European Grand Tour by Car

Did you read this current thread on the Transportation board? http://www.ricksteves.com/graffiti/helpline/index.cfm/rurl/topic/70104/driving-your-own-car-in-europe.html

Julian, As you lived in Europe for a "couple of years", my first question is whether or not you carry a Passport from an E.U. country? If not, you'll have to deal with the provisions of the Schengen Accord which limit travel to NO MORE than 90-days in any 180-day period. Regarding the issues of using your own car to drive around Europe, that topic has been WELL covered in the other Thread that Kathy mentioned. Good luck!

"There doesn't seem to be a pan-European guide to driving in Europe.." Do you mean a book with suggested driving itineraries or a source that covers practical information? I'm not aware of any pan-European sources for the former, although Frommer's "25 Great Drives in ..." series is great for individual countries. The Germany edition directs you to many great towns not in any other guidebook. For the latter, the complete European road atlas sold by Michelin contains a chart that summarizes all the particulars of driving in each country, like the speed limits and whether or not a vignette or tolls are required.

Just when you think a subject line has run its course it comes back! Always amazes me, especially this one since it is somewhat unique, unlike the ubiquitous should I get Euros before or leaving North America.

Yes, that thread just about says it all. Don't take the visa question lightly, and I advise you to get your car insurance organized sooner rather than later. As discussed on the other thread, as you will be importing the car for an extended time be sure that doesn't spook the insurance folks, nor cause any problems with the authorities within which you will travel. Do realize that you will need also to export the car at the end.

It's a good thing that I'm researching the trip a year in advance!! I read the VW bus/Schengen issue with great interest. I'm actually questioning whether I want to take my car there (I do realize I need to bring it back). I would be going with a Lexus GX470 SUV (a smaller SUV than the Landcruiser. It's big enough to store my crap (but I do understand the security risks with that as well). Renting/buying a car like that in Europe would be quite expensive. Tom, thanks for the suggestions. I do have a Michelin Europe Atlas...it's a great resource. I'm thinking of actually starting my adventure in Lisbon, and driving all around Europe and ending in Antwerp (where I previously shipped a car when I lived in Switzerland).

I think the Michelin atlas route may be the most comprehensive single source way to look at driving regulations. In the past, the information I have found on the internet sources has been rather spotty and tends to be old enough the I have been concerned about its currency. I would also suggest taking a look at doing a lease program with Peugeot or Renault. In the long term the daily lease rate for a Peugeot 308 diesel is only about $23 per day for a brand new car that comes insured to the hilt and has no pick up or off charges in France. In 2009 our 308 diesel automatic was very comfortable, had good performance and delivered and average of over 43 mpg for 3200 miles of highway driving which is something I guarantee your Lexus will never do. By the way one nice thing about turbo diesels is driving in the mountains, the little suckers never know they left sea level.

Peugeot and Renault both have lease programs. We leased a Renault because they had the best car for us. Diesels get amazing mileage. Manual transmissions get better mileage and help you get the most performance out of relatively small engines. A GPS is now a must for me. I drove all over without one. After my first Italy driving, however, I picked up a TomTom GPS and now wonder why I traveled without one for so long. Signage seems consistent throughout Europe (although in multiple languges) exept Italy. ZTL's should be watched for carefully to avoid racking up fines. An international driving permit is going to be necessary unless you specifically avoid the countries that require it. You have experience driving in Europe, so I don't think you will have much trouble. Millions of people drive there everyday.

Irv, that is phenomenal mileage....thanks for the information. Leasing seems very reasonably priced, although I probably want a larger car. I need to weigh the pros/cons of bringing my own car vs. leasing. This Schengen issue is gnawing at me. If I start in Portugal, I would imagine if I stay longer than 3 months straight in Europe, I need a visa from Portugal. Is it easier to get a Visa from one European country vs. the next? I'm wondering how much of a hassle it is to ask for a 4-5 month visa.

Brad, what are ZTL's? Are those the automatic speed traps? I actually have a Swiss driver's license as well, but I will get the International license from AAA just to make sure I'll be ok. One of the reasons I wanted to bring my Lexus was the fact that it has a built-in GPS. My guess is that I'll have a problem converting it to provide European directions, particularly since the car is a 2003. I'm hoping the Tom Tom's will be even better next summer when I embark on the trip. Thanks for your help.

Shipping a car with a questionable ability to get maps when a new gps with maps costs less than three hundred bucks seems a bit odd.

Julian, "ZTL's" are Zona Traffico Limitato zones which are becoming increasingly prevalent in many cities and even smaller towns in Italy. These are designed to limit or "discourage" cars from driving in the historic older parts of towns, presumably to reduce damage to old buildings from traffic. Some cities enforce these via tickets written the "old fashioned way" and others use a more "high tech" approach with automated Cameras. Florence is especially well covered by these, and EACH PASS through one of the Cameras will result in a ~€140 violation notice. There was a post here not too long ago describing one traveller that unknowingly passed through TEN of the Cameras! London has a similar system referred to as the "Congestion Charge", which I believe is also enforced with automated Cameras. These are one reason why I prefer to use rental cars "stategically" for specific purposes, rather than the default method of travels in Europe. For me, travel by train (especially fast trains) is usually the most relaxing and quickest way to get around. NO car can legally travel at 300 kmH, so the fast trains are really fast compared to cars! Cheers!

ZTL's Zona A Traffico Limitato or Limited Traffic Zones, they are areas that limit car traffic in the historical centres in Italian towns and cities, where access is not allowed to unauthorised cars and only holders of a special permit can drive. If you drive there without a permit you will be fined. If your hotel lies within such a zone and you need to drive there to park or unload luggage, you are exempt from the fine but need to ask the hotel to send your license number to the traffic police to avoid a citation, after providing the information be sure to check to see if it was sent. And it's not just a one time thing if you get caught, you are subject to it each time you enter the area, there have been posts where tourists received multiple tickets for the same area because they entered it more than once.

Ken and Barry, Thanks for the ZTL definition. I'm aware of those areas...didn't realize they were called ZTL's. Although the trains are faster, the car allows alot more freedom. I have been to most major European cities, so I thought the car would allow me to get to the "out of the way" places that I've always wanted to go to. Of course, I'll go to many cities, but I'd like to spend most time traveling the countryside. Julian

I would encourage you to look into a lease. I think it would cost you far less than shipping your Lexus both ways, plus putting fuel into a vehicle that doesn't get great mileage. The lease includes full insurance. Finding insurance for your own car could be difficult. And if the Lexus breaks down, good luck getting it repaired. I haven't seen many Lexus on the road, and parts are probably few and far between. What if you are involved in an accident? What do you do while your car is being repaired? I fully understand the reason to drive. I just think that shipping your 8 year old car over is not a great plan. And of course you have the problem of wanting to be there too long, but that is another issue. Buying a GPS and a European chip will be better than your old built in GPS. I don't know that you can even get a European chip for the Lexus.

Regarding your visa question, some countries seem to be better than others on limiting their paperwork and actually giving you a visa in a timely manner. I've France is pretty good so look into that. I've heard Spain is not so good. Look around online as very few tourists here have a need for a visa.

Since you plan on using your car for a year be aware that maintenance will be substantially higher than in the U.S. An oil change alone will scare you.