Europe Itinerary for 2 months - Help Appreciated!

In a total of eight weeks in Europe you have 7 internal flights. I think this is way too many, with your trip containing too many far flung elements.

By dropping Edinburgh and Croatia from this trip, and with a bit of re organisation, you could reduce the number of internal European flights to just two !!

Copenhagen (3 nights) 01, 02, 03 Sep
Train to..Amsterdam (3 nights) 04, 05, 06 Sep
Train to..Ghent, Belgium (3 nights) 07, 08, 09 Sep
Train to..Paris (3 nights) 10, 11, 12, 13 Sep
Train to..Bordeaux (2 nights) 14, 15 Sep
Train to..San Sebastion (Donostia), Spain (4 nights) 16, 17, 18, 19 Sep
Train/bus to..La rioja /Logrono, Spain (San Mateo Festival) (4 nights) 20, 21, 22, 23 Sep
Fly to Freiberg (pick up car and drive to..) Colmar, France (4 nights) 24, 25, 26, 27 Sep
Drive to..Gengenbach or [?Freiberg/Baden Baden instead] (Black Forest), Germany (3 nights) 28, 29, 30 Sep
Drive to.. (drop off car on arrival at Munich) Munich, Germany (Oktoberfest) (3 nights) 01, 02, 03 Oct
Train to..Vienna, Austria (3 nights) 04, 05, 06 Oct
Train to..Budapest, Hungary (3 nights) 07, 08, 09 Oct
Train to..Salzburg, Austria (3 nights) 10, 11, 12 Oct
Train to..Venice, Italy (3 nights) 13, 14, 15 Oct
Train to..Lake Garda Italy (3 nights) 16, 17, 18 Oct
Train (via Milan) to..Lucerne, Switzerland (4 nights) 19, 20, 21, 22 Oct
Fly from Zurich to..Reykjavik, Iceland (5 nights) 23, 24, 25, 26, 27 Oct

That's a lot to digest. Why don't you post the dates for each location in each particular forum and get small detailed bits of information on each particular location rather than one big overwhelming generalization.

BUDAPEST

Without knowing your interests it’s hard to make any recommendations. But in general:

October 10, if you arrive on an early train you will have ¾ a day in Pest. Pest takes two days to see so you will have to pick your interests carefully. No museum as they are closed on Monday. But you can do the Market and tour the Great Synagogue and the Jewish Quarter. Then up Andrassy ut to Hero's Square and maybe take in the bath house and city park. Do it today as the next day will be a mess on Andrassy ut.

October 11, Take the marathon for what it is and have fun with it. Starting in Buda you might miss the worst of it. I would spend the morning with maybe the Parliament tour and then head to Buda then the afternoon back in Pest. Then maybe the House of Terror if that interests you (you can sneak up the street parallel to Andrassy ut on the back side of the museum and miss the mess on Andrassy ut if the marathon is still going on.) http://visitbudapest.travel/budapest-events/budapest-marathon/# Maybe do the evening dinner river cruise to see the lights.

October 12, all of the non-stops to Brussels leave ridiculously early so no more Budapest. You came up about 1.5 days short of a good visit.

I think folks with more recent experience than mine in Budapest will say you should have more than 3 nights there.

I am not familiar with the San Mateo festival in Logrono, but are you sure you'll be interested enough in the festivities to want to spend so much time there? I gather from my own pre-trip reading that Logrono itself isn't terribly special, though I realize that La Roja is a very important wine area.

If this were my trip, I'd cut out some of the outlying destinations (such as Edinburgh, Copenhagen, and Iceland if not flying Icelandair) and fill in with some more geographically convenient spots.

For me it's more the stress factor with flying vs trains, not time or money. This is especially the case with the low cost carriers and their strict rules. With four flights in just 11 days at the end of your trip, I would find it a blur of checkin lines and security scans.

13 October Budapest Brussels
16 October Brussels Copenhagen
19 October Copenhagen Edinburgh
23 October Edinburgh Reykjavik

David did a great job re-working this itinerary. I am the same way - rather take a beating than fly! At first 8 weeks sounds like a lot of time and you tend to over extend but when you start getting to the nuts & bolts of it some things just do not make sense. I am currently planning 80 days myself so I know how easy it is to do that.

Train to..Vienna, Austria (3 nights) 04, 05, 06 Oct
Train to..Budapest, Hungary (3 nights) 07, 08, 09 Oct
Train to..Salzburg, Austria (3 nights) 10, 11, 12 Oct

Okay, the new schedule

Friday October 7 Train to Budapest. There is an 8:42 that gets in at 11:19 (unless you want to consider leaving the night before on the 6:26pm train which arrive in time to see the lights of Budapest). That’s worth it all by its self.

I would start with the Synagogue as it closes at 3:30 on Friday and is closed all day on Saturday.

Saturday October 8

Sunday October 9 is the start of the kürtőskalács festival. Okay, not the most thrilling thing in the world, but could be fun. Besides you have a +5 Hour train ride ahead. I doubt you want to arrive too late in Salzburg so your trip to Budapest is probably going to end about 1pm?

You are still a day short of a good trip, but each to their own. ld help to know where you are staying to work out a route.

Thanks everyone for your input. You have all given me something to think about that's for sure.

I know I do have a few far flung places but my problem is I have already seen a lot of central europe so want to explore other areas which just so happen to be further away. I have no interest in Paris or Amsterdam as I have been there before. I did look at going through southern france on route to Spain but this seems like a mammoth effort and it seems easier to fly. As far as going from Croatia - Italy or Italy - Spain, I did look at Ferry routes but the cost and time involved seems like it would again be easier, faster and cheaper to fly.

I am thinking of perhaps cutting Copenhagen and/or Ghent and adding those days to other places (eg Budapest for one). I understand that I am only spending 3 nights in some places but I am going with the assumption that I will return one day and want to get a good taste of Europe. Believe me I wish I could spend more time!! haha

Also I understand San Mateo is a relatively unknown festival, but that is kind of what appeals to me. Plus we are very interested in exploring la rioja wine region, so what better time than a festival? I am also thinking of adding a day or two to Croatia and adding in a couple of nights in Bilbao/pamplona (considering I am flying, it will not seem such an effort). I am slightly flexible with number of days but do not want to spend more than 60 days in Europe.

I didnt realise flying was such an issue in Europe?? Are they unreliable? I have had a rough look and it seems you can get some very reasonable flight prices for a fraction of the travel time it would take by using trains. I fly interstate on a regular basis in Australia on budget airlines and have never found them stressful. Is it different in Europe?

Sorry if this is a lot to take in!! Thanks again for the help.

I didnt realise flying was such an issue in Europe??

Its not a big issue, its more of a preference for many to take the train. I don't much care for long train rides and when the train time exceeds the flight time by 2.5 hours I fly. With exceptions like Heathrow and Chucky D, these aren't big hassle airports. You might of noticed we go to Budapest a lot, but not just Budapest. We spend a few days then leave the heavy luggage behind and take the overnight bag and take a flight someplace. Moscow, Riga, Belgrade, Istanbul, Jerusalem, Paris, Cologne, Minsk all nonstop, most under 2 hours and all under $250 round trip and a few under $100 round trip. Never had a problem. Well, okay, once returning from Varna on the Black Sea coast (WIZZ) but it was resolved.

Last year we flew into Dubrovnik, drove down the coast and around Kotor Bay (3 night trip) and then flew out of Podgorica to Belgrade, then a few days later Belgrade to Budapest. Those airports were more like big bus stations. The flights were $60 and took an hour. In about a month it's Kiev, Odessa and Budapest. Again, the tickets are under $100.

Simple. Replace the first two weeks with Edinburgh (at Festival time) and Croatia.
After the wine festival, where were you hoping to fly from, to reach Freiburg/Basel?

Edinburgh (4 nights) 01, 02, 03, 04 Sep
Fly from Edinburgh to..Split, Croatia (4 nights) 05, 06, 07, 08 Sep
Boat to..Hvar, Croatia (4 nights) 09, 10, 11, 12 Sep
Fly from Split to..Paris (1 night) 13 Sep
Train to..Biarritz (2 nights) 14, 15 Sep
Train to..San Sebastion (Donostia), Spain (4 nights) 16, 17, 18, 19 Sep
Train/bus to..La rioja /Logrono, Spain (San Mateo Festival) (4 nights) 20, 21, 22, 23 Sep
Train to Madrid (1 night) 24 Sep
Fly from Madrid to Basel (pick up car and drive to..) Colmar, France (3 nights) 25, 26, 27 Sep
Drive to..Gengenbach or [?Freiberg/Baden Baden instead] (Black Forest), Germany (3 nights) 28, 29, 30 Sep
Drive to.. (drop off car on arrival at Munich) Munich, Germany (Oktoberfest) (3 nights) 01, 02, 03 Oct
Train to..Vienna, Austria (3 nights) 04, 05, 06 Oct
Train to..Budapest, Hungary (3 nights) 07, 08, 09 Oct
Train to..Salzburg, Austria (3 nights) 10, 11, 12 Oct
Train to..Venice, Italy (3 nights) 13, 14, 15 Oct
Train to..Lake Garda Italy (3 nights) 16, 17, 18 Oct
Train (via Milan) to..Lucerne, Switzerland (4 nights) 19, 20, 21, 22 Oct
Fly from Zurich to..Reykjavik, Iceland (5 nights) 23, 24, 25, 26, 27 Oct