Too ambitious itinerary ?

If you really want to see everything, skip Bern and go to Muerren instead. The section from Luzern to Interlaken Ost is one of the legs of the Golden Pass route. Leaving Muerren, you could take the rest of the Golden Pass route to Montreux. Either stay there or continue to Lausanne on regular train.

You are aware that the Glacier Express does not run on Dec 11. The first one of the season is the next day on December 12. If you already bought reservations, check those.

Most people on this forum would recommend Pontresina rather than St Moritz. Get off the Glacier Express at Samedan, shortly before St Moritz and change to train to Pontresina.

Not clear what your schedule for Bernina Express.

Swiss Travel Pass goes on sale in 5 days.
https://www.myswissalps.com/swisstravelpass

Thank you Sam for the information! I will definitely check Muerren and the Golden Pass Line to Interlaken Ost.

I double checked our Glacier Express tickets and it seems this year Dec 11 is the first day of the season.

I will check Poschiavo vs St Moritz, thank you for the suggestion.

We just wanted a ride on the Bernina Express via our way back to Zurich, so we were contemplating a short trip
of a couple of hours without any Italy covid restrictions for US citizens.

Thank you so much for the info on Swiss Pass, it is a good deal!

You are certainly going to the right place to indulge a love of trains. I would recommend that you try to build flexibility into your itinerary since the Swiss Travel Pass allows you to do so. The thing is, the weather in Switzerland is iffy even in the summer. I once spent a day traversing Switzerland from north to south without seeing much of anything due to a combination of rain and fog. And that was in late May or June. I can only imagine the odds of good weather are less good in December. Wikipedia tells me Zurich averages only 42 hours of sunshine for the entire month, and December is the month with the most days of precipitation. To the extent that you can plunk yourselves down somewhere with a variety of available side-trips, you can minimize the adverse impact of bad weather if you are unlucky.

I like Bern a lot. It has a picturesque historic district that has the great advantage of a lot of arcaded streets. Thus it's a good place to keep on your list of possibilities in case of ugly weather. Perhaps you shouldn't commit to spending two nights there on pre-determined dates; those might turn out to be the two prettiest days of your trip, in which case it would be better to spend them in a non-urban environment.

Some parts of the country tend to be warmer and sunnier than others. I believe that includes the Ticino and valleys opening up to the south. I am no expert on Swiss weather, however. And in any case, I know you are building the trip around the most scenic rail lines.

Edited to add: Although I've never done it myself, it is often mentioned here that in most cases it's OK to spend one's last night in Lucerne if flying out of Zurich. There's frequent rail service. If you alter your itinerary to make Lucerne your last stop, you can (if you choose) free up the two nights you have planned for Zurich. Zurich is a perfectly nice city (and obviously cities are good if you have a day with dreadful weather), but most of us wouldn't put it terribly high on a list of places to see in Switzerland.

Thank you acraven for the suggestions!

We definitely are aware that December is not the ideal time given the unpredictable weather but unfortunately thats
the month we can crave out for a holiday. But you are right, I will definitely research some alternative side trips in case of
bad weather days!

Do scheduled trains not run given bad weather? Is that frequent during the month of December?

The reason for the extra days in Zurich was to be sure to have a covid test ready. We are carrying the Abbott test kits but
if need arises I want to be prepared to rush to a pharmacy in Zurich to get the test results on time.

Is there a good day trip or activity you would personally suggest if we have the extra day in Zurich?

Thank you again!

There is a short train ride that connects St. Moritz to Pontresina, a charming town. We were so glad we stayed in Pontresina instead of St.Moritz. We had been told to that by friends and they were right!

Thank you Suki, I will check out that town as an option!

The Swiss are winter-weather experts and the Swiss rail system is brilliantly engineered. I assume it would take an avalanche to stop the trains. That's not something I'd worry about at all.

I'm not a good person to make suggestions about what to do in the winter. I don't travel to Europe then because I hate the cold, the wet, and the short days. I happen to like museums, and I know there are some good ones in Basel. I've only barely stepped outside the train station there, but there's an attractive historic center, too. Basel's about an hour from Zurich by rail.

Closer to Zurich, Zug and Winterthur are attractive smaller places for a change of scenery. I have a vague recollection that there may be a museum in Winterthur, but I'm not sure about that. Picturesque Solothurn is a bit less than an hour away. I haven't spent enough time in any of those places to prioritize them for you.

I don't know whether you've progressed to the point of looking at rail links yet, but the trip from Bern to Zurich can take less than an hour. There are trains running many times per hour (most taking more like 80 minutes--the horror!). Given your plan to use the Swiss Travel Pass, I wonder whether it would make sense to combine those two stays into one.

You have to work really hard to find an unattractive place in Switzerland. You could do worse than to stop at the local tourist office and ask those folks to recommend a side-trip. Your STP covers the postbuses and lake boats as well as the trains. The postbuses head up valleys where trains don't go; the views are often great.

are you visiting Bern to add to your collection of funiculars? Of course there is the one near the government buildings but there is also the excellent one up the Gurten?

Or is there another reason for Bern on your journey?

I corrected my first post. I meant Pontresina, not Poschiavo, which is on the other side of the Bernina Pass.

As far as the first day of operation of the Glacier Express, that is a conundrum. While the Glacier Express website does say it begins on Saturday, December 11, the Swiss railway website, www.sbb.ch/en, does not show it, it shows it the following day, Sunday, December 12. The reason I believe the SBB site is that December 12 is the first day of the new railway schedule. The schedule changes twice a year, second Sunday of December and June. That is also true for all the railways in Europe. At the least, I would email Glacier Express ( [email protected]) and confirm that the train is running.

Now, Bernina Express issue. You can do the rail journey and avoid entering Italy by only going as far as Campocologna, the last stop before the train enters Italy. Do not take the named Bernina Express, which requires a reservation fee, but the regular hourly train to Tirano. If you take the 7:02 am train from Pontresina, you get to Campocologna at 9:07 am, Coincidentaly, the train going back will be at the station already and you can cross over and get on it. If, for some reason that does not happen, there is another train back to Pontresina at 9:52.

At Pontresina, change to the train to Samedan and there change to the train to Chur. It will be on the same tracks you did previously on the Glacier Express, just the other direction. At Chur, trains to Zurich are very frequent.

Do scheduled trains not run given bad weather? Is that frequent during the month of December?

Swiss trains lead the pack when it comes to reliability. They are an integral part of the national transportation system, and thus they spend a lot to insure that the tracks stay clear. That is not to say that there could not be a temporary delay in the case of a major blizzard, but they are prepared to get the system up and running ASAP. There have been instances that the trains to/from Zermatt were delayed several days due to avalanche danger. In that case, they had to move people in and out of town by helicopter, since there is no other way there. That was very unusual.

I have been in Switzerland many times, and almost exclusively in January and in the Alps. Weather has always been good and trains ran like clockwork. In fact, trains are an integral part of the ski lift system in places like Zermatt, Muerren, and Davos.

Yes it's too ambitious - you're going to spend a lot of effort moving around. If you drop one of your 2-night stops then you'll have two nights to invest in your other stops - which will give you a more thorough experience and be more relaxing IMO.

https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/trip-reports/lucerne-62eb4d28-60ab-4837-b4b4-91a2486eb732

I have linked all 7 of my Trip Reports from my recent Sept, 2021 Swiss trip. Hopefully included are some useful tips. Have a great trip in this beautiful country.

I was also in Switzerland Dec, 2019, and explored their xmas markets, in addition to traveling around. The days are short, but I didn't find the weather to be a problem. We went up to Mt Rigi, on a cloudy day, and the peak was above the clouds, covered in fresh snow, framed against perfect blue skies.

Bern has great xmas markets, and the largest European indoor xmas market is in the Zurich train station. Bring on the Gluhwein! Oh, I yearn to return!

Many folks here would discourage the First Class STP; Second Class on Swiss trains is very nice, and in 99% of my experience, the trains are not crowded.

Thank you acraven for the suggestions. Excited to travel on those Swiss trains and their brilliant engineering.

Thank you Nigel - The reason for picking Bern was that it is a heritage city, is one of the cities on Rick Steves's itinerary suggestions, has good Christmas markets, and is one of the cities where we can exchange our Marriott points for stay.
I understand funiculars don't operate after October usually?

Thank you Sam - I will confirm with Glacier Express if Dec 11 is indeed the first day and will update here.
You suggest not taking the Bernina Express but local trains. Is the Bernina express overhyped ? Is it just the route and not the train
that makes the difference?

Thank you KBK - I will consider it, seems like Bern is not getting too much love, might consider dropping Bern and extending
the stay in Luzern?

Thank you Pat - I really appreciate your detailed experience, thank you for taking time for writing and making it easier for first time travelers to Switzerland. I will add the Zurich indoor Christmas market to our travel checklist.

As for the Swiss Travel Pass for first class, if we are traveling on the Glacier Express Excellence class or first class, do we need the Swiss Travel First class Pass or would any Swiss Travel Pass do?

The Bernina Express is a named tourist type train, with panorama windows and requires a seat reservation fee. I don't see it on the schedule in December. It only goes once a day normally. The regular trains run on an hourly schedule so you can do things like make a quick turn around at Campocologna. No reservations needed. Same tracks, same scenery.

Hi RSE! I've been to both on day trips and preferred Luzern due to its scenic beauty on the lake with the mountains in the distance; however, when looking at the logistics of your rail oriented itinerary I'd probably drop Luzern and stay in Bern. It's a different feel from a lake/mountain place but still well worth visiting. You could then do a day trip to Luzern from either Bern or Zurich if you add a night in one of those two places. Also, even though I haven't been to Lausanne I have to Montreux - so IMO the beautiful scenery of Lake Geneva can somewhat replace what you would experience in Luzern. Maybe add a night in Lausanne so as to have more time on Lake Geneva?

The reason for picking Bern was that . . . it is one of the cities
where we can exchange our Marriott points for stay.

I hate to say this, but I was a little disappointed with my visit to Bern this past Sept. Certainly worthy as a day trip, but I personally wouldn’t stay longer than that.

I understand the desire to use the credit card points as my sister and bro and law had points to use. We all loved the Marriott Renaissance in Lucerne—great location near the train station, the old town, and a nice park a block away. If I’m remembering correctly, the Marriott in Lucerne is more points than the Holiday Inn (if that’s the Bern hotel you are considering), but if you have enough points, I’d extend the time in Lucerne. Or, there’s another Marriott property in Montreux, the Grand Hotel Swiss, that looks fabulous. I have it booked for next June.

Really no bad choices in Switzerland. You’ll have a great time not matter what you decide.

To answer your question about mixing classes of the pass—yes, you can do it , but you have to pay the difference in the fares. When we did it in2018, we went into the train station (I think any train station works) and paid the difference. I think I read recently on the forum that you can pay the difference on the spot on the train, but I would explore this more.

Funny, I found Lausanne boring, maybe because I was tired, and it came at the end of a trip. Alternatively, I would have liked more time in Bern. I recall making more notes to revisit places near Lausanne and not in it. Yes to adding Muerren/Wengen if you can.

Good luck - this itinerary does sound like it would wear me out, but if it ticks all the boxes for you, enjoy!

Just to clarify- the Bernina Express route is amazingly beautiful and worthwhile. You don't need the panoramic cars, which are more crowded , and the windows don't open. The regular trains on the same tracks run more frequently, have more stops, windows that open, which allows pix without window glass glare, and aren't crowded, so you can jump from left side to right side for pix. We rode the route to Campocologno and back, [not crossing into Italy because of covid] , in under four hours, and even tho repeating the route, saw the scenery in slightly different light and angles, and completely enjoyed the ride.

https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/trip-reports/christmas-markets-switzerland-france-germany-2019

As if you don't ave enough to read, I've added my Dec., 2019 xmas markets Trip Reports. The trip started in Switzerland.

I'm just SO excited you get to experience this beautiful country!

Safe travels!

Just to add to what acraven said above, there are indeed museums in Winterthur. At least three good art museums for painting and one for photography, as well as several others of differing kinds (coins, tech/science, natural history, etc.). Also, the Rhine Falls is apparently 20 minutes away.

You have lots of good feedback here... I would only add that we were disappointed in the Golden Pass train line and would not recommend building any part of your trip around it (well, disappointed in that Switzerland is spectacular everywhere but this line was just okay relatively speaking) . If it works for your destinations, then fine but don't let it be the tail that wags the dog. Also, we really enjoyed Lausanne, though it was summer so that might make a difference. I know RS is big on Lausanne and we found it very interesting but in the winter maybe Montreux would be better? I would say decide what activities you want to do in the area (for example summer is better to walk around an ancient city whereas winter... maybe not so much), look at accommodations (for our family size Montreux was expensive so Lausanne was a good option for many reasons) and then go from there.