18 night itinerary in France Italy England

Cities are sexy and intense. Who wouldn't want that? But 18 strait days of cities would drive me insane, and wouldn't be representative of the country or culture.

I would suggest omiting London. Start in Paris, end in Rome and put a week's worth of Provence and/or Tuscany in there to clense the palate.

Fly to London; return from Rome. London (4), Paris (5), Bern (1) [to break up distance - about half way to Venice], Venice (2), Florence (2), Rome (4). Land travel by rail.

When are you going? Are your dates fixed? Do you have flight tickets yet? How old is your daughter? Have you yourself been to Italy before, or do you just know that you will love it there? Are you mostly interested in cities and cultural sites, or would you like some relaxing time in a small village at a lake or coast in Italy?

Answers will help people help you.

The above itinerary is good in outline but you can modify it depending on what you wish to see and do. Also, I would spend one night less in London and Paris, and add that time to Italy.

The midway stop in Bern is good; or there are other possibilities in Switzerland right on or near your path. You can get a super deal on train tickets between Zürich and Milan (30 CHF instead of 92) if you book in advance. Milan is pretty much the gateway into Italy from th enorth.

We are taking our own daughters (late teen and young adult) to Italy this summer. We are starting in Milan and visiting Verona, Florence, Lucca, Siena, Cinque Terre, and Varenna on Lake Como, then back to Milan. It's a nice itinerary without long stretches by train. We intentionally left off Venice---we don't wish to go there in the summer---and Rome (ran out of time). We wanted more "scenery and relax" time so that drove our choices. For you, leaving in Venice and Rome might suit you better, or not. . .

We always try to spend 3 nights in one place so we aren't packing up and moving every other day.

Hi
My daughter is 15. My dates are fixed July 6th out and 25th back. She wants to go to Paris as she's an art student and the Louve is important. I love italy but have only been to Rome Florence and Venice.
What do you think? leave out london? I don't want to be rushing too fast!

Check on flight tickets into London and out from Rome (or Pisa or Florence or Milan). Them compare to flying into Paris and returning form the same cities in Italy. That may decide for you. Transfer from London to Paris on the Eurostar is easy and fast, but expensive if you don't get the early discounted tickets.

We love London but it is expensive! We usually fly British so a stop there is easy. With your considerations, and 18 days, it's a matter of whether you would rather go to London or spend more time in Italy. There are some nice art museums in London---the Tate Modern is great.

Of Rome, Florence and Venice, which would you like to see again and share with your daughter? Florence is probably a "must" due to the art interest.

I second Randy's suggestion to leave out London. I spent 3 weeks last year starting in Paris (maybe 5 days) and ending up in Nice (maybe only 2 days - not enough)- and I am a city type of guy. Now if you add in some time for Italy......
RS has a good tour of Paris and South of France to check out for itinerary suggestions. As lots of folks here say, "just know you will be back to see the things you missed last time" Happy travels

I'm with Randy,given your priorities. You just don't have enough time for London with only 2-1/2 weeks.

Also, I think that Provence would make a better stop between Paris and Italy than Bern would. Spend more than a night in Provence if you'd like to get some French contrast to Paris (Arles makes a good base).

But, there are night trains from Paris to Venice and other Italian cities; you could start in Venice and work your way south.

Have a wonderful time!

hi

I think i've gor it!i added three days to the trip! So it goes like this. Paris 5 nights- do a day trip to maybe Versille? Train to Arles 2 nights- Train to Venice 2 nights- Train to Florence home base for drives to Tuscany, have to go to Cortona, "Under the Tuscan Sun" nut! 5 nights in Tuscany, On to Rome, 5 nights, maybe day trip alittle south, then on to London for just an overnite since I can't get there early enough to catch my flight home in one day! Can't Wait!!I appreciate all the help, it Helped!

Arles is a great suggestion, given that Toni's daughter is an art student. They could go Paris---Arles---Antibes (Picasso Museum) and then into Italy via Genoa. Each of these legs of the journey is 4 to 4/5 hours by train.

Arles has a number of interesting attractions, but it is not my idea of a small town/rural experience. In fact, it's rather "gritty" and not at all a good contrast to city experiences. Nor is it centrally located to the rest of Provence. I was thinking more of any one of the 2 dozen or so cute villages of the Cote du Rhone or Luberon, and/or any of the dozens of similar villages in Tuscany.

It might provide an opportunity for the art student to sit and make some art, instead of just staring at what others did.

Good point. I was just thinking of Arles as a place to stop (with some art connection) to break up the trip south, as an alternative to routing through Switzerland.

But if the goal is to get to Italy to have more time to spend there, they could also take a night train from Paris to Antibes, spend a day and a night there, then continue into Italy along the coast.

Unless you are not renting a car and can't stay off the rail line, Arles makes a great base, though there are other attractive alternatives as well.

It's 20 minutes from Nimes and Avignon by rail, has some amazing Roman antiquities, and quite a bit of authentic Provincal charm. It's no village, but it's not a big town and is nothing at all like Paris. It's enroute to Italy and much more interesting than Bern, for goodness sakes.

But if Toni & daughter are interested in a Provence stopover, they should crack open the guidebooks and pick a place for themselves based on their preferences. (And maybe the night train would interest them more.)

They didn't actually express any interest in Provence, and I see on the Italy forum Toni is busy getting opinions about a base in Tuscany. So I imagine she's got her France plans roughed in (and probably has been convinced to leave out London).

But I'm glad I found that Paris--Antibes night train as that is something we would be interested in.

Are you doing all your traveling by train, or will you have a car at all? I would recommend a car for your five days in Tuscany. We picked one up in Florence at the airport (easy exit to airport ring road and then south on autostrada before exiting to go to San Gimignano). From SG, we used back roads; get Michelin #563. We turned in the car in Sorrento, but there are other choices n of Rome if you don't want to deal w/ city traffic.If you are going to Montepulciano, I would heartily recommend staying w/ Gio and Ivana at Mueble il Riccio (they're in RS Tuscany show).