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SPAIN July 2016

We are 3friends, 55+ from South Africa with a weak Rand Currency to back us! We have a route planned but would like you to fine tune it for us, with suggestions and recommendations of where to do what and what not to do!
We are not sure if we can do the whole trip with public transport, and if so, by bus or by train? Would you recommend us hiring a car? People are telling us that parking might be a big problem and that some of the hotels/B&B's do not have secure parking which means that we will have to park in parking garages which might be far away from the hotel, and will be additional costs - please advise.
We fly to Barcelona on the 12th of July and will then stay with South African friends in Sitges from where we will do day trips to Barcelona . I am an Open Water Scuba diver and would love to scuba somewhere? L'Estartiet....do you have any info on this ? and we are planning to do a sleep over in Girona then?

Then our planned tour is as follows: 20/07 and 21/07 VALENCIA;
22/07 and 23/07 GRANADA
24/07 and 25/07 SEVILLE
26/07 and 27/07 CORDOBA
28/07 TOLEDO
29/07 SITGES
30/07 MONTSERRAT.
We are totally confused at the moment and any info will be appreciated!
Looking forward to hear from you.

Posted by
15788 posts

I expect your friends have given you all the information you need on getting to/from Barcelona. Monserrat and Girona are day trips by train from Barcelona.

For the rest . . . First, you should read this article which will give you lots of information on using trains in Spain. Then use the Renfe website to look up train schedules. Since some trains only show up on the schedule a couple of weeks in advance, choose a date that is close and the day of the week you will travel. It is possible to get to all the cities on your list by train, however some of them will be long journeys, so you won't have much time to sightsee. Valencia is not well-connected by train and you will use up a lot of time getting from there to Andalucia. Dropping Valencia would allow you more time in Andalucia, which I think you need.

In planning your time in Andalucia, consider that 2 nights in a city gives you one full day to sightsee. You use (lose) a lot of time transferring - packing/unpacking, getting to/from train stations, and you need to arrive at the station with enough time to find your train, go through security and board. Trains close their doors 2 minutes before departure. If you aren't on board, you've missed the train. Most people fly from Barcelona to Granada, then take the train to Seville, Cordoba and Madrid/Toledo (read on) and then return to Barcelona from Madrid by train. The high speed trains are much faster than driving.

Toledo is connected to Madrid by commuter train. To get there, take the high-speed train from Cordoba to Madrid, then the local train to Toledo. To get back to Barcelona (and then to Sitges?), take the local train from Toledo and the high-speed train from Madrid. You will probably need 1/2 hour for the transfer in Madrid - it's a big station.

If you are still thinking about a car use viamichelin.com to calculate routes, driving times (they are optimal times and don't include pit stops), and costs (gas, tolls). Keep in mind that in South Africa you drive on the left. In Spain, you'll be driving on the right. This can make it more difficult in tight spots. Cars with manual transmission are usually cheaper to rent, but then you'll be shifting gears with your right hand instead of your left. If you choose to drive, you'll want a car large enough so that the person in the back seat is comfortable on those really long drives. You also need a car with enough space to stash all your belongings out of sight (in the trunk) if you plan to stop for sightseeing or meals along the way.

Posted by
3071 posts

Hi Minnie,

So you're flying into Barcelona on the 12th, then driving to the South of Spain and then returning to Barcelona again. That's why you indicate a trip to Sitges and Montserrat planned for the 29th/30th, right? While I can see the appeal of driving instead of flying while in Spain -so one gets to know nooks and crannies otherwise you'd miss- why the return driving? Since all your itinerary is to be done within the same country (for the moment!), you won't incur into drop-off charges if you decide to leave your car say in Madrid (close from Toledo) and then take the fast speed train from there to Barcelona on your way back -which, btw, will leave you in Barcelona in merely 2.5h. You'd be saving 600km which you'd probably be doing on a boring motorway ride anyway, full of tolls as soon as you reach Catalonia.

Also, in general, there's no such thing as hotel parking (much less B&B!)... real estate is far too expensive and scarce for that, especially in the cities. What some establishments have are agreements with nearby underground parking lots. Otherwise, street parking is the norm. But note that, for example in Barcelona, street parking is very sought after and it's not free... rather expensive (in the ballpark of 2-3€/hour depending on the type of space (check here). Street parking is securish (as secure as it can be in any Western European city anyway). If you do, leave your stuff out of sight, in the trunk.

To reach both Sitges and Montserrat is better to take public transportation, which is cheap, clean, convenient and (should you care) totally safe. Same goes for other escapades from Barcelona to many other places in Catalonia often visited by travellers:SITGES, GIRONA, FIGUERES -note this and Girona are very close, MONTSERRAT, TARRAGONA, VIC, BESALÚ, ROSES, TOSSA DE MAR, CADAQUÉS, etc. Thus, you can save yourself a bunch of money on car rent, parking and tolls.

Having said that, if you intend to go to the most northern part of Costa Brava, to l'Estartit or to Palamós for example (great places for scuba diving!), although there are buses from Barcelona, for convenience to your schedule you might be better off renting a car for the day. Also note that diving in Illes Medes (Medes islands) -located in l'Estartit-is restricted and a permit is required as it's within a protected Marine Reserve. Should you want to dive there it's best to contact one of the local diving schools which will take care of everything.

Posted by
7175 posts

I would suggest mixing up your modes of travel.
Without extra time for Madrid, your stay in Toledo seems pointless.

Train from Sitges to Valencia.
Rent a car and drive to Granada.
Drive to Ronda.
Drive to Córdoba and return car.
Train to Sevilla.
Fly to Barcelona, returning to Sitges.

You can do Montserrat from Sitges in a day by train.

Posted by
15788 posts

David, how do you get by train from/to Sitges? When I go to the Renfe site and put in Sitges to any of the proposed destinations, all I get is For the OUTWARD JOURNEY there is no direct connection or this train does not run on the selected date

From Sitges to Valencia, is it possible to get to Tarragona. It looks like the trains to Barcelona stop there as it's just over 2 hours from Tarragona, another hour from Barcelona.

According to viamichelin.com, it's at least 6 hours net driving time (without road delays) from Valencia to Granada.

Posted by
3071 posts

Hi Chani...

Try www.gencat.cat/rodalies instead!

Train services in Catalonia are a bit "special" to say the least. RENFE is (and has always been since its inception) a chaotic, inefficient public company run the Spanish state. Although these days is semi-private -being the Spanish government still its major shareholder- the same civil servant "this-is-not-my-problem" type of mentality still exists.

Furthermore, you 'know of' the long-lasting quarrel between the Spanish and the Catalan governments. The lack of investment by RENFE, accumulated debt, inefficient infrastructure and delays suffered in their Catalan operations are well known among regular users here in Catalonia, especially in certain lines. So much so, that a few years ago the Catalan government demanded the Spanish government the control over the train service in Catalonia. After a very long negotiation, only some services were 'allowed' to be transferred. Among those, the information service for regional and short distance trains... hence the reason RENFE is not providing those anymore in their website. Actually, they are... but to find them it's a whole adventure, you need to dig into their website: Commuter trains and FEVE > Barcelona -not the most "obvious" for people unaware on how this works... and then many results for the regional schedules are unaccurate (either obsolete or simply non-existent).

Out of curiosity, this is fresh news from two days ago only... http://ccaa.elpais.com/ccaa/2016/05/09/catalunya/1462804793_711881.html Now RENFE "pretends" to modify their schedules in the regional and short distance trains within Catalonia to cover up their massive constant delays. Even a newspaper like El Pais (Madrid-based!) is reporting this.

For long distance trains however, the service is still controlled by RENFE from Madrid, and the information is presented in their website www.renfe.com. So for AVE and long distance you have to use this one while for regional and short distance trains within Catalonia you are much better off using the link above.

Having said all that, the R2 Sud line, which is the one linking Barcelona to the south (passing by Sitges) is one of the lines with a more decent service :))

Posted by
7175 posts

Enric, always on the spot to illuminate.
Chani, a 2nd change may be needed.

RE 15151
Dep 07:37 SITGES-SAN PEDRO DE RIBAS (Spain)
Arr 07:43 VILLANUEVA Y GELTRU (Spain)

RE 15029
Dep 08:07 VILLANUEVA Y GELTRU (Spain)
Arr 08:37 TARRAGONA (Spain)

EUR 1081
Dep 08:56 TARRAGONA (Spain)
Arr 11:09 VALENCIA JOAQUIN SOROLLA (Spain)

Posted by
4535 posts

Sitges is on the local train line and is easily accessible to Barcelona and Tarragona. From Tarragona one can easily take a higher speed train to Valencia. The transit problems arise getting from Valencia to Granada and to a lesser extent out of Granada. In those cases with more time, a car would be of value. But with only two nights each, you'll have to stick with buses and trains.

Your itinerary is tight, but given your longer stay in Catalunya, I don't see why not to make a rapid trip to get an overview as long as you don't mind hotel hoping. Cordoba could be an easy daytrip from Sevilla or on your way to Toledo, though it is nice overnight. Two nights on such short itinerary seems unnecessary. I'd add an extra night in Toledo or skip it altogether. It is the outlier right now. July will give you veeery long days, so you can squeeze in a lot of sightseeing.