Another "have you changed" question---fork in left hand

I mastered this techinque when I was about 2 years old, must have been my European heritage coming through, but it doesn't explain why I write with my right hand!

I tried it for a while but I kept sticking myself in the face.

I think peas are tough no matter how you eat them. You should try them with chopsticks! I wonder if this is why the Brits like their "mushy peas." I also have a lot of trouble with risotto with the left-hand fork.

According to Wikipedia, the American or "zig-zag" style (change fork to right hand after cutting a bite of food) was the original style of eating, brought to North America with the British colonialists. Subsequently a more efficient eating style, keeping the fork, tines down, in the left hand, was adopted on the continent and spread to the UK, but has never taken hold in the Americas.

Sasha,
How funny, as this made me think. We used the left-hand method (when we remembered) maybe half the time on our first trip to Europe. Then, on subsequent trips we completely forgot about it (not on purpose....just really forgot). You won't stand out one way or the other, even in the nicest restaurants, if you are using polite American-style manners and are generally adaptable. What was your experience?

It was an easy decision for me, as I'm left-handed. A long time ago, I decided it was much easier to use a fork with my left hand, and cut with the knife in my right hand.

I'm also lefthanded - never needed to change anything.

Well I grew up using my fork in my left hand and knife in my right hand, so no change for me. And I agree, peas are hard no matter the methodology or technique. ; ) Pam

Yes I use my left hand for the fork (when eating with a knife) but I also lived in Europe and not just travelled for a few weeks at a time. I've kept other customs too.

"I think peas are tough no matter how you eat them." There is an old nursery rhyme: "I eat my peas with honey. I've done it all my life. They may taste kind of funny,
but it keeps them on my knife.

So why don't you right-handed people just keep the knife in your left hand? I don't get it.

Even in this country we cut with the knife in the right hand. We're right handed, remember. The European have the knife in the right hand, the fork in the left, the entire meal. To them, the American practice of constantly moving the fork, picking up the knife, cutting two pieces (my American MIL felt that cutting more than one piece at a time with the knife was bad manners), and putting the knife back down is distracting and impolite. Further, if you do put down the knife and fork, leave your hands on the table. Putting them in your lap is very bad manners! When I am in Europe, I always try to abide by their table manners.

Lee, just out of curiousity, do you expect Europeans to abide by American manners when they eat in the US? Honestly, just eat the way you were taught people. No other nationality obsesses over the "way" to eat like we Americans do.

I continue to eat my normal way with the fork in the right hand. If I switched it to the left hand, I would be awkward and dropping food, which would look less polite than constantly switching! Anyway, if anyone is really offended by what hand people hold their fork with while eating, they probably need something else to worry about.

Leigh, I agree completely. I really don't understand why some of us Americans feel we have to adjust the way we eat when we go to Europe. I have plenty of European friends who still eat the "European" way after being here for quite some time. A German friend of mine told me that we Americans get in knots over the silliest things. I agree.

I'm right handed, but I've eaten both ways my whole life. I etnd to eat the European way, but I blame that on living here for 5 years. I think the adaptation to eating Pizza with a fork and knife and french fries with a fork was far more diffficult. Although, once I started doing it, I've never quit unless I'm at the embassy where hands are the norm. It's nice not to end up with grease all over your hands while dining out.

I don't really care one way or the other, but I am a little puzzled by this; Using a knife and fork at the same time is never really required beyond the initial cutting of the meat. The idea that it is somehow poor manners to cut all your meat at once is absurd. In any case, at least 2/3rds of any meal does not require a knife at all. So do Europeans continue to use their left hand when, say, eating pasta - using their non-dominant hand for no good reason? If they switch for non-knife food, is that not just as "distracting" (as in not really distracting at all unless you have too little in life to worry about) as Americans swapping hands a half-dozen times during a meal? People are weird.

I first tried eating in the European style while there just to see if I could do it, not because I was worried about fitting in. Once I got the hang of it I found that it's just more practical in some instances. If a lot of cutting is involved, I still eat that way, if not, I keep my fork in my right hand. Apparently, some Europeans are bothered by the American method. In this clip, John Cleese discusses the inspiration for the character of Basil Fawlty. But no, I wouldn't worry too much what someone like that thinks. You have to skip to about 5:40 to see the beginning of the pertinent part.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjwUjWgyfPM

"No other nationality obsessed over the "way" to eat like we Americans do". Pretty bold statement. I take it you haven't been to Japan, although I would not label the Japanese interest in dining etiquette as an obsession, just an interest in tradition and good manners. The French, now there is an obsession when comes to food and eating. And they are very proud of it. But I didn't mean to start an argument. I was just curious how many people find it more convenient to keep the fork in the left hand. I do, but I am not a representative sample, as my right hand is more comfortable with chopsticks than with a fork.

I grew up eating with my fork in my left hand,, and yes, i do find watching fork passers interesting,, it looks like an awkard amount of passing forks and knives back and forth,, my kids learned to eat from my husband and I and since we both eat with fork in left hand the kids do too. I imagine what ever you grew up doing seems most comfortable to most people, a good example was chopsticks,, in asian countries i bet kids do it with ease by preschool, and here most of still fumble about.. One thing i do find rather unpleasant to watch,, is when one sees someone holding their knife in a fist and sawing away,, reminnds me of a caveman axe murdering something .. lol

As a lefty, holding my fork in left and knife in right throughout the entire meal just came naturally as soon as I was handed utensils by my mom. If it doesn't come naturally, I really don't see the point to change just to blend in with the locals in Europe. If eating long strands of pasta, then I substitute the knife for a spoon as it just makes it easier to neatly twirl pasta around the fork without having it dribbling down your chin. The only time I'd be concerned about "blending in" while eating overseas would be in countries where the norm is to use your hands to scoop up food and eat as in certain countries you'd want to make sure you are using the correct hand to pick up food as it's considered gross to use the hand most people wipe their arse with. As for cutting all the meat into bite sized morsels all at once, I don't think it's rude, but the end result on the plate looks a lot like what you see on a 3 year olds plate, or at a nursing home where the dexterity to handle a fork and knife is just not there. Also, if meat is fresh off the grill it technically is still cooking internally for a few minutes to reach the optimum level of doneness after being removed from the heat, so immediately cutting it all into little pieces is just ensuring your dinner may not be fully cooked to your liking.

Supposedly, there were American spies in Nazi Germany, who, while they spoke German without an accent, were identified and executed because of their American-style utensil handling. Could be a myth, but who knows.

I grew up here using the zig-zag American way with the fork and knife. I am right handed. Before I went to Germany and Europe, I had learned of the German way in class using the left hand fork and the knife with the right hand. When I was there for the first time in 1971, I paid attention to how they did it and their table manners. I use the German way both over there and here too throughout the whole meal...no problems.

Our family all use the Continental European way of holding fork in one hand, knife in the other. If you are left handed, you would of course switch. One uses the knife not just for cutting, but also for helping to get the appropriate amount of food onto the fork, adding a bit of sauce, etc. It is considered impolite to use your thumb to shove food onto your fork, rather than using a knife. I first learned how to do this when I decided to move to Germany. It did feel awkward at first, but it didn't take long til I was comfortable with it. Today, when we go back to Ohio for a visit, it does look odd, when people pick up their utensils, cut a bite, put the knife down, switch the fork, eat the bite, then do the whole thing over again. Seems like a lot of switching untensils from hand to hand during the course of the meal. With fries, it depends on what else I am eating, if it is a schnitzel with gravy, I want to use a fork, if it is just fries, then fingers. Pizza is usually knife and fork, but ribs and burgers are with the hand.

Check out a number of the restaurants in America and watch the trends... I am surprised no one has mentioned this, but in a number of areas European style eating has become as much a status symbol as a designer purse.... check out the local Denny's and see how many people are eating European, then go to any number of posh restaurants in Greenwich or LaJolla (no offense to anyone) and see how many people are eating European style (and no, most are not Europeans...as a matter of fact I have watched a few friends switch after a trip or two) I have stayed with the American way of eating when I am home as I still remember being taught that it was rude to look like you were attacking your food and shoveling it in because you could not take the time to do all the switching of silverware.... it is really foolish, but maybe it makes us eat slower???

I've been living here for 8 years now and really don't bother to hold my silverware like a European. I learned to eat when I was a kid in America and it comes natural that way. I learned German, instead. I think that was more than enough work. :-) My daughters basically grew up here. One of them eats naturally as an American and one of them eats naturally as a European. Interesting. (As any parent will agree, it is interesting how 2 kids raised the same way can be so different.) European vs American table manners is a fun conversation topic, but, really, who cares? To each his own... unless, as someone noted above, you are a spy on the run. But for the record, because I'm a known history geek, I always use the line that the American style has pre-revolutionary roots and is older. Also mentioned above.

the Continental European way of holding... European, not necessarily Continental. Its the British way, too.

If I am using the knife and fork at the same time, I will usually keep the fork in my left hand until I put it down. Then I'll probably pick it up with my right hand (I am "very" right-handed) and then switch if I need to pick up the knife. In Thailand, they use forks and spoons (instead of chopsticks). They eat with the spoon and use the fork to push the food onto the spoon. Then they will use both to separate a larger piece of food (fairly rare in Thai cooking) into edible bites. Once I got used to it, turned out to be a very efficient way to eat.

I'm much more likely to eat "correctly" in Europe - because I pay attention. At home, unless I'm "dining", I switch pretty easily to whatever gets the food to mouth is okay. :)

To Lola and Lee: Do you expect people to eat the American way while in the US? Just curious here. I don't. If they want to use chopsticks, spoons and forks but no knives, etc. then fine by me. I stand by what I said. We Americans worry too much what others think of our way of doing things. From my experience, Europeans don't have these hang ups.

Using decent table manners is probably a good idea no matter where you are, but I've never, ever paid any attention whatsoever to either my own use of flatware or anyone else's anywhere I've been. It's surprising that so many here have actually thought through this and have evidently made some attempt when traveling in Europe to change their normal use of said fork, knife, spoon, salad fork, soup spoon, desert fork, etc. Seriously, who cares? The only time I'll ever notice a manners breach of etiquette as it relates to flatware is when a diner's utensil hits the floor and is retrieved– bad form – the rule is to leave it. I guess the common advice given here on the RS forum to not worry about how you look (since you are a tourist) doesn't apply to use of flatware (since proper eating technique apparently suggests one's level of cultural awareness)? I just had great Ethiopian a couple of weeks back, and they use no utensils at all. Would that give you fits, or could you handle it? How about traveling in a Muslim country – would you use TP or would you pay close attention to local customs, traditions, religious rules, and culture and use your hand so that you can live like a local? I know this sounds ridiculous, but all of the cultural elitism here is funny (and weird IMO). Can't you just eat like you always do and not worry about it? Seriously, none of the locals are paying any attention to how you're using your utensils.

I don't care what you do with your hands JUST TAKE YOUR HATS OFF , the ladies may leave theirs on.

Never a change for me, I'm left handed and it's the way I roll.

None of the above. My dad uses the standard American method of zig zagging. My mom used the European method. So just to be different as a kid I taught myself to cut my steak with my left hand. So I keep the fork in my right hand and when I need a knife I use my left. I do this at home and abroad. If anyone is offended by this too freakin bad for them.

It starts to come naturally after awhile if you are not given a spoon (you'll often only get a spoon if soup is served). Some of the food that you would scoop with a spoon in the US is harder to manipulate with a fork alone, so you end up using the knife to help portion the food on the fork. It's not just about cutting the food. I didn't make a conscious effort to adapt to this style, I just naturally picked it up eating at my in-laws house all the time. No spoon provided, so you either fumble with the food or adapt. Do whatever floats your boat, I couldn't care less and I bet neither could about 99% or so of the people who live on this side of the Atlantic.

Sasha, fun thread! Terry Kathryn, said "I have stayed with the American way of eating when I am home as I still remember being taught that it was rude to look like you were attacking your food and shoveling it in because you could not take the time to do all the switching of silverware." I was taught the same thing. While dining in Europe, I do eat American-style about half the time, and European-style (fork in left hand the whole time) when I am eating some type of meat that needs cutting constantly. Same after I come home. I love eating with chopsticks and I am right-handed when I do this. Michael, I also recently had an Ethiopian meal in Washington, D.C. (Adams-Morgan neighborhood), and you are right; no utensils are used. We were served a large sampler platter of different dishes that was set down in the center of the table. Each person had a plate of spongy naan-type flatbread. You are supposed to pinch off a piece of the naan and use it to scoop up a bite off of the large platter. We were also served a jerk style chicken, and a boiled egg, which were eaten using your hands. All delicious.

Don't change utensil habits but we have removed face clothes from our bathroom after numerous trips to Europe. Also added an adjustable mirror to wall after enjoying it's use in Spain. No bidet as yet!!!

Bob, just curious, why would you quit using face cloths, did you switch to something else?

Barry , i was raised without facecloths too,, when we were very small children my mother had mitt type facecloths she used to wash up with,, but gradually they disapeared,, I still forget to put out wash cloths for guests sometimes. I do use a loofa for feet if you are wondering,, i just haven't found I get dirty enough that I need to rub off dirt with a cloth,, soap and water seem to work well without one.I mean do you use a washcloth when washing your hands,, and they are probably our dirtiest part!

Being raised in a home that didn't use them versus going to Europe and because of that stop using them is two different things. We could get into how the washcloth or luffa removes dead skin better but I think that would be digressing. Funny how the topic morphed from using untensils to using washcloths.

OK Barry, guess I should clarify, my mother was born and raised Canadian,, but eventually married a Frenchman and lived in France for a couple of years,, so SHE definately changed,, in that she then raised us without facecloths, something she had grown up using herself here.

We found that after going for many weeks without faceclothes just how unnecessary they are to us. Some people like everything on their trip to be the same as at home, we like to bring new ideas and customs home with us. Some changes in our daily 'rituals' are good for us.

When in Europe, I eat like the Europeans. When in America, I eat like Americans. When home alone, I don't pay attention. But I have brought other European customs home: 1) I got rid of my shower curtain and drilled a hole in the floor. Unfortunately, I didn't actually put a drain in so I tend to flood the bathroom. 2)I now greet the employees of every store I enter and ask if they speak English. I get very strange looks at Target. 3) I enjoy drinking wine with lunch and dinner. This has, sadly, gotten me banned from five McDonalds as they don't allow alcohol in their establishments. 4) When ordering coffee at a coffee house, I now stand up to drink it rather than sit at a table. This has really irked the employees of my local Starbucks as they say I'm blocking other customers from getting their coffee. They suggest I take a seat. I let them know that I'm aware that prices increase if I sit down and refuse. They, too, give me strange looks. 5) I occasionally drive on the left. Oh, that reminds me, I have traffic school this weekend. 6) Ive put bunk beds in my bedroom, in addition to my own bed, to get that "hostel" feel. My girlfriend just looked at me and shook her head when she moved out. 7) I've begun to shop separately for meat, cheese, bread, etc. Sadly, there are no specialty stores near me so I just go in and out of the supermarket numerous times. Food shopping now takes about four hours. 8) I pick my own pocket.

Frank II that was great. May I suggest you also start giving 50 cents to anyone standing by public restroom doors.

Frank II: Don't forget the habit in Europe of freeing yourself from any worries about dental hygiene. Lose the brush, the toothpaste & the floss. Aaaaah the freedom - sorry for the unpleasant odor!

Great suggestions Frank II! I was a little irritated when I woke up to some graffiti on my back fence yesterday. Instead of feeling like I'm on the new frontier of a gang turf war, I'm going to pretend I'm in a Roman Piazza complete with loud motorcycles and emergency vehicle sirens (albiet not the cool ones) at all hours of the day. I'm going to try and string the family drawers out to dry between me and the neighbors windows. I'll let you know how that one works out.

Ed..."public restroom?" 9) Put plate in guest bathroom with sign saying "50 cents." I have to make rent somehow. Plus more: 10) Carry my Rick Steves guidebook everywhere hoping someone will give me a discount. 11) Stand in front of Gap Stores and stare. When asked what I'm doing, I say I was told to "mind the gap."

I have always eaten with the fork in my left hand unless I'm not using a knife at all. The whole switching back and forth thing makes no sense to me.

Lee at Denver : What is the reason for the people in Europe not putting their hands below the dinner table when they are eating food ? In the year 1964, my older brother said the reason European people were required to have their hands above the table (not below the table) was to insure that two people seated at the dinner table would not hold hands with each other, under the table. I like to hold the fork in my left hand. I started doing that before I was aware that European people hold the fork in their left hand. But I grew up as a "Right Handed" person. I think the reason I held things in my right hand was because, when I was a very young child, when my mother saw me hold any item in my left hand, she grabbed the item out of my left hand, and put it in my right hand. She trained me to be a "right handed" person. She wished for me to not be a "Left handed" person, because she wished for me to not be odd. When I play the game "Table Tennis" (Ping Pong), I hold the paddle in my right hand for a half hour, and I hold that paddle in my left hand for an other half hour. I think that is good for my brain. And, I heard a neurologist say playing "Table Tennis" (Ping Pong) is good for the human brain.

Frank II at 1Bag1World : I read your eleven European customs. Ha Ha Ha, Ho Ho Ho, Hee Hee Hee. I appreciate your sense of humor. And I appreciate the additions from ed and Bob, and from Leslie !

Isn't that the normal way of eating? Keeping the fork in one hand and the knife in the other without having to switch. The question I always like is how come people don't eat with a fork in both hands? Edwin

I do eat the "European" way when in Europe, although certainly not as skillfully as the natives, and now there are many times that I eat that way now. It's just so much easier when there is a need for a lot of cutting.