traffic violation help

Sorry to hear about the fees from your rental company, but they can help you get in touch with the authorities in Pisa. Apparently you drove in a ZTL (Zona Traffico Limitato) and your license plate was photographed. Since you've been contacted according to Italian law, you are expected to pay the fines. Sometimes nothing happens if you don't pay, or it happens months or years later (while the euro amounts keep increasing on unpaid tickets). As records become more manageable electronically, you can expect to be contacted by collection agencies (there goes the credit rating) as well as the Italian authorities. It is also possible that you might be refused entry into the country unless you can show that the fines have been paid. This topic has received a lot of responses on the "To the Boot" forum (probably mostly in archives by now).

The 240 Euros is for the two tickets. You obviously intruded into two different Zona Traffico Limitados (ZTLs). They have them in Pisa. You were caught with a camera as you entered these special zones. In actuality, the tickets aren't that expensive but you most likely had your chance to appeal in court but of course, you had no knowledge of these proceedings because nobody tells you. You are now seeing the tickets with additional fines. The 120 Euros is an administrative charge for Hertz ratting you out to the police department. You might be able to work with your credit card company to challenge this charge. It is an outrageous expense for a few minutes work. We frequently see this situation for traveler's driving through the historical areas of Florence. They apparently have more of the ZTLs. Many cities in Italy have them. Here's a LINK to the SEP in Pisa that apparently collects all of these fines. https://secure.comune.pisa.it/tzv/Login.jsp Here's what you put in the fields. ?Numero verbale: 'Offence number' (solo il numero senza lettere) '(only the number without letters)' ?Anno: 'Year' ?Targa: 'Car Licence/Registration Plate number' ?Data violazione (gg/mm): 'Date of violation day/month (dd/mm)' You then will see the pictures of your car making the offense. You may also want to read the article at this LINK. It's for EU citizens but you might glean some helpful information from it especially from the parts where you were to be informed in 240 days in a language you understand. Maybe it doesn't apply to U.S. citizens

The fees from Hertz to provide your informantion to the authorities are common, though in your case seemingly very expensive. But also probably very much spelled out in the rental agreement you signed. The ZTL fines are very common in Italy. Often they come in pairs or multiples because if you weren't aware of them in the first place, you probably got dinged each time you entered one. Each ZTL entry without authorization is a seperate fine. There have been many threads on this topic and several people have reported getting contacted by credit agencies after not paying. And while you surely didn't mean to, you did violate their traffic laws and should pay. As to actually paying, someone else here may be able to help out with that, or see if a friend that speaks some Italian can help interpret the notice.

hilary, There have been a few posts here lately that have indicated that both American and Canadian drivers have been contacted by Collection Agencies in their respective areas concerning driving violations in Italy. Italian authorities seem to have become somewhat more aggressive in collecting fines from North American drivers, so it's unlikely that you'll be able to ignore this situation. This is probably not surprising, given the current state of the economy there. Without being able to see the ticket, it's difficult to suggest how you can pay it. I suspect there's information on the ticket somewhere, or perhaps a link to a website or a phone number. The information posted by Larry should help you find the information on how to pay. Your experience is perhaps a good reminder of why driving in Italy comes with some "bureaucratic complications" so may not always a good idea. Be sure to let us know how you resolve this situation, as the information may be helpful for others here. As a final thought, you may be able to get some good advice from the RS Denver group, that meets at a local Panera Bread on the third Saturday of every month. The meeting time and location will be posted here in the "General Europe" section. Good luck!

Don't bother complaining to your credit card company about the charges from Hertz. I guarantee you that you authorized these charges somewhere in your rental agreement. I always look, and that paragraph is always there.

Its interesting that this topic came up today. I was reading just last night about a British woman who has managed to accumulate €30,000.00 of Italian ZTL, restricted lane, and speeding tickets. It was in yesterday's Evening Standard. Those fines are being upheld and she has been detained. Until she pays they continue to escalate. I'd pay them and learn the lesson.

I certainly think you should pay the traffic ticket. Here's a new point of discussion. Perhaps it would be a good idea after renting a car in Italy to cancel the credit card that was used. That would prevent the rental company from charging a ridiculous amount to pass on some info. I imagine the info would still be required from the Italian government, so you would not be avoiding the legal obligation. I would not advocate this if the fee for info was reasonable-say 20-40 euros. But $140 is outrageous. It may mean you couldn't rent from that company again, but do you want to do business with a company that pulls that kind of crap? Any thoughts?

"Perhaps it would be a good idea after renting a car in Italy to cancel the credit card that was used." No, it wouldn't. Because Hertz would still come after you for the charges - that you authorized - with possible unhappy results to your credit rating, etc, if you didn't pay. I'm guessing that Hertz charges per ticket. The OP was probably charged around 50 euros per ticket. Of course. anyway you cut it, they're still gouging you. Bottom line: if you're going to rent a car in Italy, learn what ZTL signs look like. There are pictures all over the internet. And be on high alert if you decide to drive into or near any historic city centers. Another related fact that I've learned from several rentals in Italy: under Italian law, car rental agencies are required to turn over your identifying information upon request from the traffic authorities. They have no choice in the matter. The only thing they have choice about is how much to charge you for their doing so.

Yeah, I guess you're right, they would come after you. I thought perhaps if it you made it hard for them, they'd drop it. Hah!

Here is an example of what a ZTL sign looks like.

But be aware that ZTL signs do not all look alike. Here are some other examples: http://www.florence-on-line.com/travel-tips/new-ztl-traffic-light.html

Ken hit the nail on the head...it's just not worth driving in some places in Europe due to all of the varying regulations you're not necessarily going to be familiar with: ZTLs in Italy, speed cameras, red light cameras, German eco permits, Austrian Autobahn permit, parking rules you don't know about, can't drive into some countries from others, etc., etc. Add to that congestion, especially in big cities, worry about enough/right type of insurance, high public parking fees, paying for days when your car is parked and not even used, and using public transportation starts to make much more sense. Don't get me wrong, I like to drive in Europe, and I've driven in big cities, such as Paris, Munich, Vienna, etc., but I now only rent a car when I'm going to be out in rural areas – Bavaria, Salzkammergut, or wherever. I've typically used trains for part of the trips when I also drove, but on my last couple of trips, I just used trains (mostly) and buses (not as much) exclusively. I'm just more relaxed when I don't have to worry about driving. You should be able to find out how to pay the fines online somewhere, or maybe contact the nearest Italian consulate for assistance. As for the person with €30,000 in violations, how would one rack up that many violations and not know what they're doing? She deserves the fines IMHO. It's not the same as getting a Verizon bill for $30k because of data roaming – someone may legitimately not know much or anything about smartphones and data roaming. You really have to be trying to break the law intentionally to get fined that much/that many times.

@ Nigel , I recall seeing this very same story here in the states several weeks or even several months ago ( not sure which at my age ) It was in The NY Times. Michael , as I recall the story , as Nigel points out she is a British national . The article stated that she owns a second home in Florence . It seems that from the tenor of the news article she was flaunting the Italian laws simply because she somehow felt entitled or above the law. It certainly was not due to ignorance. She has owned the residence for some time . Certainly made me shake my head in mock disbelief !!!!! 2
nigel

Just for everyone's information, canceling a credit card does not relieve you from paying the charges run up on it, any more than canceling it after a shopping spree would. The interest and late payment penalties will continue to accumulate; and eventually, your credit rating will suffer, and the bank will do whatever they do to collect.

thank you all for your feedback. After posting this last night, I went on to read many articles about this topic and how Italy is one of the worst places to drive and the major consequences that will incur if you do not pay tickets. Its not so much that I was not planning to pay. I think it is ridiculous how it has taken almost a year to get these tickets. It is very angering. But now I have the info I need to take care of it. Believe me, I will NEVER drive in Italy again. thanks again all!

Hilary , Please reconsider your last thught about never driving in Italy again . Unfortunately you had a somewhat costly and frustrating experience , but you've learned a good deal as a result . I think we all go through this . There are times in Italy and elsewhere that a car is the best choice and other times not . Best to keep an open mind and not restrict yourself to dichotomous choices . Best Wishes!!

Hey! What if you said the check was in the mail? Must have gotten lost in the Italian postal system. (I realize this just adds to my growing reputation as a deadbeat. Now none of you will loan me money again. I can't ask Eileen-she's still trying to find out my address.)

I personally would never drive in Italy in any large city, as they restricted driving zones are hard to spot when you are already trying to : 1) find where you are going
2) not crash or be crashed into other crazy drivers Italy is the only country I consistantly and constantly read about these fines and tickets ,, often arriving many many months after the offence.. on this and all other travel forums I go on..

Looks like Florence, at least, wants to improve the situation. I lifted this quote from the Florence-on-line website: "The current mayor of Florence, Matteo Renzi, has announced new plans to make the whole ZTL situation simpler and more friendly to tourism."