Question about skipping one leg of flight in Germany.

If you don't get aboard the first leg at Frankfurt, they will cancel the rest of your trip home....so you may show up in Munich, but they won't have you on the passenger list any longer. Try calling United to see if they will switch this to an "open jaws" flight....into Frankfurt, and out of Munich.

Thanks Norm, although that is not the answer I was hoping for.

I tried calling United, but couldn't make it past the automated reservation system. I guess I will go to the local airport and talk to an agent. Hopefully they will not make this too difficult. It seems all they would have to do is push a button and cancel that leg of the trip, but know the lack of customer service at the airlines, I doubt it will be this easy.

I wonder if I could get around this by doing the online check in before the flights. When you check in online you actually are issued, and get to print out, boarding passes, so I would actually have a boarding pass for the flight in Munich. Seems like it might work, but I certainly don't want to get stuck without a flight home.

Thanks again!

Printing the boarding passes won't solve the problem; your butt needs to be in the seat:) The airline will let you make the change, but the real question is how much will it cost. You have purchased a discounted airfare that doesn't allow stopovers, so if they let you make a stopover they are going typically want you to to pay the difference between the discount fare and the non-restricted fares that business travelers usually purchase. That difference can run into thousands of dollars:(

If you print out (and don't use) the first boarding pass it would be like not boarding the plane -- they would cancel the rest of the flight. It wouldn't matter if you showed up in Munich with a boarding pass for that leg. It has less to do with "lack of customer service at the airline" and more to do with you abiding by the terms of carriage that you agreed to when you bought your ticket.

Rick...you don't have a flight from Munich to San Francisco. You purchased a round trip San Francisco-Frankfurt and the return Frankfurt-San Francisco.

As far as the airline goes, you are on a flight from Frankfurt to San Francisco. Just because you change planes has nothing to do with it. They didn't have a nonstop available so they offered you a flight with a change of planes. It could have been Munich, London, Los Angeles, almost anywhere.

If you don't show for the flight in Frankfurt, the airline assumes you are a no-show and cancels all legs of your flight.

You are booked on a flight from Frankfurt to San Francisco...not two flights one from Frankfurt to Munich and then Munich to San Francisco.

I hope this helps you to understand.

I would suggest you keep your original flight plan. I have flown the same route...Tel Aviv to Frankfurt to Munich then changed to the larger one to SFO.

Enjoy your trip.

Thank you to all that have responded.

It looks like I am going to be stuck going back to Frankfurt.

I still do not understand why United would not allow me to simply cancel a leg. How is it not beneficial to United for me to free up a seat that they can then resell on one of their flights? It seems as though you folks think that I am running a "scam" or something. I just thought it would be a mutally beneficial arrangement.

Also, I am a charter pilot and I have flown people to San Francisco from my small town north of there because they missed their flight to San Francisco and wanted to make their connection. Are you saying these folks were denied boarding just because they were late for the first flight? I'll bet those were some pretty pissed off passengers.

Nancy, I read the terms and conditions that came with my ticket and do not see anything addressing this situation. Perhaps it was in something else I clicked "agree" to that did not print out. If you happen to have the relevent info regarding this, I would love to see it.

You guys may not think this is poor service by the airline, but I do. It seems like such a simple thing. This is why the charter company I work for is thriving while the airlines are plummeting.

Again, I really appreciate the info and you may have saved me from a very costly mistake.

Cheers!
Rick

My understanding (and if I'm wrong, someone correct me) is that this policy is something that was enacted after 9/11. The airlines consider you a security risk if you skip a leg of your flight.

The no-stopover rule has always been a part of discounted fares, even before 9/11. Look at it this way: if you were someone who paid thousands of dollars for a non-restricted ticket, and you found out that someone who purchased a ticket for a fraction of that fare was allowed to make changes without penalty, you would not be a happy camper.

Hi Rick.

Short Answer: If you don't show for that leg, it cancels your entire ticket with the airline. Yeah, it sucks, and is in-away nonsensical. Check to see if they will allow you to pay the change fee, and just have an open-jaw ticket out of Munich. You'll have to pay most likely.

Long Answer:
You can check with them to see if they will let you change the flight though with the normal change rules. Rules vary per ticket, but general United rules are $150 change fee per person, plus any additional increase in fare.

The airlines will do this for many reasons - they may have a fare war in Frankfurt, and not in Munich, so Munich tickets were more expensive. Open jaw tickets (where you fly into one city, and out of another) are also generally more expensive, and the airlines see this as a way of skating around it, etc. They may have offered a special sale to boost Frankfurt as a destination, but not Munich, etc.

It's pretty clearly spelled out in United's Contract of Carriage. Here are the rules that apply:

TICKETS - GENERAL UA RULE: 0100
B) FLIGHT COUPONS WILL BE HONORED ONLY IN THE ORDER IN WHICH THEY ARE ISSUED, AND ONLY IF ALL UNUSED FLIGHT COUPONS AND THE PASSENGER COUPONS
ARE PRESENTED TOGETHER.

CANCELLATION OF RESERVATIONS UA RULE: 0135
B) FAILURE TO OCCUPY SPACE. IF THE PASSENGER FAILS TO OCCUPY SPACE WHICH HAS BEEN RESERVED FOR HIM/HER ON A UA FLIGHT, AND UA FAILS TO RECEIVE NOTICE OF THE CANCELLATION OF SUCH RESERVATION PRIOR TO THE
DEPARTURE OF SUCH FLIGHT; OR IF ANY CARRIER CANCELS THE RESERVATION OF ANY PASSENGER IN ACCORDANCE WITH THIS RULE, UA WILL CANCEL ALL RESERVATIONS HELD BY SUCH PASSENGER ON THE FLIGHTS OF UA FOR CONTINUING
OR RETURN SPACE, PROVIDED UA ORIGINALLY RESERVED THAT SPACE.

The Contract of Carriage is a document the Department of Transportation requires the airlines to file, outlining the rules (aka the contract) agreed to when purchasing the ticket.

Rick, I'm sure I speak for everyone who has responded to you when I say that no one thinks you are trying to run a "scam". This question has come up several times before and we have researched the answer for others before you. Please don't take our answers as personal criticism -- they weren't meant that way. We were only trying to keep you from making a very expensive and inconvenient mistake.

As for using the coupons in the order in which they were issued, though, you wouldn't be doing so. You would be using #2 first, not #1 first.

I am probably starting to get to the "beating a dead horse" stage here, but reading the carriage rules quoted above makes me think it might be possible. The rule 0100 B states that:

1. "Flight coupons will be honored only in the order in which they are issued."

OK, I would still be using the tickets in the "order they were given." I would merely be cancelling one leg, which also seems like it must be OK as the next part states

"and only if all unused flight coupons are presented together".

The next rule presented states:

IF THE PASSENGER FAILS TO OCCUPY SPACE WHICH HAS BEEN RESERVED FOR HIM/HER ON A UA FLIGHT, AND UA FAILS TO RECEIVE NOTICE OF THE CANCELLATION OF SUCH RESERVATION PRIOR TO THE DEPARTURE OF SUCH FLIGHT; OR IF ANY CARRIER CANCELS THE RESERVATION OF ANY PASSENGER IN ACCORDANCE WITH THIS RULE, UA WILL CANCEL ALL RESERVATIONS HELD BY SUCH PASSENGER ON THE FLIGHTS OF UA FOR CONTINUING OR RETURN SPACE, PROVIDED UA ORIGINALLY RESERVED THAT SPACE.

The way I read this it says if I don't show up for a flight (now here comes the important part) AND I DON'T CANCEL THE FLIGHT PRIOR TO DEPARTURE, then United will cancel all continuing and returning flights.

So, tell me where it says they have the right to deny me my flight from Munich if I notify United I would like to cancel my flight from Frankfurt to Munich?

I am probably wrong, but would really like to understand why? Perhaps a lawyer on the forum will explain the error of my thinking.

Again, thank you for the help. I am going to take these very rules to the United desk when I talk to the agent as in my eyes they support my case.

Oh, and just for general info there was no difference in price for roundtrip to either Munich or Frankfurt. I never actually checked for "open jaw" flights as this flight just happened to catch my eye and thought it would be great to have the option of leaving from Frankfurt or Munich. I thought it was great until you guys burst my bubble ;-)

Nancy is right, that would be using the coupons out of order. You would be using coupon 3 before coupon 4.

There's nothing stopping you from changing it with the change fee though, if you didn't buy a non-changeable fare. Good news: since you say prices are the same, it shouldn't cost you anything but the change fee theoretically. Hope that helps.

Chris

I've done it before. We had a flight to A'dam, transfer to Frankfurt, then flying home from Rome.
The flight from A'dam to Frankfurt was on Lufthansa while the other flights were KLM/Northwest.

It turned out to be better to lease a car in A'dam so we didn't take the flight to Frankfurt.

We didn't have any problems but airlines seem to be getting pickier all the time because people were finding multiple leg tickets cheaper than the direct flight, then skipping their connection. It may have been that the leg was with a different airline so skipping it didn't affect our booking with KLM.

Brad, your situation was similar but not the same as Rick is describing. You honored the first part of the ticket, in other words were on the plane from the beginning whereas Rick wants to get on at a later point. I did a similar thing as you, the airline wasn't going to let me get off in Dublin when I was ticketed to Shannon, they said they would cancel the rest of my ticket, I got around it by befriending a flight attendent on the way over, she talked to some ground personnel and they let me get off.

The way I see Ricks situation is what if someone is flying standby, Rick didn't show so they give his seat to the standby, airline wants to make money, the standby needs to get somewhere and the airline has no idea where the original customer (Rick)is. The only way you will be able to do this is contact United and get the change in writing so to speak (new ticket).

I've been thinking of an analogy, say for instance you made a dinner reservation, on the way you stopped somewhere else, you didn't show, the restaurant seated someone else, but you decide to show up later for dessert but want immediate seating. As far as the restaurant was concerned they held your table, you didn't show, they're a business and want to make money so they seat someone else. They no longer have to honor their conttact with you.

And as someone else said, we don't think you're trying to scam United, we see you dilemma and in a more casual world it just might work. It's just that everybody here has done business with them and other airlines hundreds and hundreds of times and know how they work. And this is why they probably charge a alot for changes, if they didn't charge people would be making changes all the time, the cost keeps this from happening.