...
Week#1 Ireland
Week#2 London
Week#3 Netherlands+Belgium
Week#4 Paris+France
Week#5 Italy

Forget Germany. Forget Greece. Forget Spain.
If you are both 21, then you have plenty of trips ahead of you.

At your age, assuming you want to use youth hostels and couch surfing as your main overnight accommodations, don't tie yourselves down to a tight schedule. Get a rail pass, have few reservations and move on to a new location when you've had enough. Be completely flexible. If worse comes to worse and you have no place to stay, you get on a long distance or slow train and sleep on it. You are asking much older people, many of whom have been there and done that, and some of whom have forgotten their youth or maybe have gotten too accustomed to certain luxuries for direction. I'd also search for a forum made up of younger people with similar travel interests as yours. While there is a lot of knowledge on this site, your spirit and time frames would not be the same as those on this site, generally. You need Rick Steves of 40 years ago or be RS of 40 years ago with technology. You should research locations, have an idea of what you might like to see there, where you want to stay and back up accommodations, and how to get in and out. Then when there you might decide to stay a shorter length of time or longer. Often, this time change will be as a result of the people you meet where you are staying, because you'll be having fun so will want more time in this location, or less in that location, etc. In other words, arm yourself with information, but do not commit to time constraints or reservations, except to your first place and last place. Also, get the Rough Guide, assuming they have that in Canada, or one similar aimed at people your age and/or budget travelers. You'll have a great time and learn a tremendous amount about yourselves. Step out of your comfort zones and have a great time! Wray

Honestly, this is crazy---you are all over the place and will spend half your time ( and most of your money) just moving around.

When you go to a restaurant do you order everything in the menu? That is what your travel plan looks like. You have to makes choices and pare it down--you cannot have everything.m save something for next time. You are young and there WILL be lots of next times.

Skip the heritage trips ( Ireland and the Netherlands) until you are older and have names and villages to visit. Start in London. Go to Paris,( by train) then Germany, and down to Italy--Venice, Florence, Rome. You could add Greece if you must, OR ( not and) fly to Barcelona and see a bit of Spain. Fly home from your last destination.

Night trains do ot work all that well and there are not many left. However, you may be able to take one from Munich down to Florence or maybe Venice. That is theonlyntime that makes sense for your trip.

Wray. " get a railpass" ...really, that is not very current advice for a young person...you didn't mention needing reservations and the extra fees,,,and the overall possibly much higher expense of getting a pass for a month.

When I traveled around for months a railpass WAS a good deal,,,but the hat was decades ago now.

My daughter did her homework and will be buying point to points, and one flight, and save money doing so.

kayla,

As this is your first trip to Europe, I'd highly recommend reading Europe Through The Back Door prior to your trip. Once you've finished that, use the country or city-specific guidebooks to plan lodgings, transportation, sightseeing, etc.

Using open-jaw flights would be the most efficient travel method, so that you don't waste time and money returning to your starting point.

Is the order you posted the same as you plan on travelling? If so, it's very inefficient and will waste both time and money. I agree with previous suggestions to skip Spain and Greece this time, as it will take time and money to get to them. You have enough to keep busy with in the other destinations. Also for travel in July, I'd suggest pre-booking accommodations so it will be busy at that time of year.

You might consider something along these lines....

• Fly inbound Dublin (check WestJet as they may have some good deals). Four nights would be good as you'll need time to get over jet lag. The Cliffs of Moher aren't really that accessible so taking a short guided tour might be a good idea. Check Paddywagon Tours (there are others).
• Flight to London - four nights?
• EuroStar to Amsterdam - four nights including Belgium? Check The Man in Seat 61 website for details on the EuroStar.
• High Speed train to Paris - three nights?
• Train to Munich - four nights (one day will be required for travel, so having three full days for Munich and a day trip to Neuschwanstein would be ideal).
• Train to Venice - 3 nights (there's a direct train that leaves Munich at 11:38 and that's the one I'd suggest). Note that your destination station will be Venezia Santa Lucia.
• Train to Florence - 3 nights (perhaps with day trips to Siena, Lucca or Pisa).
• Train to Rome - 4 nights (perhaps with day trips to Pompeii, Ostia Antica or Orvieto).
• Budget flight to Nice - 3 or 4 nights (check easyJet as they operate from FCO to NCE - if you book with them, be sure to read their Terms & Conditions carefully, especially related to luggage).

This is only one suggestion and there are many other possibilities.

There are some potentially expensive "caveats" to be aware of when using trains or other public transit in Italy. You'll need to do some "homework" on that. If you need further information, post another note.

I'm not sure a Railpass will be good value (especially in Italy where advance purchase tickets are cheap). I'll leave that question to the others. If you're planning on staying in Hostels, it might be worthwhile to get an inexpensive HI Hostels membership.

Good luck on your planning!

I think it depends on one's style re the railpass. I would assume when someone does get a rail pass, they figure out the rules. I wouldn't begin to provide the details. Pat, glad your daughter worked well with point to point, we usually do those, but my daughter used a rail pass a few years ago when she traveled with her GF and it worked well. It still provides good options, but you do need to know what trains to get onto, with and without res., etc, but can be a good in my opinion. My point was that these two young women should not get so tied down to a schedule, and still, IMO, a rail pass fits that criteria. Point to point, last minute, would work fine, too, but I find if the bulk of the transportation expense is taken care of beforehand then there is one less thing to worry about. Flights, IMO, have you missing everything in between so I avoid them even now when I can. I am old school in that I love trains. I am a dinosaur, but I still remember being young. LOL Wray

Hello! I see you have a very busy schedule. I agree with the other members of this forum that this may be just a little too busy for the time you have. I would skip two countries. Greece, in particular, would be the one I would skip this time. I think flying into Ireland and taking 3 - 4 days there would be a good start. Then on to London for 3-4 nights. With good planning in London you can see the highlights in 3. Then the Eurostar to Paris. This, being my favorite city, I would want 4 nights there. After that, its up to you really which way you go. We took the City Night Line from Munich to Amsterdam last year and we loved it. We had a sleeper car so thats why we probably loved it. If we had to sleep in a regular seat we wouldn't be so encouraging. I think you would love Amsterdam as it really is a city for young people. My advice is you are young and you are going at a great time of year. Leave yourself a little room to be spontaneous. Just remember that you are going when the whole world wants to go to Europe so you will have to lock down your sleeping accommodations. Unless you bring a little tent! Have a great time.

Hi,

Good trip planned here. It can be done (esp at your age, why not?) , get the the Youth Pass for France and Germany, no need to include Spain and Italy. There you can get point to point tickets. If you qualify for InterRail, then that would be better for more comprehensive coverage. You'll see others your age taking night trains, I still use that option, did it first also at 21. Night routes include here the Amsterdam to Munich route, which is an option for you. How are you going from Nice to Rome?

With 33 nights, look at approx 8 destinations, and an average stay of 4 nights.

Dublin (4 nts)
fly to
Amsterdam (4 nts) >> Brussels for Bruges (1 nt) >> Paris (5 nts) >> London (5 nts)
fly to
Barcelona (4 nts)
fly to
Venice (3 nts) >> Florence (3 nts) >> Rome (4 nts)

The 3 flight legs all benefit from significant competition so cheap fares are easily found.
The 5 rail connections best booked with P2P tickets.

You need to reduce the number of destinations. Remember that you will lose at least half a day travelling between each destination and day 1 is just getting over jetlag.

Take the train where possible as this saves time over flying allowing for check in time etc.

Italy, Greece and Spain will be too hot and busy. Use this time in your other destinations.

@kayla.ray....I see your trip is in the summer, peak season. My trips are from early summer to peak season also. Although I suggested point to point train tickets for traveling in Italy and Spain, there is a potential down side, depending on your luck. The train station offices could be packed with people just you waiting to buy a point to point ticket, you waste time waiting there. Using a ticket machine you might find it faster, just a matter of timing and luck at the moment. When I buy point to point tickets, I do it at night, one reason for staying not far from the train station so you can pop in there with a lot few people waiting to get a ticket. What is the main priority on this trip if you had to drop some of it?

STOP. Need to blow the whistle, talk you down.

Your itinerary is insane - not just too frenzied (it is that, too), it just doesn't make any sense.
For example, you allocate 3 days to Neuschwanstein Castle and 3 days to the entire country of Spain. Not rational.

You need to step back, forget all the details about whether or not to get a railpass, etc. and do a reality check. You need to get some sense of scale, and priorities. You first need to get much more solid ideas on what is important to you, what you most want to see. Spend some time researching (it's fun).

Note that you should avoid listing countries. Countries are big, and you don't really go to countries - you go to places within them (usually cities and towns). Be a lot more specific. If you can't think of someplace specific ("Spain") maybe you don't really need or want to go there that much?
Write your list of places. Prioritize that list - sort items into three categories (must see, really wanna see, nice to see). Get out a map of Europe (preferably one you can draw on). Circle the places you want to go. Make a big, bold dot on places that are top priority, a medium size dot on middle priority, small dot on nice-to-see. Play connect the dots. Figure out a route that makes sense geographically. If all your biggest dots are clustered in a general part of Europe, but one or two are waaaay out towords the edge (say, Greece or Spain), consider cutting those.

Go through this process multiple times, tweaking your list/priorities/route each time. You won't get it right on the first try (do it many times - each time it should get more reasonable).

Remember: popular places in Europe are very, very crowded in the middle of the summer. Much of Europe is uncomfortably hot in the summer. You're Canadian (of Irish and Dutch heritage) - do you really tolerate intense heat well (lugging a heavy backpack all day long)? I love Europe but I wouldn't be caught dead in Spain or Greece in July (the heat would kill me and if it didn't, the crowds would make me want to kill myself).

Remember: this won't be your only time in Europe. You don't have to go everywhere. I'd concentrate on the northern parts (less heat) and save the Mediterranean for another trip, in May/June or September.
Hope some of the above helps.

@ kayla.ray....True about the heat in the summer, can be often oppressive, stifling heat. But is your luggage a two or four wheeler or is it a big backpack with a frame where you're carrying 35 lbs on your back. Big difference. In 1970s and 1980s US kids your age carried that weight on their backs; now, if your luggage is the wheeled type, it's much more convenient and energy saving, your own energy, especially the 4 wheeler where you need only to glide along the surface of the street/road, etc. I know you are still working on the itinerary to get it down to specifics, a matter of priorities. I would skip both Spain and Neuschwantein Castle since neither holds the interests. Spend the three days in Munich if you're staying in South Germany, if not, then in Berlin. If you do have the five full weeks, the trip is easily doable, I could, minus Spain. If you keep Greece, how are getting there? Plane or ferry?

I would suggest that you get a map of Europe, and draw on it your proposed destinations and the route between them. That would clarify what you are trying to do.