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Need Suggestion for 9 Day Itinerary to Spain in April 5-14, 2018

My Daughter and her friend (both in mid 20s) will take a first-time trip to Spain. They will arrive on April 5 (Thurs.) morning in Madrid from US (overnight flight) and leave on April 14 (Sat.) around noon time back to US. They have total of 9 days and nights in Spain. Here are the places that they are interested to cover: Madrid, Toledo, Sevilla, Granada. Not sure if Cordoba should be included (maybe only if it is conveniently on the way and easy to do). They are interested in scenery, culture, good food, etc. They are on a budget.

The tentative itinerary is following:
April 5 -arrive in Madrid in the morning, Stay 2 nights here for sightseeing.
April 7 -train to Toledo for one-day visit. They are debating to stay overnight in Toledo or back to Madrid on the same day. Please help me on this with pro and con for each approach.
April 8 -fast train from Madrid to Sevilla. Stay for 2 nights.
April 10 – from Sevilla to Granada. Not sure what is the best transportation method; train+bus or bus. Stay for 2 nights.
April 12 – Back to Madrid. It seems that Cordoba is on the way. Not sure if there is time to stop there on the way or if it is worth the trouble. What is the best transportation method from Granada to Madrid? Stay 2 more nights (probably only one full day) in Madrid.
April 14 – Noon flight back to US.
I would really appreciate your comments and suggestions for the above tentative itinerary, especially for the following questions:
1. Is there any difference to do the Toledo trip in the beginning or the end of the trip? Should they overnight in Toledo or just day trip from Madrid.
2. Do the days distributed in each place look reasonable or it could be improved by moving around the places?
3. Should Cordoba be included on the return trip from Granada to Madrid?
4. What is the best and inexpensive way to get from Granada to Madrid?

Thanks very much for your help!

Posted by
7175 posts

If you think an onward trip to Sevilla is manageable on your arrival day, then I would suggest something like this ...

April
5. Fly in to Madrid. Train to Seville (3N)
6. Seville
7. Seville
8. Train via Cordoba (Mezquita) to Granada (2N)
9. Granada (Alhambra)
10. Train to Madrid (4N)
11. Madrid
12. Day to Toledo
13. Madrid
14. DEPART Madrid

Posted by
39 posts

Thanks so much for your suggestions. I have two additional questions.

I understand the rationale to go straight to Sevilla upon arriving in Madrid. It will avoid check-in and check-out twice in Madrid. However, my concern is potential oversea flight delay. My understand is that you will get much better price for high speed train ticket from Madrid to Sevilla if booked well in advance. In potential flight delay situation will they be able to change the train ticket to a later departure time?

Do you also suggest that they spend 2 nights in Cordoba and only one night in Granada?

Thanks again for the help!

Posted by
26829 posts

I think David is suggesting that they stop in Cordoba for daytime sightseeing on the way to Granada, where they will need to spend two nights in order to see the Alhambra.

I was going to suggest something along David's line. On a short trip like this (they have only 8 full days), it's best to try hard to avoid two separate hotel stays in the same city (Madrid), because checking in, getting settled, then packing up and checking out takes a lot of time. The first day is often a jet-lagged, sleep-deprived time, so it can be very smart to use part of that day to get to one of the destinations you want to visit anyway. They could then put all their Madrid time at the end of the trip.

For the same reason, I would tend not to spend the night in Toledo or Cordoba, but rather to visit them on day-trips or in transit. They'll still be sleeping in 3 different hotels/hostels over the course of their nine nights. Believe me, that will make for a less frantic trip.

The tricky part is the April 5 timing: They cannot know exactly when they will get themselves to the train station at Barajas Airport. They can address that issue by allowing a lot of time between scheduled flight arrival and train departure time, which may leave them cooling their heels at the airport or at Puerta de Atocha Station for quite some time and will not provide 100% protection in the event of a significant flight delay. Alternatively, they can just plan to buy their April 5 rail ticket upon arrival. This is safer but may well mean a substantially higher fare.

The fare swing may be observed by going to Renfe.com and pricing tickets from Madrid-Puerta de Atocha to Sevilla-Santa Justa for tomorrow and also for as close as you can get to April 5 (as of now, the latest available Thursday seems to be February 22; I don't know why). The lowest-priced tickets are promotional fares that are totally non-refundable and non-changeable, so they stand to lose all that money if they miss the train. At the moment I see prices between 56 and 102 euros for tomorrow (most between 60 and 80 euros) and between 32 and 70 euros for Feb. 22. Because their travel period is so close to Easter, I wouldn't be surprised to see the lower-cost tickets for April 5 get snapped up earlier than usual, right after they go on sale, so I do not guarantee that they'll have so many 60-80 euro options if they buy a ticket on that date. They might well be facing substantially higher prices. A few of tomorrow's Seville trains are sold out, and I've observed that situation before on that particular routing. Lots of people like to go to Andalucía around Easter, too.

Looking at today's fares, it seems that prices to Granada are 30 euros for the promotional ticket (only available for a very early train and the 5:35 PM departure) and 69 euros for the last-minute, full-flexible ticket (on the two trains that would be more likely to fit their schedule). Part of that trip is on a bus since the rail line is still under construction. The lower (apparent) maximum price to Granada would make starting the trip in Granada attractive if not for the fact that there are far fewer departures for Granada, and the trip takes a lot longer. And on a day when they'll be really tired. So I think traveling to Seville first is probably better if they want to take the train.

A bus to Granada looks like a decent possibility, though. ALSA has frequent runs from Madrid's Estacion Sur to Granada. They take 4-1/2 to 5 hours and are much cheaper than peak train fares, though the bus fares are also variable. A significant disadvantage here is that it would mean getting from the airport downtown, then taking the subway to the stop near Estacion Sur, and there might be some sold-out buses to deal with. That is not hard, but if they haven't slept on the plane...

Posted by
26829 posts

Ran out of room above.

If they are not big art fans, they might add a day to Seville so they'll have more time in Cordoba, taking that day from Madrid.

I don't know whether April tickets for the Alhambra are on sale yet, but they should check right away, because those tickets sell out. If there's only spotty availability, that might dictate the order in which they must arrange their destinations. If the tickets are already sold out, they would probably opt to skip Granada on this trip. They could fill the time with other day-trips from Madrid (Segovia and Cuenca are both good) or time in Ronda.

Posted by
39 posts

acraven,

Thank you so much for your detailed info for the train and the bus. They are so helpful. This is their first trip to Spain and they don't know much at all. Also glad that you mentioned the need to book Alhambra ticket ASAP. I just checked the website it is on sale now. For April only April 1-3 are sold out. All other dates are still available for Alhambra General ticket. But they are shown in yellow color (means only limited availability). So should book it soon.

As I mentioned before they are on a budget. So the big difference in price for the high speed train between booking in advance vs last minute maybe a concern for them. Your suggestion for taking the bus from Madrid upon arriving to Granada may be a viable option for them. You mentioned the bus takes 4-1/2 to 5 hours. How long is the train ride from Madrid to Granada? How much does the bus ride cost? Is there any price difference for the bus fare between advance booking (I don't know if this is available) and last minute purchase at the station?

If they go to Granada first upon arriving in Madrid would you still suggest that they spend 2 nights in Granada and 3 nights in Sevilla (maybe a day trip from there to Cordoba)?

Thanks!

Ying

Posted by
26829 posts

I'd go with 2 nights in Granada, I think, though I recognize that they may still be fuzzy-brained on April 5.

The blue Renfe.com link in my earlier post will take you to the train schedule and fares up to late February. The link can be used to see April schedules once those tickets go on sale. The schedules won't change much for April, but day of the week is important.

Bus tickets can be bought in advance, but I wouldn't do that for arrival day. I have definitely seen bus fares that varied by time of departure. Without watching them over a period of time I cannot say for sure whether that's a function of higher initial pricing on the most popular departures (those perhaps attractive to commuters/students, etc.), an indication that tickets are selling like hotcakes on certain individual buses and it's a what-the-traffic-will-bear situation, or purely a function of the distinction between a regular and "premium" bus. Perhaps it's a combination.

The regular buses are perfectly fine. I ended up on one premium bus in 2016 for schedule reasons, and it certainly wasn't worth a 150% up-charge. Maybe fancier upholstery, more reliable Wi-Fi, some sort of video capability? The only thing I'm sure about is that we got a free snack--a sandwich or something like that and perhaps a soft drink.

Here's the ALSA website, where you/they can take a look at the schedule and fares to Granada. As of now, the April 4 fares for late morning and early afternoon are cheap. The 3 PM departure is much more expensive. How long the others will stay low, I do not know. If the next seven days' fares are the same as for April 4, there's your answer.

I hope they are familiar with the concept of the 24-hour clock. Those 1:30, 1:45, etc., departures at the top of the bus schedule are AM--i.e., just after midnight. That's early by Spanish standards; dinner ends at midnight, if you're lucky.

The ALSA website is acting strange at the moment. I sort of had to back into that search. It might work better on a tablet than on my desktop. In a pinch they may be able to get there by Googling "Bus Madrid to Granada". They'll need to remember that the schedule is from the Estacion Sur Station in Madrid, not the airport.

ALSA has ticket-vending machines at every large bus station I went through that had ALSA service. You can easily change the display language to English, and it's easy to buy the tickets there. Which is handy, because you never know how long the line will be at the staffed counter, and the other customers at the staffed counter are for sure not doing something simple like buying a ticket from Madrid to Granada. Get behind a couple of people buying international tickets for a group and you may as well pitch a tent. In addition, the staffed counters stop selling tickets some minutes before departure (the machines may do that, too). If they get caught in that situation when using the machine, they can always buy a ticket for the first-available bus, then approach the driver (or the assistant, who may be loading baggage), show them the ticket and ask (using charades if necessary) whether they can take the earlier bus. That might be possible, though obviously no guarantees.

Posted by
7175 posts

This then might suits them better ...

April
5.am. Arrive in to Madrid (3N)
5.pm. Walk thru Madrid’s historic centre
6. Madrid - Royal Palace & Prado
7. Day to Toledo (Book trains ahead)
8. Train to Granada (2N)
9. Granada (Book Alhambra tickets ASAP)
10. Train to Seville (3N)
11. Seville - Cathedral & Real Alcazar
12. Seville - historic neighbourhoods
13.am. Early train to Cordoba for the Mezquita
(Luggage storage available at the bus station)
13.pm. Late train to Madrid (1N)
14. Fly out of Madrid

Posted by
39 posts

Thank you all so much for the very helpful information. The revised itinerary looks good to me.

Posted by
1117 posts

Just wanted to second what the others said about Cordoba: The Mezquita is breathtakingly awesome and an absolute must, IMO.

Posted by
39 posts

There is slightly schedule change for the trip. Also the Alhambra ticket now only available for April 10-13 during their visit.

Revised Itinerary (April 6-15, 2018)
April 6 (Fri), Arrive at the Madrid airport around 8 AM (3 nights)
Walk + Royal Palace
April 7 (Sat), Day trip to Toledo
April 8 (Sun) – Tour Madrid: Walking tour + Prado (World’s great museum, masterpieces) or Reina Sofia (modern art, Picasso’s)
April 9 (Mon) Train from Madrid to Sevilla (3 nights)
Stopover at Cordoba to see Mezquita.
Do you have to buy two separate train tickets or just one for the stopover?
April 10 (Tue) - Seville - Cathedral & Real Alcazar
April 11 (Wed) – Seville - Historic neighborhoods
April 12 (Thurs) – Train to Granada (2 nights)
Sight seeing
April 13 (Fri) - Visit Alhambra
April 14 (Sat) – Train or bus back to Madrid.
April 15 (Sun) Fly back from Madrid at noon.

I would really appreciate you input to see if this schedule looks reasonable. I try to fit Alhambra ticket availability and also try to avoid crowds for the Seville Fair (April 14-21).

Posted by
26829 posts

You will need separate tickets for Madrid-Cordoba and Cordoba-Seville. Buying early will save you money, but be sure of your timing since the low-priced tickets are not changeable or refundable.