Europe Trip w/ Kids 2012

Are you planning on visiting anything in Poland other than Auschwitz? I mean this with no disrespect but, it is a awfully long way to travel from all the other locations to visit a place that is going to make you depressed and give you and your children nightmares. I do think that remembering that portion of European history is important, but could be accomplished by visiting Dachau, Anne Frank's house or literally hundred of places that would be a lot closer. Granted Auschwitz is uniquely horrible because of the sheer number of people murdered there. But I am not even sure if I really would want to give my pre-teen children the nightmares that such a trip is going to involve. The nightmares they would have from a visit from Anne Franks house are horrible enough.

I personally think this is way to much for three weeks. Also, that is 21 days, less two days for travel so now only have 19 days. Definitely skip London, stay on the continent. See if you can fly into one city, such as Paris and then home from say Venice . Even with that I think it is too many cities with the travel by train. What do you want to see,, museums, cathedrals, etc. and that can also help to narrow down your ideas.

First (and you will hear this a lot), that's too many far-flung places for three weeks. Your first and last days will be travel days, getting to and coming from Europe. That only leaves you 19 days for eight, maybe nine, cities. Changing locations will cost you at least half a day, maybe more, depending on your mode of travel. You will all be happier and have a better experience if you limit your locations and spend more time in each. Second, plan on flying into one city and out of another to save time backtracking. Look at your locations on a map and see what order it makes sense to travel in. Third, start early to find/book lodging, especially if you plan to travel during peak times (summer). Family rooms are harder to come by than they are in the US, so you might need two rooms in most places. Fourth, get the kids involved in deciding what things they would like to see and do. They will be more invested in the trip if they have a hand in planning it.

Right now we might travel into London or Paris and may fly out of Amsterdam but nothing is written in stone yet. We just got back from a 2 week trip through Italy and loved it of course that was sans kids. However, Auschwitz is a must there is no way to remove that from the schedule, the kids want to go and so do we. We have made up our minds to teach them as much as we can about that and we have visited several Holocaust museums here in the US, they have also read many bools and have watched documentaries as well as movies, such as Shcindler's list and the Boy in the Stripe Pajamas. At the end of the day if they are not ready to go in, then one of us will stay with them. I know it sounds like too many cities, we are planning on doing a lot of sleeping in trains and they are helping to plan this 100% we gave them two choices caribbean cruise or a 2 week trek trhough Europe, they chose Europe, lol. We will be visiting more than one place in Poland I would like to go to warsaw and maybe also visit The Crooked Forest, we shall see!

If Poland is a must, stick with Germany, Czech Republic and Poland. Poland has weeks worth of stuff to see the hightlight being Krakow, which is right next to Auschwitz. Those three countries would be great for WWII history and even Cold War history. You can sleep on night trains, but trust me, the quality and quantity of sleep is nowhere near what you would get in a hotel. Night trains are also not cheap, they can actually be more than hotel rooms, especially for 4 people. You say you are on a budget, so remember that you spend more per day when you move around a lot. If you just have to include another location consider Amsterdam, Berlin, Krakow/Auschwitz/Poland, and Prague. I traveled with my parents at 11 and spent 2 weeks in England and had an amazing time, there is no need to take them to 8 countries in 3 weeks. Most kids at that age also don't understand the travel time and cost to get between locations to make educated iteneraries.

When my son was 10 we did Prague (4 nights), Krakow (2 nights) and Warsaw (1 night). I would have liked to have spent more time in Poland - Prague was great but 4 nights was one too many. He went to Aushwitz with us and I don't think at that age really grasped it - by 11 he definitely would have had a better understanding. When he was 8 we went to Amsterdam for a long weekend and saw Anne Frank House, Resistance Museum, Zoo, Hidden chapel in Canal House (that was his favorite). Prague - climb the hill (or smarter - take the train up) and see the house of mirrors. Paris - are you planning on just the city? We enjoyed seeing Normandy but it was a long trip - we went out there for two nights of a six night trip and drove (never drive in Paris even if you are just trying to find the Avis!) I have never been to Zurich but have heard it is skippable. How about Munich? We are on our way there in April. Also, I would choose either Berlin or Amsterdam and fly out of there.

Thank you for bringing the children along. With the right preparation and attitude, they will get a lot out of it. We started doing trips like that when our three children were 4, 8 and 10. However, see #5 below; Here's a quick bunch of suggestions; 1) Children find cities stressful. Keep visits brief and low-key. This presents a problem since, like so many other travelers, you list a parade of cities you want to visit. It's pretty hard for a child to distinguish one city from another when they are consecutive like that. 2) Our children enjoy youth hostels more than any other accommodation, but a close 2nd choice would be rentals (usually week-long). Both can be had for around $100-$150/night for a family of four. You will have to ask around to find hotel rooms for 4. They are not common. Two rooms explodes the cost. You will have to book far in advance to secure the rare rooms for 4. 3) We were at Auschwitz last summer with them at age 7, 11 and 13. No problem. Just talk about it a lot before hand. They saw the A.F.House in Amsterdam first, also the sights in Nürnberg. Don't neglect Krakow. It's wonderful and inexpensive, too. 4) I would strongly suggest that you break this into two different trips. Do London & Paris with a strong dose of rural England & France on one trip. Then do the Amsterdam east to Krakow run (with some rural stops) on another trip. It makes more sense culturally, logistically and makes doing EACH in three weeks more sane. 5) If you absolutely MUST spend 21 strait days in cities, I would leave the children home. There is a strong chance that they would grow miserable - or at least numb. It's not worth it. Fortunately, there is quite a lot of life happening outside of the big cities, too.

Wondering why cities are stressful for kids? I have never heard this before. Many kids love them. They get a kick out of the trams and buses, and seeing everything. Just because your kids get stressed in a city, Randy, doesn't mean that this is a general occurence with kids in general. There is no difference between seeing lots of stuff in a rural setting and seeing lots of stuff in a city. Parents need to not have a full plate of things to see and do, but kids retain just as much if not more than the adults do. Stress is an overused word in my opinion. You can use the word tired, or bored, or realize you have tried to see too much in one day, but it isn't stress. Edit: the more I think about it the more it bothers me that thinking a child of 7 will be stressed by visiting a couple of cities in a row but not be stressed by visiting a place like Auschwitz boggles the mind. Interested as to how you explain mass murder and the Holocaust to a 2nd grader. I do not think any child of that age can take that in.

Given your two posts, here's my suggestion.
Fly into Amsterdam for a few days, then to Berlin for a few days, through your desired stops in Poland, then down and home from Prague. Paris and London are removed enough from Poland that you'll spend a good day in airports flying between the destinations and at least a day if you take the train.

Re-directing the conversation, if you visit Hamburg, bring the kids to Miniatur Wunderland: http://www.miniatur-wunderland.com/ If you go on a weekend, arrive early, because by late morning the place can get packed. The nearby Internationales Maritimes Museum Hamburg is also somewhat kid-friendly. I found that while the scope of the museum is international, it nicely places Hamburg's local nautical culture in perspective.

While granting that Randy's choice of the word "stressful" may not be the best - I completely agree with his list of how to travel with children, especially the part about not making it all cities, all the time. Our family trips have all had stretches of time spent outside the main cities. When our daughter joined us for only a week of one trip, she missed the days we spent along the Rhine, coming in only for Prague and Vienna. At the age of 18 even she said she wished we had put in a few days of hiking, etc. in between the two city visits. Even now our kids get some of the cities mixed up - "was it the museum in Vienna or London where we saw the cool painting, etc.", while the trips to see English castle ruins, Tuscan towns, French prehistoric cave drawings, etc. are more singularly remembered. So - Randy gives you a good suggestion in breaking this trip up. We have spent 3 weeks each in JUST England and France, each time staying in rental housing for oart of the time, giving us a base and the kids LOVED having a "home" to come back to. It was cheaper per night than our stays in city hotels, even when we only had 1 room and in the rentals the kids got a separate bedroom. And part of the joy of being out "in the countryside" involve doing outdoor activities - our kids liked biking in the English countryside, canoeing in the Dordogne, climbing in Ireland, swimming in Italy. They also liked the various forms of transportation including rental car, ferry and train but again, you should look very carefully into the cost of train tickets for 4 people, especially a night train if you actually plan to sleep and want to reserve a sleeping compartment. Our overnight train rides were fun, but they were not economical. Bottom line on traveling with kids is to SLOW DOWN - they will love getting to know a few places more than whipping through all the big spots.

I agree with Jo 100%. I can't fathom how "cities" would be more stressful to a seven year old (or for that matter a 17 year old, 27 year old or 77 year old) than a visit to Auschwitz. If you can go to Auschwitz and then not leave completely miserable you either weren't pay attention during the visit or you lack all human compassion. I am not saying don't visit sites such as Auschwitz. One should. But realize that it is quite stressful and doesn't make for a "fun" vacation. Educational -- yes. Relaxing -- no.

I like to keep the travel legs short. When I cover a large area it's with multiple short trips in a straightish line or logical progression, flying in at one end and out of the other. Adding large out of the way legs or backtracking wastes too much time. Plot your locations on a map, then you can decide the best way to approach it (or if some destinations are best saved for a different trip). In Spring I start south and work north, opposite in fall, summer I'd plan around festivals to attend (or avoid due to crowds). I'd suggest three days, at a bare minimum, for bigger cities, with shorter stays at smaller towns. Try to limit one-nighters, they tend to wear everyone out and consume too large a percentage of your time packing/unpacking and checking in/out. For three weeks, I would consider a leased car. The pluses, it's cheaper and more convenient for four. The down side, you have to drive/navigate and a car is useless in a big city (and often costly to park). If you include large doglegs, flying is going to be the best option most of the time.

We actually live near the center of a fairly large city and our children are not particularly outdoorsy. But I know for a fact that their memories of the Cotswolds was more positive than London - the Dordogne was more positive than Paris (though that was a close call) - Füssen was more positive than Munich - and Cesky Krumlov was more positive than Prague. Yes, they did enjoy each of those cities to some extent. I'm not at all suggesting they were miserable during those visits. They love good museums and all the iconic sights. But, especially through the eyes of a child, there is a lot of sameness to cities. When mixed with smaller town experiences, the identity of a city and the distinctive culture of an area stand out more. The activities that adults do to wind down and relax in cities - sitting at a cafe and people watching, going for long strolls through quaint neighborhoods, or having a nice lingering late-night dinner - don't rank high with children. On the other hand, you could tailor your visit to include every child-friendly stop a city has to offer, but that's not really the best trip for adults. We have found that getting out of the city cleanses the pallet so to speak and can be very satisfying and rewarding for both. I've never once met a family whose summer vacation was to visit New York City, Boston, Washington DC, Miami, Dallas, Chicago, and Denver with a little Phoenix and Los Angeles thrown in if they have the time. If a family in, say, France were planning their American trip of a lifetime, would an itinerary like that sound either pleasant or representative of America? Aside from the fact that European cities are closer together, how is it different in Europe?

I just want to say "Cheers" to all the parents/aunts/uncles out there who are bringing children to Europe!! It is not easy to find "family rooms", especially in Europe where hotel rooms can be small for 2 people, never mind 2 more who need to crawl on the ground with some Legos or miniature cars. We've now brought our children (at ages 9 and 11)on a trip to Germany/Paris and just this year to Barcelona/Seville. They have been terrific travelers. I've done LOTS of research beforehand considering what activities will best suit them-balance is key. There are museums where children have a great time (Rhine River castle in ruins)-others where they are told not to touch anything (and the tour focuses on tapestries and is conducted in German); the trampolines in the Tulieries are wonderful, but there was no way I was about to go to Disneyland Paris!! Hooray for all of us who find a way to travel, to keep things active, and balanced, and enjoyable!

My son especially likes smaller cities. He LOVED Krakow. We like to be on the move so one night stays are fine for us (we never.unpack just live out of a duffel bag). For us, we have no interest in staying in a house or staying I'm the countryside - we would go stir crazy! We are a small family but have traveled around together a lot and each trip we better understand the way we travel and how we want to do it in the future. Our most recent trip was hiking in Peru and while great our.next trip will be back to Europe and we'll be staying in smaller cities in Germany.

It definitely depends on the person as to whether or not the energy of a city is something that is pleasant or tiring for a child or an adult for that matter. While I am okay for a few days in a big city, I cannot wait to move myself to the countryside. Some people respond negatively to all the crowds, noise, chaos, and I can hardly think after a few days. I have taken 3 of my grandkids to Europe and found a mix works for us. Each of them have very fond memories of the times that were in the small towns. I just took my 10 year old grandson to Istanbul, then Athens and finally to Nafplio and we were both so ready to just chill out and enjoy the Greek culture in this small village. I took one of the grandsons to Germany and although he is very bright and would have understood Dachau & Aushwitz I would not have taken him. There was a horrible, unshakable feeling that overcame me and I could not shake it for days after my visit and I think there is plenty of time for that experience later.

Okay, I'll chime in on the kids in cities thing. It drives me nuts when people want to take their kids to Europe and only see the big cities. We just got back last night from 12 days in Germany. The last 2 were in Munich, the only big city on the trip. While it was fun, it was stressful to us. Our guys are a bit smaller, 9 and 5, and trying to keep the group together in a crowded big city and make sure that we all get on the same S-Bahn while also keeping our eyes out for anyone who was "casing" us (yes, we had moneybelts, but it still doesn't hurt to be on the lookout, and we did had a time when BOTH my husband and I felt we were in danger of being pick-pocketed) is not my idea of relaxing. Plus, in Munich, we were in one small hotel room together, so I got woken up every night to "He's taken all the covers!" "She's kicking me!" Do I regret going to Munich? Of course not. We had a blast, the kids loved the Deutches Museum and the Hofbrauhaus. Would I want to spend my whole vacation in big cities with my kids? Absolutely not. If Auschwitz is a must, I'd stick more on the Eastern side. You could visit Prague, do a day trip out of town, keep Berlin on the itinerary, and go to Saxon Switzerland in the middle. It's in Rick's book, although it only gets a page. You can park yourselves there for a few days, hike around, rent bikes, explore fortresses, take a day trip to Dresden.

I like Randy's suggestion of staying in hostels. Check hostelworld.com for prices and reviews. Sometimes you can get a better deal directly with the hostel when you make the reservations. It's easy to find a quad room with private bath. It will also give your kids an opportunity to chat with other kids (either families or young adults) staying there. And Brad's advice to limit hotel changes and one-night stands. You might consider going to Terezin outside of Prague instead of Auschwitz. It is a completely different, but very moving, experience. The entire walled city was turned into a camp. Here in Israel children under 10 aren't permitted entry to the holocaust museum. Over 10, good for you.