itinery help

For what it is worth,I think this is way too much. You will be spending too much times traveling and transferring to hostels to enjoy anything. Why are you going into and out of London. That is too much backtracking. Fly open jaw with whatever you decide.

carol - Just my opinion: 16 destinations in 21 days (as best as I can count) means you are visiting train stations, not towns. Seriously, you may be underestimating the time it takes in just getting things together and getting to and from train stations and hostels and sights. Not to mention meals, shopping standing in line, etc. All of those places in Germany and Austria are wonderful, but they will all blur into one long train ride, and some are very similar to each other. In my experience, day trips are all half-day trips as it takes half a day getting anywhere and back. London, Paris, Munich & Venice are each worth 3-4 nights each, just in themselves.

I would cut back on the several of the smaller stops if you can't lop off London and Venice.

I count 18 locations in 21 days, and if your 21 days includes your arrival day and departure day, that means 18 places in 19 days. Even if you could teleport from place to place, that is only one day in each town. One day for London, one day for Paris, one day for Venice....why bother? You need to look at just how long it can take to get from one place to another, to start with. You can't count on the train being ready to leave when you are ready to catch it - there will be waiting. Then add in some extra time for getting to the train station, waiting for the train, getting out of the new station and to your hotel, getting checked in and settled, etc. Also subtract the time you will be eating, and time it takes to see any museums or tours you might be interested in. Make a list of your true priorities, then add in from there after you look at travel times. You just have to accept that you can't do everything, and start planning another trip.

I'd make a few changes. You probably can't do it all, but certainly most of it if you hustle...

London: (4 nights)
Paris: (4)
Paris - St. Goar (3): See your castles here. Rheinfels is right in St. Goar. Do daytrips to Marksburg castle, Bacharach, Oberwesel, Rüdesheim, a river cruise perhaps. No need to visit Koblenz.

St. Goar - Mainz for a half day (use lockers) - Rothenburg (2)

(skip Dinkelsbühl - there's no "easy train route.")

Rothenburg - Donauwörth (about 2 hours, Romantic Road town) (1): Drop bags, daytrip in afternoon to RR towns Nördlingen, Harburg, (both very close.)

Donauwörth - Munich (3): 1 daytrip to Garmisch and Mittenwald. 1 half-day trip to Dachau.

Munich - Salzburg (2)

Salzburg - Venice (2)

That's 21 nights. You might drop 1 night in St. Goar and add 1 night in Salzburg if you want a daytrip from Salzburg to Berchtesgaden or somewhere else. I'd catch a super-early train out of Salzburg to arrive in Venice in the early afternoon.

Hostels: Maybe, but generally not the best option in Germany, where you'll find comparable pricing and a superior experience in private B&B's.

Carol: My sister and niece took an extended European back packing trip. It was a highlight of their lives and something they talk about 20 years later.

I try to travel to places of the least resistance, traveling long distances between cities by European budget airlines if available. It looks like you really want to see London, Paris, Bavaria and Venice.

I would suggest you fly into Paris, do your tourist thing for 5 nights and take the Eurostar to London.

After you tour London area for 5 nights, take a budget flight on EasyJet.com into Venice for 2-3 nights.

Catch a train thru Innsbruck into Munich for 3-4 nights. You could easily spend the balance of your time visiting Garmisch/Fuessen, Berchtesgarten and Salzburg as day trips by train. Or you could rent a car to do day trips with.

The Munich Airport is a fine airport to fly back to the U.S. from.

carol,

To put it mildly, your proposed Itinerary is FAR too ambitious for a 21 day time frame. If I'm reading correctly, you're planning to visit 16 locations covering a fairly wide geographic area in 21 days, or an average of 1.3 days per location with NO allowances for travel times between each place. I'm not sure that's even possible? If it is even remotely possible, you're going to see the inside of lots of trains and rail stations, and very little of the sights of Europe.

IMO, this seems like the recipe for a stressful, hectic trip, one which wouldn't be enjoyable or something you'll want to remember. I'd highly recommend paring down the list of destinations to a more reasonable level. One method you might try is to list each of the places you want to visit in order of priority. Decide how long you want to spend in each one and calculate reasonable transportation times. There will undoubtedly be a few places on the bottom of the list that you can't get to, so plan to visit those on another trip.

Good luck with your planning!

I know this plan soundss very ambitious and I have added towns we would pass through rather than actually stay in as a means of following a specific route. We have been to London so I had palnned only our flight day and 2 days of sights then then evening train to Paris and 4 days in Paris Perhaps a flight from Paris to Venice would be a good idea and then continue on to Munich from there.

Carol,

If you want to follow the path of who/whatever, then go for it.

just so you know that time could be spent doing/seeing something.

Happy trails.

Thanks to all for some really good ideas, Russ I really love your advice and I may just add 2 days to the trip and follow your route for the most part. I will look into some in country flights or the night train to Venice. Thanks again so much to everyone
Carol