Spain itinerary Sept/Oct

I'll try to tackle some of this.

You have only have one day, your arrival day, in Bilbao; how do you do in museums on arrival day? I don't do well at all, so I'd want at least two days there. And as you say, San Sebastian to other places takes time. I'd probably drop either Bilbao or San Sebastian, and spend two days in the remaining one. They're quite different, so which to keep and which to drop is up to you. San Sebastian has few "turnstile attractions" other than the aquarium, but it's lovely and a nice place to hang out. Bilbao is a much larger city with a real urban feel, several good museums (the Bellas Artes and the Museum of Reproductions in addition to the Guggenheim), and a more interesting Old Town than San Sebastian, including a much larger market. I much preferred Bilbao, but if your goal is beaches, beauty, and relaxing, pick San Sebastian; Bilbao is definitely a bit "rougher" and less pretty.

From Bilbao to San Sebastian, the bus is much faster than the train. This is also true of many of your other segments. The trains in Spain are not as extensively developed as in many other European countries, and the high speed rail system is skeletal. So, buses fill in the gaps. Don't worry - they're much nicer than Greyhound in the US, with a better clientele. You usually get an assigned seat, and some of them have seatback entertainment and USB charging ports like an airplane! The ALSA bus from San Sebastian to Madrid definitely has these features, because I just took it last month (albeit only part of the way).

To find buses, use acraven's trick. Go to Rome2Rio and put in your cities: https://www.rome2rio.com/. Then find the bus companies that do your route (often there's more than one). Then, go to the bus company websites to get full information (for some you may need Google Translate). Buses usually don't need to be bought more than a day or so in advance, and can usually be bought right before travel.

As for train reservations on Renfe's website, almost everything I needed to know was in this Tripadvisor tutorial: https://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g187514-c80518/Madrid:Spain:Buying.Renfe.Tickets.Online.html

Use Paypal to buy the tickets, as Renfe almost never works with US credit cards (I started with a credit card and wasted time).

If you are making a connection (such as Toledo to Cordoba, which requires changing trains in Madrid), I found that the Renfe site did not show all options. I used the Bahn website http://reiseauskunft.bahn.de/bin/query.exe/en which did, then booked the tickets for each segment separately. If you're not familiar with the Bahn website, here's Rick's excellent tutorial: http://www.ricksteves.com/travel-tips/transportation/trains/online-schedules

In the end it took FIVE websites to buy tickets (Renfe, Paypal, Tripadvisor, Bahn - and Rick Steves to learn about the others!). But in the end it went off without a hitch. Remember that if you can't buy tickets because it's too early, it's also too early for anyone else. Just check every few days.

The train from Toledo arrives in Atocha station's lower level; I don't know if the one to Cordoba uses the upper or lower level (Barcelona uses the upper one). If you have to change levels, there is an elevator that connects them without having to go through security again. It's outside the waiting lounge, in the track area near the high numbered tracks; ask for help if you can't find it. Using this elevator, I made a half-hour connection with lots of time to spare.

Hi Lakshman. What a wonderful trip. I love the breadth of your plan. It's at a fair pace, but you seem up for it.

Some questions/points.
1. Is Day 1 your arrival at Bilbao?
2. You will benefit from 2 nights in both Bilbao and San Sebastián, giving you are a full day in both to explore.
3. Arrive late in to Salamanca, spend the next (full) day exploring before an evening train on to Madrid.
4. El Escorial can be done in half a day.
5. Consider alternative order - Seville > Cordoba > Ronda > Granada as you have direct trains for all those journeys.
6. Bus is best for Granada to Malaga as well as Bilbao to San Sebastián (as mentioned by Harold).
7. It's too early to book trains - Spain is 60 days ahead I think.
8. Similarly too early for Alhambra.

EDITED
Sep
19/ Arrive Bilbao (2N)
20/ Guggenheim
21/ Bus to San Sebastián (2N)
22/ San Sebastián
23/ Train to Salamanca (2N)
24/ Salamanca
25/ Train to Madrid (4N)
26/ Madrid
27/ El Escorial (half day)
28/ Segovia
29/ Afternoon train to Toledo (2N)
30/ Toledo

Oct
01/ Train via Madrid to Seville (3N)
02/ Seville
03/ Seville
04/ Train to Cordoba (2N)
05/ Mezquita
06/ Train to Ronda (1N)
07/ Train to Granada (2N)
08/ Alhambra
09/ Bus to Malaga (2N)
10/ Malaga
11/ Leave for USA

Some trains to look for ...

ALV 4086
Dep 08:57 SAN SEBASTIAN/DONOSTIA (Spain)
Arr 13:09 VALLADOLID (Spain)
TRN18308
Dep 14:19 VALLADOLID (Spain)
Arr 15:48 SALAMANCA (Spain)

ALV 4988
Dep 18:20 SALAMANCA (Spain)
Arr 19:56 MADRID-CHAMARTIN (Spain)

ALT 9366
Dep 10:39 CORDOBA-CENTRAL (Spain)
Arr 12:20 RONDA (Spain)

TRN13065
Dep 13:36 RONDA (Spain)
Arr 16:10 GRANADA (Spain)

Anyone over 60 can buy a tarjeta dorada (gold card) for about €6 each in Spain (you need to show proof of age, passport does it, I used a driver's license last time). The card entitles you to full price (that is, full refund/exchange benefits) train tickets at considerable discounts. As you'll learn more about by reading the excellent article Harold gave you, Renfe sells some tickets at huge discounts. You can compare prices by ticking the "tarjeta dorada" box when choosing a route on the Renfe site. When you do that, you'll be able to see the "TD" prices as well as all the others. Note that you can only buy the TDs once you are in Spain. Some routes do not have discount rates, so waiting until you get the TDs will save you money. It also gives you some flexibility. I think someone discussed Toledo trains. They often sell out, but only a day or two in advance. To go from Toledo to Cordoba (or anywhere else), you need to book separate tickets. to Madrid and from Madrid. Allow 30 minutes transfer time. It could take around 15 minutes to get from the Toledo platform to the high-speed trains and you'll need a few minutes to go through security, get to the platform and board. Trains close their doors 2 minutes before departure. If you aren't on the train before the doors close, you've missed the train.

I tried to access the official Alhambra site, but I got an error message. I took a peek at the tripadvisor forum. It seems that a few people have had trouble buying tickets. One person advised: If you want to access the phone tickets service you may do it calling 902 15 00 25 pressing option 2. The service is available the 365 days of the year from 8am to 12am. I think that means midnight - assume Central European time. Many Spanish sights give a discount to over-65's. Ask before you buy, if it's applicable.

Harold, David, Chani: Thanks for your valuable inputs. I will definitely follow up and take them into account.
David, Harold --- By the way, we arrive in Bilbao on the previous night to Day 1. So, we will be rested to tour Bilbao on Day 1.
We could leave for San Sebastián on Day 2 in the afternoon for Salamanca. Spend Day 3 in Salamanca and leave for Madrid Day 3 evening or Day 4 morning. What do you think?
David, I noticed that there is a train "change over" from one the train to another on the way to Salamanca from San Sebastián. There does not seem much time for the transfer....?
I will look into the great inputs for looking into PayPal and the "gold cards" for seniors. However, in regards to the "gold cards", I tend to feel better when I have taken care of every thing before leaving the US. I guess I am loosing some sense of my "adventurous attitude" as I get older (not leaving things to chance).
Chani: I will look into the "gold cards" for seniors and the idea of calling the tel # for Alhambra reservations. Thanks.
Thanks for all the inputs.
Lakshman

Hi Lakshmank.
We are heading to Spain in late September/October also. I have signed up on loco2.com for alerts to advise me when the trains I want are available to book. Others have advised me that this site is reliable in notifying you. Also, it looks like Alhambra tickets are available up to September 30. I have been checking every day for October tickets.
Hope you have a great trip!

Yes, I agree, that's a tight connection. A change at Valladolid may be better.

ALV 4086
Dep 08:57 SAN SEBASTIAN/DONOSTIA (Spain)
Arr 13:09 VALLADOLID (Spain)
TRN18308
Dep 14:19 VALLADOLID (Spain)
Arr 15:48 SALAMANCA (Spain)

I really think 2 nights each for Bilbao, San Sebastián, Salamanca is the best way to start off your trip. Otherwise you will feel too rushed. It's good you already have 2 nights in Bilbao. I added your dates (correctly I hope) above.

Hello David:

I hope you don't mind asking additional questions .............

I could not find the train schedule that you outlined above for the leg San Sebastián to Salamanca:
ALV 4086 Dep San Sebastián Donostia 8:57 AM; Arr Valladolid @ 13:09 PM
TRN18308 Dep Valladolid @. 14: 09 PM; Arr Salamanca @ 15: 48 PM.
I like the early departure from San Sebastián.
Could you direct me to the appropriate link? I have gone through a variety of train sites with no luck.

Also, is there an early train (or bus) from Cordoba to Ronda? ; I am in Ronda for the day. Leaving next morning. The ALT 9366 arrives in Ronda at 12: 20 PM -- not leaving much time for the visit. Here too, the research I have done on trains don't provide an earlier alternative.

Similarly, I need to find an earlier departure from Ronda to arrive earlier in Granada.

I am sorry to ask this many questions. Harold, Chani and you have been very helpful so far and I am very grateful for the expertise you all have provided.

Thanks

Lakshman

Lakshmank,

You don't need to apologize for asking questions, we're here to help answer questions :-)

You can check train schedules at Renfe.com.

It looks like there's not an earlier train departing from Córdoba to Ronda other than the one you found departing at 10:39.

However, there is an early train departing Ronda at 7:53, and arriving to Granada at 10:55.

Keep in mind that the railway around Granada is undergoing renovations which means that trains cannot travel to/from Granada, so you will be transferring to a bus ( provided by Renfe) when you arrive to Antequera Santa Ana's train station (from Ronda). The bus will transport all pasengers on this route to Granada's train station.

You can book your Alhambra tickets 3 months in advance at Alhambra- tickets.es, so you should be able to book anytime after July 8th, for your visit on October 8th.

Let us know if you have other questions.

Enjoy your trip!

Lakshmank,
If you don't think you'll have enough time to visit Ronda, you may consider skipping it an adding that extra night to Sevilla or Granada.

If you decide to skip Ronda, you may also consider changing your route to something like this ( to avoid backtracking):

• train from Madrid to Córdoba
• train from Córdoba to Sevilla
• train or bus from Sevilla to Granada
• bus from Granada to Málaga

I did some quick checking and found no buses from Cordoba to Ronda: most people probably travel to Ronda from Seville.

To go on from Ronda to Granada by bus you would change in Malaga. The trip will likely take considerably longer than by train, but you might find a better schedule for your purposes. I found service to Malaga by Los Amarillos and Automoviles Portillo. For the Malaga-Granada leg, other companies are involved. Googling "bus Ronda to Malaga" will get you started. Be very careful about the day of the week you intend to travel.

Ask as many questions as you want. We all get help here.

It doesn't look like the trains meet your schedule. Maybe you could leave Cordoba on the late afternoon train the day prior and then the late afternoon train to Granada. Also have a look at ALSA bus schedules. That might fit in with your current plan.