Feedback and Help needed for 7 week Europe trip

When do you plan to do this trip?

In the current environment trying to keep up with and satisfy the covid requirements of eight countries will be a full time job for one of your party

I agree with Joe. If this is for travel this year, keeping up with Covid entry requirements for what…8 countries?…is going to be a full time job. You’re young so can probably pivot pretty easily but checking the status of entry requirements will be ongoing throughout your trip.

Not sure if you’ve been lurking here on the forum but just the last few days The Netherlands has instituted a quarantine for people coming from the US. It was literally announced on 12/29 and went into effect at 00:01 on 12/30 so practically no notice. France put in a ban from the UK the weekend before Christmas.

Some countries have a 14 day lookback period, others do not. So, on your arrival day to The Netherlands you’ll need to know if they have a lookback period. You’ll have been in Germany, Czech Republic and Austria over the last 14 days so you’ll need to check the status of all 3 countries for entry to the Netherlands if a lookback applies.

Your itinerary looks good for a fun trip in 2019. Not so much in 2021.

I agree that you are trying to cover too many countries. Consider that 4 nights somewhere is only 3 days. Your first few days maybe jet lagged, so you may wish to add a night or two to Rome. Every time you switch locations you are going to lose half a day. You need an odd down day every 2-3 weeks so that the trip doesn’t become a blur. You haven’t got much nature factored into your itinerary.

Switzerland is eye wateringly expensive.

I had 6 full days in Berlin and didn’t get to see everything that I had on my list. You are also short changing Paris. I haven’t been to Hamburg.

Keeping tabs on ever changing Covid requirements for so many countries is going to be a logistical headache. I suggest that you pick three countries maximum (ideally two) and focus on spending better quality time rather than a long tick list of countries seen.

You can do this trip, but you will be exhausted! Step one should be going to Youtube and watching the three RS Travel Skills videos. He covers the planning basics, including how to cut stops.

Planning the nights rather than the days is a good start, but you need to subtract 1/2 day's activities every time you change location. 14 locations means at least 7 days shot with travel. And, EVERY stop you mention deserves more time. Adding more stops will be even more rushed than you currently have. Next step - get on Bahn.com (the German railway website that actually provides a lot of information about traveling all over Europe) and figure out the series of journeys this itinerary will require. Then get on one or more booking websites and find lodging styles that seem to fit your travel styles and add up the costs.

Realistically I suggest cutting close cousins - Vienna and Salzburg? Berlin and Hamburg? 12 cities and 2 more nature focused places - maybe cut some city stops.

You don't mention how many friends are involved but you should probably recognize that different people will wear down at different points in this itinerary so building in some more flexible time will be essential (not to mention an afternoon/evening every week to do laundry).

It should be obvious, but .... You are all vaccinated, but none of you are bulletproof. Being vaccinated protects you from serious illness, but it does NOT protect you from getting COVID and becoming mildly ill for a week or more and having to quarantine or isolate. Trying to push on with almost any itinerary will be impossible. And consider what you will do when you all get tested to be able to fly home and one or more people who feel fine discover that they will be spending an extra ten days in Europe in isolation because they test positive.

Just found this cautionary post:

https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/germany/federal-police-handed-over-190-000-violations-of-corona-entry-rules-from-travelers-to-authorities

I agree with all the comments above.

Regarding the vaccine, with Omikron here in the UK it has been shown that 2 doses of vaccine are not particularly effective against this variant - it is after the booster that the protection is best. And getting a case even after 3 doses is frequent, although the consequences are much reduced. So, before you travel will all of you have also had the booster 2 weeks or more before travel?

And keeping track of >>8<< countries' changing requirements is more work than should be dumped on only one person in your party.

So quick answers to your 3 specific questions:

1 = Yes

2 = No, you don't have time

3 = No, if you don't have specific reasons for having it in, take it out and allocate the time elsewhere

4 = No, see my answer to number 2

Rome, Italy: 4 Nights
Make sure you spend one day in Vatican City.
Florence, Italy: 3 Nights (Including day trip to Pisa)
You can replace Pisa with a day trip to Siena by direct bus (1h 15m) and stop in Pisa on your way to the Cinque Terre and store your luggage at the train station while sight-seeing.
Cinque Terre, Italy: 3 Nights
Will you be hiking? If not make it two nights. If you’re taking multiple hikes add a night per hike.
Bernese Oberland, Switzerland: 4 Nights
Lucerne, Switzerland: 2 Nights
Munich, Germany: 4 Nights (Including day trip to Neuschwanstein Castle)
Also take a direct 30-minute train to Dachau and tour the concentration camp. Furthermore, I think three nights in Munich is all you need.
Salzburg, Austria: 3 Nights (Including day trip to Hallstatt)
Vienna, Austria: 3 Nights
I would add another night so you have time to visit the Hofburg Imperial Apartments and Treasury. Spend an evening at the Vienna State Opera, St Stephen’s Cathedral, Kunsthistorisches Museum and Schönbrunn Palace. I would also add a night if taking a day trip to Bratislava’s old town that I recommend.
Prague, Czech Republic: 4 Nights
Berlin, Germany: 4 Nights
Hamburg, Germany: 3 Nights*
From Vienna go to Budapest instead and skip Hamburg. You can take a direct train from Budapest to Prague (7h 15m) or fly nonstop for < than $50.
Amsterdam, Netherlands: 4 Nights
Bruges, Belgium: 2 Nights
Paris, France: 4 Nights
Of course this itinerary does not factor in the amount of time it takes to travel by train to each place. Expect to spend at least a day getting there when traveling between countries.

Three comments:

First, it almost always takes longer to change locations than anticipated. It's not just the actual travel time, its the packing up, checking out, getting to the train station, finding the track and waiting for the train. Then, upon arrival, you have to clear the terminal, get a taxi, get to your hostel, check in (if possible), and unpack to some degree. You want good memories of unique sights, good food, good wine, and people you'll meet. If your try to do too much, I'm afraid you'll only have blurred memories of taxi rides, train stations, and riding the rails. Just something to consider as you finalize your plans.

Second, I'm suprised you've omited Venice. It is truly one of the world's great places. You might want to do some research and reconsider.

Third, enjoy!! Sounds like a great trip -- wish I'd had that opportunity at that age.

Does your budget include your airline tickets? If it does, I would question whether you have enough. Paris, Amsterdam, Rome, Lucerne and Bernese are really up there in price. We ate a burger, fries and one beer each in Lucerne and the cost near 100.00. I swear tears hit my eye. Would I take Switzerland off, no I would just increase my credit limit? You may just need to take a few days off the trip.

I am so excited for you and your friends: to be 25, have 50 days to travel and @6,500 Canadian dollars each!

The only way I can envision the plan that you have is if we were covid-free. You have eight countries and therefore, eight covid policies to follow. You and your friends might have to make adjustments. Also, my idea of hostels is that many might be sleeping in the same room--they might not all be vaccinated or wearing masks while sleeping. Do all eight countries have hostels where you want to be located? Do you have a Plan B if one or all of you get sick due to break through covid or just the normal colds/flu?

But, I don't want to rain on your parade. Taking covid out of the equation, if the three of you are high energy, then, yes, I think your plan would work. You have a nice range of large cities and small cities/large towns with nature just a hike away.

I'm unsure of your finances, however. It looks as though you'd each have @ $130 per day. If your flights are included in the average of $6500, does that seriously impact on your daily average? You might have extremely cheap flights--let us know.

I've not been to Berlin, Hamburg or Bernese Oberland, but if you shaved off one night at each, you might be able to fit in Budapest. I say, go for it.
I consider shopping for groceries to be eating like the locals. How about you? If so, you could always eat several meals from the local markets which would save money: bread, cheese, cured meats, fruit, wine/beer, etc. that do not have to be cooked.

Please keep us posted.

money is even tighter than it looked - $6500 CDN is only 4,512€.

pp

for 50 nights.... 90 Euro a night pp for a bed with no food, no admissions, no transportation, no nothin'

oh, if you haven't visited Europe before, looking at the countries you mentioned, if you try to go fancier than a hostel you will find that almost all hotel or Pension or B&B rooms will legally sleep no more than 2 adults. No double doubles. They have fire regulations and won't let 3 in the room, so don't try to sneak in (you're Canadians, eh, so you wouldn't, just sayin'). So you will need a double and single or some other 2 room arrangement.

I know you said hostels but that may not work out.

What a wonderful opportunity! My first trip to Europe was 40 nights many years ago with the 4-H Ambassador program, and it really gave me the desire to return to learn & see so much more!

You’ve received a lot of good advice. One general observation is that you are mostly looking at the larger cities. Smaller cities are usually much cheaper - less expensive accommodations and lots of history & inexpensive or free museums. I always include about half of my time in my 3-week itineraries in the smaller locations and enjoy them immensely.

With your budget but still a desire for nature, I would drop Switzerland and instead either spend time in the stunning Italian Dolomites or Austrian Alps. Or, if you’re from British Columbia in Canada, maybe skip the mountain regions and concentrate on the other options in Europe?

You are 25-years old so very likely you will be back to Europe. So think about your top priorities and try to drop a few countries - both for ease of traveling and to have more time actually enjoying your trip vs. time sitting on a train. Could you be happy with Amsterdam, Germany & Austria? Or France, Italy & Austria? My goal on trips is to have 1-3 hours max. between cities on all train travel with only one longer.

Also, check the dates you choose for any town festivals; they are a lot of fun to attend!

Too much moving around. I'd cut Switzerland -- it's beautiful but too expensive (eye-wateringly expensive is right -- you will not be able to believe how expensive it is, especially for what it is) and not nearly as lively and fun as your other destinations (I've been around Zurich, Lucerne, Bern, Geneva, Lausanne, St. Gallen, and Sargans). Honestly, Switzerland seems quite culturally sterile to me, compared to its neighbors. I'd also consider skipping Salzburg -- it's beautiful, yes, but on my two visits, there's little to do in the way of attractions (especially compared to the other cities on your list) and it's full of and caters to mega-wealthy Gulf-State tourists who love luxury shopping, not young people on budgets who love culture. (If you were going during the opera festival and had tickets, I'd say differently... but at other times, eh.)

I've never been to Hamburg, Munich, or Bruges, so can't speak to those...

Give Rome, Florence, Vienna, and Paris more time. Budapest is wonderful -- I'd swap Salzburg for Budapest if I were you.

And go to Venice. There's no place like it. If I were you, I'd swap Cinque Terre for Venice.

We have a 6-7k budget (per person)

Does this include the flights to/from Europe?

If it does you are worse off than Nigel pointed out. When you consider the cost of 13-14 moves within Europe you will be out of money long before 50 days have passed.

You should do more detailed research of the cost of travel within Europe to all your desired destinations. Plan on the cost of eating out to being no less than what you would pay at home.

Look at the cost of admission to the places you want to visit.

Apart from the complications of covid, you may need to expand your budget or reduce your time.

Good luck

I was going to look at your other thread to get some insight to your planning philosophy since you haven't given any feedback but it has been deleted.

That's too bad...

These threads work best with a certain amount of to and fro...