Leaning Catalan

Thanks Robert,

Hopefully, some you're looking to study CATALAN -which is the local language of Barcelona and Catalonia, the region where this city is capital of and it's spoken by nearly 12 million people as well beyond its borders. I point this out because many visitors are unaware that this region has a distinct language, heritage and culture from that often portrayed when talking about Spain and upon arriving they discover that street signs, official information/documentation, media and a lot of their citizens use Catalan on their daily lives. It's also true that there is a big chunk of population, mostly of migrant descent, that use both and/or only Spanish instead, especially in the industrial belt around Barcelona. Note though you can also learn the Spanish language while in Catalonia.

Having clarified this, should you be interested in learning Catalan, this government website provides useful information and links and also this online resource allows you to learn online the language at a basic level and for free and for other tools for further self-learning (children & adults) check here.

There are also private courses in many schools:
http://www.cpnl.cat/cursos-catala/cercador-cursos/index.php -choose "Traductor" to translate the page into English. Note in this directory you're invited to choose the level -choose "Inicial" (entry level)- and the 'comarca' (county) in which you wish to search for schools -if in Barcelona choose "Barcelonès"-, then press 'cercar' (search). Many are free of charge for the student, especially on entry levels.

and universities: www.upf.edu - www.uab.es - www.upc.edu (Note I only included those in Barcelona)

and you can study it abroad as well: http://www.intercat.cat/en/info/catala-estranger.jsp

Once you reach a minimum command of the language, there's a very useful resource to enhance one's knowledge: "language volunteering", a free program available across many cities and towns across Catalonia served by volunteers -native speakers- that offer their spare time to accompany a learner in enhancing his/her conversational skills. This consists of a commitment on both sides (learner and volunteer) to meet one hour per week for ten weeks on a relaxed environment (ie. having a coffee, strolling, etc.) to practice one-to-one conversational Catalan so that the learner can enhance his/her confidence and command in using this language. There's no cost for the learner nor any remuneration for the volunteer. This program is also aimed to help the learner to immerse into the Catalan culture and these 'linguistic couplings' often results in longtime friendships. More info: http://www.vxl.cat/

Some universities (ie. http://www.upf.edu/vl/en/) also have similar programs for their foreign students/teachers which include ludic activities such as visits and guided tours so the language can be practiced while learning about heritage, history and culture.

Btw, if you're interested to listen how it sounds... check different examples here: choose the 'language' tab and scroll down, you'll find examples left of the image.

While many Rick Steves travelers want to get as close to the locals as possible, it's not true that you need to speak Catalan to get around in Barcelona. It's true enough that there are tricky politics involved in the use of the language, but no one expects average tourists, or even people on business postings to speak Catalan.

It might be useful to learn whether there is any danger (I have no idea, myself) that you could annoy someone on the "other side" by using a few Catalan courtesy-words to someone who doesn't care for the language. Maybe you know it took Belgium most of the last year to form a government because of friction over Dutch and English. By that, I mean that discretion (i.e. tourist ignorance) could be the better part of valor.

I never encountered any tension by using Castillian in Barcelona or Girona (by the way, "Castillian" is the name they use for what we call "Spanish"). It's nothing like trying to use French in Flanders.

However, signs are in Catalan first, Castillian second, English third, and French fourth. So, it's common to encounter Catalan-only signs. If you can read Castillian, you can understand written Catalan - except when you can't. Some common words that are quite different include amanida (salad) and tancat (closed).

If you know the days of the week in French, they're similar in Catalan - with the twist that the "day" part always goes at the end. Instead of Monday being lundi, it's dilluns. Dimarts, dimecres - you get the idea (if you know French, that is).

I have the Google Translate app on my Android phone, so I downloaded the Catalan package. While in some languages the app will read words and sentences out loud in a reasonable facsimile of a local accent, for Catalan it uses a computer generated voice that sounds nothing like an actual person speaking the language. So, if you want to hear what it actually sounds like, YouTube is a better bet.

I totally disagree Tim. In general terms, while nobody expects you, as a traveller, to speak anything but English if you want, it's very impolite and extremely selfish to ignore the fact there's an autochthonous language spoken in any area you might visit, anywhere you go in the world, and that that local language doesn't necessarily have to match or even to be the "official" language of the country. There'll be always the odd moron everywhere but in all, people will always greet and embrace you better (warmerly!) if you make the effort to know some words. And memorising a handful of words and sentences in any language doesn't require to be a rocket scientist, lol!

Also, if you know you're visiting a country or region where there might be frictions on language, religion or any other matter, it's wise to get some previous background if anything to show you care a bit about the society who is going to be hosting you during your holiday -let's not forget we're always 'guests' when we travel-, and that you're not visiting just for the stones, ruins and museums or the beaches and the weather. Everybody likes to be praised. Ignorance and preconception are never a good excuses... anywhere :))))

Well, Enric, I brought up the Belgium issue because I've spent weeks (instead of just 10 days in Barcelona ... ) in Belgium. It is possible to annoy people very easily by speaking French or Dutch to a randomly selected person in an area THEY consider to be "the other." It's long ago, but in 1987, I spoke French to ask directions in Brussels (where French is the nominal language) and she couldn't answer me in French. But back then, I think no offense was given.

I think a big difference may be that people who hate the idea of Catalan autonomy avoid living in Barcelona, so you're much less likely to give offense to an unidentified stranger by saying "Thank you" in Catalan, in Barcelona.

I have lived on and off in Brussels for quite a few years. All pupils in the region do study both French and Flemish at school so they know both languages, something else is whether they have a good command of both or whether they wish to use them both. Older people and/or 'migrants' from other parts of Belgium that's a different matter of course. Yet it's unfair to simplify so much the issue, (almost) nobody gets offended if you use one language or the other, they'll simply say whether they do understand you or not (be really so or not) and then you can switch to a different language if you still want to communicate with that person. Also note that Brussels, being the capital of the EU, has a very large community of expats from elsewhere in Europe, so in many circles, English is the de-facto language for communication.

As per Catalonia, everybody who's been schoolarised in the region as a child since 1975, be local or migrant from Spain or elsewhere, does understand Catalan and is able to speak it... otherwise he/she would not have graduated high school as the vehicular language is Catalan. And that's the majority of the locals. Again, something else is whether some of them do use it regularly, whether they do have a good command of it or whether they prefer to speak Spanish instead. As a rule of thumb, families whose origins are from Spain or South America tend to use Spanish as mothertongue, yet, as said, it's not a written on stone as there are plenty of factors that might alter that (first generation vs second generation, social environment, etc). Yet we don't have a problem with language in Catalonia, it's quite normal, and nobody makes any fuss out of it, that within a group conversation some people will speak Catalan and others will Spanish without even noticing these are different languages. The name of the game is called 'respect', if your mothertongue (or simply you feel more comfortable) speaking in one language, since we all have the right and duty to know both (as per what I mentioned earlier), why do I have to make you speak something else? Same goes for me, if I'm more comfortable answering you in my tongue, since you have the right and duty to understand it, why should I switch to the other one?

What better example for showing this that a recent election of a president for the Catalan government who was originally born in Córdoba, moved to Catalonia and now it's 'another' Catalan who speaks both Spanish and Catalan: José Montilla was the 128th president of the Generalitat de Catalunya. The so-called 'problem' is often fictitiously introduced by Spanish politicians in Madrid who don't have a clue on how Catalan society functions and that have an agenda on re-centralizing power.

As per expats and migrants who are no longer in school age, well, as everywhere else it's a result of your environment. If you're living in a city suburb where many are also foreigners or migrants from elsewhere you're less likely to learn Catalan than if you live in a different district or a smaller rural town. But again, the same can be said for English in London or New York... how many Londoners don't know people living in London who barely speak any English?

since you have the right and duty to understand it, why should I switch to the other one?

No comment.

... that's textually extracted from the Spanish constitution: http://www.congreso.es/consti/constitucion/indice/sinopsis/sinopsis.jsp?art=3&tipo=2

Sorry gents, I honestly didn't mean to spark a skirmish, I simply was hoping to learn a few things so that I give myself a decent shot at being able to guess my way through a menu, etc.

I thank you all for your responses and Eric, I really appreciate the information you provided.

Best,
Robert

Oh no, I don't see this "as a skirmish", but as a friendly exchange of apparently different views, didn't you Tim?

Robert,

I spent about ten days in Barcelona a few years ago and did just fine with Spanish, English, and only a few words of Catalan. To be specific, in Catalan I learned the polite phrases, the days of the week, open and close (to help me figure out when I could go places), and then picked up some food words while I was there. About all I remember is the food vocabulary, to be honest. I do want to be polite and considerate about the places I travel and their history and culture, as do many travelers, I am sure.

Frankly, you are already above the average for knowing about Catalan and showing interest in learning it.

The only place we ran into difficulty was the opera. Our seats were in the front row and we didn't have the seat-back captions. My husband said, no problem, there are super-titles over the stage, and there were, and they were in Catalan. My Spanish was good enough that I could mostly understand what was going on, and it's opera, after all, but my husband was totally lost. It was a great multi-lingual experience!

As I recall, we were only greeted in Catalan once or twice, and after I ran out of things to say in Catalan, nobody seemed to be offended when I switched to Spanish, although I always apologized/asked first. As a matter of fact, everyone I encountered in Barcelona was more than kind and polite about my Spanish, and also patient regarding the limits thereof!

The only thing we wish we had done differently (besides visit for longer) was to visit the Museum of the History of Catalonia closer to the beginning of our trip, so that is my suggestion for you. I hope you have a great trip.

I was just in Barcelona this summer for a month and I spoke only Spanish the whole time. Even though I knew that Catalan was the local language, my Spanish is much stronger, and I thought I'd rather try to be able to converse completely in ONE of their languages as opposed to very poorly or not all in Catalan. I never had any problems (except when I said something completely stupid in Spanish) and for the most part everyone seemed to be very happy to try to make the conversation work even if I was struggling sometimes. I always feel it's better to make an effort to speak in their language than just to assume they all speak English. And after a month of reading signs all over town in Catalan, I was very proud of my ability to translate from Catalan into English but I never would have tried to figure out how to say something intelligible in Catalan!!