23 days in Europe...suggestions please!

Well, you have only about 3 weeks plus 2 days. You land in France and have to leave from France, so consider your transport costs to go to Italy, Germany and the Netherlands as well as through France. You are planning on 4 countries in 3 weeks. Perhaps pick out the cities you want to go to in these countries to see if it is feasible to go to all of them in your time frame and with your budget.

Michele,

You've only got about a month and a half to work out the details, so you'll have to get these sorted fairly soon.

To begin with try to find a copy of Europe Through The Back Door at a local Library or Book Store. That will provide LOTS of information to help you work out things like Itinerary Planning. Be sure to carefully read the section on "Rail Skills". You may also want to download the free PDF Rail Guide from this website (click the "Railpass" tab at the top).

Using open-jaw tickets would have been preferable, but if your air tickets have already been purchased, you'll have to work with that.

Which sights do you & your friend most want to see? If you both make a list, you'll be able to narrow down sights that you both want fairly quickly. If you could provide a list it would be easier to make Itinerary suggestions. What are your interests (history, art, museums, or ?).

For such a short trip, I'd suggest keeping locations fairly close geographically. That way you can minimize travel times.

For the most important cities (Paris, Rome), it's a good idea to allocate at least 4-5 days each for those, as there's so much to see and do.

One thing to keep in mind is that you'll lose the first day in flight times, and with jet lag you won't be up to "touring speed" for a day or two. On the trip home, usually you'll arrive on the day you left.

Hostels are a good idea, but it would probably be a good idea to pre-book your accommodations. Although Sept. is technically the "fall shoulder season", I've found in the past that lots of people are travelling and it may be hard to find lodgings. Pre-booking allows a choice not only in the part of town you want to stay but also the price range.

You may want to have a look at the Italy or France Guidebooks, as there's an enormous amount of information there (I usually pack along the Guidebooks for the areas I'll be visiting).

Good luck with your planning!

thanks for the replies and suggestions! I do have the book by Rick for Italy and a general europe one.

Here is what we are thinking as far as traveling....does this itinerary seem feasible?? Paris (2 days), Brussles (2 days), Amsterdam (2 days), Prauge (2 days), Venice (3 days), Rome (4 days), Cinque Terre (3 days), Monaco (2 day), Paris (2 days)

is this really reasonable for the amount of time we have?

out of these cities, what does everyone recommend as far as "must see"?

My friend and I really dont know where to go....this trip is a graduation present to ourselves (just received our Masters Degrees). ...so really, anything will be great for us! but we do want to focus on Italy!

thanks for the help!!

Hi, Michele.

Prague seems really out of the way on that itinerary. You'll spend the better part of two days getting there, and the getting to Venice, even if you fly. Just and idea, you might want to cut it out.

The night train from Venice to Rome is great btw! :) Leaves Venice at 11:30, and gets into Rome Tiburtina around 7-8AM. :) Comfortable sleeper bunks are really inexpensive. (We paid $75 each in high summer. It's a bit more for a room for just 2.)

I think I would drop Monaco unless you want to go in the casinos. It might be one of your more expensive places too.

Michelle,

IMHO you'll need to revise your Itinerary further, as I don't believe there's adequate allowance for travel days (some of which will be LONG with the cities you've listed).

In order to provide some "leeway", I'd suggest dropping Brussels and Prague this time (as Rick says "assume you will return").

You might consider something along these lines:

Day 1: Flight to Paris

Day 2: Arrive Paris / CDG (The RER is one of the easiest methods to get into Paris, but you could use the Air France/Roissy Bus or a Shuttle)

Days 3-5: Tour Paris (Museum Pass would be a good idea)

Day 6: Train to Amsterdam (arrive mid-afternoon)

Day 7, 8: Tour Amsterdam

Day 9: At this point, I'd suggest a budget flight (given the time & distances). EasyJet flies AMS to FCO (but you'll have to book soon - be sure to read their terms & conditions carefully & PACK LIGHT).

Days 9-12: Tour Rome (LOTS to see)

Day 13: Train to Venice (use ES Italia to save time - note that you'll be going to Venezia Santa Lucia station, not Mestre).

Days 13-15: Tour Venice

Day 16: Train to Cinque Terre (shortest time is ~5H:36M, with 1 change at Firenze SMN, reservations compulsory)

Days 17,18: Tour C.T., hike trails, enjoy!

Day 19: Train to Nice (Shortest time ~5H:04M with 1 change in Genova, reservations compulsory). I'd suggest Nice as it has a greater range of lodgings and it's easy to take a day trip from there to Monaco & Monte Carlo - the Bus fare is only €1).

Days 19-21: Tour Nice, Monaco, etc. (there's a dress code in the Casino)

Day 22: Train to Paris (~5H:34M direct via TGV, reservations compulsory. Depending on which train you choose, you should arrive about 16:00)

Day 23: To CDG and flight home

Of course there are many ways this could be arranged; this Itinerary is just one suggestion.

Happy travels!

Michele,

You also asked about "must sees". That's somewhat difficult to answer, as everyone's interests are different. What are you interested in seeing? What's your "tolerance" for Museums or Art Galleries? Are you planning to visit Bars or Clubs?

I'd suggest having a look at a few of Rick's Guidebooks (France & Italy) as there are LOTS of suggestions there for sightseeing in each country. Info is also provided on admission costs, opening & closing times, etc. I'd pack a copy of each book along, as they're excellent reference sources while travelling. You can order from this website or you should be able to find them at larger bookstores.

A few sights you might consider:

PARIS:

• Eiffel Tower (probably a long queue, but this is usually a "must see" for most people. Extra cost to go to the top)

• The Louvre (don't plan on touring all 3 wings, you WON'T have time. You might focus on the Denon wing, where Mona Lisa is located. Be vigilant for pickpockets!)

• Musee d'Orsay (fantastic collection of Impressionist Art in an elegant old train station)

VENICE:

• Doge's Palace (be sure to walk across the Bridge of Sighs)

• Piazza san Marco

• Duomo

ROME:

• Colosseum (be sure to read the tips for avoiding queues. I'd recommend the "official" tour inside, as it's very informative and not expensive).

• Capitoline Museums (if you're interested)

• Pantheon

• Lots of other suggestions in the book!

CINQUE TERRE:

• Hike the trails (Park Pass is required - buy at train station)

• Relax & enjoy, swim (depending on which village you choose to stay in)

NICE:

• Aside from Monaco, tour Villefranche, Eze or Museums in Nice.

After reading the Guidebooks, if you have questions about specific sights, post another note and I'm sure the group here will be able to provide answers.

Cheers!

Hi Michele,
If you are still in the planning stage I would suggest:

Paris 3 days to get in and get over jetlag etc.

Bruge 2 days

Brussels 2 days

Amsterdam 2 days

Rome 4 days

Florence 2 days

Venice 3 days

CT 3 days

Paris 1 day - just to fly out.

Lots of options - have a great trip.

A few years ago I traveled around Ireland with my wife and teenage son and we stayed at hostels and they were great so you should look forward to them. We were there in June when schools and colleges were still in session and mostly the people in them tended to be our age or older so you may find that they are a bit different than what you might have imagined as a semi-hippie “youth hostel”. Most of the ones that we stayed at had private rooms that we were able to get. We normally would call in the morning for reservations at the next hostel for that night and we never had any problems getting reservations.

The hostels will vary in quality greatly, checking out reviews on the internet and asking other people at the hostels is very important but just like hotels even a great place will have an occasional bad review.

You will likely find that the hostels outside the urban areas are the best ones. The urban ones occasionally can have a younger “party” crowd that will be a bit louder and where drug use and the related petty theft would be a concern so pick the urban ones very carefully.

With two people you may find that you can find a hotel room for about the same price as a hostel, but a huge advantage of hostels is they have kitchens where you can cook your diner to save money.

Greg

My friend and I are also spending the month of September overseas, I have been researching for about 6 months. B&Bs/small hotels are cheaper than most hostels, for some reason hostel prices have really gone up. Hostel advantagesa are you get to meet a lot of people like yourself( but you may tend to hang with Americans), they generally have planned activities, usually a kitchen is available for your food. You have to check about breakfast; some hostels have stopped providing them, but more and more hotels/pensions are serving breakfast. Wifi is usually free in the cheaper accomodaations. Apartments are seeming like a good deal in the big cities (I like Craigs list) but you won't have the chance to meet other travelers. Some people don't like it, but we have 4 overnights when we are traveling by train/bus, saving room prices and not wasting travel time. I put together a May trip for my dauaghter and her fiance based on these ideas and it went well. I have been overseas several times but this time it is amazing how everything is available on the internet....haven't made one phone call. Oh, don't buy rail tickets here unless you can pick up a special price for a special trip...we got the overnight party train, includes breakfast and drinks, from Paris to Nice for $30 each, 2 months in advance. Other train tickets we will get at the station a couple days in advance. Don't use eurorail. Trenitalia can give you timetables. Google the country and trains to get the local sites, put in GB as your home base so you don't get transferred to the Eurorail site. I have never had passes come up cheaper but I have heard some people like the easiness. You still have to pay for reservations. Also if you have a budget, check out the buses. Some are about the same time and much cheaper. We are taking an overnight bus from Amsterdam to Paris. And will probably use buses in Spain unless we rent a car. Have fun.

Hi Michele, you pretty much are doing the same trip my husband and I did last year. We were there in September for 25 days and started in Amsterdam and flew out of Belgium. It is a little crazy, but totally fun and we saw a lot along the way. Our trip for the most part was: Amsterdam-Paris, France-Bern,Switzerland-Interlocken, Switzerland-Nice, France-Monaco-Pisa, Italy-Rome, Italy-Florence, Italy-Tuscany ( San Gimigimano, Sienna ) to Amalfi, Italy-Venice ( by night train )to Salzburg, Austria-Halstatt, Austria-Munich, Germany ( stayed for 3 days to celebrate Oktoberfest ) then to the Black Forrest to Triberg and Freiberg, back to Paris and then to Brugge and Brussels, Belgium. In a nut shell-we saw a lot! We used hostelbookers.com and travelocity along the way. We didn't really have a plan and stayed in inexpensive bed and breakfasts and hotels the whole way. Let me know if you have specific place that I can help you with! Best of luck. By the way-we are going back again this year for September again!