2-Month Europe Itinerary Help

Hi Val- All in all, this looks like a good trip to me! You have 3+ nights in most places, so it's not quite the breakneck speed I've seen (and done). My main suggestion is that I would for sure add a night or two in Venice. It's wonderfully atmospheric, especially at night, and you could easily trim time away from other places. (My suggestions would be Ljubljana, Zagreb, or Split because they're small and won't "need" a lot of time, or Vienna because we found we saw it quickly and it really wasn't our cup of tea). I have friends who were in Bratislava at Christmas and said it was way more fun than they expected, FYI. I would also consider cutting one night from Zagreb or Zadar and just stay overnight in Plitvice since it's between the two cities.

Thanks for the feedback Christine! I might remove a night from Split to put into Venice. I'm a bit on the fence about Vienna, it seems like people either love it or dislike it. I had originally dedicated 4 nights to it like Prague and Budapest but lowered it to 3.
I'll look more into staying a night in Plitvice but from what I have seen it's pretty expensive (the park entrance ticket is already not cheap). I'm trying to keep a lower budget, sticking to mostly hostel dorms (with a few private rooms to give myself a break).

A few things:
- Why take a bus from Brussels to Amsterdam? Train is far more comfortable and reliable. Bus on that route is for people who must travel at the lowest cost at the expense of everything else, even personal safety.
- Budapest to Bratislava is certainly going to take more than 1h, and the train on that route is cheap. Just buy in Budapest.
- The night train to Split from Bratislava will not be running this summer AFAIK.

This seems like a good itinerary! Sure it's busy, but it seems doable given the number of nights at each destination and the order makes sense.

Regarding your comment on whether to go to Vienna or not, that really depends on your interests. If you're into art and architecture, you should definitely visit.

Also I agree with WengenK that taking the train from Amsterdam to Brussels is much better than taking the bus. There are direct trains going from Amsterdam Central Station to Brussels in a little less than three hours. Tickets for this so-called IC-Brussel can be bought online via NS International or B-Europe.

Thanks for the feeback Wengen and Thomas!
''Why take a bus from Brussels to Amsterdam?'' The bus is a lot cheaper and the train from London to Brussels is already super expensive. I'm trying to keep a lower budget and I've found that if I keep telling myself a little 20-40$ extra here and there for comfort isn't so bad, it really starts adding up in the end.
''The night train to Split from Bratislava will not be running this summer AFAIK.'' Oh no, Really? I'll look around to be sure because it is showing up as 3 trains/week when I look at the summer and I'm even able to buy a ticket for the date I was considering.

As for Vienna, I do appreciate nice architecture (although I've never been super into art). There's just something about the city that feels a bit ''off'', I'm not sure how explain it. Almost like it's too sterile and proper and not enough lived-in gritty soul compared to some of the other cities. I'm totally just basing that opinion off of pictures so I might be completely wrong! haha

''Why take a bus from Brussels to Amsterdam?'' The bus is a lot
cheaper and the train from London to Brussels is already super
expensive.

How much is a lot? In the end it is your trip and you should travel the way you prefer, but you can get a ticket from Brussels to Amsterdam for €25 if you buy it in advance.

I'm also a bit sceptical about the one night in Bratislava. It might be easier to do Bratislava as a day trip from Vienna.

''The night train to Split from Bratislava will not be running this
summer AFAIK.'' Oh no, Really? I'll look around to be sure because it
is showing up as 3 trains/week when I look at the summer and I'm even
able to buy a ticket for the date I was considering.

As far as I can see it is still planned to run 3 trains per week as you mention.

The night train to Split- I saw about the cancellation as well over the weekend on the community page of Doc7austin- a you tube rail guru who I follow.
He's pretty good, so I would be surprised if he was wrong. Seems to have only just happened.
Worth double and treble checking.

''How much is a lot? In the end it is your trip and you should travel the way you prefer, but you can get a ticket from Brussels to Amsterdam for €25 if you buy it in advance.''

13$CAD for bus or 40$CAD for Train, so more then double. Still not a terrible price, but I'm already spending a lot of transport so I thought I'd chose the lower cost options occasionally when the duration is similar.

''I'm also a bit sceptical about the one night in Bratislava. It might be easier to do Bratislava as a day trip from Vienna.''
A day trip would probably be fine but I'm mostly going there for that night train to Split (if it still exists). I guess I could just get to Bratislava from Budapest and take the night train that same day without spending the night. Or do Budapest before Vienna so I can go back there to take the night train.

Thanks isn31c, I'll keep an eye on it to be sure! It would really mess up my plans if that's the case. I could always fly but the only direct flight I could find (from Vienna) without crazy layover is almost more expensive than the flight I'm taking from Canada to Europe haha. Or I guess I could do Budapest-Zagreb and probably forget about Split since it's quite a detour from Ljubljana for only a couple days.

I think your pace is reasonable, and I understand doing things as cheaply as possible. I just have a few location-specific comments:

• Wroclaw: I liked the city and spent 3 nights there myself without running out of things to do. I took several walking tours. However, if you need an extra night somewhere else, I think you could probably manage with just 2 nights in Wroclaw, nice though it is.

• I also wonder about Cesky Krumlov. I haven't been there yet and will certainly stay at least two nights, but my goal is always to walk every single street of a town like that--more than most folks are interested in doing. I wonder whether you could get by with just one night--again, assuming you were short somewhere else.

• I can't comment on Vienna since I haven't been there for over 30 years, and I've never been to Bratislava.

• You wouldn't be sorry to have an extra night (or more) in Budapest, I don't think. The city's a lot of fun.

• Zadar has an attractive historic center and doesn't get many North American tourists. Major points for that. But 2 nights might be enough.

• IMPORTANT: Please, please don't treat Plitvice as a day trip. I've been there three times, most recently in 2015 on a day trip from Zagreb. That last trip was massively less enjoyable than my earlier trips (prior to the split-up of Yurgoslavia, back when tourism in the area was much lighter than it is today). Day-tripping hours were a nightmare. I stood in the ticket line for an hour (from 10 AM to 11 AM). The over-water walkways were absolutely packed with people. I thought at the time that if one person stumbled, there'd be a bunch of people falling into the (shallow) lake; there are virtually no guardrails. The park is gorgeous, but imagine a beauty spot with crowds like the sidewalks in Manhattan. You really, really need to spend a night near the park so you can see it late in the afternoon and/or early the next morning. Check booking.com; you may find lodging outside the park, but nearby, that offers a shuttle service to the park. You'd need to confirm the accuracy of that by email, of course. PLEASE do this, even if it means you have to eat supermarket food for a week. I Googled crowds at Plitvice and got these photos: crowds at Plitvice. It was worse the day I was there.

• I believe there are buses from Zadar to Plitvice, so you can take a bus to the park from Zadar, spend a night there, and then take a bus on to Zagreb. You'll save a bit of money by avoiding the fare for a separate day trip from Zagreb. Side comment: Buses in Croatia usually have a fee (equivalent to about $1 in 2015) for each piece of luggage stowed in the hold.

• If you're spending a couple of nights at Bled, you might get by with only 3 nights in Ljubljana. I like the city a lot, and I'm not suggesting you will be anxious to leave, but you're very short on time in Venice, and on a trip like this, you could run into a transportation issue that causes you to lose a day or two here or there.

• Venice is fabulous, and I always hate to see folks give it just 2 nights, because it means they're likely to spend nearly all their time in the tourist zone between the train station, the Rialto Bridge/Market and Piazza San Marco. If you do that, you miss much of the magic of Venice. If you have trouble finding cheap lodging in Venice (quite likely), consider staying in Venice-Mestre in a place near the train station. You will be advised to stay in Venice proper, but I contend that 3 or 4 nights in Mestre would be better than 2 nights in Venice itself. Trains from Venice-Mestre to Venice are extremely frequent, fast (10 or 11 minutes) and cheap (from 1.45 euros each way). It's like staying in an (admittedly charmless) suburb and commuting in.

The night train to Split- I saw about the cancellation as well over
the weekend on the community page of Doc7austin- a you tube rail guru
who I follow. He's pretty good, so I would be surprised if he was
wrong. Seems to have only just happened. Worth double and treble
checking.

Are you sure about that? I don't follow him so I don't know what he's written. But, it was reported recently that Regiojet is cancelling their Prague-Split over night train. Are you sure that you, or he, haven't mixed up the trains?

I've been to 8 of the places on your list(but not Budapest or Prague) and Vienna was my favorite of the 8 by a wide margin. I had been to Europe 14 time previously before I ever went to Vienna and was amazed at how much I loved it. I wasn't that impressed with Split. I agree about spending the night in Plitvice Lake National Park.

Hi Val, this sounds like a wonderful journey. I have been to nine of the cities mentioned in your itinerary. In regards to Cesky Krumlov, we were happy to spend 2 nights (Th/Fri.) It was a nice break from from the big cities (Budapest, Vienna & Prague). We hired a guide for a morning walking tour. We felt 2 nights in Split was just right. We spent a week in Venice. I would recommend adding a couple more nights to Venice. We used GoOpti shuttle from Venice to Ljubljana. We stayed 4 nights in Ljubljana and didn’t want to leave. It’s my favorite European city! Four nights in Prague is great since you are planning a tour of Terezin. We hired the phenomenal historian Pavel Batel. In addition we did a Prague walking tour with his colleague Yvonne. We also hired Jason from Livingprague.com for a city tour. All were wonderful. We spent 5 nights in Amsterdam and wished we had more time to see more of the Netherlands (next time) Enjoy it all!
Edited to add- Also agree to spend the night at Plitvice.

Thanks everyone for the feedback!
I will take it all into consideration. I'll definitely look into spending a night at Plitvice Lakes, I think I found a decent affordable hostel near that has shuttles to the park, now I just have to decide if I'll remove a night from Zadar or Split. I'll also think about where to remove a night from to add to Venice. If anything, since I am planning on eventually doing a stand-alone Italy trip, I may go back if I feel it wasn't enough time.

The night train to Split- I saw about the cancellation as well over
the weekend on the community page of Doc7austin- a you tube rail guru
who I follow. He's pretty good, so I would be surprised if he was
wrong. Seems to have only just happened. Worth double and treble
checking.

Are you sure about that? I don't follow him so I don't know what he's written. But, it was reported recently that Regiojet is cancelling their Prague-Split over night train. Are you sure that you, or he, haven't mixed up the trains?

-They were/are the same train which called at Bratislava on it's way from Prague. There is always the possibility that it is now starting short at Bratislava. Regiojet have a delay repay policy. His train ran very late due to an engine failure and he had to fight for the money back as Regiojet told and persisted in telling untruths about how late the train had been. At one stage it was so late there was even doubt if it would get to Split or turn short to recover the northbound timetable. Sometimes these things just happen.
One of the joys or challenges of travelling.

Greetings! We are doing almost the same trip (except I start in Berlin) what are you doing for train tickets? Did you get a pass or doing each one individual? I hope you have a blast!

Hi Melissa,
That's awesome, I hope you enjoy your trip also! :)
I calculated the individual tickets and decided it wouldn't be worth getting the pass for me. Maybe if I was in the 27 and under category but the 28+ prices are a lot more expensive. I'll buy individual train tickets with a mix of cheap buses.

Doesn't this sound like a Lonely Planet type trip? Just saying.

Maybe, I've never heard of it haha

I’ve been to every city but Dresden and Salzburg.
Take the day from Zadar for your night in plitvice. 2 nights in bled and 4 in Ljubljana is a lot. You can stay in Ljubljana and do a day trip to bled. Add the time to Venice. take a day from Wrocław and add to Krakow. Great city.
Everything else sounds good.
Even if you keep it as is, it reads like a wonderful trip.

Cesky Krumlov, Czech Republic (2 nights)
Bus 3h
Salzburg, Austria (3 nights)
• Possible day trip to Hallstatt
Train 2h30
Vienna, Austria (3 nights)
Train 2h30
Budapest, Hungary (4 nights)
Bus 1h
Bratislava, Slovakia (1 night)
Overnight train 14h
Split, Croatia (3 nights)
Bus 1h40

Look at Bean or CK shuttle to get to Salzburg. Maybe better, maybe not.

I didn’t do your research, so there may be good reason for the back and forth, but if you can get to Split as easily from Budapest then when you are in Vienna do Bratislava at the same time, then go to Budapest; after all, Bratislava is just a suburb of Vienna ….. (sorry Slovaks)

Then there is the whole Croatia thing. Croatia is certainly the new in spot for tourism. Hard to say to think about any place else with all the Croatia buzz, but do look at Montenegro. Montenegro is to Budapest what Prague is to Dubrovnik. Anyway, if it appeals there were (maybe still are on your dates) direct flights from Budapest for under $100 which beats 14 hours on a train or a bus. You could still go up the coast to Dubrovnik and Split if you wanted (but I would stay in Montenegro). Just food for thought.

Montenegro My favorite country after Hungary. I will just let the videos talk.
Herceg-Novi https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOqLXoeE_o4
Cetinje https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6RwWDPe9M8
Perast https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fd6ErEHPHmg
Uncinj https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaPcThRQdi4
Fly Fishing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpnDIoqvfbo