Families from North American Traveling in Larger Groups!

Interesting observation,, I have noticed since I have been on these (this and others) travel forum that many extended famlies seem to like to travel together,, 'I often wonder how they can afford it,, since it often seems like the mom and dad seem to pay for everything,, nice, I am a bit envious,, but i get your point, groups in general don't seem to reaize how invasive they can be . I have been in cafes where three or four little tables are together and are talking across each other,, rather obnoxious, but I do understand.

And your point is????? We have been "blocked out of the breakfast room" on numerous occasions, with nothing left to eat, by Asian tour groups, not North American families. On other occasions we have been " blocked out of the breakfast room" by unaffiliated travelers, with nothing left to eat. It can happen in small hotels, no matter where you are.

I didn't see any complaint about the sharing with the RS tour group there, James. What he (she?) said was, "but they are always on the move in the morning so everyone eats, drinks and moves on. Tables changed very quickly" This was used to then refer back to the previous contact with, "The groups we encountered last month occupied several tables for over an hour" Why does the OP need permission to voice a gripe on a RS website after visiting a hotel used by a RS group? We don't need the post police for that.

"Hate to _itch, but blending in with locals and not being around loud people is one of the reasons why we go to Europe." A tourist such as yourself shouldn't expect to "blend in" with locals on a 12-day trip staying in what are probably tourist hotels with other tourists, and seeing the sights tourists like to see. You're mingling with fellow tourists, which is why these groups got your attention and the reason you came to know their family relationships. And as far as "loud" is concerned, any group of 5-10 is going to seem loud, no matter the nationality. I don't understand why your travel goal is to blend in with locals on such a trip or to conceal your nationality. When I went to Paris, I wanted to see the Louvre, Notre Dame and Versailles and try some interesting food, not pretend I wasn't American (a fact that was revealed anytime I opened my mouth.) It may have been inconvenient that some lingered at breakfast. But lingering over a meal is certainly more in keeping with European dining traditions than American. Maybe they were trying to blend in too.

I feel a bit envious of these groups. I travel alone for the most part except for one trip I made with my parents and one years and years ago I did with my sister. I would love to travel with my sisters, brother and their families to Scotland. I want to explore places with the people I love. Sadly, it is unlikely because of money, but also due to problems of the diverse schedules and different priorities. Some day, when my ship comes in, you can look for my family to be taking up the tables for breakfast at The Anderson in Fortrose on the Black Isle. We may have a few Dutch, Germans and Swiss with us as I'll want my family to meet the European friends. I suspect we'll be quite loud as we'll all have a lot say. ; ) Pam

You can embrace a culture and respect it's customs but blending in while following a published guide and not speaking the language, isn't going to happen. I feel bad for the couple who's entire family went on their honeymoon, sort of defeats the whole purpose.

For the very reasons outlined above, we prefer to stay in B & B's, pensions where you are not subjected to the herd mentaility. Quite often they are not centrally located, but you can't have it all.

Well, I guess families are a herd if you want to liken them to antelopes. Honestly, are we really being critical of families traveling together and enjoying Europe? If you really have a problem with this, and run into it, then find a new hotel or B&B. I would love to spend an hour over breakfast with my family in Edinburgh or Paris or Amsterdam or Berlin and then go off and have a wonderful day. How wonderful that they don't feel pressed to pack into the day 15 tourists sites and lunch at the finest cafe. I think that Backdoor Travel need to encompass an open to tourists as well as locals. Pam

Pamela I certainly didn't intend to label family groups as a 'herd'. I would like nothing better than to be able to travel to Europe with my family. I meant herd as in large numbers of people all gathered in one place.

Judy, I just think we're being a little hard on families here. You do travel differently when you travel alone, with one other person, with family or with a tour. Each type has a different dynamic. Rather than whinging (what a great British term!) I think we need to come up with our own ways of dealing with the different dynamics when we encounter them and not let them put an unpleasant note on our vacations. So feeling a bit Pollyannish, maybe we can turn this thread into ways to cope when the breakfast room is invaded? Is the best strategy to grab your muesli and run? Or do you join in the conversation? If the party is that loud you probably can! ; ) Or do you as the B&B owner for an idea? Pam

As long as the family or group in question isn't letting their kids run up and down the hallways where the hotel rooms are late at night slamming doors or yelling, or you are in an art museum or a church where adults or kids talking loudly would be frowned upon, what's the problem? It's a breakfast room and if it bugs you that much, grab some food or coffee and head back to your room. I don't have kids and I choose not to travel overseas with big groups of family or friends, but I don't see the need to begrudge others for doing so. And if I was that disturbed by it, I'd get a room at a very small B&B or rent an apartment of my own for a few days.

You asked if there is a growing trend to travel with extended family. I don't have precise statistical data, but in my own little circle of neighbors and friends, I am seeing an increase in this. I've heard many, of the age to have grandchildren, say that they are glad they did thus-and-such (extended family) trip with their kids/grandkids (and the grandparents are usually treating), because it is a much better return on their money right now than the stock market. When parents can afford it, it appears they are accomplishing a few things: quality family time for themselves/children/grandchildren; creating wonderful travel memories for same group; being generous with their $s. Life is short. If I had children/grandchildren, I'd probably do the same thing. On the other hand, we have run into several fellow travelers who are treating their parents.........adults who know their parents always wanted to visit the "old country" or the place of their heritage, or one very faithful old couple who just really wanted to see the Vatican before they died, etc., often giving a 50th anniversary joint trip, etc. Having the boomers along helps to aid the post-boomer couple. Similar situations with a surviving parent, having them come along, as they may no longer wish to travel alone. Re: the noise level........same thing happens in American restaurants when large families or groups gather. Maybe kindly approach the group, smiling and saying that it looks like they are enjoying each other and their trip....ask if special occasion, their plans, etc. Joke that you want to be adopted...then ask if you could pull up a chair with them to eat....that would probably prompt them to clear a table or two for you (and others).....or the worst case scenario, you literally pull up a chair and become part of the merriment for a few moments while you down your yogurt.

Great post Margaret, especially the idea of making friends with them, a bit of the old saying, "if you can't beat em, join em"!

Well, Margaret, I personally would consider that rude and intrusive. You are actually advising that one should foist oneself onto a group of friends or family, complete strangers who are having a rather noisy good time? What if you are with a couple of friends? Do they join you in this invasive move? Do you really believe a group of friends would welcome you? Not my friends and me ... don't even think of it.

Norma, You have a good point. I suggested chatting with them really as a last resort........thinking (although I did not state it as such because of limited space) if food was not permitted in another part of the hotel, the breakfast room staff could offer no other seating options, etc. I would really suspect that by just chatting with them very briefly and holding one's food, looking for place to put it down would really provide a little hint (it would for me if I were part of the group....I'd suggest we finish up and move on out, making room for those who need to dine). And, of course, I would assume anyone being friendly to a group would be attuned to reading body language and social hints.....if a few kind words commenting on how it appears they are having fun are not returned in a light-hearted, kind way....of course, I would never suggest going any bit further....that's sort of an unstated assumption. But, granted, people are different and some may or may not respond to the kind "hint." Sounds like you would find it offensive, so maybe it is better for folks to just let the hotel management be their interface. Having lived in the South, it's just a way of life to chat and be friendly with others (provided it is not in a forceful, overbearing way).....if someone approached a table commenting that the group appeared to be having great fun, no one would give it a second thought in this part of the US, especially if the group was being loud and chatty (as the poster stated). I'm actually planning a trip to Quebec next year, so I will definitely tone down my outgoing friendliness there (as I did when I was in Paris). I appreciate your point of view and feelings.

I've found myself in the same situation many times. The breakfast area is full, it's noisy, it's a bundle of energy. Not my favorite environment for an early morning. One little secret I've found is that most hotels that serve breakfast have trays. You have to ask for it. It's rare that I can't get one. Once I have the tray, I fill it with what I want and take it back to my room for a quiet, peaceful, calm breakfast. And if I can find a newspaper as well, even better. Why fight the crowds?

It's true that different nationalities have different ways of behaviour at the breakfast table. I sit alone at breakfast in a B&B, but if I am occupying a table for 4-6 persons with the breakfast "manger's" permission and some other Americans sat down and started talking to me and I detect a Southern accent (which I normally focus on listening), I would definitely welcome that. I would find that friendly and social, instead of rude. It depends on your own values or your culture's.

All I can say is "good for them".

Thanks Fred for the shout-out! We 'Southerners' usually get a bad rap here (o.k. I'm from LA but claim AL, no one else does that!). If I hear a sho nuff or ya'll I perk up too as I know I have a friend. I'm venturing into the family thing too as a first this Christmas in London. Good news is I've been there enough I have seen everything so no schedules. The bad news is my in-laws are already freaking out about the exchange rate. I guess I'm buying! It's a good thing for me as I get to combine time-off with family bonding. I imagine some Norman Rockwell stuff, but expecting European Vacation.

Margaret, you said exactly what I was thinking. If the room was packed and there was no place else to sit, I'd do just what you said. Heck, I see similar behavior in NYC at crowded lunch places, where singles are taking up 4 person tables! It's not that they want to, but there are not many single tables. So, you say to the person, do you mind if I share? And they all say sure and go back to reading their newspaper or checking their phone. Granted, in a B&B packed with tourists you have a slightly different problem, but you still have not enough chairs in the right configuration and everybody wanting to eat within a similar time frame. BTW another solution is to find those B&B's that assign seating by room number. I've been to many like that in the UK. I don't think I've seen it as much in Europe. I've definitely seen people use trays to take breakfast up to their room. Pam

Thanks subsequent posters that replied re: sharing tables. It's worked rather positively for us many times in the past, but I was beginning to question myself after the subsequent response posted they would find it invasive. In Rome, we asked to share an end of a table with two gentlemen in a crowded hotel breakfast room. Turns, out they were from Ireland, and we both totally enjoyed our conversations, so much so, we finally (an hour and a half later) really had to excuse ourselves and pull ourselves away from our new friends so we could get about touring. But, they offered their email/contact info, and we gave them ours.....should we ever make it to their section of Ireland or they to the U.S. Delightful, well-traveled gentlemen. We stay in touch with a couple we met on a Greek Island cruise under similar circumstances, they've since visited our home, and we hope to travel with them again. Ditto for a lovely Japanese lady and her mom from another trip. We also stay in touch with two couples we met on various Rick Steves' guided tours, and we hope to travel again with both of them.....but table sharing among a known group is not uncommon. Yes, one can meet someone who would find your friendliness "invasive," but we have been fortunate to only find new friends....some friendships are just long enough to down some yogurt/coffee, and some (we hope) lifelong. And, again, we are very careful to read body language/social clues when initiating any social interaction and behaving accordingly. We are also careful to not approach a group/couple who look(s) too serious (or unfriendly)....we are good judges of who might be receptive to a friendly couple from Nashville. After all, who were your friends before you first met them: strangers!! In addition to the sights we see, the people we meet (both locals and other travelers) are just as enriching.

I'm not the kind of person who generally thinks to initiate conversations with strangers (it might just be a cultural thing - the west coast isn't nearly as friendly as the American south!) but when traveling I sure don't mind when people do. I don't think most people do, honestly. Whether it's talking to people from the country you're visiting, travelers from other countries, or a welcome chat with folks from "back home" I think it's one of the nicer experiences while traveling and have certainly never felt that someone who struck up a conversation with me (which happens on a fairly regular basis after hearing me and my husband speak English) was being "invasive". Just my two cents. As far as larger family groups, a good friend of mine was recently in Europe with his family. He and his two brothers decided to take their mother to Europe since she'd never been. One brother brought his fiancee, and my friend brought his boyfriend. I thought there was something really charming about this diverse, modern family (mom lives in Texas, bro and fiance in New York, my friend & partner in San Francisco) finding another way to spend quality time together. After all, if you have to fly to be with your family, you might as well fly somewhere great! I met up with them for the Parisian part of their trip and we all had a wonderful time - meeting up with my friend's boyfriend's college friends who also happened to be in Paris at the same time! Talk about a small world! I certainly didn't think there was anything particularly obnoxious about them given the huge amount of tourists already around us.