Diversity on RS Tours?

Dorothy:

Hello. I have been on two RS tours, each in 2022. Prior to my first RS trip, I had traveled overseas independently 17 times. Then I took a second RS trip. I wanted to try RS tours to see what they were like.

Overall, the groups were generally homogenous: mostly White, middle- and upper middle-class Americans.

However, there was some diversity. On the Eastern Europe tour, there was a Black man and two Latino individuals, one of whom grew up in Nicaragua and the other in the U.S. There was a Jewish couple; there might have been other Jewish people who chose not to identify their denomination. On the Rome tour, I think everyone was White, but I'm not completely sure.

On travel experiences, there were some who traveled internationally on their own. As I mentioned, I traveled pretty extensively on my own prior to the RS tours.

I think it's a little unusual that you knew that no one on your tour was jewish. Did you inquire after everybody's religious affiliation?

Out of curiosity I checked the Minorities tab on this Forum and their's only been 1 post this year and 5 last year. Maybe it's just not a popular tab.

My sample size is small with only 1 tour to draw on, but the only diversity in our group were the two Canadians. Both of us were white and both brought the average age down.

We definitely didn't take the tour due to fear of travel, our motivation was curiosity of what bus tours were like.

"I think it's a little unusual that you knew that no one on your tour was jewish. Did you inquire after everybody's religious affiliation?"

I was wondering the same thing. I have no idea what the religious affiliation was for anyone on my 12 tours. You didn't mention Asians but my last trip there were 3 folks of Asian descent, 2 from Vietnam and 1 Chinese, I think. I sat with them a couple of times and they were discussing where they were from, I didn't ask. I've traveled with people on tours who had Hispanic surnames but didn't inquire about ethnicity.

I don't find the folks on RS tours are "a little afraid to travel on their own". You have to get to the starting point on your own and that eliminates a lot of folks right away as they want to be met at the airport and have plane reservations organized for them. I also travel with Road Scholar and many of those travelers need a bit more hand-holding.

We’ve had Latinx, Asian and Jewish people on our 8 tours, youngest was 12 and oldest mid 80’s. Definitely skewed white and seemed middle class but to be honest we didn’t quiz anyone about income. Not since our first tour in 2013 has there been anyone who hasn’t traveled to Europe on their own before.

Well, I’m Jewish and I’ve been on 8 RS tours. So there’s that!

While the majority of RS travelers have been white and middle-class, some have been of other backgrounds. Age diversity has been greater during tours during school breaks (Christmas in Istanbul had several teens and young adults) and on shorter tours (adults who are still in the workforce are often limited in vacation time).

I have not found my tour mates “afraid to travel on their own.” In fact I have met many interesting and adventurous people on these tours. Most add independent travel before or after the tour, and many have traveled to places Rick doesn’t go. I love chatting with others on the tour to get ideas for myself!

Actually, one thing I appreciate about RS guides is their effort to educate travelers on how to navigate travel on their own and their encouragement to do so! I have used other tour companies and they do a lot more hand-holding. They seem to prefer to keep their tour participants somewhat dependent- more business for them down the road, I guess LOL!

We've been on 17 RSE tours, with age ranges from 9 to 86, I believe, skewing 50 and over, I'd say. Most of the tour members were white, a few Black. We've had a fair number of people who, when we were kids, were considered "white," but now seem to be reclassified as something else. We've been on tours with people from the Philippines, Iran, Syria, Mexico, Cuba, Puerto Rico, Guatemala, South Africa, and Canada. Rather more female than male. Most folks travel in couples or as families; we've traveled with a number of folks traveling single, and the vast majority of them were female.

I have no idea how many, if any, people were Jewish. There do seem to be a lot of Catholics, though. (I am Catholic; my husband is not. And we're both white, in our 70s now. We were in our early 60s when we took our first RSE tour.)

I also don't know how many people were "a little afraid to travel on their own," although a handful of people commented that they were more comfortable in a group. I suppose that may be what the OP meant.

We signed up for our first RSE tour to more or less get our feet wet in this European travel for pleasure thing. We had traveled abroad before, but always for work or school. After our first RSE tour, we kept coming back because we enjoyed the tours, and consider them good value.

So if you’re not African American, Hispanic, or Jewish (how exactly do you determine who is Jewish?), you are from the middle of the US & are afraid to travel without a tour group??

"I think it's a little unusual that you knew that no one on your tour was jewish. Did you inquire after everybody's religious affiliation?"

Touché! No, I didn't inquire. I was just wondering about diversity because it adds to my experience when there are people in a group who are different from me. Good to know there's been a little diversity on RS Tours.

I’m 85% Spanish, 5% Scottish, 7% Native American and 3% French, but many folks think I’m Jewish because of my last name.

Can’t get over why any Americans I’ve met (quite a few) do this, in my experience I usually get something along the lines of my great grandmother was Irish so I’m 20 % Irish , no your not your American Europeans don’t go around saying that or Asians I’ve met. Not having a rant just passing comment

Know one of the guides for Ireland and most groups are white between 40-80

Oh my, I also have to chime in because of the ‘middle Americans a little afraid to travel to travel on their own’. Seems an incorrect assumption to me knowing my own solo travel history and from talking to many people on the 5 tours I’ve taken.

On the tours I’ve taken there have been people who were Canadians, Filipinos, Chinese American, Japanese American, Indian American etc. These folks were 2nd generation Americans just as I am a 2nd generation Irish American so I’m not sure how you might regard them.

We had a lot of age diversity on our RS Venice, Florence, Rome trip. Had a couple of college age sisters, a grandmother and her high school aged granddaughter, a single in her early 20’s, a gentleman in his late 70’s, a couple of friends in their 30’s and the rest of us 50 plus. I have to say we had so much fun as a group. We enjoyed spending time with all of them. We enjoy going on tours because you don’t have to worry about planning all of your hotels, transportation (other than flights) and it’s been a lot of fun getting to know others in different life stages and from different parts of the U.S.

I have been on 4 RS tours and while they have been predominantly white, some folks have identified as Jewish and some were Hispanic and African American, Asian and even LGBTQ+! And ages have been 20s to upper 80s.
I have found most folks to be open minded and want to experience the food, art and culture. As for not wanting to travel on their own, that could be a reason, and for me it is just a great use to the ultimate resource-time. RS tours are very efficient as a way to see a lot on my limited vacation time. I don’t want to stand in lines for hours. I want to learn and enjoy my time off so a tour works for me. Ymmv

Race, ethnicity, religion should be non-issues.

They should be, sure. But the only people who have the luxury of thinking that's anywhere near the world we live in are those who've never experienced being a minority in the society in which they live. Ignoring the realities of minorities' experiences doesn't make them fade away.

On all our tours, most of the travelers were experienced at independent travel in Europe, and not timid, just not wanting to do the planning and logistics anymore.

I'm finding the original question and this whole discussion a bit odd - too many generalizations and assumptions. I started traveling on RS tours after decades leading tours in Asia, and in my experience, others on the four RS tours I participated in also had a wide range of travel and international work experience. They simply chose a tour for a variety of personal reasons. If the OP wants to label people, travelers in the tours I was on included immigrants to the US, first generation Americans, and among those who chose to talk about it, people holding all kinds of religious beliefs. Most of us chose not to dwell on any of that and focused on learning about the places we visited and on enjoying each other's company.

What about other ways of divvying us all up demographically?
Urban/Suburban/Rural ?
(or city mice vs. country mice)

Mountain folk / Valley folk ?
(or herders vs. farmers)

Coffee with the meal / Coffee after the meal / Tea Drinkers

Jocks / Student Gov't / Too-Cool-For-School

Tailored / Off-The-Rack / Hand-Me-Downs

Beanpoles / Pear-shaped / Beerbellies

Window open / Window closed

I can't figure out how to best express something like Californian or not-Californian that gets across what I mean,
but part of it is that we don't use the term Hispanic to describe Latinos.

I have to disagree that RS travelers are afraid to travel on their own. I took a RS tour after having been on numerous overseas trips on my own. Some of my fellow RS travelers were doing independent travel after the tour or, like me, had planned their own trips previously. I chose a RS tour for the efficiency of travel as we can’t be gone from the farm too long. There are lots of reasons for choosing a tour. Being afraid to travel independently is not necessarily the reason.

I find this whole topic fascinating!

Too many people who are not discriminated against just assume that discrimination doesn't exist. We (husband and I) belong to an LGBT hiking club. One of my straight friends says to me "why do you want to belong to a gay hiking club? You are excluding straight people!" But I have been on 3 RS tours and so far, my husband and I are the only gay couple. I don't want to exclude straight people, but it would be nice to not be the only gay couple.

I can understand why someone in an underrepresented group - for example, an African American, would prefer to find a tour that has some other people who look like them on the tour. It doesn't mean they don't like others or not want to be around them.

This is a great conversation to be having. We all should be listening more to each other and communicating. We shouldn't pretend that discrimination doesn't exist, that's not the way to solving the problems. Instead we should be talking to each other and trying to understand each other. Try to walk in the other person's shoes.

But assumptions are not the way to go: don't assume that we are "afraid to travel on our own". Jim and I went to New Zealand a few years ago and it was not a tour, but I felt like I missed so much being on our own. The RS tours help provide a framework for the trip, and it's fun to socialize with the others, even though we can both be introverted at times.

Thanks for your post.

A few random thoughts on this. Concerning Jewish participation, with a small percentage of total population, it stands to reason that most tours would not have a significant number of Jewish participants.

If the tours in general skew on the older side, not sure to what extent, but if they do, one thing to remember is that the older generations skew a bit whiter than US as a whole. These generations also have more assets and disposable income and kids who are grown. When we were younger a RS tour would have been out of the question due to finances and what to do about our young kids. Now the fast pace and early start times make the tours less attractive.

Also, with whites having ancestry ties to Europe, how many go on trips or tours to Europe due to such ties? I haven’t in particular, but knowing a relative left from near Prague to immigrate to US in the late 1800s for instance, made our visit there a bit more interesting.
So these factors might work as a force multiplier for the demographics of who goes on tours. I’d be interested in seeing demographics of who are donors to PBS stations in different areas and see if there are big disproportionate ethnic differences as well, not that it would represent an exact translation to RS tours but as another example of this phenomenon.

Also, with whites having ancestry ties to Europe, how many go on trips or tours to Europe due to such ties?

It's the same with many Latin Americans, it's a land of immigrants, many return to Europe, the Middle East, and Asia to discover their roots. In Spain I run into many Latin American tourists. Ever hear of the German villages of Argentina and Brazil? https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-28271797

Not the first time this question has come up, both in this form, with a focus on racial diversity, but also surrounding age, number of single people, I think even geographical area once.

I do not think anyone is surprised that the Rick Steves demographic tends to be older, white, upper middle class (though many would just call themselves middle class), probably higher educated, and engaged in some professional career. In the US, this is the same demographic that has the means and interest to travel to Europe, and probably crosses over into a major demographic of PBS.

That is not good or bad, just the way it is. You take a tour, that is what you can expect to see, with some variation, but do not count on a highly diverse group. You want something different, go somewhere different under a different mode of travel.

I have lurked around on this forum for just over 20 years as it went through various iterations. Another observation I can add is that the Rick Steves Demographic has changed over the years. The main characteristic is that it has aged, along with Rick. With that the focus has changed from frugal independent travel to a more higher end comfortable travel style. This includes lodging choices, transport, meals, etc. I have to admit, with my own aging, I have opted for a bit more comfortable travel, so I am not being critical, just observing.

The prevalence of those that primarily take tours has grown as well, the same with the RS business model. At one time you rarely saw tours discussed, now it is a good chunk of the topics. Rick Steves has always been in the tour business, but the tour side has steadily taken over, partly due to the realization that travel books as a business is a declining commodity, as is selling Rail Passes and tickets (everyone just goes direct now, probably foregoing a pass altogether) Even Lonely Planet is a shell of what it once was, and when I browse the guide shelf at one of the few remaining bookstores, beyond RS books, the selection is pretty thin.

Maybe the engineer in me finds data like this fascinating, maybe I am just being reflective as I get old. It does make me wonder what the future trend is. Lets face it, Rick must be getting ready to call it quits or take on an "Emeritus" role. Getting older means the people on these tours will not be around forever. Do things reach a static state? Crash altogether? Or re-set to something completely new?

Diversity on RS Tours question was so interesting to me because I have never thought about it. Going on our 5th RS Tour this fall. Feel so blessed to be able to experience the culture of different countries. Guilty of being middle Americans and a little afraid to travel on our own. We would have loved to travel when young but jobs and raising three amazing children took up our time and money. Now we are retired and our children are on their own so we can finally afford to travel. True I am a little afraid to travel on my own because I might miss something, spend time lost and end up staying in a tacky hotel. RS Tours work for us because we feel safe and well taken care. RS Tours have provided knowledgeable tour guides, clean buses with excellent drivers and comfortable hotels. My expectations for other tour mates is that they be polite and respectful of all tour members and people we encounter on the tour. I can not give a number of the different ethnic backgrounds, religious backgrounds or LGBTQ tour mates we have been with because it doesn’t matter to me so I don’t count. I just enjoy the tour mates and the memories we all make together.

A more diverse staff and public faceat RSE would certainly help reach
a wider demographic.

As an employee of a family owned business that is currently in the process of succession from Father to Daughter, and I'm currently involved with my own exit plan, I am curious about the RS company. I don't see a lot of public announcements of change as everything seems to be running well, but it would be fun to be a fly on the wall in board meetings. The topic of a vision for the future must come up. At some point I'd think the company will need to reach out for a younger and potentially more diverse customer base. The current customer base appears to be loyal, but it is aging.

Allan, this question has arisen previously. At one point, a RSE employee chimed in to say, rather coyly, that "a succession plan is in place."

No other info, at least that I've seen.

Glad Paul added his comment above!

I'm lagging behind the peloton of aging RS fans and still want the frugal close-to-the-ground advice and perspectives that made this community and business so valuable -- in the printed guidebooks there are now only a couple of lodging listings for a given locale that fit my low-budget demographic, darn. Where are us early middle age cheapskate blitz travelers supposed to get seasoned advice from now?

avirosemail; i think the RS format of travel has changed a lot over the years. Its all middle age upper middle income stuff now because, I assume, thats where the money is. RS served a purpose for younger budget travlers before the internet and when the world was a lot larger than it is now, but not so much any more. Just my uneducated impression.

Diversity: Has anyone spotted any confessed Republicans on a tour? Or do they have to stay in the closet?

A more diverse staff and public faceat RSE would certainly help reach
a wider demographic.

Alan, its a for profit corporation that caters to the largest and most profitable market segment.

On diversity, reminds me of a misconception about 10 years ago:

I went to a Klezmer concert at an outdoor venue in Budapest. I spoke to the old lady sitting next to me and discovered that her parents had taken her to South Africa before the holocaust reached Budapest and this was her first trip "home". At one point she looked around at the sell out crowd and said that she never thought she would see so many jews together in one place.

I asked her what a jew looked like and she went on to describe me ..... I smiled and told her I was a baptist to her great embarassment but we laughed and clapped hands and sang all night. Moral ... well you understand. Possibly the RS tours are more diversified than you think. But I bet not.

I have found the strangest experiences lately. I go on vacation and I end up with a lot of senior citizens. I volunteer at the food bank and it is the same demographic. I went to my high school reunion and, much to my surprise, it was this bunch of geezers again.

What could be happening?😀

Carol now retired, another of your great posts! Mister E, I loved the comment about Republicans, and as someone who is currently attending a Baptist Church, I think we would also be in the closet on that. And since we're talking about diversity, not all Baptists identify with the Republican base and our church is more "diverse" than what the OP thinks is the case with RS tours.

But I have been on 3 RS tours and so far, my husband and I are the only gay couple. I don't want to exclude straight people, but it would be nice to not be the only gay couple.

That's exactly what my husband and I have experienced on all of our RS tours. We have always been the only gay couple in each of them. Our tour guides have become increasingly adept at inclusion and others on the tour have become increasingly more inquisitive about our lives. "Are you two married?" has become de rigueur. There's much more interest and curiosity now from others in the groups. We do still sense a certain amount of unease around us though and it wouldn't surprise me to see it worsen considering recent events.

Lack of similar gay couples in the groups doesn't really bother us too much as we often become good friends with the women and/or men traveling singly or together. It works to everyone's benefit.

Sometimes you will casually discover people's religion affiliations. A fellow group member once told us she was Mormon after "The Book of Mormon" came up in conversation. She was perhaps the kindest member on the tour often offering to snap photos of my husband and I together. You know what they say about assumptions....if we had known her religion beforehand we would have been really reticent. For the record we both left our respective religious institutions at 18 - my partner was Catholic and I was in the most liberal Lutheran synod that evolved into the "Reconciling in Christ" of today. We've been without any involvement for 50 years even though there's an RIC site around the corner.

What I noticed the most was that every group has been completely white and definitely skewed to our retiree age group. It's much too complex to discuss the many issues and reasons involved. It's very noticeable to us as we've lived and worked in such an integrated locale for our entire adult lives.

We're still going to wear our wedding bands at all times but our list of potential destinations is shrinking again.

Cala, the last 4 or 5 times I attended a house of worship, it has been a Synagogue. Always amazes this old Baptist where he can find the presence of G-d. Interesting that RS, who promotes his relationship with his church does not, correct me if I am wrong, include an option for religious service on his Sunday (or Saturday) tours. Religious tour guests is a diversity after all.

Mr É, I was going to respond to one of your posts on this thread, and then I read the next one ...

We recently received our tour roster for an upcoming RSE tour, and I recognized a couple of names on them from another tour 7 years ago. They are two women who frequently travel together, but are from different countries. One of them I will always remember for a comment she made one day, that she had "found her niche as the token Republican on Rick Steves tours."

And I believe you met a couple of my friends from Oklahoma recently, who also fit that demographic. So they are out there!

As a practicing Catholic, I have been somewhat frustrated by the problems I sometimes have squeezing attendance at Mass into our tour schedules. When we were on tour in Sarlat last year, there was no Vigil Mass (Saturday evening worship that "counts" as Sunday) in the town, and our bus was leaving early Sunday, before the first scheduled Mass. I remember joking (sort of) that had my dad been on the tour, he would have let the air out of the bus's tires to delay its departure long enough for him to attend the Sunday service.

I'm surprised that Silas Marner has had tour mates who asked if they were married. That seems awfully intrusive to me; it would never occur to me to ask any couple if they were married. There have been couples on our tours that we thought were married, but weren't, and I'm sure some we assumed weren't, who indeed were. I think the only people I remember having mentioning their marital status were newlyweds, or couples celebrating an anniversary.

Interesting. And I agree that "diversity" covers more than ethnicity. We've always been surprised (and even a bit disappointed) when everyone on a tour "looked like us." Part of the fun of being in a group is meeting people we would not normally spend that much time with at home.

My only requirement for other tour members is “ no grumps”! We’ve been on RS tours with young, old, gay, Hispanic, Jewish, and who knows what else. Our tours last year skewed younger. Most were 30 to 40 ish with a few 60 70+. Only once was there a group of three who were self centered and simply did not fit in. Nobody was rude to them that I could see. Either they sensed they didn’t jive or their plan all along was to do their own thing. They skipped many scheduled attractions.
We are not afraid to travel independently and have done so. We also enjoy traveling with a tour and look forward to meeting wonderful tour mates.

If you're ever on a tour with me or my sister, there will be at least one Jew in the group. She and I do not travel together. So far, my list of RS tours is completely different from hers.

I'm not afraid to travel alone. When going to just 1 or maybe 2 places, I will travel alone. Beyond that, I just don't have the bandwidth to do that kind of planning any more. It's so much easier to find a good tour and leave the majority of the planning to someone else.

As several people have mentioned, there are many ways to count diversity. I just find it fascinating to talk to people and learn about their lives. On an RS tour I've found myself talking to ranchers and teachers, artists and businessmen, nurses and engineers. It is amazing the different perspectives people bring to the table.

I'm surprised that Silas Marner has had tour mates who asked if they were married. That seems awfully intrusive to me; it would never occur to me to ask any couple if they were married.

Jane, it didn't occur to me before but you are right that it is intrusive. I was actually rather pleased to have people interested enough to ask. I hope it indicates a comfort level that hasn't existed in the past and any question gives an opportunity to increase understanding. What I do find most offensive is calling my identity a "preference".

I went shopping in thr "bad" quarter of Budapest a few days ago with a young lady (all ladies are young) who is culturally, religiously, and racially quite different than I am (substantially shorter too). After the 3rd stranger asked if we were married, I just started answering yes. I could do worse .... her too.

I don't see why asking if we are married is intrusive. What's the reason for that? I suppose there are all sorts of potentially intrusive questions, from questions about your heritage to questions about your finances. People have different boundaries and I suppose you have to learn to set your own limits and say "I would rather not discuss that".

But I know some people feel awkward interacting with people from other demographics, especially if they haven't done it in the past; Like Silas, I am happy if people ask me a question such as "are you married?" - they are making an effort to reach out and show their interest in me. Is that any different from me asking them "do you have any kids/grandkids?" This is how we form connections and share parts of our lives with others.

Years ago, on a business trip to our office in India, I was a little shocked when a colleague there asked me if I believed in God. That's not something we would ever ask at work in the US! So yes, I guess there are limits.

I knew I had met my soulmate in 1985 when we got sex, religion and politics out of the way in the first hour of our first date. Still together 38 years later. I asked her a lot of things, but it never occurred to me to ask if she was married. Glad she wasn't.

Maybe I’m an outlier, but I find many of the questions that some people ask to be intrusive, especially when the questions come immediately upon meeting. Questions about marital status, work, spouse’s line of work (!), children, grandchildren, etc. can feel like an inquisition.

I find the children/grandchildren question to be particularly awkward – when I answer “no,” the questioner nearly always seems to be uncomfortable and either tells me “That’s OK” or they move on to talk to someone else, or they try to change the subject or they begin to talk at length about their family/ kids/ grandchildren.

All of these things might come up eventually in natural conversation as we get to know each other and that’s fine, but as automatic questions when first meeting someone, it’s a little much. Feels like a rapid “ticking of boxes” to assign labels and see if we have anything in common, which feels rather superficial. We might have a great deal in common, such as books we like, places we are interested in, hobbies, volunteer work – in spite of having different backgrounds, family structures, jobs, etc.

This will be our first RS tour since we usually travel on our own. I’m half Jewish. But honestly I don’t think the subject of religion has ever been a conversation in our travels. My husbands father was black and again never brought up in conversation. I love meeting people from around the world and always have a great time. We even talked politics with a group from South Africa last year. Looking forward to our trip!

I assume the OP is not suggesting that RS implement an “affirmative action” plan to increase diversity on tours. As others have pointed out, RS tours are self selective with no discrimination other than time and resources to travel. And politics is seldom discussed in my experience, although as the only Floridian on a Sicily tour his spring, I was asked about the ongoing battle between our Governor and Disney. I was happy to provide some historical data and my take on the current controversy. No one was offended. In the 9 RS tours I have taken, most tour members were white and retired but had very diverse backgrounds, interests, jobs and religions. The number one reason my wife and I take RS tours is the people we meet from whom we always learn and with whom we always bond.

Maybe I’m an outlier, but I find many of the questions that some people ask to be intrusive, especially when the questions come immediately upon meeting.

I must be an outlier too. I don't look or sound like the people where I live, plus I have a surname no one can pronounce, so I'm constantly asked "where are you from?" within seconds of meeting anyone. I've lived in the US for most of my adult life...it's my home...but they want to know where I'm "from." I know 99% of people asking are just being friendly and making conversation and I don't take offence, but it's always a jarring reminder that I'm viewed as being different.

Feels like a rapid “ticking of boxes” to assign labels and see if we
have anything in common, which feels rather superficial.

Conversations need to start somewhere.

Conversations need to start somewhere.

If you get stumped https://youtu.be/qeFlDoepDR0?t=7

Roubrat, unfortunately I get a message that that video is unavailable in my country.

roubrat, I get the opposite-"I know where you're from". It even happened at a grocery store in Russia, from another American

And I can't imagine asking people on a tour if they're married. It's none of my business. There are plenty of more relevant questions I can ask, such as "what are you especially looking forward to on this tour?" or "If I visited your home city, what sights should I see?".

I’m not easily offended so ask away!

cala, did they guess correctly?

I guess I'm in the outlier camp, too. Frankly, I hate it when right out of the box (rather than waiting a minute or two and figuring it out) people ask me if I'm his daughter (I'm not, I'm his wife), or if I have grandchildren (I don't; and I don't want to explain that both of my sons have autism and intellectual disability. If one of them were to become a dad, I'd really be in trouble.) And while I'm at it, just because I don't have grandchildren/overachieving children, it doesn't mean I want to hear about your brain-surgeon-and-astronaut-in-their-spare-time children/grandchildren. It may make you feel better to tell the world of their achievements, but being at the receiving end of that isn't so great. My view is that my marital status, kids, job, and religion/politics are none of anyone's business, especially upon first meeting. I'll tell you if the need arises or I want you to know. A lot of uncomfortable stuff lies under the surface for many people. It's best to leave it there. There is a certain level of protection and anonymity in a forum like this as I am nameless and faceless. And, I'm unlikely to ever meet any of you in person, so I divulge some information to illustrate the other side. In person, I'd rather you stick to questions about favorite vacation destinations, hobbies or the weather.

I guess I'm on Team Outlier too. I don't have children due to medical issues. It never ceases to amaze me that people who I barely know will ask me why I don't have any children. I would never ever ask someone why they HAVE children.

I don't think it's insensitive to ask if you're married and have children, to me those are normal and polite conversation starters. But I do think it would be insensitive to ask why as a follow up question.

I would never ever ask someone why they HAVE children.

I always answer, accidents, never wanted them. Usually the last question I get.

I'm surprised that Silas Marner has had tour mates who asked if they were married. That seems awfully intrusive to me; it would never occur to me to ask any couple if they were married

The RS tours I've been on start on the first early evening with a group meeting and as part of that everyone introduces themselves (pro tip - print off the roster from your tour package and bring it to the meeting to jot notes). Often people will say "I'm here with my spouse X" as they introduce themselves. They also often volunteer if they're working or retired, if they've been on other RS tours, etc. But if people haven't volunteered info about marriage or career I don't ask.

Recent comments are evidently from travelers outlier than I am, but I can mask being a bit outly by ignoring other people's stories and just going on and on about myself -- that's a kindness, since by being selfish I'm not intruding into anyone else's business. No need to engage in the pretense of being interested in your identity or relations or career just so I can talk about mine! Someone always hogs the limelight or wants to, so why shouldn't it be me who makes a blowhard of myself and puts others off instead of leaving that to another? If i turn out the outliest of a group or an occasion, so be it.

[Do I need to mark this with a tongue-in-cheek emoji or a /s ? ]

Avi rose mail! Haha!

roubrat, do many of the people where you live talk with a certain accent? So yes, all I have to do is open my mouth and people will get it right.

Well darn wish I had never read this question regarding diversity and all the comments. I tend to be a bit introverted and struggle to feel comfortable the first few days on a RS Tour. Now feeling like the next tour we take I should just keep my mouth shut and not try to be too friendly because some where along the line I might offend someone and not even know it.

Some people must think my wife is a horrible person, 3 years after our only RS tour and she still remembers everyone's name, where they're from and some brief personal notes about them such as kids, jobs, spouses and favourite travel memories.

I'm not sure if it happens on every tour, but after a couple of days the guide played a name-game to help us remember everyone's name. My wife was the first to be able to list off everyone's names, and did it easily without a bat of an eye. Could it be that some people aren't intrusive, but ask and listen because they're interested?

after a couple of days the guide played a name-game to help us remember everyone's name

RS loves this game and requires all guides to do it. Many people on the tours don't like it, though. I've heard rumors that some guides tell their tour group they're not doing the game but if anyone were to ask of course they did it ;-)

John, on two out of my three RS tours, the guides did not do the name games. Thankfully.

I think we've only done the name game on 4 or 5 tours, out of 17. Actually, I can only remember 3 for sure; I added on one or two more, assuming I'd forgotten some.

We have done the buddy introduction on three tours, one of which also had the name game.

I know people hate the name game, but it only takes about 10 minutes, and it works! As the circle progresses, you can see folks rooting for everyone to get the names right. By the end, all the people are quietly chanting the names.

And the last time we were on a tour that did the name game, the guide confided to us later that although it was supposed to be for the tour members, he always did it for himself, to help him learn everyone's names as soon as possible.

Jacq,

I too am introverted, but as I get older, I try to take a "who cares what other people think" attitude. This is especially hard for me because I was brought up to believe that everyone else's impression of me is more important than my own (the problem with having low-self-esteem parents!) but I have found that the more outgoing I am, the better off I am. So I push myself, and if someone thinks my question is too intrusive, they don't have to answer it.

I would strongly encourage you to be outgoing. Despite all the people who call themselves "outlier" in this thread, there are lots of people who do not get offended by polite questions. I believe that showing an interest in others is the best way to make real connections.

That's my two cents. Apparently others feel differently. That's ok too.

and by the way, nobody seemed to explain why asking if one is married is offensive. All I heard is "it's none of your business". But I don't honestly know what that means, other than "I don't want to tell you and I think it's rude you asked." Why is it rude? Honest question here, not trying to ignite a war!

In some countries, strangers discuss politics with each other without fear of being offended or offending others; apparently religion is also discussed in some countries (at least, if my India experience is any indication). But in the US those two, along with financial resources questions, are considered off limits. OK, I get that, but I think the line is vague; is it ok to ask "do you have any pets?" If yes, then why not children? Clearly children are of more importance than pets, so it seems odd that we would care about someone's pets more than their children. If those are not ok, then how about "what are your hobbies?" Still too intrusive? Do you see what I am getting at: where is the line?

I wish our guide had done the name game on our tour in June. I was really trying to remember names, but with several duplicate names and six J's - it took awhile. I was relying on a fellow tour member who took copious notes at the introduction meeting.

Our group certainly wasn't composed of people afraid to travel on their own. Most were very well traveled, and had very interesting pre and post tour independent travel planned. We had six Canadians, and 22 Americans.

As far as visible diversity, yes, almost all were White. But politically we went from the left (probably me, as a union rep), to the right (at least one Republican voter). Not that there was a lot of political talk, but he "came out" to me partway through, lol. Our group was very cohesive and spent a lot of time together even during free time.

nobody seemed to explain why asking if one is married is offensive

It isn’t offensive, but it can feel intrusive.

I am single and have no children. When someone I don’t know asks me about my marital status or whether I have children, their reaction to my response is often an awkward silence while they figure out what to say next. It can feel judgmental, although I know this was not their intention. In my experience, people who are married with kids often volunteer this information as you get to know them so I never feel the need to ask upfront.

When traveling on a RS tour, I prefer to focus on questions about people’s travels (e.g., Have you been on other RS tours?, When did you arrive?, etc.) rather than their personal life. The exception might be, ”Where are you from?”

I took my first RS tour in 1991. Back then the majority of the tour members were from the Pacific Northwest.

I'm surprised that Silas Marner has had tour mates who asked if they were married. That seems awfully intrusive to me; it would never occur to me to ask any couple if they were married. There have been couples on our tours that we thought were married, but weren't, and I'm sure some we assumed weren't, who indeed were. I think the only people I remember having mentioning their marital status were newlyweds, or couples celebrating an anniversary.

Well, after seeing how far astray the conversation has wandered, I'm beginning to be sorry I posted that.

I've been trying to figure out why I think asking a couple, not one person but a couple, if they are married is intrusive. It's tricky, and the line is definitely smudgy. I'm thinking of one couple we met on a tour who seemed to be "a couple," but it turns out they only see each other when they travel together. I'm thinking of one couple we knew who never knew quite what to say when someone asked if they were married, because one of them was; the other wasn't, although they did live together.

I guess I was thinking that there were people who might be uncomfortable being asked about something that intimate. Evidently, lots of folks see it differently, which is fine, of course. We started talking about diversity, right? So different is good!

I don't mind being asked if I have children, but I do think people asking "Why not" definitely are crossing a line.

As an aside that is loosely related: we've noticed on our last few RSE tours that far more people are showing off photos of their pets than of their grandchildren. That's new!

Edit to add: Laura was evidently posting while I was typing; what she said!

Still too intrusive? Do you see what I am getting at: where is the line?

That's the problem. Everyone draws the line differently and it's invisible. Until you ask a question there is no way to tell if the person finds it an "interrogation of things that are none of you business" or a conversation starter that indicates you are interested in getting to know the person.

If nobody asks a question you end up with a situation of the 4-way Stop where everyone is super polite and waits for the other car to go first. You sit and stare.

OK, this is really a side question but I’m curious. I’ve been on 6 RS tours, until the one I took in May I’ve never had a guide ask in the meeting if there were any medical professionals in the group. Turns out we had 1 MD, 1 RN. Have any of you had that on your tours? It surprised me, I thought it was a bit intrusive.

until the one I took in May I’ve never had a guide ask in the meeting if there were any medical professionals in the group. Turns out we had 1 MD, 1 RN. Have any of you had that on your tours?

On one of my RS tours, one of the tour members slipped and broke her leg. We happened to have an ER physician, a pediatrician, and 3 nurses on the tour. Needless to say, she was in good hands until the ambulance arrived.

Maybe the guide asked because they had a similar experience.

Tony

I do appreciate your reply and thank you for it.

One tip for everyone on a tour: take a photo of the tour roster and make it your phone default image. Then you can look down on your phone anytime to see the names!

It took me three tours to figure this out.

Wow! Did I miss something? Did I need to fill out a diversity questionnaire when I signed up for a RS tour. I thought it would be a group of travelers interested in the culture and region they were about to visit. I had no idea it was about pre-judging fellow tour members to see how many boxes they can check off on the diversity list. I guess I should have purchased the "cancel for any reason travel insurance".

Sandi, don't push that "cancel" button quite yet! I wondered when this post first came out if it might be a troll. The wording was provocative and calculated to prick people and get responses. It worked. The OP may or may not have intended to get a lot of people worked up, but certainly managed to do so!

A tour that is open to anyone who cares to register and pay the cost will always be limited to a demographic of a certain economic strata. I don't think that RS Europe can control (or wants to control) who signs up for their tours. You sign up, you pay, you go. No other requirements or questions asked. (well you do have to handle your own luggage.....)

I have found on my 5 RS tours that my fellow tour mates came from a variety of places and had a variety of past experiences. The one common thread was a desire to travel and explore. Tour members were friendly, easy to get along with, and a pleasure to travel with. One is free to share as little or as much about oneself as you like. I can think of introductions at the first meeting when we were supposed to say our names, where we were from and one interesting fact about ourselves. You picked the fact and then that was that.

Don't let this thread keep you from anticipating a great tour with a congenial group of people.

I thought it was a legitimate topic for discussion, it just went sideways as people read more into it than was intended.

A bit of informal asking others on our tours, and many of the people we've met had no prior knowledge of RS or especially his politics. That is, they were not familiar with the TV program, radio show, or even his guidebooks. I had no idea he ran tours for years after first coming across his books and watching his program. So when word of mouth and the large number of repeat travelers is your customer base, the makeup of the groups are not surprisingly not too representative of the population at large.

We've found a wide variety of ages on Rick Steves tours, but I would guess the youngest couple we've seen on the 2 tours we've done were in their late 30s.

On the other end of the age spectrum, we traveled in Tuscany with a couple in their late 70s, and on our Loire valley tour there was a man who was 84 and who kept up with the group with no apparent trouble at all.

I had no idea he ran tours for years after first coming across his
books and watching his program.

I had no idea he had books even after watching his show for a couple of years, then in winter of 2013, I discovered his books, but still had no idea he had tours until about 2016, and then it was still about another year before I discovered this Forum.

Maybe I'm part of a clueless demographic that businesses try to find.

Thank you Carol NR for adding some common sense to all this.

On my 17 Days Best of Italy tour, we had 1 physician and 2 pharmacists!

To the commenter who is concerned about a diversity checklist, don’t worry about it. I’ve been on 9 tours and am embarking on my 10th mid-September. We’ve had a.wide variety of people traveling with us. On almost all of the tours, we bonded fairly well, no matter our demographics, ages, etc.

I can think of introductions at the first meeting when we were supposed to say our names, where we were from and one interesting fact about ourselves. You picked the fact and then that was that.

Now, this one would have me quaking in my boots. One interesting fact? The only thing that pops into my mind is the family trait of the little toe on our right foot that turns under. Probably not of general interest.

I think on all of the 17 tours we've been on, we are asked to give our name, whether or not it's our first RSE tour, and often why we chose this tour.

Some people give their occupation at this time, but not all. We don't, for a number of reasons. We have found that the tours seem to lean very heavily toward teachers (at all levels, from preschool to college professors) and, curiously enough, medical personnel. Lots of nurses, pharmacists, and dentists, especially. Some doctors, but they seem less likely to out themselves.

Jane, I'm at a loss about interesting facts about me as well. It's something that occasionally gets asked at group strategy sessions on business trips-often in the US. One time when I was at a loss, a guy I'd known for years told me to say that I carry hockey sticks in my car year round-he was always amused by that. I did say that and the Americans loved it. I must have been confirming a stereotype, and to this day one of the guys in that group; now the CEO of a large corporation still asks me if I still have sticks in my car. I do.

Tony, people can usually choose whether or not to have pets(I do realize that living situation can deny people that choice), but not everyone can choose whether or not to have children, so that question can be hurtful to those who wanted to be parents but couldn't, for whatever reason. The same thing applies to marital status. Asking someone who has just been widowed about their marital status could be an unwelcome reminder of their pain. Obviously, these questions aren't hurtful to many, but why risk hurting someone unnecessarily?

To cala's point, I used to work with someone who had had one child and that child died. She once confided that it would almost trigger a panic attack when her and her husband were asked in social settings "do ya'll have kids?" The question itself isn't meant to be harmful at all (and I get that, and I personally don't care if I'm asked) but thinking of her reminds me that we often don't know what's going on under the surface.

Allan, I smiled when I read your post, because I find you so interesting, and have ever since I first read the South of France scrapbook that you and Carla entered in the contest. You and I have traded comments and observations for the past few years, along with everyone else here, of course.

You're at the top of my list of "Forum Folk I'd like to meet In Real Life." But how would you put that in a sentence? Now I'm laughing: Tour Guide: "Say something interesting about yourself." Allan: " Well, there's this woman on the Forum who would thinks I'm particularly thoughtful and would like to meet me."

Definitely Lol.

I will say, I have met about a dozen or more Forum Folk in real life, and have been charmed and delighted by each and every one. Ditto for the vast majority of people we've met on RSE tours. Regardless of which diversity boxes we can check.

Travel on!

Dorothy,
You may gave gotten more responses than you expected. I have taken 4 tours. The majority of tour goers were white, over 60 and educators. However, my tour mates also included a teenager, two 20 somethings, at least one ethnic Jewish person, a Greek expat, African Americans, a few Asians and a Republican or two.

If you ask me a possibly intrusive question, I will assume that your intentions are benign unless I have a reason to think otherwise. I will answer if I choose or deflect you politely.

I don't think that asking a recently widowed person if they are married will increase their pain by reminding them that they have lost a life partner. They don't ever forget it. I do think it is possible that it will give them the opportunity to speak about their grief, which is frequently a positive outlet. And of course if you ask the question, you should be gracious about how you receive the answer.

As a friendly introvert, I don't really mind being asked personal questions. As a privatish person, I am comfortable deciding what information to share and what not to....and how to do that. But because of being an introvert I tend to be fairly careful bout what I ask others. I tend to keep conversation general and wait until the other person mentions a spouse/partner/child/occupation/politcal view/religion before speaking about the topic.

I am fearless about asking about pets, however. I feel it is a fairly safe topic.

Obviously, these questions aren't hurtful to many, but why risk hurting someone unnecessarily?

Clearly, this is a topic that we'll all have to agree to disagree. As a parent who many years ago felt the pain of losing a child, I'm happy to talk about it. I remember walking into a room months after it happened and people were still trying to avoid me rather than risk that I might bring it up. I would have liked nothing better.

Edit to add: this isn't the topic I bring up at sessions when you're asked to share something interesting about yourself..😉

@Allan,
Thank you for sharing.

As to the issue of being “a little afraid to travel on their own,” I always remind those who are skeptical of the group/bus experience that many RS travelers combine the tour with an independent component either before or after.

We always plan three days somewhere within a two-hour train trip of our RS departure city. We call it “pre-gaming.” For example, we are getting ready to take the Germany Austria Switzerland tour next month. We will pregame in Belgium in an Airbnb for a quick jog to Ghent and Bruge. Quick train over to Cologne the morning of the tour’s beginning.

It serves several purposes: 1) no jet lag by the time we meet in the RS lobby; 2) we get well-set with Euros in smaller denominations; 3) we always find an apartment with a clothes washer, so we start the tour with a suitcase full of clean clothes; and 4) we get to scout out another country or region for a future tour.
In summary, many RS travelers are perfectly capable of independent travel.

At the intro meet up for the RS Adriatic tour in June, our guide requested that if we had any medical personnel in the tour to please let her know sometime that evening. That was a nice way to let them have the ability to still be incognito, if they wished.

Our guide did the Name Game on this tour but in the best way I’ve experienced. She did it a few days into the tour and said we shouldn’t be worried about it at all. Of course, I was checking faces with my roster on the bus - LOL! She did it in the courtyard of a winery after lunch when we were all mellow. She had us stand in a circle. The first person said their name, the second person said their own name - first person could say it at the same time, if they wished. 3rd person said their own name - 1st & 2nd could say it with the 3rd person, if they wished. Etc. around the circle. So, the volume increased, but no one was put on the spot. One person at the end wanted to try saying all of them & did.

We have only done the original RS name game once on all our tours. Very embarrassing for several of the tour members like me who could not remember the names and equally embarrassing for some whose names were missed. I have always appreciated our Best of England tour guide who at one of the first group dinners requested that each of us sit at a table with fellow travelers we didn’t know, no spouses or buddies. He felt that the best way to get to know each other was to share a meal and that was what his group meals were for. I still think about that when the tour guide suggests some variation of the name game and everyone groans.

In May 2023 our tour guide had the most effective tool to enable remembering names. He snapped photos of each couple or single traveler and using his IT skills created a page containing all the photos with names attached to each one. He emailed them to each of us and printed hard copies as well. Everyone carried this document with them and names were learned faster than I've ever seen. It really helped too since several people shared my partner's name. He used his more formal "Michael" moniker (I call him that and that's his social media moniker) while two others used "Mike". I wish RS would adopt this technique for all tours.

Silas - Yes, the photos w/names is the way to go! In all my RS tours, only one guide did that, and it was sooooooo helpful!

The Name Game is just too stressful and fortunately I've only encountered that a couple times. Once, the guide did it but with everyone repeating the names (each person says their name, everyone repeats it). Other guides have done buddy introductions - this is just "OK" as I'm waiting/stressing for my turn and not really getting much out of the other presentations. And some have done "two truths and a lie" which gamifies it but also doesn't help nearly as much as the photo sheet.

Now I'm wondering how many Black and Hispanic tourists from the US I've encountered in Europe. I've never paid much attention, but I don't think I've met many at all. OTOH when I go to tourist sights here in Israel, I often meet US tour groups that are mostly/all Hispanic and lots of Black groups from Africa - the ancient Christian religious sights are a big draw here - they are all in the Bible. Where else can you walk on the same pavement Jesus could have walked.

Where do people hear about RS tours and guide books? I found the forum first and only years later went on my first (of 3) RS tours. Many of the people on my tours didn't even know about the forum.

I also didn't get the impression on my tours that any folks were at all afraid to travel on their own. Everyone seemed to be a veteran traveler who chose the tour because of convenience and/or content. My tours were Turkey, Greece and Alpine.

I hate the name game. I'm terrible at remembering names to the point of being grateful when someone doesn't remember mine. One guide said she also disliked it and her variation was for everyone to say each name in unison. That way people who didn't remember weren't embarrassed. Another guide had a brilliant solution. Each person had to explain how they got their name. Some of the stories were memorable - at least for the duration of the tour - almost all were either amusing or interesting.

Just a quick comment, no time for more right now: we met the group for our Portugal tour last night. There are 27 tour members, all pretty much of retirement age, although a few are younger. Three people are from Canada, the rest live in the States. One of the latter was of Chinese heritage - she was actually born there; I don’t know yet how long she has lived in the US. Another person is from Mexico, although he has lived in the States for some time now.

Just a quick comment, no time for more right now: we met the group for
our Portugal tour last night.

Good luck with the name game Jane. I'm cheering for you.