Beware Driving in Switzerland

Don't speed or run red lights anywhere in Europe.

This has been said over and over on these Forums.

I'm sorry you missed them.

You mean Hertz has to tell you to obey the law. If you had viewed this site prior to your trip you would have read dozens of warning about camera enforcement. It is wide spread and efficient.

What's an 11 second red light infraction? Do you mean you crossed a junction 11 seconds after the light had changed to red? You are lucky to be alive.

Dare I say it, but not speeding and not running red lights should be common driving sense in any country. I mean, after all, is it that hard NOT to speed or run red lights?

Do you mean you crossed a junction 11 seconds after the light had changed to red?
I think OP wrote 1.1 seconds (one and one-tenth), not eleven seconds. But that said, we plan on taking the train that runs between Zurich and Luzern during our next winter trip. Why drive?

Follow the rules of the road OR just take the train and never have to worry about such things as this. Lots of people on these forums sing about the "Freedom" that a rental car gives you...ha. There's SO much more to rental vehicles than just "freedom" :-)

Think it was one point one sec infraction. Or as you write 1,1. There is a common misconception in the US that if you get one wheel into the intersection before the red light, you are safe. On US drivers test the most missed question is, What does the yellow light mean and what action should you take? '

You don't have to rent the car in Switzerland to get a speeding ticket there. We got one in 2011, also for a very small amount of kph over the limit, on the way through Basel to return our car over the border in Germany.

It took almost 2 years for the ticket to get to us! It wasn't nearly as expensive as yours. In fact, it cost less than the cost to do the bank transfer to pay it. I guess we were lucky.

It does not look expensive to me. Switzerland often issues fines as a percentage of the income of the lawbreaker, they can really sting.

"What does the yellow light mean and what action should you take?" Drive very very fast! (Just joking but it does appear to be what most drivers do.)

The fines are about what you will be charged for similar infractions where I live, so I don't see them as high.

Also, 3.3 miles (or is it actually kilometers) over the speed limit? If that was on a highway, then OK be miffed. If this was in a residential or school zone area, then you really should be watching how fast you drive. But in both cases ,you broke the law so you pay the fines. And why would you even consider not paying?

Even without fines for speeding, red light infractions, ZTLs in Italy, phantom scratches, etc, it has cost me less for rail and bus travel in Germany and Austria for every trip I've taken than it would have cost to rent a car. In fact, my cost of tickets is usually not much more than gas alone would have been.

And I don't pick my places based on getting there with public transportation, but I've never had problems finding public transportation to anywhere I've wanted to go, and (and contrary to "common belief"), you don't need a car to get to small towns. 85% of my stays have been outside big cities.

For future reference, and for anyone planning to drive in Europe, download for free and read this booklet about renting a car and driving in Europe -- http://www.gemut.com/car-rentals/free-rental-car-booklet.html.

One of the biggest differences between driving in North America and Europe...

Speed limits are enforced by cameras, not police officers who have the discretion to only pull over the worst offenders. The unbiased eye of the radar camera has no such agency. Everyone who goes over the limit will be flagged.

It is not Herz's responsibility to make sure you obey the posted speed limit, nor is it their's to explain the differences between urban and rural speed limits, which may not be specifically posted.

On US drivers test the most missed question is, What does the yellow light mean and what action should you take?

Of course It means that the light will soon turn red, so speed up and try to make it through. Actually, I would think that most people taking a driver's test would know what it means, but once they get their license they just ignore it.
As to the fines, they seem incredibly high, but Switzerland is known for law enforcement.

"What does the yellow light mean and what action should you take?" Drive very very fast!

This was actually a line from the movie "Starman" where the friendly alien life-form (Jeff Bridges) explains how he learned to drive a car simply by observing his host (Karen Allen).

PS Thanks for your warning to others. I won't beat you up about it. Hurts enough already.

sam,

I was wondering if anyone would catch that reference. :-)

We are just back from a road trip to USA. Got a speeding ticket in Ohio. The officer was disinclined to use any judgment, probably because he knew we were unlikely to bother returning for the court date and just pay online. Oh well - we were speeding and that's the risk you take if you choose to do so.

"What does the yellow light mean and what action should you take?"

Here in B.C., the amber light also means "Stop". Even here in my small city, we have red light cameras at problem intersections. The cameras are totally impartial so if the driver tries to "run" the light and is in the intersection when the light turns red, they can expect a ticket in the mail.

jfbailey,

Unfortunately, you've learned the "hard way" about some of the pitfalls of driving in Europe. Based on anecdotal comments here on the forum, the same situation exists in many other countries and no leeway way is given for just being one or two km over the limit. Italy also has the dreaded ZTL (limited traffic) areas, which come with hefty fines for each pass through one. These are also enforced by automated cameras in some cities (ie: Florence).

For future reference, especially in Switzerland it's often best to use the excellent transportation system rather than a rental car.

Just to be clear the OP was way over the speed limit not just 3.3 miles! The reported mileage is after a very healthy allowance for mistakes, so depending on where it happened the driver was traveling at between 13.3 or 23.3 miles over the speed limit.

Drive a car, break a law, get a fine.

I am missing WHAT here?

It seems like it would be the same for trains.

Ride a train, break a rule (like pay for 2nd class tix but sneak into 1st class area), pay fine. Right?

I have four tickets under my belt. I got an email for one of them last time while I was still on the road. I think I figured it had happened about three weeks before. And had already been paid and charged to me. Awesome--Thaaaaaaaaaanks...

When you are in a foreign country you play by their rules. 150 CHF for speeding is not high, even compared to the US. And 250 for a red light violation seems perfectly reasonable, given the danger you might have caused to pedestrians or cross-traffic. At least these two moving violations won't go on your US driving record or be reported to your insurance company. Mine would seriously raise my rates--or drop me altogether---for incurring two moving violations in rapid succession.

Anyone renting a car in Europe should know about traffic cameras---they are the norm there. You signed a rental contract with Hertz consenting to the admin fee charged for them to provide your name and address to the authorities in the event you received a traffic ticket. This should have been warning enough to be more careful.

You actually got away quite cheaply. Swiss citizens are assessed speeding tickets that are a percentage of their income based on tax information. I think that system is brilliant! We borrowed the car of some Swiss friends once and they made sure we knew this! Believe me, we didn't speed at all!
Anyone who drives anywhere in Europe is responsible for knowing the laws of the individual countries. This information is readily available online and in many printed resources. You should have done your homework so you would know the law and how citations are issued. Speed cameras are common in many European cities and countries, not just Zurich or Switzerland...many, many places. There are also many city centers where you cannot drive without a special permit/sticker. Lots of people get tickets for these as well because they don't know or aren't paying attention.

Anyone who drives anywhere in Europe is responsible for knowing the laws of the individual countries.

Travel in foreign lands is, or at least should be, a cultural learning experience.

In the US it seems as if the driving cultural expectation is that the speed limits are a minimum speed. Folks driving in the left (fast lane) can be cited for obstructing traffic even if they are driving at the speed limit.

OP seems to have learned that in Europe (or at least Switzerland) the cultural norm is that the speed limits are maximum speeds, as in Do Not Exceed.

Cultural lesson learned:
- When in Rome, do as the Romans do.

- When in Switzerland, drive as the Swiss do

.

Since the 2013 "via secura" program the margins are:
3 km/h (speed limit up to 100km/h)
4 km/h (speed limit over 100km/h)

In addition they give 3 km/h for a fixed Lidar, 5km/h for a fixed doppler radar, and 7km/h for a mobile unit.
Those are Federal guidelines that can vary locally.

The ultimate goal of the "via secura" program is not to "get" tourists but to cut the number of casualties by 1/4.

In regards to traffic light cameras, no fines are given during the first 0.5 seconds of the red phase.
There is also a law for the duration of the yellow phase in places with a camera:

3 seconds if the speed limit is up to 50 km/h
4 seconds if the speed limit is 60 km/h
5 seconds if the speed limit is 70 km/h or higher

Source: Weisungen über polizeiliche Geschwindigkeitskontrollen und Rotlichtüberwachung im Strassenverkehr