I was instructed by friends who travel to Italy often to always book first class train tickets. We are super thrifty and wondering what other's experiences have been? Is there that much difference?
We are also unsure if we want the freedom of buying tickets as we travel (not missing our trains) vs. booking in advance for best pricing but having to make sure we're on time to not miss our train. Preferences?
Maybe your friends who instructed you like to splash their money around....
It might help to specify where you will be traveling.
High speed trains first class is gilding the lily.
Regionale trains might be a touch less crowded in First and the seats are a bit more spacious. Then again on many Regional Veloce trains on certain routes the first class carriages have been declassified to second class.
I never pay the 50% upcharge to go first.
"I was instructed by friends who travel to Italy often to always book first class train tickets. We are super thrifty and wondering what other's experiences have been? Is there that much difference?"
There's one poster on another forum who insists, often, that in Italy one should always take first class trains. But I never have. While I found second class fine, I couldn't compare them. When my brother and his wife went to Italy, they took mostly second class, but from Florence to Rome they went first class. So, I was eager to hear his opinion. Before I could even ask, I got a stream of profanity-laced invective, all about what a rip-off first class was. It seems he was expecting more leg room; the seats are wider, but not farther apart, so he was disappointed.
That's one man's opinion. You can see pictures of the different classes on The Man In Seat 61: http://seat61.com/Italy-trains.htm#What%20are%20Italian%20trains%20like
Also note that to take first class, there has to be first class on that particular train. Many of the regional trains, as Nigel said, have only second class.
"We are also unsure if we want the freedom of buying tickets as we travel (not missing our trains) vs. booking in advance for best pricing but having to make sure we're on time to not miss our train. Preferences?"
You've laid out the pros and cons of each approach. It's your choice; there's no right or wrong answer. If you want to save money and can accept the limitations on refunds and exchanges, book ahead. If you need full flexibility and don't mind the full prices (which in Italy are not too high), buy as you go. Do buy a day or two in advance, just for convenience.
My response to exactly the same question in the Italy section ----
It is strictly personal preference. We probably have traveled more than your friends and ride second class all the time unless we can get a deal for first class that is cheaper than second. Second is very close in comfort to business class on the airlines. Not like economy on the airlines. The first class seats are only slightly bigger - a couple inches at most - but the first class will be quieter because it is used mostly by business travelers. And sometimes, but not always, a beverage service may be available. No food service unless a cart is making the rounds.
I've ridden in both and while 1st class is quiet and very pleasant, there isn't much of a physical difference. It's important to not think of European train classes in the same way as airline classes. Trains have plenty of legroom and seat width compared to airlines.
And as others said, you either pay less and lose some flexibility or pay more. Your choice. But missing a train? That only happens if you don't keep a schedule. Besides, you still have to buy a ticket and if you show up ticketless 20 minutes prior to the train you want leaving, you'll miss it standing in the ticket line. I always recommend buying your ticket a day in advance unless it's a local train.
I have another silly train question! I get terrible motion sickness, especially if faced backwards on a train. Do the trains have both forward and backwards facing seats? Or are they all forward facing??
Most of the coaches have half of the seats facing in each direction. That way the car can be run in either direction. Other coaches will have a pair of seats facing each other so basically the effect is the same.
Hi yes, seats face both directions. Years ago there was a difference, but not so much anymore. We do all second class now. Just fine. Harold has excellent advice. a couple of years ago we stayed for a month, just bought point to point and it wasn't too expensive anyway, ESPECIALLY if on regional trains. We were in Italy last month. This time our schedule more more set, and we did buy advance tickets for the high speed train. We were on Italo, not Trenitalia. Still second class,and fine. We paid another 5 euro when booking for something called "smart". Never did figure what we got, but our ride was very comfortable, and the train had free wifi. There are now two train companies, the older and far more extensive Trenitalia, and the newer Italo trains. The latter has a super easy to use website, and from what I saw, nice arrangements about changing times to different trains..you paid something but it wasn't a whole bunch. However, we never did make any changes so not sure...just looked quickly before purchase and it seemed ok to me. If you buy in advance be sure to call your credit card company to tell them a foreign transaction is coming. Have fun. Train travel in Italy is fun.
Is it obvious to the rider which direction the train will be traveling so you know which seats to choose? Or is it easy to switch?
If the train is not full, you can switch seats once you depart and find yourself riding backwards. The trick is finding a seat that won't be occupied later on the journey at an intermediate stop. Sometimes the reserved seats are marked and sometimes not. But even if not, just be courteous and flexible if someone comes along with a reservation for your seat.
All trains in Italy - except Regionale trains - require a seat reservation that is assigned/selected when the ticket is purchased. No way to know or determine which way the seat will be facing during travel. It has been a very long time since I have seen a coach with all the seats pointing the same direction. The cars are set up with 50/50 facing in each direction. There are two type of train stations in Italy. A pass through station is when a train comes from one direction and departs in the other direction. In those situations you can determine easily the direction of travel just by watching. In major stations like Rome's Termini is where trains begin and end at UUUU shaped platforms. And these stations are called termini meaning terminal. Generally the trains are pull out of these stations but sometimes they can back out. Look to see which end the engines are attached. That is general a good clue to direction of travel.
On any train but a Regional if you switch to an empty seat it will be reserved for someone else who may get on at the next stop or further down the line. But it might not be sold either so you are taking a chance of seating in someone else's seat.
If facing forward is absolutely critical then first class might be a better choice for you because there are fewer travelers in first class so you might have a better chance of switching to an unoccupied seat once the train is rolling.
Most (all?) of the trains have engines at both ends, because they often have to reverse direction after arriving at a "terminus" station - that is a station where the tracks end as opposed to a through-station. Most larger cities are termini. So if you take a train from Venice to Rome, it stops in Bologna and in Florence, where it reverses direction. So you'd have 2 parts in one direction, 2 parts in the other.
I also suffer greatly from motion sickness but I've never had a problem on the high-speed trains in Italy, even riding backward.
We are getting ready to go to Paris to Switzerland then to Italy. We are planning to take the TVG Lyria train. I looked at the difference between 1st and 2nd class. They said they office a dinner and drinks in 1st class but in 2nd class it is food for purchase. Is the difference worth the money if you meal is included? Just asking.
Thank you,
Tina
Thank you Dick, that is just what I needed to hear. Thank you.
Tina
Agree with the picnic takeaway/station cafe food being perfectly fine for TGV travel.
Ham, butter, and pickle on crusty bread--that's good stuff.
Doesn't pertain to Italy, but just a note that on the Eurostar you can see the carriage layout and seat direction online when booking thru the Eurostar site.
I have done both, 1st and 2nd class. I prefer 1st class if it is available only because it seems to be more quiet--less teenagers/children--so I can get a nap.
I normally don't get motion sickness but i have found that i do if I sit backwards on a train. Looking forward is better for me.
For those who are fine with 2nd class, just be sure to double check 1st class prices on certain trains, especially those whose prices vary a lot (like Thalys, Eurostar, ItaloTreno), because sometimes you can find that the promotional fare for 1st class on the train you want is less than the fare for 2nd class. That happens on particularly busy trains, when all discounted 2nd class tickets are sold out, but not those on 1st class.
Ticketing websites are not always informative in that regard, you often must select 1st class to check promotional prices for 1st class (instead of being merely offered an upgrade on the same fare category while you browse 2nd class tickets).
It depends on how much care you need.
If you are young, rugged, and hardy, travel Regionale. If you need more care, upgrade if you can.
On Regionale trains, I always have to stand with my luggage in the vestibules. Those trains are full of young agile travelers, students, soldiers, workers who can bounce up the stairs and toss their duffels up on the luggage racks and sit down at the same time.
I'm nearing 69, travel alone, and I'm always among the last on the train, along with other old folk who share the vestibule with me. It's tiring to stand and on a recent especially long Regionale train, every jerk threw my lower back out.
The pain was so bad I groaned all the way.
The train stop at Termini was staggered, giving us a one or two mile walk to the station. I was the last to make it to the station, I was so tired I could Not remember how to say or spell my hotel's street. I had written out the address but could Not remember where I put the piece of paper. It was late at night and I
Had put myself in danger.
Reserved second class is a tad better but only if I can reserve the solo end seats with floor space for my luggage. I am Not able to lift my bags onto the luggage racks, and I cannot always count on help being there all the time for me. Then there's the aggravation of other passengers in my seat. They don't have to get up. There's no one around to enforce my reservation. I'm on my own.
On First class there are a lot of old people there for the same reasons. There are professionals too. My seat is always available for me. There are "A" spaces in between seats for luggage storage. If my seat suite is empty I bring my luggage into my suite. If I need to use luggage racks overhead I can always count on a nice man to hoist my bags up and get them down.
The seats are larger and have tray tables for my laptop. Some cars have WiFi so I can send emails to hotels and my families and do Internet research. I can leave my seat and it is waiting for me when I return.
First class is more Fun, relaxing, and therapeutic. My body is intact and refreshed when I reach my destination, and I can take on the world again. So I always travel First class if available. There is time enough when I have to travel Regionale. So if I can give myself a First class break I take it.
