Scenic Train Help Needed

It will not be possible to do both, in my opinion, and the Gotthard Panorama express does not work at all with your route.
Even Glacier Express will be challenging, because you arrive too late on day 1 to travel the long way round via Chur to ride it. If you are happy with an 8-hour train ride that ends at night, you can travel the same route on regular trains. I do not think it is worth it, and I do not think you should add a night anywhere if it means taking a night from somewhere else. But if you can ADD a night, then spend it in Chur and arrive in Zermatt via Glacier Express the next day.

Nonetheless, there are other scenic railways that you can include in your trip without changing your trip:
- the Luzern-Interlaken express: you can take it if you travel via Luzern on your way from Giessbach to Paris.
- the old Lotschberg railway: you can take it between Zermatt and Wengen if you make sure to take a train that goes via Kandersteg (other trains go through a deeper, newer tunnel).

Not to mention that your excursions around Zermatt and Wengen will be full of scenic railways anyway.

Have you been to visit the Man in Seat 61? Have you been watching train videos on Youtube?

There's a good episode about the Glacier Express from a Canadian series that was called, I believe, Mighty Trains. You can usually find it on the internet. And everyone who vlogs has done the Bernina Express several times, in various seasons.

I have some suggestions that may help. Take a look at the map of the Swiss railway system, and the attached schematic of the scenic routes.

https://cdn-doc.myswissalps.com/docs/default-source/rail-network-maps/swisstravelpass.pdf?sfvrsn=7788603a_56

First, with an 11 am arrival at Zurich, you can easily head straight to Zermatt from the airport. The journey is only 3.5 hours, and there are trains departing the airport each hour at 45 minutes past (11;45, 12;45, etc) with only a single change at Visp. In between, there are several other trains with an additional change, usually at Bern. You could arrive in Zermatt, where you want to be, by mid-afternoon, with time left to get outside and shake off the travel fatigue.

Now for the scenic journeys: the Glacier Express is a long time in a train, but you can break it into two smaller sections that include much of the best scenery, and still and allow you to reach the places you want, as well as take the Gotthard Panorama Express and visit Kandersteg on the way. Like this:

After 2-3 nights in Zermatt, you head to Wengen via Brig and Kandersteg. This will put you on the Glacier Express route between Zermatt and Brig, but you can ride a regular train instead of the named Glacier Express if you like——it is a short ride, and the scenery is the same. From Brig, you head to Kandersteg, avoiding the deep Basistunnel that bypasses Kandersteg. You will still have a tunnel, but it is much shorter. You can see the tunnels on the map, indicated by dashed lines. Stop for a few hours in Kandersteg, or spend the night—-maybe at the mountain inn up at Oeschinensee. (We have done this several times)

Www.Oeschinensee.ch

There are lockers in the Kandersteg train station where you can store your luggage while you explore, or overnight if you want to spend the night at the lake. Or you can take your bags up on the gondola to the lake (we have done it both ways).

From Kandersteg you take the train to Wengen, connecting at Spiez, Interlaken, and Lauterbrunnen. Spend 2-3 nights.

Then head from there to the Grandhotel Giessbach on Brienzersee. I believe you reach the hotel by boat from Brienz—-always wanted to go here but we haven’t made time for that so far.

After a night at the Grandhotel, continue from Brienz to Luzern—-this will be the scenic Golden Pass route, but you will be on a regular regional train. After 2 nights at Luzern, you take the Gotthard Panorama Express boat and train south, but only as far as Göschenen. Get off there and take the 10-minute train ride to Andermatt, where you can pick up the Glacier Express heading east to Chur. This would put you on the late Glacier Express train which departs Andermatt at 15:54. Alternatively, you could stay on the Panorama Express to Bellinzona or Lugano, overnight there, and the following day take a regional train back to Andermatt to catch an earlier Glacier Express—-in summer they pass through Andermatt at 10:54, 11:54, and 12:54 as well as the 15:54. Either way, you end at Chur and depart to Paris from there.

You could also do the circuit in reverse, by riding a different section of the Glacier Express. From Zermatt, take the regular Glacier Express all the way to Andermatt, and transfer from there to Göschenen for the Gotthard Panorama Express to Luzern. (You will have to check the schedules for both scenic routes to make sure this will work—-you may have to overnight somewhere as the northbound Gotthard PE stops in Göschenen at 11 am). After your time in Luzern, you ride the Golden Pass route to Brienz for the Grandhotel Giessbach, then continue to Wengen for your final stop in Switzerland, departing for Paris from there.

This latter route gives you most of what is reputed to be the most scenic section of the Glacier Express, between Brig and Disentis, although you would miss the last part unless you stay on til Disentis, disembark there, and backtrack to Andermatt. TBC

Ran out of space. I am not sure I agree on the assessment that Brig to Disentis is the ‘most scenic” section of the Glacier Express, so you might want to get other opinions on that. We have only used the train on the sections between Zermatt and Brig, and Brig and Andermatt, and then between Chur and St. Moritz. In other words, I have not been to Disentis, so cannot comment on that, but I wonder how it compares with what you will see around Wengen.

The downside of the reverse route is that is skips Kandersteg, although I suppose you could work that in after Wengen and before Paris, if you have time.

Note that any connection between the Glacier Express and the Gotthard Panorama Express requires the short (10-minute) transfer between Andermatt where the GE stops and Göschenen where the Gotthard PE stops. You need to check the schedules at SBB to see the timing of these connections.

Here are the websites with schedules for the two scenic trains:

https://www.sbb.ch/en/leisure-holidays/trains-trips/rail-travel-specialtrains/panoramareisen/gotthard-panorama-express.html

https://www.glacierexpress.ch/en/travel-planning/timetables/

Just be sure to consult the summer timetables, not winter, for the Glacier Express.

Have fun planning! It sounds like a great trip.

Lola asks about the most scenic part of the Glacier Express.

I've been on pretty much the whole part of all the most scenic named rail routes in Switzerland over the years - never on the named trains but always on the local trains which take the same tracks with the same scenery, in a similar amount of time, but much more frequently.

I have never taken the Glacier Express from end to end - in fact I would never want to because it takes so long - but I have done the whole length bit by bit over the years.

It is probably my least favourite of all the routes. Yes, it is at altitude, yes, especially in the western part of the route, you do pass a number of often frozen or ice covered lakes along the way, yes there there are mountains around, but for me the scenery is quite repetitive over a very long journey and I frankly find routes with repetitive scenery especially if they are straight quite boring.

I would happily ride the full length of the Bernina Express or its local analogs all day long any day of the year. Why? There are always new vistas. Twists and turns and tunnels and bridges and mountains and valleys, sometimes lower altitude, sometimes up and in the rocks. I absolutely love the route. Who doesn't enjoy dogbone tunnels and seeing the same thing on the opposite side above or below you and then another twist in the tale. And to cap it off it goes around a nearly perfectly circular loop out in the open.

So to answer the question, probably I would not choose the Glacier Express, but perhaps the best two parts for me are the two ends - from Brig eastbound for a while, and the mountainous arrival to the east into St Moritz.

Others will have their opinions, and I hope that others chip in with their opinions.

This is only the opinion of me as one person.

Thanks to all of you for the super helpful information. Your time and detail are much appreciated. We are rethinking our pans based on your great feedback and will post more once we have nailed things down a bit more.