Germany trip planning help for this summer.

I know I have gotten a lot of suggestions for Salzburg but we might have to skip that. Berchtesgaden is a must for me.

I guess this is a lot to see in a short time, but I thought most of the trips I listed above were easy day trips from Munich.

This is what I was thinking:

Day 1: Arrive Frankfurt Rhine River

Day 2: Rhine River. Train to Rothenburg

Day 3: Rothenburg Train to Munich

Day 4: Munich (One of above day trips)

Day 5: Munich (One of above day trips)

Day 6: Munich (One of above day trips)

Day 7: Munich (One of above day trips)

Day 8: Munich (No day trip) Night train to Berlin?

Day 9: Berlin

Day 10: Berlin

Day 11: Berlin to Dublin (latest flight of the day)

Gary,

Could you indicate why Berchtesgaden is "a must" to see?

If you're interested in the WW-II history, you might consider taking a day trip with one of the local tour firms.

Check the websites for Bob's Tours (departure from Salzburg) or Eagle's Nest Tours (take train or Bus to Berchtesgaden to meet the tour).

You'd need some type of transportation to get to the Dokumentation Centre and Bunkers which are above Berchtesgaden. The exhibits are all in German, however they provide Audioguides which can be set for English.

There's also a Salt Mine there which can be toured. It's a wonderful and picturesque alpine town, so I'm sure you'll enjoy your visit there.

Happy Travels!

OK, feasible, but not desirable.

Thanks for the tips Steve. I was thinking about spending 5 nights in Munich to hit all the day trips I had listed. What we might do instead is leave Munich, stay in Salzburg, and then take the train to Berlin.

Okay, seriously, you've got 9 days, and 8 cities listed. I'd cut Salzburg, although I love it, it's worth more than a day trip. I'd tell you to cut Berlin, too, but I'm assuming you've already got your flight booked out of there. I'd also consider cutting Berchtesgaden. With a lot of those being day trips out of Munich, you can always decide the day of whether you want to do it or not.

I think going to the Rhine on the day you land would be fine. It'll help with the jetlag to be outside and moving around.

I'd stop in Nurnberg on the way from Rothenburg to Munich.

Berchtesgaden is probably a must for me, being a history teacher and all. I know this seems like a lot and I could always cut a few things. Berlin isn't a for sure thing yet. I figured most of our day trips from Munich would be easy to handle. The one I wasn't sure aboutwas the Berchtesgaden/Salzburg trip.

How many days would you suggest on the Rhine without a car?

Get your rail schedules and fares from the German Rail schedule and fare webpage.

I saw all I wanted to see of Salzburg in a day, but spent two days in Berchtesgaden (Eagles' Nest, Dokumentation Center, Königssee). You can get from Munich to Salzburg on regional trains with a €28 Bayern-Ticket. There is a bus, the Waltzmann Express, RVO 840, that goes hourly from the Salzburg Hbf to Berchtesgaden Hbf. If you get an RVO Tagesticket (€9 per adult) it will cover all of you bus transportation, RT from Salzburg to Berchtesgaden as well as all the local buses in Berchtesgaden, except the special mountain buses for Hintereck to Kehlsteinhaus (Eagles' Nest).

Dachau is a suburb of Munich, about a 40 min trip by S-Bahn and bus from the Munich Hbf. You should be able to get there and take the tour put on by the Memorial and get back in 4-5 hours. Buy a Munich XXL Partner Tageskarte (day ticket for up to five people) from an automat for €12,30. That will cover unlimited travel on all modes of transport in the inner two zones of the MVV (Munich metro) for the day. Dachau is in the second zone. Everything else in Munich is in the first (inner) zone. A Partner Tageskarte for the inner zone is €9,40.

For days when you do day trips outside of Munich, buy your Bayern-Ticket the night before for the next day. Then it will also cover your travel in Munich to the Hbf, as long as you start after 9 AM on a workday.

For help on getting to the castles, see my webpage.

First off, you are trying to fit in far too much for only 9 days. 8 destinations in 9 days? Not going to work, especially with Berlin. To answer some specific questions:

1) It is physically possible to see both Berchtesgaden and Salzburg in one day from Munich, but you won't see much of either. Throw in Hitler's Kehlsteinhaus, and you won't have time for much more than hopping on and off the train in Salzburg.

2) RailEurope. Just kidding, the Deutsche Bahn website.

3) The best way to see the Rhine would be by car or cruise. Many of the scenic day cruises along the Rhine do not travel as far north as Remagen. If you wanted to go there, you might have to take the train.

4) A cruise would be difficult on your first day, although you could easily take a quick train ride to Mannheim to see the river itself. This probably isn't what you wanted, though.

5) Yes, but except as mentioned above with Salzburg and Berchtesgaden, you would need separate days for each trip.

Wow what an agenda. I have been to all these places and my wife is a romantic. If your wife is the same she will never forgive you if you dont do 2 things and she finds out later how cool they are. If she is not, then your agenda might work. Salzburg at night is the best time to see it. It is all lit up,all the tourists are in their hotels and a night walk through the old city with nearly empty streets except for fun locals that want to chat is not to be missed. The night watchman does a tour in Rothenburg that is the best part except for walking the wall. Next it didnt look like to me you leave much time for Munich to actually see it. It is really cool. I would probably arrive on day 1 and take an afternoon cruise on the Rhein. Next day I would cruise on the Mosel visit a town or two and see if you can catch a late train to Rothenburg.. Day 3 I would do Rothenburg,stay the night and do the night watch tour. Day 4 I would go to Munich and enjoy the town during the afternoon and evening.Day 5 Dachau and Munich. Day 6 The castles in Fuessen. Day 7 Go early to Salzburg and see area and take night walk(with good camera that takes night shots. Day 8 Eagles nest and area with night train to Berlin (I have never checked to see if there is this option from Salzburg). If that is possible you have Days 9 and 10 and 11 in Berlin. Have fun whatever you decide but always remember you will go back so dont rush to much and you can see what you miss this time the next time you go.

I like what Terry proposed, but I would definitely spend at least one night in Salzburg. From hotels in Salzburg you can get tickets (all hotels sell them) to Bergtesgarden,(Hitler's Eagles next tours are good, and take only half a day) or tours to the Sound of Music sites, and even to the salt mines (I am planning on that next myself...especially if it rains). The evenings in the cities are special. I loved Salzburg then and Rothensburg too. With Rothensburg it is better when the tour buses leave and you stay at a hotel inside the walls of the town--like a trip to the past.
I personally have no desire to see Berlin, unless I have seen all of the Rhine and Lake Constance too. my personal feeling tho.

The train trip from the Rhine to Rothenburg will take most of a day IF you make all your connections. There a a couple of train changes and some are pretty tight. We missed one connection last year by a couple of minutes and had to wait more than an hour for the next one. Like everyone else has said, too much here in too little time. I'm planning another trip this year and am allowing a couple of nights at each stop to make it less hectic. I think the cruise is perfect for the first day. It'll get you outdoors without being too strenuous as you adjust to the time change. I'm not as prone to jet lag as a lot of people but found this a good way to recover from the long trip and reset my clock. I'll be taking some of the same route you're planning but no Munich or Salzburg. Think about cutting out some of your stops so you can enjoy the places you actually visit.

Berlin is not that close to the rest -- maybe save that for another trip. (We are going to do it in the future along with Prague and Dresden on the same trip).

Nurnberg is a great stop, can be done as a daytrip from Rothenburg with a car. They have park and rides in Nurnberg, that's what we did. Could also be done on the train. We went for the Documentation Center, which was great, but the German National Museum was just fantastic. Not to be missed. Next time we will stay overnight in Nurnberg for a couple of nights.

I would not recommend Salzburg as a day trip from Munich. Salzburg is great, but doing only a daytrip would leave you disappointed at not staying overnight. A daytrip could be done of course, but Salzburg is so great you will regret not staying for a couple of nights.

Paul, I like that. I might stay in Berchtesgaden 3 nights so as to get one complete day there (Kehlsteinhaus and the Dok Center) and then take the bus for a day trip to Salzburg. There's a regularly scheduled bus, the Watzmann Express, that would take you round trip from the Berchtesgaden Hbf to the Salzburg Hbf for €9 per person RT. I might have said to take your luggage to Salzburg, leave it in a locker at the Hbf, then go on to Munich that night, but with the renovation work at the Hbf, I'm not sure how many lockers are available. The actual Hbf building is closed.

On the day you go back to Munich (afternoon), you could spend the morning seeing Königsee.

As for Herrenchiemsee, I was there "last August. This is what I wrote on my blog, "If I were to rate a place on how worthwhile it is to see vs. how difficult it is to get to, Herrenchiemsee would not rate that high. Not that it isn't worthwhile seeing, but if you've been to Nymphenburg, the Residenz, and Linderhof, it's getting pretty repetitious. And it is a pain to get to." From the station, it is a fair walk to the harbor or you can take the trolley. Then it's a boat ride to the island, get your tour reservations at the kiosk by the dock, and it's another 20 minutes by the shortest, not the most scenic, route to the castle.

There is a bus (RVO 846) from Berchtesgaden Hbf to Hintereck (Obersalzberg). That where the special mountain buses leave for Kehlsteinhaus, and it's a short walk to the Dok Center.

Getting to Füssen and the castles is not difficult to do on your own. See how on my web page

Lee, I guess you haven't seen a US History book in a few years. They might dedicate 2-3 pages to WW II, it is a joke.

I understand what you are saying though and I agree with your point on quality over quantity. I thought some of these sides trips wouldn't be too difficult such as Dachau which I was under the impression was an easy half day trip.

Looks like we will probably skip Berlin, seems like that is the consensus. Also we will probably stay the night in Salzburg. Probably the best thing for me is to check out train schedules and get some more information on the Rhine River. I have been told everything from 1-3 days on the Rhine.

Thank you everyone for all the suggestions. I think we are going to drop Berlin and stay at least one night in Salzburg. I think if we drop Berlin we can easily do the rest. Like someone mentioned, we could always go back to Berlin and maybe hit Prague also someday.

...for me, being a history teacher and all..

You're obviously not a geography teacher.

This is a classic "Check list" tour (Rhine, check, Rothenburg, check). I've seen Italy. Left in the mid-morning from Innsbruck for Brenner Pass, took the train from Brenner Pass to Fortezza, got off and had pizza, back to Innsbruck. Italy, check.

I don't think one afternoon on the Rhein anywhere near does it justice. With the time you have allocated, Remagen is just too far down the river. It's going to take about 5½ hours from St. Goar to Rothenburg. If you leave in the morning, having had very little time to see the Rhein, you'll get to Rothenburg in the mid-afternoon with not much time to really see it. Then it's on the go next morning without any more time in Rothenburg, stop in Nürnberg without enough time to see it and on to Munich. You spend five days in Munich, but three are long day trips. You only have two whole days in Munich, and Dachau will take most of one of them.

Why are you taking this trip? To see the insides of trains?

This is madness!

Sorry my trip doesn't meet your expectations Lee. Just trying to good some suggestions to try and figure out what we can and can't do. You can call it a check list tour, I would just like to see as much as possible. Again I appreciate all your help.

"I would just like to see as much as possible."

I guess it is how you define "see". Is it a glimpse or is it long enough to truly understand it. Does you history book devote two pages to WWII, or a whole chapter, or maybe the whole book. I guess I see your trip as the Cliff's Notes version of Germany.

Think Quality instead of Quantity.

But it's your trip.

Hi Gary,

If you drop berlin, I'd suggest arriving in Frankfurt and departing from Munich. Now, if you decide to drop the 3 nights in Berlin (and travel time), put 1 of those nights on the Rhine, another 1 in Rothenbueg and the last 1 in Salzburg. In fact, if you want to Berchtesgaden, use 1 of the nights from Munich and add it to Salzburg, as it is much closer to Berchtesgaden than Munich.

My suggestion would then be:

Day 1: Arrive in Frankfurt and go to the Rhine
Day 2: Rhine
Day 3: Rhine to Rothenburg
Day 4: Rothenburg
Day 5: Rothenburg to Munich
Day 6: Munich
Day 7: Munich to Salzburg (late afternoon)
Day 8: Salzburg/Berchtesgaden
Day 9: Salzburg/Berchtesgaden
Day 10: Salzburg to Munich
Day 11: Munich to Dublin

For a "Ludwig castle, you might also consider Neues Schloss (Herrenchiemsee), between Munich and Salzburg. This is Ludwig's version of Versailles. It's amazing inside. It's our favorite of Ludwig's castle's/palaces.

The Nightwatchman's Tour in Rothenburg was teriffic!

www.herrenchiemsee.de/englisch/n_palace/index.htm

www.nightwatchman.de

Hope this helps.

Paul

Dachau is easy to get to. It's a suburb of Munich. The Memorial is about a 40 min trip by S-Bahn and bus from the Hbf underground (tief) S-Bahn station. Take the S2, Richtung (direction) Petershausen to the Dachau Bahnhof. The buses leave from in front of the Bahnhof. I believe it is bus #726, but the stop is clearly marked in English. I took the Memorial's €3 guided tour and it took 3 hours. So you will spend 4½-5 hrs.

As for the Rhine, I spent 4 full days (5 nts) there in 2004. Admittedly, one day was fairly relaxed. I was going to go to Burg Eltz, but it was raining, so I stayed back and explored Boppard and the ancient Roman fortification. The other three days were pretty filled with St. Goar, Rheinfels, Rhein cruise, Bacharach one day, Marksburg and Koblenz (Deutsches Eck) the other two. You want to go to Remagen, which will take a full day from St. Goar/Bacharach.

BTW, St. Goar and Oberwesel are within the Verkehrsverbund Rhein-Mosel (transit district). Bacharach is just outside. If you stay in St. Goar, a network VRM Gruppentageskarte (for €20) will cover all of your travel (on/off for up to 5 people) in the district for a day. Remagen is also in the district, so you can go there.

Two years ago I spent a week with my family in germany, and from what it sounds like you will be very busy. Slow down,and choose 2-4 places you really want to go to. I was to munich and the Ludwig castles, they were both very nice. In munich, do a bus tour, because it takes you all around the city in a day, without a car. the train system works very well, it is a good decision to go by train.