night train Italy to Salzburg--are we crazy

You will only be on the train a bit more than 7 hours. It makes several stops throughout the night, although you will get a 3 hour stretch between Padua and Tarvisio. What can I say? Give it a try. It won't be the best nights sleep, but you know the saying. "I'm on vacation. I'll sleep when I get home."

Is that the 10:52 PM departure that gets in at 6:15 AM? What time of year is your trip?

I'm not sure what you'll find to do at 6:15 AM in a small city like Salzburg, beyond killing rather a lot of time in a little café at the train station. If you're not traveling mid-summer (and possibly even if you are), it may be quite chilly outside at that hour of the morning in Salzburg. If you're dead on your feet you'll still need to keep going until you can check into your hotel room, possibly as late as 3 PM. [As Fred points out below, I worded this badly. Any hotel with staff on duty will allow you to check in early and almost certainly to drop off your luggage. I meant that you wouldn't be able actually to get into your hotel room and collapse until possibly as late as 3 PM.]

When you say it will save to $200, do you mean the train tickets are that much less expensive after you include the cost of the couchettes, or are you comparing to a day-time train plus a hotel? If the latter, have you considered staying in a less expensive hotel for one night? I can assure you that you would have a very, very hard time finding any budget hotel in that part of Europe (or anywhere in Europe, probably) that even approaches overnight in a couchette for discomfort.

The more people you have in your group (children?), the greater the likelihood that at least one member will have gotten very little sleep on the train and will be miserable--probably making all of you miserable.

I wouldn't do it. If you have no youngsters with you and are young (in your 20s or 30s), I might not be so adamant about it.

I write this as someone who slept not one wink on the way from Rome to Sicily in 2015, though I admit that part of the problem was poor track condition, which probably doesn't apply to the route you are taking, and I was 64 years old at the time. The next day was unbelievably miserable. I got into my hotel room early and must have just collapsed, because my list of expenditures for the arrival day includes nothing except my hotel room!

To me, the money is the least relevant part of this equation. I don't particularly like getting up at 6:00 a.m., as you would do in Salzburg. Nor do I like trading a 4-hour visit for a 2-3 hour visit, if that's the trade-off. I'd consider Verona and Padua both equal and choose whichever allows you the longer, more relaxed visit. Of course, you can board the same night train at either one (departs Verona at 22:52, then Padua at 23:44), but catching it at Padua shortens sleep even more. If you take a daytime train, you'll enjoy some mountain scenery.

Hi,

If this trip is in the summer, ie from May on, I would take this night train ride. By 0600 hr it is definitely day light, the food vendors in the train stations are opening up. I've arrived at 0600 hrs or a bit later off of a night train in Germany, no problems at all.

The best time to arrive off of a night train is between 0600 and 0800 hrs. Since the "the timing works well....", then take this option.

Be advised too that even though officially a hotel's check-in time is at 3 o'clock, I have arrived at the hotel (in Vienna, not Salzburg) at 0930 or so, checked in, and went to my room. The room was not occupied the night before; still, if it had been, I would have been allowed to check in with my luggage placed in the luggage office, ie behind the Rezeption desk...good enough for me.

I have never experienced in Austria or Germany that you had to wait until 3 pm to do the check-in business. Going to your reserved room is a different matter, depending if had been used the previous night.

No night trains for me. You’ll lose time either way. The night train will make the next day a wreck.

Fred's right. I worded that very carelessly. I meant that you might have no room to go to until the traditional check-in time of 3 PM. I've adjusted my earlier post. I, too, have sometimes been lucky enough to get into my room upon arrival at the hotel. But Murphy's Law being what it is, one of the two times I really, really needed to do that (suffering from two sprained ankles and severe vertigo), my room wasn't ready until 3 PM. Just the way the cookie crumbles; couldn't blame the hotel. But I'm sure I looked drunk as I staggered along the sidewalks of Bolzano for the next four or five hours. (Could be the basis for a country song!)

Fred and I are at opposite ends of the spectrum here. I have difficulties sleeping at the best of times and am miserable if I get no sleep. He can sleep sitting up on a train. How I envy him!

That day on the train won't be lost time. It is one of the most scenic railway journeys in Europe, right through the Dolomites mountain range. When I did this trip, I enjoyed every minute of it.

Go for it! You'll see a wonderful city waking up and for me that is priceless. Especially for photos. I think Salzburg you could easily do your own walking tour, see the architecture etc... before moving on.

I agree with tonfromleiden. Going on that night train you will miss a beautiful train journey.

I was a little confused about the Verona Padua thing. I've been to Padua, but not Verona. Whether you're there in summer or not, things will not necessarily be open late, and depending on the day, might be closed. If you are planning to just walk around, that's different. You can do that until it's dark.

My last overnight train ride was so miserable that I will never do that again. We were zombies in Sicily.

My recommendation would be to spend the night in Verona, seeing a bit of Padua (Scrovegni Chapel?) on the way and getting to Verona in time to see what you want to see.

Then leave Verona the next morning, giving you time to see the amazing mountain scenery enroute and arriving in Salzburg after check in time.

My wife and I have found from hard experience that night trains are a false economy, and therefore would never recommend them to anyone. In your party of 4 you can count on at least 2 of you (and probably all of you) getting little to no sleep through the night, and this added to whatever jet lag and associated sleep pattern disruptions you'll still be experiencing from the trip over.
Never again for us. Take the day train or fly. Make it easy on yourself...and the other members in your party.

You are not crazy. If you wanted to try a night train this is a good option ( some have terrible times or even a change at two in the morning). That said this would also make scenic day time ride.

You can’t really lose either way in my opinion.

DJ

Note that mountain scenery is mostly weather dependent.

more info:
end of June travel--if we spend the night in Verona, we give up a day in Salzburg (2 vs 3 days) or Munich (then just stopover with no days) on a rather tight trip.
Day train: If we get up early in Venice, we could see 3 hours of Verona before taking the 3pm train to Salzburg. Or we could see 4 hours of Padua before getting on the same train at 2:18 to Salzburg.
If we take the night train, we would get up later in Venice, train over to Verona, check our luggage and have from 1pm-7pm to tour, get our bags by 8pm, eat at a pizza place with our bags near train station and get on the night train at 10:30ish. Arriving at Salzburg at 6:15, where we would have a hotel near the train station to store our bags and refresh, eat breakfast at a cafe, etc. and tour around S for that day. For day train, I'm leaning towards Padua, as it seems like we could more easily get to city center and not be as rushed in a 3-4 hour block.
Seems like the group is 50/50 on day/night. We have 2 older teens who would sleep fine. DH and I in our 50s, less likely. We have taken an Amtrak with a couchette before--slept at 50% of normal--way better than a red eye flight in coach (I'd give that a 20% sleep rating), but not nearly as good as a comfortable bed--is this what to expect?

I've done Amtrak in a sleeper, and night trains in Europe. For me I slept better on Amtrak, but the experience is fairly similar. Probably a few more stops on European night trains. I think you can't go wrong either way.

Getting an early start from Venice after a good night's sleep in a hotel sounds preferable to an early start in Salzburg after a bad night's sleep on the train. Also, on a trip this tight, you pretty much always need to get an early start, just not as early as 6:00. The more time you can give yourself at your daytrip destination, the better.

Hi,

If that night train route included having you change trains at 2 AM, then forget it. Those type of night train rides I don't take, only the straight shot ones arriving at the earliest at 0500...I believe Salzburg Hbf has a waiting room (Wartesaal) or area (Wartebereich).

straight shot verona 10:43 to salzburg 6:15. about 5 stops, no changes. 4 person couchette.

@ elaine...What you listed is ideal for this solo traveler. Ideal for you since you got the couchette, as well as arrival time.

so, I guess it comes down to is seeing Verona worth an overnight couchette or forgoing Ludwig castle tour (on DH and DDs bucket list--I know it's touristy).

For me, there would be not only the virtual certainty that I'd have no better than a few brief catnaps during the night and be too out of it to enjoy any of the following day (until I could go to bed), but the significant possibility that I'd collapse super-early and wreck any semblance of vacation sleep schedule for the following night or two. In other words, I might well be affected for more than one day.

For sure I'd fell really grotty until I had a chance to shower. I walked into a toilet stall in a French train station last summer and hit a wall of body odor from the previous user. She looked like a tourist. I can only assume she had slept on night trains two times (at least) in succession and had not found a way to wash; perhaps she was too sleepy to realize she needed to, though that is a bit hard to believe; I've never smelled body odor that strong.

If you decide to try the overnight train (which I realize the kids may get a kick out of if they sleep pretty well), I hope you'll come back and report. A lot of us are commenting based on just one bad experience. Some additional data points would be helpful.

Once is usually enough for most people to realize just what a mistake they've made.
For us, however, it took a second misguided (by me) attempt for it to sink in. During a 30th anniversary trip a few years ago I talked my wife into trying it again, believing that the whole experience had to be much improved over our first unhappy trip many years before. It wasn't. At the completion of the ordeal I was informed in no uncertain terms (and I didn't even know she knew those words) that there wouldn't be a 31st anniversary if I even considered trying it again.

we just had a family discussion and DH said, "we've done Amtrak overnights in couchettes several times and been fine, it gives us an extra day, who cares about scenery after 30 minutes, seems like a fun adventure!" Then I read a few more posts and revert to maybe we should do the day train.
Night train would be to Salzburg--staying at hotel with pool (with locker room), so we could eat breakfast, store bags, and then use locker room to freshen up when it opened. We would not walk around stinky and grungy as that's just yuck for everyone.

I have taken night trains on three occasions and always slept fine, but this is an individual thing. Because I slept fine does not mean you will, and the fact that someone else did not doesn't mean you won't. Part of it is do you have sleep troubles at home--last time I took a night train I was younger and never had trouble sleeping. Now I do a lot of times, ironically because I get more sleep and am not chronically sleep deprived. I think I would shy away from a night train for that reason, I'm just not that sure that I would sleep well. But that's me. (Also, now I focus on itineraries that cover less distance for the most part). The duration and arrival time do see a little problematic, and the idea of seeing the scenery on that route is worth considering too. If you can't get into your room right away you could be faced with walking around all grungy for the better part of a day, too. Venice might not be the most practical place to start a day trip, depending upon where you are staying it can take quite a while just to get to the train station.

I'm in the take the night train camp. My husband and I love night trains with private couchette like you are doing. It is fun. We both sleep fine. Whenever we can find a night train, we are on it! In fact, we have planned trips around them. You will never know unless you try it so make it part of your adventure and see which side you are on. It will be a good experience for your kids because this type of travel seems to be disappearing so it will be something they will always remember, one way or the other OR they will know to hunt these trains down because they loved it. Salzburg at sunrise...what could be bad about that? Then a relaxed breakfast somewhere? OK, I'm obviously missing the down side...

Oh, and the hours are perfect for a night train...again, I see no downside.

I've been on 7 night trains in the US and one in Europe. I've never had trouble getting a good night's sleep.

I say that with some reservation because the one European night train was from Brussels to Heidelberg. The train was three hours late getting into Brussels because they waited for ferries crossing the channel (this was before the Chunnel), and they were late due to storms. I naively thought they could make up the time so set my alarm for an hour before we would arrive in Heidelberg and woke up in Koblenz. I slept well until then but could not get back to sleep. Still, I had had enough sleep before then that staying awake was not a problem.

Other than the fact that you will miss some scenery, I would not be reluctant to take the night train.

I had no idea that Amtrak had couchettes. I have been cross country with them several times but always had a bedroom, and a similar arrangement on trains between New York and Montreal. My trips were, LakeShore Chicago to Syracuse several times, Chicago - Los Angeles several times, Denver - San Francisco, once, New York - Montreal many times (especially fun in the morning to walk to the door at the rear of the train and see the snow blowing around), Fort Worth - Chicago several times.

Granted this was quite a time ago, and maybe the sleepers have changed. I never experienced anything like the skinny thin plank that is a European couchette. I looked at that once and knew it was no-go for me (and because I work on trains it was nearly free to me). For me it was always a bedroom - Belgium and Germany to Germany, France to France, Germany to Italy.

I'll never sleep on the plank.

Actually, having experienced too many unpleasant overnights in Europe, I probably will never take another night train. When I was criss-crossing the US on three night trips I never had a really bad night. I think the Amtrak experience was better, for sleeping.

Nigel - I think you are right about no couchettes on Amtrak. They have Roomettes (like 2nd class sleeper on the old CNL), Bedroom (like a 1st class CNL sleeper), Family room (2 connecting Bedrooms) and Accessible (large bedroom able to be accessed with a wheel chair).
https://www.amtrak.com/onboard/onboard-accommodations-for-all-your-needs/sleeping-accommodations.html

I just remember couchettes available of some night trains 30 or 40 years ago.

This is a good point. A couchette is nothing but a padded ledge, and not all that well-padded.

Lest there be any confusion, there is also no wash basin or toilet in the compartment. It is not a sleeper compartment (though those do exist).

Hi,

If it comes down to choosing Verona or Ludwig's castles, I choose Verona. Your family has to decide, an individual decision. I say Verona since the castles don't interest me in the least, touristy or not. Definitely take the night train in order not to miss out on Verona...very doable.

I'm not sure if you used the Man in Seat 61 to research night trains.

If not, this link will take you to info on the Austrian Nightjet sleeper trains between Venice and Vienna. It describes all the kinds of accommodations. Scroll down for Couchettes. They are pretty minimal compared to what you see at that Amtrak link, but they look a lot better than those on the Italian train we took from Rome to Catania so many years ago.

I believe I saw the Nightjet route from either Verona or Padua to Salzburg using the DB Bahn website. I love their maps.

Sorry. I meant a roomette on Amtrak-a small cabin that converts to 2 bunk beds-so fairly similar. I will keep in mind that the couchette bed is not as comfy. I did research prior to posting, reading seat61, etc.
Family is voting for couchettes so they can see both Verona and Ludwig. I’ll report back in July how much sleep we got. Elaine

"Family is voting for couchettes...." Bravo! The family are good troopers.

I'm looking forward to your trip reports. I want to see how you did through your eyes, and the eyes of your family....